US coal mine collapse traps six-Utah - Thread No. 2

[Buzz Mills]

Buzz, you were saying it but Murray wasn't. LOL

That's what I heard Murray say, in so many words, this morning. It required drawing a conclusion for a few things he stated; in other words, he didn't come right out and say the 6th is last hole; he said Saturday would likely spell the end of it, and drilling a next hole (which would take until Saturday).

 

[Earthbound Misfit I]

I have heard Murray give several interviews and each one different. So for me there is not yet a conclusion to whether or not there will be another hole drilled after the 6th hole.

That's what I heard Murray say, in so many words, this morning. It required drawing a conclusion for a few things he stated; in other words, he didn't come right out and say the 6th is last hole; he said Saturday would likely spell the end of it, and drilling a next hole (which would take until Saturday).

 

[lilpony]

lp, I thought we had had this conversation before, but it must have been someone else.

Wages are relative to the area that we live in. I live on the west coast, like you do, where the rumors say that we make big bucks; as you well know, the rumors are all true; jobs are plentiful, and we make the big bucks. In the mountains of Utah, and the hills of West Virginia, such is not the case. There aren't many jobs available, and the jobs pay peanuts. Those guys make at least half-again more than other jobs in the area. So, working in mines is considered a good job, and earning up to $25 an hour, is very high pay for that area, where there aren't many jobs, and those jobs all pay from $5 to $15 an hour, depending on the skill.

Buzz, yes I do understand that they make a lot less in other states. I still am shocked that the miners where only making that kind of money. I know they make less in these other states. I just assumed that MINERS made a really high wage. I guess I shouldn't assume. But when everyone is saying their wage is huge, I thought wow, how much do they make. Thanks for the info though Buzz!

 

[SewingDeb]

I have heard Murray give several interviews and each one different. So for me there is not yet a conclusion to whether or not there will be another hole drilled after the 6th hole.

This seems pretty definitive:

...a sixth hole will be drilled later in the week, Murray said. But that could be the last one.

"After the sixth bore hole, we don't have any more options."
Rescuers will not drill a 30-inch hole in order to send down a cage large enough for a human being. Such rigs have been used in past mining rescue efforts, but only after signs of life were recognized.
"If we find someone alive, which is very unlikely, we will continue our rescue efforts," Murray said. "But the use of a 30-inch hole is useless unless there is a live miner in there. I can't put a human being down there unless I find a live miner."
The Crandall Canyon mine may well be the last resting place for the trapped miners, Murray said.
"We're already discussing how to honor these men -- if this is a site in perpetuity."

http://www.sltrib.com/ci_6688698

 

[Earthbound Misfit I]

and this doesn't:

Murray said a sixth exploratory hole would be drilled beginning Thursday. When asked how long, and how many holes will continue to be drilled, officials could not give a definitive timetable.

"Until we are assured that there are no signs of life," Kuzar said.

http://kutv.com/topstories/local_story_218103238.html
------------

This seems pretty definitive:

...a sixth hole will be drilled later in the week, Murray said. But that could be the last one.

"After the sixth bore hole, we don't have any more options."
Rescuers will not drill a 30-inch hole in order to send down a cage large enough for a human being. Such rigs have been used in past mining rescue efforts, but only after signs of life were recognized.
"If we find someone alive, which is very unlikely, we will continue our rescue efforts," Murray said. "But the use of a 30-inch hole is useless unless there is a live miner in there. I can't put a human being down there unless I find a live miner."
The Crandall Canyon mine may well be the last resting place for the trapped miners, Murray said.
"We're already discussing how to honor these men -- if this is a site in perpetuity."

http://www.sltrib.com/ci_6688698

 

[SewingDeb]

So he's talking out of both sides of his mouth. Or Kuzar disagrees with Murray. I guess we'll have to wait to see what happens.

 

[Earthbound Misfit I]

In an interview Murray did with KUTV today (This is the link:
Full audio/video interview (9 minutes)
http://kutv.com/video/[email protected] )
Murray talked about the #6 borehole and then he went on to say that they will keep on drilling until they run out of places to put boreholes or until they find the dead miners. Maybe hole #6 is the only place left to put a borehole? I just don't know. I will wait and see.

So he's talking out of both sides of his mouth. Or Kuzar disagrees with Murray. I guess we'll have to wait to see what happens.

http://kutv.com/video/[email protected]

 

[Buzz Mills]

So he's talking out of both sides of his mouth. Or Kuzar disagrees with Murray. I guess we'll have to wait to see what happens.

No, Murray again firmly stated, on CNN tonight, that unless life was found, the sixth hole, or Saturday would likely be the end of it.

 

[Earthbound Misfit I]

Why should we (I) believe what Murray says from hour to hour? Earlier in the day right in front of the cameras for all to see he says one thing and later he says another?

 

[SewingDeb]

No, Murray again firmly stated, on CNN tonight, that unless life was found, the sixth hole, or Saturday would likely be the end of it.

