Was JonBenet Posed?

[popcorn]

Another reason Dr Lee suggests JonBenet was posed in death is her freaking mother had her spending most of the time she was alive posing. Patsy wasn't about to let her get away without a final shot. We all want to believe JonBenet had a normal childhood and enjoyed such simple childhood pursuits as swinging on a tire. But look closely, the tire is flush with the floor and will not budge. It's a staged shot from a photographer's studio with artificial lighting.

Another scenario for her hands being over her head is the killer was a person she trusted who she was reaching up to for help or who she was clinging too when she died.

 

[BlueCrab]

Staged. That picture symbolizes the Ramsey murder case. "Don't believe anything you hear from them and only half of what you actually see".


JMO

 

[sissi]

After reading a few of the above posts, it occurred to me that there was a suspect who had a stun gun in his possession, was a writer, was politically "off", and carried the title of "Japanese bondage expert" on the internet.

This is what Jeff Shapiro wrote in an editorial to the Boulder News...

The Prophet

Among the first "possible suspects" I studied was "The Prophet."

I had learned of The Prophet from an e-mail he sent his friends about how the Boulder police came to his apartment in 1997 to confiscate his Hi-Tec boots, a Sharpie marker and a stun gun-three things possibly used in JonBenet's murder.

The CU student came under investigation after police found his Internet site-a series of essays about sadomasochism, which included an instructional piece about Japanese bondage and how to tie complex knots.

On the website, known as "Wide Awake," The Prophet had posted a self-authored essay called "Barbie Doll, The Ultimate ****." His essay chronicled the sexual torture of Barbie in an extremely sadistic, vicious manner. When John Ramsey found JonBenet, the killer had left the girl's Barbie doll nightgown beside her.

Few people around town knew The Prophet. But during his college years, the manager of a local diner allowed him to hang a mobile of naked Barbie dolls from the restaurant's ceiling. As I was investigating The Prophet in the summer of 1998, I found a similar doll in the Ramsey's front yard, stuffed inside a tiny white sandal. I wondered if the shoe had once belonged to JonBenet. The blonde doll had a little white rope around her neck and a red spot marked on her gown by her vaginal area. I immediately called the police who collected the item into evidence.

In his book Mindhunter, former FBI profiler John Douglas-who was employed by the Ramsey's to profile the killer-described men who torture Barbie dolls and predicted they would eventually advance to torturing small, helpless girls.

The Prophet's Internet site featured strange graphics, with a variety of different kinds of hearts. Some hearts had spikes coming out of them. I recalled that when JonBenet's body was found, a small shape like a red heart had been drawn on her left hand.

So I decided to knock on The Prophet's apartment door in order to discuss these issues. A student told me the previous tenant moved to San Francisco. Today, The Prophet lives and works in Denver and remains among the ranks of the city's 140 "possible suspects

sissi's note...
BTW he was investigated and CLEARED!

 

[VespaElf]

I belive it wasn't him (after all why would the Ramsey's lie on a stranger's behalf)but the Japanese bondage tid bit is quite interesting .............hhhmmmmmmmmmmm

 

[Ivy]

"The Prophet" is weird, but he didn't kill JonBenet. If there was any way possible to pin her death on him, the Ramseys would have succeeded in doing so by now.

imo

 

[K777angel]

It is frustrating when people put energy into every weirdo they come across as somehow possibly being involved in the death and cover-up of JonBenet Ramsey just because they fit some element of the crime - but IGNORE all the elements that flat out rule them out. Like BEING in the home that night and having your jacket fibers all over the crime scene and the dead child's body and neck ligature!! Just one critical example.

This crime was NOT committed by some sex pervert. That was NOT the motivation for the crime. So you can forget that angle.
Money was not the movitation for the crime. Much as the stager hoped you would believe it.
What was the motivation for the crime? Well which crime do you mean? The one that caused her death or the staging/cover-up and obstruction of justice?

The first is obviously anger. A true "accident" in the purest definition of the word would not necessitate a cover-up. So we know whoever lashed out at JonBenet with that head blow struck out in anger.
That's the first motivation that got the crime going.
The second motivation is obviously CYA. Fear. Protection for the family and perp. Diverting attention away from what really happened.

NONE of the circumstances and facts in this case point to a sexual predator or
pervert.
Everything points to a familial homicide covered up.

 

[cherub]

:innocent: as much as I tried to believe the paerents , It seems you are very right.

