VA - Amy Bradley - missing from cruise ship, Curacao - 1998 #3

[Quill]

As I understand it, they are considered victims and WS is still "victim friendly" even though today it sure hasn't seemed so.

Rules Thread 'Etiquette & Information'

Jun 7, 2008

Websleuths (WS) Etiquette & Information
​

It is the responsibility of each Websleuths member to understand and abide by the rules and policies listed below. Should you have questions, please address them in an email to WS Adminstration at [email protected].

FREEDOM OF SPEECH

While we believe very much in the freedom of speech & expression, you DO NOT have an absolute right to say whatever you want in this community. WS is based in the United States, but is not an agency of the Federal or any State government - so the 1st Amendment to...

• WS Admin
• Replies: 1
• Forum: The Rules

• 
• 

BIBM

The "victim friendly" rule extends to family members of victims and suspects. Sleuthing family members, friends, or others who have not been officially designated by law enforcement or in mainstream media as a Person of Interest or suspect is not allowed (i.e. Sleuthing out this type of information, and publicly posting their social media, personal information, including names, addresses, and background data -- even if it is public is not allowed and such posts will be removed, along with any posts that encourage such sleuthing).

This does not mean, however, that statements made by family members and other third parties cannot come into discussion as the facts of the case are reported in the media. Members may reasonably discuss what is said in MSM by them or about them, but do not make random accusations, insinuations, suggest their involvement, trash, bash or attack them, or speculate negatively about them.

 

[RandyMcDonald]

If you go back to my previous comments, you can see I was coming from the context of Amy's sexuality and their expectations of the family being healed. Entertaining that Amy returning to their home with children she might have been given birth to is just some angle for their ideal, original vision of Amy's future, disregarding everything else. I wasn't saying they were nefarious. They're just innocent, like keeping her car and hoping she'll return eager to drive it.

That doesn't even get close to what some other characters in similar documentaries are subjected to.

It does really seem as if her parents have consistently put forward a version of the story of her daughter and her kidnapping that does not reflect closely everything that happened. That lawsuit against the cruise ship company that they lost comes to mind. Pretending that they were fine with her not being straight seems especially untenable if the father had sent that letter to her girlfriend, which we know happened.

 

[Quill]

This may be the case, but there have always been elements of their explanation that have never been plausible. A lot of the new detail provided by the documentary, most notably for me the revelation that she came out to her family as lesbian and got a negative reaction from her parents, was never to my knowledge shared by her parents. That this new detail also went some way towards explaining how Amy got so dangerously drunk in the first place is interesting.

I am reminded, a lot, by the behaviour of the Sodder parents after the fire. They were so desperate to believe that five of their children did not die in a terrible fire at Christmas time that they embraced the most unlikely and contrived conspiracy because, all plausibility aside, it meant their children were still alive.

Dangerously drunk: Care to post a link? I have never seen her described as "dangerously drunk". In fact her bar tab shows 6 lite beers after 6 pm. She was just graduating college and was said to be able to hold her alcohol pretty well by her closest college friends.

 

[lebvidox]

As I understand it, they are considered victims and WS is still "victim friendly" even though today it sure hasn't seemed so.

Rules Thread 'Etiquette & Information'

Jun 7, 2008

Websleuths (WS) Etiquette & Information
​

It is the responsibility of each Websleuths member to understand and abide by the rules and policies listed below. Should you have questions, please address them in an email to WS Adminstration at [email protected].

FREEDOM OF SPEECH

While we believe very much in the freedom of speech & expression, you DO NOT have an absolute right to say whatever you want in this community. WS is based in the United States, but is not an agency of the Federal or any State government - so the 1st Amendment to...

• WS Admin
• Replies: 1
• Forum: The Rules

• 
• 

BIBM

You really misunderstood the context of my original comment. It was based on a comment made by the mother in the recent documentary, and not at all an accusation, random or not random.

 

[fridaybaker]

FWIW, I never had the impression that the Bradley’s were “Entertaining that Amy returning to their home with children she might have been given birth to is just some angle for their ideal, original vision of Amy's future, disregarding everything else.”

My take away from the talk of grandchildren in the NF documentary was that they were simply recognizing that Amy’s life might be quite different from what it was, and that they not only love her unconditionally, but that would include any children she may have.

