UK UK - Suzy Lamplugh, 25, Fulham, 28 Jul 1986 #8

[kes1972]

JC was at car auctions apparently in May 86 in Poole, just as an aside. Could he have picked up a (cheap) LHD BMW?

BMW man apparently could identify where pop up police station was in Stevenage Rd where he allegedly reported in 86. With you on noise - surely others would have noticed?

The only issue is he may have that 2nd hand information, but it would be a great question to ask.

 

[kes1972]

i thought the same. if a couple was having a argument, why did he feel threatened. or did galway say this because he wanted to make sure the cabbie remembered exactly what he said. to misdirect.

The taxi driver seems very questionable,like you said if he could remember the price why not the time it would surely be easy to place between jobs, i am not buying that one.

 

[kes1972]

As to the question of why SL waited in the car, my brother and I were discussing this last week and he came up with the possibility that he might have taken the keys from the ignition when he went to the basement flat and that maybe she didn't want to just leave the company car there. At this point in time, they may have been arguing but I'm pretty sure she wouldn't be automatically 'thinking this man is going to rape or kill me'.

The other day on the thread someone asked about whether she had got out of the car since as it was facing toward Hestercombe Ave she would have been on the far side so for my father to see her hair colour and also to be able to recognise her when her photo showed on the news it wouldn't have been possible had she not got out of the car. It's my belief that she must have got out, I just unfortunately can't remember if my father told us or not and neither can my brother. There's no reason he wouldn't have mentioned that part of events, I just don't want to make stuff up to compensate for my lack of this memory. I am sure though that he didn't remark on her demeanor or any viewed distress from her and I think he would have noticed and told us. As far as my father was concerned, he thought they were a couple and he was trying to make sense of the man visiting downstairs. It was odd, he did not fit. There could have been a thought process going on whereby my father may have dismissed a drug angle initially and assumed the visitor was there for a different or official purpose (with it being during office hours and not in the night time too - just surmising) and then, when he saw the news flash about her being missing (he recognised her straight away, no umming and ahhing, that was her) and went on to tell my brother everything he remembered, the car colour, that the car was a hatchback, the hat on the back shelf and the dark haired man in the suit who went down the side alley. He wasn't able to give the make of car but I think he did pretty well considering he didn't know he would have to recall the details. Then when the car was recovered he jumped up from his chair and shouted "That's the car!". Ive left out the swearing. He was animated, at the tv pointing at the hat he had seen. That's when my brother started taking it seriously. I don't know if he went to Fulham police station the same day as the missing Suzy photo or the next morning (his statement would show that). Knowing him, I think he would have gone straight down there with a bee in his bonnet.

Back to the why... I think the man was able to placate SL and calm the situation down, he would have surely known he had to because the more the public arguing dragged on, the more attention it would attract, the more chance someone might step in and the less chance of carrying out his abduction or whatever plan was in mind.

My brain hurts

I think moo they had been to dorncliffe, he had recovered something (possible weapon) then made sl drive past sturgis gone down kelvedon road now sl panicking - (near miss with van driver) then the bw sighting all that is needed is to where time 2:40 to be parked back at 123sr by 3:30 to and from a location and deal with sl all in 40-50 minutes give or take. It has to be at a lock up on sun road with taggart waiting near garage

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

The taxi driver seems very questionable,like you said if he could remember the price why not the time it would surely be easy to place between jobs, i am not buying that one.

He was quite specific, why lie & he came forward quite quickly? Could you as ascertain time from a metre back then? Two screams were heard in road, be interesting to know whereabouts the women lived who heard.

 

[kes1972]

View attachment 652942

This is the shot taken from the original Crimewatch reconstruction.

The light blue car on the left belongs to the garage owner located just behind the white Fiesta
The black taxi cab on the left COULD belong to the same taxi driver who saw the white Fiesta parked "just before 2pm" but there's also ANOTHER Black taxi parked up on the left, located 3 cars behind the white Fiesta.
The white Fiesta is parked opposite 123 Stevenage Road
There also appears to be ANOTHER white car parked 2 car lengths behind the Fiesta; i.e. the other side of the garage entrance.
The Red Sierra is parked directly opposite the black taxi; ergo, 2 car lengths away from 123 Stevenage Road.

