GUILTY WA - John Hauff arrested for 8 hr. sex torture session in special chamber

[Missizzy]

Steadfast posted those great pics of 5323 12th St. NE, Tacoma, WA but Hauff lived next door at 5321 12th St. NE--according to the very first photo at the first link on this thread--the one with the mailboxes. The other mailbox name has now been obscured but I noted it. If you look up 5323 12th St. NE at the following link, you'll see that there's a bit of an issue with pollution--to Superfund status, I guess:

http://scorecard.goodguide.com/env-releases/land/npl-prp.tcl?epa_id=WAD980726368

It's a list of "potentially responsible parties per the EPA". The name given at that address is NOT the one that was on the same mailbox stand, FWIW. But that may be the name of the neighbor who passed about two years ago and who gave permission for Hauff to stay next door. I'm assuming that this neighbor owned both properties. Is that correct? Or am I confused?

 

[Missizzy]

Comes up here too:


http://www.tpchd.org/files/library/0adcbd61557ae6a9.pdf

 

[Missizzy]

The pertinent info starts on page 27. So the property originally included 70 acres. My guess is that this included the area where Hauff was allowed to live and might even stretch as far as to where his towing and salvage company is located. The owner used the area as a landfill/dump and it was proven to have high levels of lead, cadmium, chromium and methane gas migration and yet he wanted to develop it for mobile home sites???

I keep wondering if Hauff lived elsewhere until 3 years ago. Maybe that's when his marriage ended. Possibly he exchanged living privileges with the son of the original owner of this property in return for doing some clean up as ordered by the EPA and city. He could have literally driven or walked across the field to his business. I'm thinking that even though he moved onto this property only 3 years ago, he's had access to it for far longer.

FWIW, the neighbor died on March 19, 2009 at age 87. Any son would be around Hauff's age presumably.

 

[Missizzy]

I don't know how to do all the fancy stuff Steadfast did with the maps but if you googlemap 3 57th Ave. E., Tacoma to 5 57th Ave. E., Tacoma; you'll see that the addresses are adjacent and only 171 feet apart. 3 57th Ave. E. is the address for the defunct American Mission which was run by Hauff's father until 2000. That's the last year it was listed under the charitable organizations in WA. Right next door is Hauff's business, Seaway Towing and Salvage. It started operation in 1973.

The neighbor's (BC) property, where Hauff was currently living, backs up to these two addresses and was in that owner's name since at least the 1960s and used as a landfill and dump ever since.

So, Hauff has been "in the neighborhood", whether working or living, for about 38 years.

 

[Missizzy]

Maurice Clemmons is the reason that Hauff can be held without bail. Washington law used to only allow for the holding of a person without bail when it was a death penalty crime. Clemmons changed that:

http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-n...f_allegedly_kidnapped_and_tortured_woman.html

"...Lawmakers argued Clemmons shouldn't have been released when charged earlier with child rape, and they offered House Joint Resolution 4220 allowing judges to deny bail to suspects facing a life sentence if they view them as showing a clear "propensity for violence" that endangers the public...."

more at link

 

[Missizzy]

Why would a relative of Hauff's write a song about Gary Ridgway and the death of Kimi-Kai Pitsor?

Kimi Kai Pitsor's was working as a prostitute at age 15 or 16 when her pimp saw her get into a truck in April 1983 with a man with a pocked face. She had been working on The Strip in Seattle. She was never seen alive again. Her skull was found in December 1983 in Auburn, WA, near a cemetery.

One of Hauff's relatives is a musician and I found it a bit unsettling that they would write a song about the murder of this young girl.