 

[AbigailCrane]

Burke Ramsey's best friend, Doug Stine, had a live-in caregiver by the name of Nathan Inouye who lived at the home of Glen and Susan Stine. Nathan was a teenaged student attending Colorado University. He was also a member of a "group of individuals" who belonged to a small organization (29 BU students) called the Asian Pacific American Coalition, known simply as APAC. The BU chapter of APAC was politically active in the Boulder area and its programs included speakers who, IMO, bordered on extremist views.

Nathan lived with the Stines but also knew the Ramseys very well, and sometimes even helped babysit JonBenet and Burke. Nathan Inouye's name doesn't appear anywhere in PMPT and other major publications about the murder. I often wonder about that.

APAC at BU suspiciously folded just weeks after the murder of JonBenet. I often wonder about that. .

I often wondered about Nathan Inouye when Cecelia Zhang's killer was found in Canada. Quotes from the Toronto Star:

"As investigators continue to work the case, Min Chen, the 21-year-old Chinese visa student accused in Cecilia's death, appeared briefly yesterday in a court in Brampton, where a preliminary hearing is likely to take place next June".

"Chen is alleged by police to have murdered Cecilia soon after abducting her in the early hours of Oct. 20 from a bedroom of her home on Whitehorn Cres. in North York. Cecilia's parents last saw their child when they put her to bed Oct. 19"

"Chen, who police say was known to the Zhang family, spent many hours with Cecilia, having been introduced to her by a woman who was among the Chinese visa students who had rented rooms in the household. It's known that both Cecilia and the accused man loved to fish and that both had fished in the Credit River".

Was Nathan in the USA on a student VISA like Min Chen? How much time did he spend with Jonbenet? Did he like action movies? :twocents:

 

[BlueCrab]

Was Nathan in the USA on a student VISA? How much time did he spend with Jonbenet? Did he like action movies?

Abigail,

Nathan Inouye is from California. When he finished at CU Boulder he went into the Peace Corps from 1999 to 2001 and served in Kingston, Jamaica. Nathan then attended graduate school at UCLA and is now teaching high school in California.

I don't know how much time Nathan spent with JonBenet, nor do I know about his likes and dislikes in regard to movies. Nathan struck my interest because of the apparent organized effort to keep his name and Doug Stine's name out of the press and other publications, such as Laurence Schiller's "Perfect Murder, Perfect Town".

PMPT pb hit the book stores immediately following the termination of the 13-month Ramsey grand jury in October of 1999. IMO that GJ solved the JonBenet Ramsey murder; it involved children too young to prosecute; and the Colorado Children's Code prevents the public disclosure of their names. A court gag order sealed everything. It appears to me that Doug Stine's name had been purged from PMPT to comply with Colorado law. Doug's name appears only once in the text, but appears multiple times in the name index. Nathan Inouye's name doesn't appear at all.

JMO

 

[Nehemiah]

But it seems to me with the R's high powered attorneys and obvious political influence, if someone over 18 had indeed been involved, that person could have been hung to high heaven. He could have been the "scapegoat" of sorts and taken the rap even if the actual circumstances involving minor children were never known or even disclosed.

IMO

 

[BlueCrab]

But it seems to me with the R's high powered attorneys and obvious political influence, if someone over 18 had indeed been involved, that person could have been hung to high heaven. He could have been the "scapegoat" of sorts and taken the rap even if the actual circumstances involving minor children were never known or even disclosed.

IMO

Nehemiah,

There are two possibilities in regard to why the authorities wouldn't prosecute a teen who might have been involved with children under the age of 10 to commit a serious crime:

1. It's against Colorado law to disclose the names of children under 10 who commit a crime; and the discovery process and the criminal trial itself of a teen would have forced the disclosure of the names of the younger children, thus violating the law and the court's protective order.

2. Perhaps the authorities aren't aware of an older suspect. The number of uninvestigated coverups and uninvestigated lies in this case are enormous.

Another reason I think a teenaged boy is involved is the ransom note. It reads as if written or dictated by a teenaged male.