 

[RandyMcDonald]

As I understand it, they are considered victims and WS is still "victim friendly" even though today it sure hasn't seemed so.

Rules Thread 'Etiquette & Information'

Jun 7, 2008

Websleuths (WS) Etiquette & Information
​

It is the responsibility of each Websleuths member to understand and abide by the rules and policies listed below. Should you have questions, please address them in an email to WS Adminstration at [email protected].

FREEDOM OF SPEECH

While we believe very much in the freedom of speech & expression, you DO NOT have an absolute right to say whatever you want in this community. WS is based in the United States, but is not an agency of the Federal or any State government - so the 1st Amendment to...

• WS Admin
• Replies: 1
• Forum: The Rules

• 
• 

BIBM

It is not obvious to me how any of this discussion has violated the above terms.

No one has accused the family of committing the crime, most obviously.

Beyond that, people like me pointing out that her parents reacted badly to her coming out as lesbian and pointing out what this sort of thing can do to a person are not making "random accusations, insinuations, suggest[ing] their involvement, trash[ing], bash[ing] or attack[ing] them, or speculat[ing] negatively about them." That letter Amy's father sent to her girlfriend is a fact. The effects that parental rejection can have on someone who comes out is a reality.

 

[cenazoic]

“This does not mean, however, that statements made by family members and other third parties cannot come into discussion as the facts of the case are reported in the media. ”

 

[BethAnn777]

I’ve seen on several gaming forums that it is common for players to change their IP address for an extra layer of anonymity as players can look up each other’s IP addresses to find out which country they are located in. Perhaps the person looking on the findamy website has changed their IP address to make it look like it’s coming from a completely different location. Not even for any nefarious purposes whatsoever, just as a layer of privacy.

 

[Quill]

You really misunderstood the context of my original comment. It was based on a comment made by the mother in the recent documentary, and not at all an accusation, random or not random.

I misunderstood nothing.

 

[RandyMcDonald]

Dangerously drunk: Care to post a link? I have never seen her described as "dangerously drunk". In fact her bar tab shows 6 lite beers after 6 pm. She was just graduating college and was said to be able to hold her alcohol pretty well by her closest college friends.

Did she only drink those six lite beers, was she given others? How quickly did she drink them?

Even her brother said that she was "tipsy".

What Happened to Amy Bradley: Unpacking the Disturbing Theories About Her Disappearance

Amy Bradley disappeared in the middle of a Caribbean cruise in 1998. The Netflix series Amy Bradley Is Missing dives into the theories about what happened and the family's ongoing search for answers.

www.eonline.com

 

[Quill]

“This does not mean, however, that statements made by family members and other third parties cannot come into discussion as the facts of the case are reported in the media. ”

but do not make random accusations, insinuations, suggest their involvement, trash, bash or attack them, or speculate negatively about them.

 

[lebvidox]

FWIW, I never had the impression that the Bradley’s were “Entertaining that Amy returning to their home with children she might have been given birth to is just some angle for their ideal, original vision of Amy's future, disregarding everything else.”

My take away from the talk of grandchildren in the NF documentary was that they were simply recognizing that Amy’s life might be quite different from what it was, and that they not only love her unconditionally, but that would include any children she may have.

I even went back to her mother's specific quote. She says: "To think that I’ve got grandchildren that I don’t know, I’m still on Earth, I’m still here, so if I do, and we’re able to locate Amy, and if she has children to locate her children, I’d be happy."

She's talking from her perspective. It might come from the sense of "no matter what, no matter violence Amy had to endure, we'll be here, we'll help her heal, etc". I feel very sorry for this mother. She's absolutely genuine. She's never saying she WISHES her daughter had been impregnated against her will. She's just entertaining scenarios in her head. Many what ifs... (There's not a single sighting of 'Amy' with children, so they're just considering: maybe she doesn't come forward because she's scared for her safety, maybe she doesn't come forward because she had children and her children are being threatened')

 

[RandyMcDonald]

but do not make random accusations, insinuations, suggest their involvement, trash, bash or attack them, or speculate negatively about them.

Which is not being done.

 

[lebvidox]

but do not make random accusations, insinuations, suggest their involvement, trash, bash or attack them, or speculate negatively about them.

"random": made, done, happening, or chosen without method or conscious decision.