 

[STEADFAST]

Steadfast posted those great pics of 5323 12th St. NE, Tacoma, WA but Hauff lived next door at 5321 12th St. NE--according to the very first photo at the first link on this thread--the one with the mailboxes. The other mailbox name has now been obscured but I noted it. If you look up 5323 12th St. NE at the following link, you'll see that there's a bit of an issue with pollution--to Superfund status, I guess:

http://scorecard.goodguide.com/env-releases/land/npl-prp.tcl?epa_id=WAD980726368

It's a list of "potentially responsible parties per the EPA". The name given at that address is NOT the one that was on the same mailbox stand, FWIW. But that may be the name of the neighbor who passed about two years ago and who gave permission for Hauff to stay next door. I'm assuming that this neighbor owned both properties. Is that correct? Or am I confused?

The aerial pic that I posted is an aerial of the property that the news identified as where Hauff lives (or, at least, where Hauff's torture room was located.) Tacoma addresses are alligned to a grid of the city and indicate a pretty exact location, and an address of 5323 and one of 5321 would both be located within the property shown.

BTW, we lived in Tacoma for three years while my husband was stationed with an Inshore Boat Unit (that was located just a couple of miles away from Hauff's place.) This area of Tacoma, which includes the Port of Tacoma, the Tacoma Tar Pits, and the Tide Flats, is the origin of the phrase "the aroma of Tacoma." It reeks very, very badly. The tidal flats, location of the torture room, is swampy and run down, full of rusting junk, seedy motels, vacant lots overgrown with witch's broom and brambles, derelict bridges and rutted roads. It's right next to the port, which is not the kind a cruise ship visits; it's a gritty working port with smelters, oil refineries, wood-pulp plants, etc. As far as the salvage yard being a superfund area -- many places in Tacoma are superfund areas,especially down in the Port of Tacoma area, as toxic materials soak in and ooze all around the area from, I suppose, years of unregulated industrial practices. A little farther north, up by Point Defiance, a horrible superfund site, a large copper smeltering plant that leached arsenic into the soil for miles around, is now being developed into upscale condos. so maybe the mobile home park plans for the salvage yard site aren't that unreasonable.
Not to put down Tacoma -- It's mostly a friendly, lovely town with amazing views, full of craftsman houses, picket fences, wonderful gardens. I really liked it. But it's also got lots of creepy, creepy goings on.

 

[Missizzy]

Thanks Steadfast. I've lived in the NW for 18 years but never been to Tacoma. I did know about the Craftsman homes, though, as there's a couple of "important" ones there. I'm very curious about the American Mission. Would it have been like a storefront place or was it a place for people to park trailers? There's lots of naval stuff and salvage and trucking and light industry in the area. It's kind of creepy as there's so many places to hide something. A mission seems as if it would be out of place. I wonder if it was just in the father's home? I've seen a single reference to it being possibly being connected to the Baptist faith.

ETA: I just looked again at 3 57th Ave. E. and it comes up both as in Tacoma and in Fife. Not sure what that's about. But if you look closely, it seems that all that's left there is a driveway. Possibly whatever was the mission has burned down. Looking at the surrounding area, though, still makes it seem very out of place. Maybe it was nothing more than an office in a person's home.

 

[Missizzy]

Concerning Kimi Kai Pitsor, one of the Green River Killer's victims:

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/news/local/greenriver/1987/part5.html

"....One hour later, 16-year-old Kimi Kai Pitsor was last seen getting into a green pickup truck in downtown Seattle. Eight months later, Pitsor's skull was found near a cemetery just west of Auburn. Four months after that, on April 1, 1984, Gabbert's remains were found wedged against a log on a hillside just east of Star Lake, about five miles north of where Pitsor's skull was found.

Gabbert's remains were accompanied by a dog's skeleton, as if her murderer had also killed the dog at the same time. Later, rumors about the animal bones were to spark widespread speculation about Satan worship in relation to the murders, although police insisted the killings were instead the work of a single psychopathic killer.

THE BIG IF

If the dates and times Pitsor and Gabbert vanished are at all accurate _ a big if, but police say they're the best estimates they have _ the deaths of the two women suggest there could be more than one person involved in the 46 Green River murders.