That places the Red Sierra outside the 2nd OR 3rd house from the corner of the street, which is seen on the far right of the picture. This exact same lamppost on the street corner can be seen in the 2000 reconstruction!

The lamppost was removed sometime between 2001 and 2008, because it wasn't there on the 2008 Google Maps.

This means that the light blue car here on the left is parked virtually on the corner of the junction of Langthorne Street

But what's really crucial here, is that when the witness sees the woman in the hat walking with the man in the suit, she sees them as they walk along that wall to the left, directly next to the black taxi cab. This means that the woman in the hat was seen just 2 car lengths away from the white Fiesta.

It seems fairly evident therefore, that the witness had just missed SL get her hat out from her car.

This again ties in roughly with my proposed timeline presented upthread.

It would be good to know who that Red Sierra in this photo belonged to?

Because if there's any way to enhance that photo, and then the Reg matches Cannan's Red Sierra, then boom!

It is also particularly horrifying to consider that SL may have been subdued and then dumped in the boot of that very same car we can see in this photo.

Where's the last place someone would look for a body?

In the car parked opposite.

 

[kes1972]

He was quite specific, why lie & he came forward quite quickly? Could you as ascertain time from a metre back then? Two screams were heard in road, be interesting to know whereabouts the women lived who heard.

What? To recall a time give or take thirty minutes in a day, i think so.

 

[kes1972]

The red car seems to be a ford escort moo

 

[Rookie D]

Hmmm...

I don't think that's the same white car!


The white car is parked in the same spot in both photos, but is that the SAME vehicle?


I don't believe it is.


Does that finally solve the mystery of the white car anomoly?


Or are my eyes playing tricks on me?

 

[Rookie D]

Hmmm...


View attachment 653062
View attachment 653063

I don't think that's the same white car!


The white car is parked in the same spot in both photos, but is that the SAME vehicle?


I don't believe it is.


Does that finally solve the mystery of the white car anomoly?


Or are my eyes playing tricks on me?

The position of the number plate, the orange side lights, the lack of the black strip directly under the Ford logo on the first photo.

I think these are 2 different vehicles.

Surely the police must have spotted this?!

Or am I just seeing that they're different cars, when they're not?

 

[Rookie D]

The implications of there being 2 different cars that looked almost identical.

It would surely prove that SL went to Shorrolds Road directly from the office to meet Mr Kipper.

But of course, it then poses a tantalising question...

Did Mr Kipper deliberately park SL's white Fiesta in the same spot close to the garage, because he knew there was usually another white car parked there?

Or more specifically, did Mr Kipper see a white car parked there earlier, and then plan to park SL's Fiesta in the exact same spot, because he knew it would confuse the investigation?

Of course, I may be wrong about those 2 cars being different, but if you look really closely, there seems to be distinct differences between the 2 white cars.

Now if we add into the mix my hypothesis that Mr Kipper may have been an Estate Agent, then could that white car in the photo belong to the abductor himself?!

And if so, then could the white car belong to another branch of Sturgis?

Perhaps the Putney branch that were dealing with the sale of SL's flat?

Lots to ponder here.

 

[Rookie D]

Please tell me these aren't the same car, and I'm not losing my mind...

The number plate is definitely not in the same place for a start.

Curious indeed

 

[Clairybums]

i come from a council estate, but there are good hardworking people in our area. like you said, you are more comfortable around the , jack the lads type, than the posh boys.

