UK UK - Suzy Lamplugh, 25, Fulham, 28 July 1986

[Terryb808]

Someone previously mentioned along the lines of it's extremely unlikely that the acting landlord would have attacked Suzy on his first day in sole charge of the pub.

I wonder however did he know her when he was training up in the Prince of Wales. However, Adam said it wasn't a place he (and maybe Suzy) frequented.

Did the acting landlord perhaps visit Sturgis? Maybe with a view at looking to rent a flat in the locality? Was he on their books / a client perhaps of Suzy's?

Yes this possibility has been mentioned (I think by Pinkizzy), but as he was only a temporary landlord and for one week why would he need a flat?
As part of the training he would have needed to manage different types of pub, which would have been in different locations.
It’s possible that on his previous training he may have noticed SL, she’s likely to have passed the PoW many times even if she didn’t go in.
If the temp landlord is responsible and it was accidental (as DV indicated in his book) he was very calculated afterwards when he abandoned her car in Stevenage Road. Also, to carry on working as if nothing has happened with a body in the cellar takes some doing.
Then there’s the possibility that at some point the body will be found, how many could live with this for 35 years?

 

[WiseOwl]

For me, Suzy's car & the keys to Shorrolds Road are big clues in this case but how they fit I don't know.

What surprises me is that we have a lot of witnesses seeing her car in Stevenage Road that day yet none of them seemingly spotted Suzy's straw hat in the back of the car. The only person who seemed to notice this is her friend BW who of course claimed to see her driving down the Fulham Palace Road that afternoon.

Also what about any fingerprints found in the car, apart from Suzy who did they belong to? If it can be explained by the fact it was someone known to Suzy who had also driven the car then fair enough, but why has it never been revealed whose these prints belonged to?

Another little odd thing I have read in DV's book about the car is that it said PC Dollery found it shortly after 10.00 that night in Stevenage Road, helpfully it was right under a street lamp. Yet in all the pictures I have seen of where the car was supposedly parked it doesn't appear to be right under a street lamp? Could it be possible the police moved the actual location of the car to fit in with WJ's account of where she claimed to see the car at 12.45 that day?

As for the keys to 37 Shorrolds Road, well this completely confuses me. We know there was only one set of keys to the property, meaning Suzy did not take them to view 37 Shorrolds Road. For some reason, the police did not visit Shorrolds Road that evening, but instead broke into Suzy's flat. Is this because when MG visited the house that afternoon to see if there was any sign of Suzy, that for some reason the police thought he had actually been inside the property? What exactly did he tell them?

Then the following morning: The police had obtained the keys to 37 Shorrolds Road from Sturgis, but which member of staff had actually given them the keys? In DV's book, MG seemed surprised at this information as he seemed to assume that the keys had been found by the police. But as we know, they had not. So if not MG then which member of staff had found the keys still at the office and handed them over? And why didn't they tell their manager they had found them?

Apart from Suzy & MG, the only other staff who were working there were Suzy's fellow negotiator NH, the secretary SF and the office junior JC.

Which of those three were the most likely to find the keys and hand them over to the police, supposedly without letting their manager know? Also did the police realize the keys they were given were the original set and not spare ones, did whoever hand them over inform them of this?

 

[Pinkizzy]

For me, Suzy's car & the keys to Shorrolds Road are big clues in this case but how they fit I don't know.

What surprises me is that we have a lot of witnesses seeing her car in Stevenage Road that day yet none of them seemingly spotted Suzy's straw hat in the back of the car. The only person who seemed to notice this is her friend BW who of course claimed to see her driving down the Fulham Palace Road that afternoon.

Also what about any fingerprints found in the car, apart from Suzy who did they belong to? If it can be explained by the fact it was someone known to Suzy who had also driven the car then fair enough, but why has it never been revealed whose these prints belonged to?

Another little odd thing I have read in DV's book about the car is that it said PC Dollery found it shortly after 10.00 that night in Stevenage Road, helpfully it was right under a street lamp. Yet in all the pictures I have seen of where the car was supposedly parked it doesn't appear to be right under a street lamp? Could it be possible the police moved the actual location of the car to fit in with WJ's account of where she claimed to see the car at 12.45 that day?