The driving times and distances between the places where the women disappeared and the places where the bodies were later found makes it seem less likely _ although still possible _ that the same person was responsible for both crimes.

If the dates and times were more accurate, police today would have a better chance of knowing whether they're looking for one man acting alone or two people acting together...."

more at link



Because it seems that Kimi Kai must have had some sort of impact on Hauff's family, I've been reading about her. She was a very young prostitute, described as being 15, 16, or 17. Her mother and sister gave victim's statement at trial that totally forgave Ridgway for his crime but skewered the media for the hurtful things which has been said about the victims.

Kimi Kai was picked up while prostituting (presumably) on The Strip in Seattle in April 1983. Her remains were found in December 1983 near the Mountain View Cemetery in Auburn, WA. A number of other victims' remains were found at that location. That's 9.4 miles from Mr. Hauff's residence. I also learned that one of the victims (Mary Meehan, who was 8 months pregnant) was found buried with some items which have never been fully explained:

http://www.francesfarmersrevenge.com/stuff/serialkillers/greenriver.htm

"....Several unexplainable items were found on or close to the body, including two small pieces of plastic, a large clump of hair near the pubic region of the body, a patch of skin attached to the skull, which contained fibers on it, three small bones, two halved yellow pencils and clear plastic tubing...."

This link has lots of details and mentions that a number of men were picked up and questioned in the 80s and 90s concerning the killings. I wonder if Hauff could have ever been a POI? I wonder if he ever drove a green pick-up truck?

 

[Missizzy]

Hauff has a 61 ft. towing boat named the Seaway 2:

http://www.boatinfoworld.com/registration.asp?vn=312654

 

[STEADFAST]

Thanks Steadfast. I've lived in the NW for 18 years but never been to Tacoma. I did know about the Craftsman homes, though, as there's a couple of "important" ones there. I'm very curious about the American Mission. Would it have been like a storefront place or was it a place for people to park trailers? There's lots of naval stuff and salvage and trucking and light industry in the area. It's kind of creepy as there's so many places to hide something. A mission seems as if it would be out of place. I wonder if it was just in the father's home? I've seen a single reference to it being possibly being connected to the Baptist faith.

ETA: I just looked again at 3 57th Ave. E. and it comes up both as in Tacoma and in Fife. Not sure what that's about. But if you look closely, it seems that all that's left there is a driveway. Possibly whatever was the mission has burned down. Looking at the surrounding area, though, still makes it seem very out of place. Maybe it was nothing more than an office in a person's home.

Most people in Tacoma would consider that location to be about the western edge of Fife. I didn't even look in that area at first for the address of the torture room because I thought that area would be Fife.
Any mission down in the Tidal Flats would probably be for homeless/drug addicts, etc. Could he have been trolling for victims?

 

[KikiWanBaniki]

I agree, Steadfast; that seems a likely scenario to me!

I had a 'personal' experience with GR through my work with a community agency years ago (if it winds up seeming helpful, I'll be more than willing to submit myself to a mod for verification as an 'insider' or whatever; a confidentiality agreement currently prevents me from spilling all the 'beans' here).

I can say two things:

1.) I DO think he had one or more accomplices; and
2.) He scared the bejeebers out of me, and that was BEFORE he was caught!!!

 

[STEADFAST]

Tacoma police and local search-and-rescue teams spent Thursday searching the sprawling property in northeast Tacoma . . .
As of 6 p.m., searchers had not found anything, said police spokesman Mark Fulghum.
"We're searching with cadaver dogs and other tracking dogs," he said. But Fulghum characterized the search as a "general search" not tied to any specific case . . .
Searchers were concentrating on the property itself and hadn't gone inside Hauff's 55-foot mobile home or other buildings on the property . . .

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/theblotter/2014841518_cadaver_dogs_search_site_of_al.html

I sure hope they're planning on bringing the cadaver dogs to the salvage yard, too -- and the towing vessel.