Hi Lee,

Sorry, I just re-read my post and I came across aloof like I was knocking people in social housing as if they were all dodgy types. That was certainly not the case. I was just trying to point out that although Fulham was a somewhat affluent and middle class area, it wasn't all middle class. I had left out Clem Atlee Court (on Lillie Road) amongst others that are not coming to me. I myself didn’t come from a council estate as such (Lakeside Road) but it was full of working class people and many kids, with Shepherd's Court and Bush Court a stones throw away. Where I live now is a council estate (for the past 40 years) and there are a mixture of posh people and working class as well as those who regularly move in and out of flats that are now privately owned. During the time I have been here, we've had our problems with drug dealing (I had a crackhouse next door to me for a while), stabbings and other criminal stuff. Some are blissfully unaware of what goes on, I only know because 1. Council estates being communities tend to have lots of gossip (if number 12 in one block farts, number 56 in a block way over the other side of the estate knows about it by the next morning, or sooner). 2. My kids... great sources of info over the years. 3. I know some of the criminals, some I've watched grow up. 4. People felt safe to tell me things knowing it would go no further. The only difference between here and where I lived in Fulham is people were more dotted around in houses than together in blocks of flats (aside from the actual estates there). It was like a dream come true when the council offered us the maisonette in Dorncliffe Rd but I can tell you that at one point (mainly because of my brother and his cars) one of the posher neighbours tried to put a petition together to get rid of us. Thankfully enough people liked us (we were good people) and hardly anyone eould sign it. The basement neighbour was a nightmare, the only good thing was that he was a much worse neighbour to have than we were.

I should start my posts with an overshare alert haha!

 

[Officer Dibble]

Isnt that the sb case?

I need reminded of the intials as SB I'm unsure who that is

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

What? To recall a time give or take thirty minutes in a day, i think so.

There are so many who can’t be precise with times, one reason we have such a confused timeline. There’s nothing to me to suggest he’s particularly dishonest, especially as he could quote money spent on journey.

 

[rvlvr]

Hmmm...


View attachment 653062
View attachment 653063

I don't think that's the same white car!


The white car is parked in the same spot in both photos, but is that the SAME vehicle?


I don't believe it is.


Does that finally solve the mystery of the white car anomoly?


Or are my eyes playing tricks on me?

Yeah, I don’t think they’re the same. I’m not a car guy but isn’t the reg plate on the white car in the street scene beneath the bumper, whereas on Suzy’s Fiesta it’s on it?

There are so many who can’t be precise with times, one reason we have such a confused timeline. There’s nothing to me to suggest he’s particularly dishonest, especially as he could quote money spent on journey.

Indeed. I think unless you have something with a timestamp then in that game, the taxi business, you’re never going to recall things exactly.

 

[WestLondoner]

There are so many who can’t be precise with times, one reason we have such a confused timeline. There’s nothing to me to suggest he’s particularly dishonest, especially as he could quote money spent on journey.

There was some speculation on here after DV's book came out that "James Galway" was CV. He'd just dumped SJL's car, needed a cab to get back to the pub and planted a false trail by hailing a cab and telling the cabbie he'd just seen a violent altercation.

It's not impossible, but you'd need to know what CV looked like in 1986, and you'd also need to dismiss the BW and now the EM sighting.

 

[Kasparthecat1]

I need reminded of the intials as SB I'm unsure who that is

Shirley Banks?

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

There was some speculation on here after DV's book came out that "James Galway" was CV. He'd just dumped SJL's car, needed a cab to get back to the pub and planted a false trail by hailing a cab and telling the cabbie he'd just seen a violent altercation.

It's not impossible, but you'd need to know what CV looked like in 1986, and you'd also need to dismiss the BW and now the EM sighting.

Thanks. I think that’s more plausible than cab driver spinning yarns.

 

[kes1972]

There was some speculation on here after DV's book came out that "James Galway" was CV. He'd just dumped SJL's car, needed a cab to get back to the pub and planted a false trail by hailing a cab and telling the cabbie he'd just seen a violent altercation.

It's not impossible, but you'd need to know what CV looked like in 1986, and you'd also need to dismiss the BW and now the EM sighting.

No need to dismiss bw sighting if he drove to 123sr as taxi driver gave no time as long as between 240 and 330

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

No need to dismiss bw sighting if he drove to 123sr as taxi driver gave no time as long as between 240 and 330

BW also couldn’t be precise. It’s interesting DV didn’t explore this incident, or even make mention of it (?) In his book. ‘Galway’ sounded older than CV at time (greying beard, middle aged) etc.