 

[Danaya]

I think we can fairly consider if this is really a good thing for the family to do, for their own sake. Convincing yourself that your daughter did not suffer a tragic accident but was instead abducted and prostituted for years does not seem like the kind of fate that would help you come to terms with the loss. (As I have said above, I suspect that they might not want to really do that because doing that means that they would have to examine how their cold reaction to Amy's coming out contributed to her fate.)

I'm speaking to the experience of being a mother, which is difficult to understand unless you are one. I never said anything about what's good for the family, and what isn't.

I relayed my perspective of how difficult it must be, particularly as a mom, to not know where your child is. My post was in response to the general rhetoric of, "They should just move on with their lives. Forget it. Accept she's dead."

Whether Amy fell, jumped, was murdered, or is still alive, I don't blame her family for still wanting answers. The fact that it's been decades doesn't change the gravity of the situation.

 

[cenazoic]

I think the thing I found most “shocking” in the doc was Ron B’s admission that he wrote a 3-page disapproving letter to Amy’s girlfriend. I mean, who does that, especially to an adult woman involved with another adult woman? The breathtaking overreach there makes me think the family’s much-vaunted ‘closeness’ might be better described as ‘enmeshed’.

I think it speaks volumes about his feelings about Amy’s coming out and how it may have colored and distorted the narrative provided over the years.

 

[Quill]

I even went back to her mother's specific quote. She says: "To think that I’ve got grandchildren that I don’t know, I’m still on Earth, I’m still here, so if I do, and we’re able to locate Amy, and if she has children to locate her children, I’d be happy."

She's talking from her perspective. It might come from the sense of "no matter what, no matter violence Amy had to endure, we'll be here, we'll help her heal, etc". I feel very sorry for this mother. She's absolutely genuine. She's never saying she WISHES her daughter had been impregnated against her will. She's just entertaining scenarios in her head. Many what ifs... (There's not a single sighting of 'Amy' with children, so they're just considering: maybe she doesn't come forward because she's scared for her safety, maybe she doesn't come forward because she had children and her children are being threatened')

She's letting Amy know that if this is the case, she would embrace her and any children she may have had. She is desperate to hold her daughter again.

 

[lebvidox]

I think the thing I found most “shocking” in the doc was Ron B’s admission that he wrote a 3-page disapproving letter to Amy’s girlfriend. I mean, who does that, especially to an adult woman involved with another adult woman? The breathtaking overreach there makes me think the family’s much-vaunted ‘closeness’ might be better described as ‘enmeshed’.

I think it speaks volumes about his feelings about Amy’s coming out and how it may have colored and distorted the narrative provided over the years.

Exactly. This is not a "random accusation" or "insinuation". Because... "this does not mean, however, that statements made by family members and other third parties cannot come into discussion as the facts of the case are reported in the media."

 

[RandyMcDonald]

I'm speaking to the experience of being a mother, which is difficult to understand unless you are one. I never said anything about what's good for the family, and what isn't.

I relayed my perspective of how difficult it must be, particularly as a mom, to not know where your child is. My post was in response to the general rhetoric of, "They should just move on with their lives. Forget it. Accept she's dead."

Whether Amy fell, jumped, was murdered, or is still alive, I don't blame her family for still wanting answers. The fact that it's been decades doesn't change the gravity of the situation.

Sure, but the answers that they are coming up with are not really helpful. Is it really less helpful to realize that your child had a probably accidental fall while drunk into the ocean than to choose to believe your daughter has been raped as a drug-addicted sex worker for most of her life?

I get that Amy's parents want to believe that their daughter is still alive. If the unlikely scenarios they come up with to justify this desperate belief have Amy living in the most terrible circumstances, well, what comfort are they actually getting from that?

 

[Salah11]

Sure, but the answers that they are coming up with are not really helpful. Is it really less helpful to realize that your child had a probably accidental fall while drunk into the ocean than to choose to believe your daughter has been raped as a drug-addicted sex worker for most of her life?

I get that Amy's parents want to believe that their daughter is still alive. If the unlikely scenarios they come up with to justify this desperate belief have Amy living in the most terrible circumstances, well, what comfort are they actually getting from that?

BBM

If the facts have led them this way, then it’s hardly their fault.

There is not a single bit of evidence that she fell overboard, and the family don’t believe she did for various reasons. For them, it must be highly frustrating that some continue to Peddle a narrative that's not backed up by facts.