 

[STEADFAST]

Those pictures of the salvage yard area on Google are out of date. The winding creek running behind and curving around 57th Ave. East is Hylebos Creek, and it is being reclaimed. In fact, if you look at these Flickr pictures, you can see the salvage yard had probably been bulldozed and changed irretrievably. The one that this link (should, I hope) go to shows the lot that Google says is 3 57th Ave NE from the back (looking towards the road.) Look at the very first photo at the link. http://www.flickr.com/photos/portoftacoma/sets/72157624719192072/with/4889540434/
Very different than it was when Google drove by. I'm just thinking of any hopes for a body search. On the other hand, with all that activity there, you'd think they'd have found anything if there was anything to find. Here are some street views of the lot from before the reclamation efforts.

 

[Missizzy]

A couple of things. I noticed in the landfill report that I linked to upthread that some work had been done on the property. I kind of got the impression that the owner, Mr. C, did the minimum that was required to stay one step ahead of the law. He seemed to have big plans for the property. Because it comes up on the Superfund list with so many dangerous factors, my guess is that Hauff's offer to help clean up the site was graciously accepted in return for living in a trailer on the property. I do wonder where the boat is and how it was used. We can't forget that besides the property that he's lived on, his business is just a stone's throw away. From everything I've read, it seems to be a going concern.

I don't know how to look up ownership of property in Tacoma but it would be interesting to know just who owns both #3 and #5 57th Ave. E--where the salvage company is and where the mission was. I've seen mention that John Hauff, Sr. has passed away and he seemed to close the mission--whatever that was, in 2000. Being that Hauff, Jr. has been in the area since 1973, he's seen a lot of prostitutes and needy people pass through the area.

Concerning Gary Ridgway, I read several accounts that state that many many investigators have felt that there was more than one person involved. And, Kiki, your impression was identical to almost every woman who met the man. He creeped them out. Being that we arrived in Oregon with 12 children (2 came later) in 1993, I didn't have much free time to read about the GRK for quite a while. Being that my daughter is now trafficked, I have a really really hard time reading about his exploits and crimes. But when I got to the parts about plastic tubing and things they couldn't identify, I thought of Hauff. I wonder if Ridgway ever read the Gor books?

 

[Missizzy]

Steadfast--It was confusing when I looked up those addresses. They come up as Fife on some sites and as Tacoma on others.

 

[Missizzy]

For Kiki--This is where I found the info on GR's interaction with women:

http://karisable.com/greenrivergrwork.htm

Lots and lots of info. Interestingly enough Hauff was also described as being a friendly, likable guy.

 

[KikiWanBaniki]

Steadfast--It was confusing when I looked up those addresses. They come up as Fife on some sites and as Tacoma on others.

Missizzy--I have spent a lot of time driving through that area, and always found it odd and confusing the ambiguity of addresses and city listings of locales in those and other rural areas of WA, if they were near county or city lines...

Yes, I think I can say without violating my confidentiality agreement, that GR was so unusually irate-seeming that I advised our receptionist to be on 'emergency alert', as I was extremely concerned that he was going to return to the premises with a weapon, or some violent intention. I was so disturbed that I arranged for DH to come 'hang out' until the end of my shift-- thought GR might be waiting for me at the end of my shift!!!

 

[Missizzy]

Kiki--I'm so sorry you had that experience....job or not. The man is terrifying. Women were not real to him. He couldn't remember names or faces. He took one of his wives back to the scene of a number of his murders to have sex. God only knows how many women we lost due to this monster.

 

[Missizzy]

http://www.q13fox.com/kcpq-torture-room-victims-20110420,0,302259.story

"...."It's not likely she's the only one," former FBI profiler Rick Mathers said.

Mathers has profiled such criminals as Gary Ridgway, Ted Bundy and the BTK killer. He said if the allegations are true, Hauff fits a familiar profile. "The anti-social personality disorder. They don't care, they like to inflict pain," Mathers said. "They like the power and control, so you're looking at a psychopath...."


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