Verdict Watch Discussion Thread

[mozzagirl]

Adam Carter ‏@AdamCarterCBC 6s6 seconds ago
The jury is now being brought in. #TimBosma #Bosma

 

[loveisthemovement]

He said they can report on it because the jury is out.

Oh boy. I am so used to his line saying he CAN'T report on it.....lol. Time for more coffee!

 

[mozzagirl]

I never knew they could do this and disrupt the jury.

 

[meterclicks]

Alex Pierson ‏@AlexpiersonAMP 6m6 minutes ago
There has never been testimony about Tim getting gas. Ever. Time truck did not leave again until test drive after 9pm.

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 6m6 minutes ago
Smich and Millard in courtroom, wearing same clothes as yesterday. Jeans for both, Smich a pale yellow shirt, Millard a blue/green plaid.

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 6m6 minutes ago
Dungey thinks a correction is going too far, that it's submitting evidence they haven't heard. Answering the question is sufficient. #Bosma

Colin Butler ‏@ColinButlerCBC 6m6 minutes ago
Dungey argues there is no evidence to the contrary, so it should be left as is. Crown agrees. #TimBosma

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 6m6 minutes ago
All lawyers and judge agree a correction to jury is required. Jurors are being sent for. #Bosma

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 6m6 minutes ago
#Bosma jury coming in now. Judge will re-address their question from last night

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 5m5 minutes ago
Leitch says Goodman's response to the question last night was sufficient. #Bosma

Colin Butler ‏@ColinButlerCBC 6m6 minutes ago
Dungey says to correct it would be going too far and submitting evidence that wasn't there before. #TimBosma

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 6m6 minutes ago
The jury is being brought back in. #Bosma

Colin Butler ‏@ColinButlerCBC 6m6 minutes ago
Jury on its way. #TimBosma

Alex Pierson ‏@AlexpiersonAMP 6m6 minutes ago
Millards team has an issue w this question. Jury being brought back and will be corrected on the information. @AM900CHML

 

[kaen]

The Judge's instruction to the jury to disregard their feelings for Tim rubs me the wrong way, no matter that he is likely covering some legal aspect of impartiality.

respectfully snipped by me

I see your sentiments. He is a fellow human. But, I look at it this way. What would happen if the victim was not a likable guy or even a good guy? If a jury feels that a victim deserved to die would they return a murder verdict?

Added: We have another trial coming up with both defendants regarding a woman who struggled with drugs and other issues. I would hate that she would be seen as less valuable because she was not as sympathetic or knew/hung around these guys.

 

[mozzagirl]

Adam Carter ‏@AdamCarterCBC 5s5 seconds ago
Justice Goodman tells the jury that there is no evidence that #Bosma went to fill up the truck with gas on May 6, 2013. #TimBosma #sc

0 retweets0 likes

 

[mozzagirl]

Adam Carter ‏@AdamCarterCBC 14s14 seconds ago
Jury now going back to their deliberations. #Bosma #TimBosma

 

[andreww]

What additional things came out about MS? Harder drugs and a Facebook photo of MS holding a bullet?

Things that still haven't been released.

 

[meterclicks]

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 5m5 minutes ago
"A misapprehension of the evidence. There is no evidence Tim Bosma went to fill up the truck with gas on May 6," judge tells jury.

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 5m5 minutes ago
Judge is speaking to jury, apologizes for interrupting their deliberations.

Lisa Hepfner ‏@HefCHCHNews 6m6 minutes ago
Judge correcting his answer. There is no evidence #TimBosma filled his truck with gas May 6, 2013

 

[meterclicks]

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 5m5 minutes ago
Goodman tells them there is no evidence TIm #Bosma went to fill up the truck with gas on May 6, 2013.

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 5m5 minutes ago
Jury is back. Goodman apologizes for interrupting their morning. But wants to correct them on a "misapprehension of the evidence." #Bosma

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 6m6 minutes ago
That's it. Jury goes to continue deliberations, judge retires to chambers, the rest of us wait. #Bosma

Alex Pierson ‏@AlexpiersonAMP 6m6 minutes ago
Justice Goodman explains to jury is a misapprehension of evidence. They are told no evidence Tim got gas. #Bosmajurywatch

 

[mozzagirl]

I feel like the jury must have been so annoyed by the disruption. They were taken into court to tell them there is no evidence of Tim getting gas. Is that not exactly what they were told last night?!

 

[Claroon]

"Jurors also didn’t hear about a Google search found in the browser history of Smich’s iPad for “Zombie rounds for 9mm,” that supported Daly’s story. Daly said the Zombie bullets went with Millard’s gun. The gun in the toolbox was a .380-calibre handgun, and Daly suggested there were two different guns, one owned by each accused.But this was information ordered withheld from jurors. There was plenty of other talk of guns, multiple guns, at the trial, but Goodman instructed witnesses and lawyers to only discuss the Walther PPK."

