WA WA - Shantina Smiley, 29, & Azriel Carver, 8 (fnd deceased), Olympia, Mar 2010 - #4

[RubyRed]

Tunnel vision.

I don't think that is the case at all. The facts are pointing to her being in the water, The shoe found was hers, identified by bf. Scent dogs didn't pick up any scent that she made it off the beach.

 

[houndstooth]

http://www.kitsapsun.com/news/2010/mar/23/investigators-following-leads-case-missing-silverd/

This news article is very interesting if only b/c of these things:

"Thurston County Sheriff's detectives are still 'following up leads' in an effort to find Shantina Smiley, but are not conducting any searches for the missing Silverdale woman."

"Detective Lt. Chris Mealy said Monday that investigators are working on several tips that have come into their office."

After reading this latest, I take it to mean that they aren't looking for a body.
They are following leads. What leads need to be followed up on to solve an accidental drowning case?

Also, I read somewhere a post that she turned around on the beach, but I looked for 30 minutes at those tracks and couldn't see where she turned around, so she must have backed down to the spot. Pulling forward and backward from that spot in a tight circle does not get you turned around facing a different direction. I think she was spinning her tires as she went, and that is what spattered the wet sand on the windshield. I agree, there is no way LE or the tow truck driver would have entered the car at all except to put it in neutral and disengage the emergency brake if it had been set.

I thought a lot about this today at work. The Williams family never said they smell alcohol on her. If she drank from the jug or poured into a bottle, she would more than likely have spilled some that would have made her smell of it even more. I just keep having the sense that she never drank this wine. I don't why. I keep getting the impression she was wanting to give the impression both in her "relapse" ( under what circumstances this took place we aren't privy to ), and on the trip that she was drunk, erratic and lost. I do not see evidence of this as on a Saturday night at some point she had to have passed a cop. So other than driving hither to and yon she must have not been weaving as no one 911 a drunk driver.

Lastly, I dont get how she wouldn't have told the grandfather she was not coming until the next day. When she KNEW she intended to drive down the road she was on before back past the Mercantile and and onto the beach. How did she know she was close to a beach? Going once to the Mercantile is one thing, going past it again tells me she already had it in mind as a destination. Why? Zangle Rd is obviously a side road. And the other one looked more promising to be near a beach, as this looked like it was going farther inland. She knew where she was going all along.

 

[Calliope]

I highly doubt a murderer would turn them on either!

If he was driving in near-total darkness and with mud as thick as it was on the windshield of that van he would.

BTW, they weren't just turned on. The wiper fluid had been used as well. The glass was clean. Which tells me LE or tow driver didn't do it. And if Shantina did it, she was alive after the tide receded.

 

[Miss Optimism]

I don't know how LE is investigating this, although I DO hope they haven't dismissed out of hand that someone else could have been involved somehow. What I am saying is that once most heard the word "alcoholic", then all other possibilities ceased to exist. There is no other explanation for what happened that night, no other possible scenario, no other reason for her actions.

For example:

They found no foreign fingerprints in the car and the body of Azriel was claimed to be a drowning by the ME. If there was some kind of beating or vicious attack, the ME would know the difference between injuries before and after death.

Why would it have to be an attack or beating? It's been stated many times on these threads, the water was cold enough to kill very quickly. Open door, throw poor little guy into the water.

I have enough confidence in LE to not make assumptions like that and to exhaust every possible scenario she could have been involved in.

 

[LogicalMinds]

That's not true. I've called 911 to report a drunk relative that had called me from his cell phone while driving drunk. LE located the driver on a CA freeway, observed, stopped and arrested the driver for DUI. Even if only works some of the time, isn't a child's life worth the call? I've called on other drivers and been taken very seriously, but I didn't follow up to see if they'd been located/stopped.

That said, we have the benefit of 20/20 hindsight and knowledge of the events that followed.

Yes..but they were drunk....there is no indication that they thought she was drunk ...just upset at being lost

as for the diner and the "fall"...they did not see her fall, they saw it on the security video after they were reported missing

she paid for the food there...and left early...no crime

she didn't appear drunk at the convenience store...women are allowed to buy a bottle of wine when they have a child with them

Actually I would not have even answered the door myself ...and I bet many here would not have
answered the door ...could be dangerous

Hindsight is great but easy to do IMHO

 

[KR2tonenow]

I'd like to see these leads LE is referring to. Possible sightings of Shantina, what?