Thanks Buzzm.

 

[philamena]

Just caught up on today's post and I want to thank you all for the informative post and discussions.

 

[Utopia]

Why should we (I) believe what Murray says from hour to hour? Earlier in the day right in front of the cameras for all to see he says one thing and later he says another?

Exactly. Earlier today he categorically denied that changes were made to the mining plan after he took ownership. Tonight when Anderson Cooper asked him about this, given that the Salt Lake Tribune claims they have obtained documents indicating that plans were indeed changed in order to mine areas not included in the original plans (see the article I posted earlier), he then said he had requested copies of the documents and that he had no knowledge of them.

In addition he seems to be going back and forth between saying the mine will be sealed permanently and saying that at sometime in the future they may go after reserves in other parts of the "former Crandall Canyon Mine".

Sounds to me like they will seal off part of the mine, change its name and then carry on once all the publicity dies down.

 

[philamena]

IF Murray really held the paychecks of the missing miners, why hasn't he offered the families the paychecks plus some type of severance pay to tide these folks over?

 

[Vegas Bride]

Buzz, yes I do understand that they make a lot less in other states. I still am shocked that the miners where only making that kind of money. I know they make less in these other states. I just assumed that MINERS made a really high wage. I guess I shouldn't assume. But when everyone is saying their wage is huge, I thought wow, how much do they make. Thanks for the info though Buzz!

I asked my husband about the wages miners here make and he told me a new inexperienced miner would get about 110. a day, an experienced miner would get around 160. a day. I have to say that here in Utah the cost of living is higher than in some parts of the county, housing is very expensive! Wages are low low low! When I was looking for a job it was a shock, the job postings were pitiful, many jobs at minimum wage or just above it. Most jobs do not offer benefits, mining is one of the few jobs around where someone can provide a good way of living for their family.

VB

 

[cheko1]

What questions?
Unlike you, I'm not glued to my computer screaming about things I know nothing about.
I don't appreciate being baited cheko1.
you are now on ignore

For your information........it's totally no concern of yours what I do/ I'm sitting in my own home doing what I want to do. Until the time comes & you walk in my shoes for a day & pay my bills, don't tell me what I do or do not know!!!

I asked you several questions since your a coal person.....what the heck is wrong with that? Seems you coal people fly off the handle way to easy. I'm glad you put me on ignore......I'll do the same!!!

 

[cheko1]

Awwww...Double Hugs, Cheko! Now ya made me cry! (Is this going around or something?!)

Thanks SS.........I never meant to make you cry!!! :blowkiss:

 

[cheko1]

A bit harsh, aren't you, Drew? I believe Cheko knows what is going on! I don't see where she was "baiting" you, but she was simply stating her position on things...in particular, Robert Murray. There are many people who feel he lied, abandoned, and left the families of the first six men in a bad way. They do have a right to their opinions...as do you and I.

I don't feel Robert Murray has been totally forthcoming and honest about his mining practices from the beginning. (They say there is paperwork other than the "plan" submitted to MSHA that supports the fact he was retreat mining.) Was he doing maintenance the morning of the first collapse and he is skirting the issue? Perhaps. There are many unanswered questions which will be asked of Murray in the months to come.

Thanks SS!!! I HONESTLY wasn't trying to bait anyone.

JMHO From what all posters are saying Murray is double talking again, we know from the media he says one thing & does another.

To me & once again MHO he is dancing around something. He will never admit to wrong doing. Is that the reason he never brought in more drills? If he closes the mine like he says & entombs the miners nobody will ever know what really happened & what the true conditions the mine was in.

If he is withholding the miners pay from there families. Causing hardship upon hardship on the misery these poor people have suffered already I sincerely hope karma comes his way. But once again this is JMHO

 

[cheko1]

IF Murray really held the paychecks of the missing miners, why hasn't he offered the families the paychecks plus some type of severance pay to tide these folks over?

Evil & greed!

 

[philamena]

Hey cheko!
Sheeseeeeeee he's more greedy than I thought.

 

[SewingDeb]

In this article, he seems to say he will keep searching and he won't keep searching:

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/UTAH_MINE_COLLAPSE?SITE=WBNSTV&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

Utah Mine Boss Vows to Keep Searching

HUNTINGTON, Utah (AP) -- Lashing out at criticism he was abandoning six trapped coal miners, the mine chief promised Wednesday to keep searching through the weekend and punch yet another hole into "this evil mountain."

and

Officials said a sixth exploratory hole 1,700 feet below ground would be drilled beginning Thursday, officials said, and Kuzar said it will be in the area where the miners were last believed to have been working.

"This is the last hole," Murray said. "If we don't find anybody alive, there is nowhere else that anyone in MSHA or our company would know anywhere to drill."

Drilling that last hole, he said, will "bring closure to me that I could never get them out alive," although he acknowledged it may not bring closure to the miners' families.

"It's going to have to be in the hands of people a lot better than I am, and it's going to have to be in the hands of the Lord," he said.