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/c...jury-didnt-hear-in-the-tim-bosma-murder-trial

I think it's quite unfair the judge says only to accept corroborated evidence, but in this case eliminated the piece that would have corroborated BD's testimony.

 

[XiolaBlueX]

Just a note to say, the judge going over those decision trees yesterday was soooo long, thorough, at times extremely repetitive, and very complex. Because they have manslaughter, 2nd degree M, and 1st degree M to consider, but individually, they need to go through it all for each accused separately. Then they have aiding and abetting to consider for each depending on those findings.

Judge said aiding and abetting (helping) is a matter of legal indifference and equal significance in the law.


Then in there were very complex supplementary trees to consider only under unique circumstances, lots of details here too.

Judge said after going through the the trees, 'I have to tell you now that a charge/conviction of Accessory After the fact is not a matter of consideration for you''

After the long at times cumbersome trees instructions, judge then summed up each parties positions:
Crowns
Nutshell was that murder was deliberate and planned and committed to keep 'no witnesses live' They do not claim it was financially motivated.

DMs
the usual stuff, but I also noticed they added DM (and presumably MS also) would have had no idea if there were cameras at Bosma residence so why would they take that chance.
Wasn't planned and deliberate murder as - Didn't clear his browsing history of searching for trucks nor TBs kijiji ad, texted whidden about looking for a truck ('why broadcast looking for truck, even to steal to several people if it was going to be a murder') busy scheduling that week, and last minute 'airport politics' text, incinerator not 'ready'.....among other issues touched upon

MSs the usual mostly, no evident of deliberate and planning murder, just scoping truck. Had no reason to kill TB, no ill will toward him. Cadillac and move to Calgary issue is nonsense, had no license. Among other issues touched upon

 

[dar107]

I feel like the jury must have been so annoyed by the disruption. They were taken into court to tell them there is no evidence of Tim getting gas. Is that not exactly what they were told last night?!

To be fair, they were told there was no mention of what time he went to get gas. This reads to me as the jury was sure he went for gas, but not sure what time. And as it turns out...there was no testimony of Tim going for gas, period.

 

[canadiangirl]

Things that still haven't been released.

Your comment said regarding the information that was released yesterday that if there was any doubt about premeditation it may be disappearing.
I see nothing surprisingly or vastly different released thus far. The rest would be speculation.
For MS the jurors still have essentially the same information going into the jury room to decide about him.
DM, well, that's another story all together. MOO

 

[marymcd]

I do see your point, but they took a man's life. That's what this whole trial is about. I just feel, that so often it's the victim who is forgotten. Seems it is always about the accused rights. Personal I feel our justice system is flawed in that way. However, having said that, I do believe we have one of the best justice systems in the world. But it could be better remembering the victim who can no longer speak.. Knowing the family does not make me very objective sorry.

I didn't know the family, but am passionate about wanting justice served, and I don't care who the victim might be, because it could have been anyone. I feel that the victim's rights are not balanced with the accused's rights. Every victim should be considered beloved by friends and family even if they're not in reality. The jury is instructed to consider and weigh all of the evidence which in many cases are outright lies and are told that they may accept them as fact which many do if there is not evidence to refute it and it aligns with the evidence. I apologize if this offends anyone, but I think ending a closing statement which is not evidence as the Crown did should be just as permissible as a defense lawyer bringing all of his client's virtues (helped MM off of cocaine(?), helping his cancer-survivor mother, bettering himself by excelling in prison studies, ah and don't forget he only pushed around/hit his girlfriend once) to light.

 

[mozzagirl]

I feel like I learn something new every day when following this trial. I always thought when they start deliberations that the jury could not be bothered and they only come back in court when they have a question. This deliberation may take forever if they come out to get an answer and then after the answer they are brought back out to clarify said answer.

 

[Claroon]

Also regarding new info on MS, Lisa Hepfner said in her news report, "People in court who were there in the absence of the jury, could see how cunning he was. He would use information he heard when the jury was out of the room and twist it to his own advantage on the stand.”


http://www.chch.com/deliberation-begins-tim-bosma-trial/

 

[Bellers]

Why does he say this and then continue to report on what happens? :thinking:

He CAN report, not can't. I think you're so used to seeing him say can't that you misread

 

[cckp72]

Also regarding new info on MS, Lisa Hepfner said in her news report, "People in court who were there in the absence of the jury, could see how cunning he was. He would use information he heard when the jury was out of the room and twist it to his own advantage on the stand.”


http://www.chch.com/deliberation-begins-tim-bosma-trial/

While I absolutely believe that to be true, I wonder what the proof is for them to make this statement?