<quote> County Sheriff's detectives are still 'following up leads' in an effort to find Shantina Smiley, but are not conducting any searches for the missing Silverdale woman." <quote>

 

[floridaheather]

Has anybody ever wondered if maybe she was dosed? By that I mean had been drugged... I was reading what AION ESSENCE wrote abt his theories abt the drugs and I started to think... If you were **tripping** (and I mean on a hallucinogen) you would have a hard time remembering the directions someone just gave you from the time you got them to the time you cranked your vehicle. It would make total sense that you would order a corn dog & then leave w/out it. It explains that bike goofy smile that she had when she walked in the handy pantry. I would explain her driving in circles and not being able to get anywhere, or get Az food, regardless of her attempts. You would lose all sense of time. You might be "pulled" down curious paths that "looked" interesting for some fleeting reason that would sound nuts to someone else. If you have ever, as a kid, even shroomed, you probably remember how even going out to the store for a pack of smokes was something of a "mission" that was expected, in advance, to be difficult not to get "side-tracked" on. It would explain the repeated asking for directions. The curious "looking in" to the closed merchantile, and even seeming confused and nervous and falling down in the parking lot and then speaking of it to the grandparents on the phone as an "accident"--anyway it's just something to think of. And I don't know of *anyone* that would intentionally decide to go tripping in a vehicle w/ their kid, which is why i question was she dosed. It takes a while for those things to set into your system. The effects are not at all immediate could take 1-2 hours or so.

 

[jessigirl]

If some random, intoxicated woman with a starving son knocked on my door at 10:00, I'm sure I would probably call the police

According to their interviews they said she did not appear to be intoxicated,only nervous acting from being lost.

MOO~They are being polite and stating whatmost would see as actions of having been drinking, they are chalking it up to just a worried mom lost at night with her son~MOO

 

[floridaheather]

Yes..but they were drunk....there is no indication that they thought she was drunk ...just upset at being lost

as for the diner and the "fall"...they did not see her fall, they saw it on the security video after they were reported missing

she paid for the food there...and left early...no crime

she didn't appear drunk at the convenience store...women are allowed to buy a bottle of wine when they have a child with them

Actually I would not have even answered the door myself ...and I bet many here would not have
answered the door ...could be dangerous

Hindsight is great but easy to do IMHO

That is another thing that is curious to me. I can smell beer on someone's breath after they've had one. Alcohol reaks. And especially to someone who is not drinking. None of those folks that ran into her that night said she smelled like she had been drinking. You notice those things if they are there. Right away.

 

[90Nine]

Looking very closely, I can see track marks along the red lines, which would possibly indicate that she drove down the beach, turned to the left and ended up with the rear of the van pointing toward the water.

I'm not sure if all of the tire tracks are hers - maybe she was driving in circles...wouldn't surprise me.

I don't know what is in the photo or if it was there, but it doesn't show in the photo of the van on the beach alone.

 

[sorrell skye]

Has any of her family or friends been interviewed (by the media) other than her boyfriend and Aziel's father? If they have, I apologize, as I missed it. If they haven't been interviewed, why? I find that a little odd.

Her ex husband JS was interviewed.
Here is the link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbUeSJkVtBc&feature=related

I'm still catching up, so if this has already been posted tonight on this thread, I apologize.

 

[Calliope]

That's not true. I've called 911 to report a drunk relative that had called me from his cell phone while driving drunk. LE located the driver on a CA freeway, observed, stopped and arrested the driver for DUI. Even if only works some of the time, isn't a child's life worth the call? I've called on other drivers and been taken very seriously, but I didn't follow up to see if they'd been located/stopped.

That said, we have the benefit of 20/20 hindsight and knowledge of the events that followed.

I was pulled over because my car fit the description of one someone had seen swerving. They called the police and an officer was sent to the area to search for the driver.

 

[KR2tonenow]

Looking very closely, I can see track marks along the red lines, which would possibly indicate that she drove down the beach, turned to the left and ended up with the rear of the van pointing toward the water.

I'm not sure if all of the tire tracks are hers - maybe she was driving in circles...wouldn't surprise me.