As for the keys to 37 Shorrolds Road, well this completely confuses me. We know there was only one set of keys to the property, meaning Suzy did not take them to view 37 Shorrolds Road. For some reason, the police did not visit Shorrolds Road that evening, but instead broke into Suzy's flat. Is this because when MG visited the house that afternoon to see if there was any sign of Suzy, that for some reason the police thought he had actually been inside the property? What exactly did he tell them?

Then the following morning: The police had obtained the keys to 37 Shorrolds Road from Sturgis, but which member of staff had actually given them the keys? In DV's book, MG seemed surprised at this information as he seemed to assume that the keys had been found by the police. But as we know, they had not. So if not MG then which member of staff had found the keys still at the office and handed them over? And why didn't they tell their manager they had found them?

Apart from Suzy & MG, the only other staff who were working there were Suzy's fellow negotiator NH, the secretary SF and the office junior JC.

Which of those three were the most likely to find the keys and hand them over to the police, supposedly without letting their manager know? Also did the police realize the keys they were given were the original set and not spare ones, did whoever hand them over inform them of this?

According to the book, MG knew that SL was spending her lunch hour shopping near her home. I think he knew she hadn't taken the set of keys too.

 

[WiseOwl]

According to the book, MG knew that SL was spending her lunch hour shopping near her home. I think he knew she hadn't taken the set of keys too.

That's interesting Pinkizzy, so do you think that it was MG who handed the keys over to the police on the Tuesday morning then? If so, that means he wasn't telling the truth in his interview with DV. But why be evasive about it?

It would be good to know exactly when the original investigation team found out about the keys, in fact were they ever informed about this at all?

 

[Pinkizzy]

I don't know who handed over the keys to the police. You should watch the crimewatch episode featuring SL

 

[WiseOwl]

I don't know who handed over the keys to the police. You should watch the crimewatch episode featuring SL

I have watched it several times; the police state in the show that the keys were still missing.

The show was aired in October 1986, 3 months after Suzy disappeared. So by this time the police either:

1. Did not know that there was only one set of keys to Shorrolds Road.

2. They did know, but chose to ignore this information and plough on with the Mr Kipper theory.

 

[Pinkizzy]

I wonder whether the cops visited bars and pubs near her house after she went missing?

 

[Terryb808]

I wonder whether the cops visited bars and pubs near her house after she went missing?

They seem to have been a bit tunnel vision on this, only focusing on Fulham and only on Mr Kipper.

 

[Pinkizzy]

They seem to have been a bit tunnel vision on this, only focusing on Fulham and only on Mr Kipper.

They searched her house on Disraeli Rd. The elderly neighbour may have been interviewed too.

 

[Terryb808]

They searched her house on Disraeli Rd. The elderly neighbour may have been interviewed too.

The general comment that comes back when you are critical of the original investigation is that hindsight is a wonderful thing.
I get this and we’ve had many years to mull over the facts of the case. However, we expect the police to be the experts and to look at all possibilities.
In this case they didn’t, once the Mr Kipper photo fit came into being, everything else went south. Including some of the most basic stuff, like establishing exactly what went on in the Sturgis office that Monday.
They didn’t establish what the normal protocols were for the estate agents business, the number of keys to a property being one example.
This doesn’t need hindsight, just good practice.

 

[WiseOwl]

The general comment that comes back when you are critical of the original investigation is that hindsight is a wonderful thing.
I get this and we’ve had many years to mull over the facts of the case. However, we expect the police to be the experts and to look at all possibilities.
In this case they didn’t, once the Mr Kipper photo fit came into being, everything else went south. Including some of the most basic stuff, like establishing exactly what went on in the Sturgis office that Monday.
They didn’t establish what the normal protocols were for the estate agents business, the number of keys to a property being one example.
This doesn’t need hindsight, just good practice.

I agree with your post Terry, and also Suzy's flatmate at the time who said that the police investigation was very hit-and-miss, almost keystone cops-like. Once they had established the Mr Kipper/Shorrolds Road theory, then that really was that as far as anything else was concerned.

What's astonishing really is that Suzy was a very sociable person and seemed to know lot's of people, but how many of her acquaintance's were investigated? For a start, look at the weekend before she disappeared. Firstly a party on the Saturday night, well how many people were there? How well did Suzy know these people? Any issues with any of them, romantically or otherwise? What about the so-called new boyfriend she was pictured with sitting on his knee? Who was he and what happened to him after Suzy disappeared?