I don't know what is in the photo or if it was there, but it doesn't show in the photo of the van on the beach alone.

Right then why not drive out, unless your tires are stuck.??

 

[floridaheather]

I never said otherwise. I guess I'm not being clear. Not sure how else to explain...

Calliope, I know what you mean. I think I've got the word you are looking for--it is *investigative reporting*. It is a whole line of journalism in the media. Sometimes these folks end up finding out leads for LE that break the case. I can think of Greta Van Sustren doing this type of work on Natallee Holloway (sorry abt sp) and some other guy who befriended Joren VS to get info for a media outlet... It is pretty common. And you are right, we are missing it!

 

[Calliope]

I don't think that is the case at all. The facts are pointing to her being in the water, The shoe found was hers, identified by bf. Scent dogs didn't pick up any scent that she made it off the beach.

"Tunnel vision" as in there's no other possible scenario considered beyond "well, she's an alcoholic".

 

[floridaheather]

"Tunnel vision" as in there's no other possible scenario considered beyond "well, she's an alcoholic".

Please look at my earlier post (last page) abt a non-alcoholic possibility that may seem far out, but it could be.

 

[Calliope]

Her ex husband JS was interviewed. He is not Azriel's father, but AFAIK, he was charged @ some point with assaulting Az (choking him, breaking his arm). IIRC, the charges were dropped.

I don't believe he is the one who assaulted Azriel. This was discussed on the last thread.

 

[powayparent]

My point is that LE took my call seriously. It's very possible they would also take a call saying that a barefoot, disoriented woman with a young child just knocked on my door...seriously. It's bizarre behavior.

"I wish there was something more I could've done. I wish I knew more, or asked the right questions to be able to say this is a person who's in trouble," said Williams.

Yes..but they were drunk....there is no indication that they thought she was drunk ...just upset at being lost

as for the diner and the "fall"...they did not see her fall, they saw it on the security video after they were reported missing

she paid for the food there...and left early...no crime

she didn't appear drunk at the convenience store...women are allowed to buy a bottle of wine when they have a child with them

Actually I would not have even answered the door myself ...and I bet many here would not have
answered the door ...could be dangerous

Hindsight is great but easy to do IMHO

 

[floridaheather]

After reading this latest, I take it to mean that they aren't looking for a body.
They are following leads. What leads need to be followed up on to solve an accidental drowning case?

Also, I read somewhere a post that she turned around on the beach, but I looked for 30 minutes at those tracks and couldn't see where she turned around, so she must have backed down to the spot. Pulling forward and backward from that spot in a tight circle does not get you turned around facing a different direction. I think she was spinning her tires as she went, and that is what spattered the wet sand on the windshield. I agree, there is no way LE or the tow truck driver would have entered the car at all except to put it in neutral and disengage the emergency brake if it had been set.

I thought a lot about this today at work. The Williams family never said they smell alcohol on her. If she drank from the jug or poured into a bottle, she would more than likely have spilled some that would have made her smell of it even more. I just keep having the sense that she never drank this wine. I don't why. I keep getting the impression she was wanting to give the impression both in her "relapse" ( under what circumstances this took place we aren't privy to ), and on the trip that she was drunk, erratic and lost. I do not see evidence of this as on a Saturday night at some point she had to have passed a cop. So other than driving hither to and yon she must have not been weaving as no one 911 a drunk driver.

Lastly, I dont get how she wouldn't have told the grandfather she was not coming until the next day. When she KNEW she intended to drive down the road she was on before back past the Mercantile and and onto the beach. How did she know she was close to a beach? Going once to the Mercantile is one thing, going past it again tells me she already had it in mind as a destination. Why? Zangle Rd is obviously a side road. And the other one looked more promising to be near a beach, as this looked like it was going farther inland. She knew where she was going all along.

YES, exactly--wow, I was just thinking this too--even made a post on it. NO ONE SAYS SHE REEKED. If you are drinking and talking to random people that are at work (and not drinking) they will notice that you are drinking b/c you will reek! From personal exp. I know. And while people vary as to their sense of smell--alcohol really stands out. And at least ONE of those folks she ran into is going to notice & SAY SO when LE asks!!!! Good eye!

 

[floridaheather]

I don't believe he is the one who assaulted Azriel. This was discussed on the last thread.

No they did not have the same initials. I agree.