Then there was the Sunday afternoon at Worthing - same friends as Saturday or different ones? Again, who were they? How many of them were there? What about the tennis on Monday evening? Who was she supposed to be playing with? Why did no-one ever come forward to say they were supposed to be meeting her that Monday evening?

I have always believed (and still do) that it was someone Suzy knew that had something to do with her disappearance. I believe this person met her at her car that lunchtime, most probably unannounced. Because Suzy knew them she was ok with them getting in her car, but after that of course we can only speculate as to what happened.

 

[Pinkizzy]

According to the book, the so called boyfriend flew to the Bahamas after SL disappeared. I haven't established his identity yet.

 

[Crusader21]

I agree with your post Terry, and also Suzy's flatmate at the time who said that the police investigation was very hit-and-miss, almost keystone cops-like. Once they had established the Mr Kipper/Shorrolds Road theory, then that really was that as far as anything else was concerned.

What's astonishing really is that Suzy was a very sociable person and seemed to know lot's of people, but how many of her acquaintance's were investigated? For a start, look at the weekend before she disappeared. Firstly a party on the Saturday night, well how many people were there? How well did Suzy know these people? Any issues with any of them, romantically or otherwise? What about the so-called new boyfriend she was pictured with sitting on his knee? Who was he and what happened to him after Suzy disappeared?

Then there was the Sunday afternoon at Worthing - same friends as Saturday or different ones? Again, who were they? How many of them were there? What about the tennis on Monday evening? Who was she supposed to be playing with? Why did no-one ever come forward to say they were supposed to be meeting her that Monday evening?

I have always believed (and still do) that it was someone Suzy knew that had something to do with her disappearance. I believe this person met her at her car that lunchtime, most probably unannounced. Because Suzy knew them she was ok with them getting in her car, but after that of course we can only speculate as to what happened.

Great post Wise Owl.

As Terry said hindsight is a wonderful thing, and with the focus on 'Mr Kipper' it's easy to see now how mistakes were indeed made.

So what does happen now in 2021?

You'd imagine all possible leads, regarding where Suzy's remains are today, would be fully and totally exhausted. And if her body was located only then perhaps, might we be in a position to piece together her last movements .....

Are the Met actively trying to locate her body?!

 

[Pinkizzy]

Do you need a golden thread to look for remains in a certain location? No. The cellar under the cafe in Gloucester didn't require a golden thread and neither did the gravel pits in Sand Hutton. All it takes is a little look.

 

[Terryb808]

Great post Wise Owl.

As Terry said hindsight is a wonderful thing, and with the focus on 'Mr Kipper' it's easy to see now how mistakes were indeed made.

So what does happen now in 2021?

You'd imagine all possible leads, regarding where Suzy's remains are today, would be fully and totally exhausted. And if her body was located only then perhaps, might we be in a position to piece together her last movements .....

Are the Met actively trying to locate her body?!

You’d think the new owners of the Prince of Wales pub would want to end the speculation generated by DV’s book?
The only way to do this is to allow a closely controlled inspection to take place. If this proves negative, then photograph evidence can be published and that would be an end to the matter.

 

[Crusader21]

You’d think the new owners of the Prince of Wales pub would want to end the speculation generated by DV’s book?

I take it that the pub is open as normal again ....

So folks could be dining, socialising virtually on top of humans remains?

 

[WiseOwl]

I take it that the pub is open as normal again ....

So folks could be dining, socialising virtually on top of humans remains?

Worryingly, they could have been doing this for 35 years.

There is only one way to find out...... Over to you Met police.

 

[Bohobird]

I have always found it quite strange that PSS has never mentioned Suzy ,Neither has she appeared in any documentary regarding Suzy’s disappearance as they were very good friends .

 

[Terryb808]

I have always found it quite strange that PSS has never mentioned Suzy ,Neither has she appeared in any documentary regarding Suzy’s disappearance as they were very good friends .

Yes, many of us have thought the same given her nature and media attention. I wouldn’t have thought she was the type to find the subject difficult to deal with when in the public spotlight.

 

[Pinkizzy]

I have always found it quite strange that PSS has never mentioned Suzy ,Neither has she appeared in any documentary regarding Suzy’s disappearance as they were very good friends .

She helped raise money for the Suzy Lamplugh Trust when it was established