JMO

 

[sissi]

Patsy is an easy suspect for the Ramseys dunnit.
Kids are good for "some Ramsey dunnit".
If we are going to go easy, the Pughs are the easiest for the "intruder dunnits".
Daddy drunk, family with money fights, child slightly snubbed at party,are things that could sure lead up to ," here's the key, go get the damn check".
IMO

 

[K777angel]

While it is curious that even though the Stine's were the last known people the Ramseys visited that Christmas night - yet they did not phone them the next morning to come over like their other friends - and the Ramseys then ended up LIVING with the Stine's - I do not think there is any evidence other than odd circumstances (including too the Stine's picking up and leaving Colorado and moving to Georgia with the Ramseys...) that link the Stines to the crime. This Nathan angle is pure fantasy.
There is no physical evidence at the crime scene other than JonBenet's immediate family.
The note does NOT sound like a teenage male but an adult female. It gets real "wifey" toward the end ("go the bank" "bring your attache'" "when you come home" "it's up to you now JOHN" "be well rested") Give me a break.
Not to mention Patsy's unique phrases she was known to use: "and hence" "gentlemen" "good southern common sense" etc. etc.
Her exclamation point usage, her handwriting similarities along with everything else.
No 4th grade kid wrote this and there is simply NO evidence of a teenage boy with another 4th grader being in the house that night.

This is a familial homicide with alot of secrets known only to them buried.
I think there were most likely problems that had been growing between Burke and JonBenet in the recent past and it just blew up in tradgedy that night.
In their wildest dreams while they were covering up that crime that night they did not think the word of the death would ever get past Boulder/Denver - let alone the entire world!!

 

[sissi]

http://216.239.41.104/search?q=cach.../pdf/PART_ONE.pdf+mike+mcelroy&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

If anyone has the time, perhaps Brother Moon? ,I would like to know what ya think of this?

 

[BlueCrab]

There is no physical evidence at the crime scene other than JonBenet's immediate family.

Angel,

That's one of the problems. Where is the missing evidence? SOMEONE other than John, Patsy, or Burke apparently removed crime scene evidence from the house immediately after the murder. Only a fifth person in the house that night could have done that prior to the 911 call at 5:52 A.M. For instance:

o Where is the roll of Shurtape brand of black duct tape? There was no duct tape like that anywhere else in the house.

o Where is the rest of the Stansport brand white cord? It came in 50' and 100' packages and the cord used on JonBenet was the only white cord in the house.

o Where is the stun gun? Those were definitely stun gun injuries on JonBenet's face, back, and lower leg.

o Where is the dark blue cloth that was used to wipe down JonBenet after death and which left dark blue fibers on her labia and thighs? Not one piece of cloth in the house matched the dark blue fibers. It was likely an item of clothing, such as a shirt, and the perp wore it out of the house when he left.

0 Where are JonBenet's size 6 panties she was wearing prior to being killed? The perp re-dressed her in ridiculous size 12 panties while cleaning her up. Did the size 6 panties become a trophy?

o Where is the red pen that was used to draw the red heart on JonBenet's left palm? The house was searched thoroughly and the pen was never found.

o Where are the nine missing pages from the notepad from which the ransom note pages were torn?

These missing items of crime scene evidence point to a fifth person in the house that night and, when he left, the items left with him.

JMO

 

[K777angel]

Angel,

That's one of the problems. Where is the missing evidence? SOMEONE other than John, Patsy, or Burke apparently removed crime scene evidence from the house immediately after the murder. Only a fifth person in the house that night could have done that prior to the 911 call at 5:52 A.M. For instance:

o Where is the roll of Shurtape brand of black duct tape? There was no duct tape like that anywhere else in the house.

o Where is the rest of the Stansport brand white cord? It came in 50' and 100' packages and the cord used on JonBenet was the only white cord in the house.

o Where is the stun gun? Those were definitely stun gun injuries on JonBenet's face, back, and lower leg.

o Where is the dark blue cloth that was used to wipe down JonBenet after death and which left dark blue fibers on her labia and thighs? Not one piece of cloth in the house matched the dark blue fibers. It was likely an item of clothing, such as a shirt, and the perp wore it out of the house when he left.

0 Where are JonBenet's size 6 panties she was wearing prior to being killed? The perp re-dressed her in ridiculous size 12 panties while cleaning her up. Did the size 6 panties become a trophy?

o Where is the red pen that was used to draw the red heart on JonBenet's left palm? The house was searched thoroughly and the pen was never found.

o Where are the nine missing pages from the notepad from which the ransom note pages were torn?

These missing items of crime scene evidence point to a fifth person in the house that night and, when he left, the items left with him.

JMO

Bluecrab, so many refutations I don't know where to begin.
First of all, this obviously was NOT a "planned" crime. No one intent on invading that home on Christmas night (so bold and risky an idea to begin with) to KIDNAP a child is going to come so ill-equipped. NO note brought with him, and you want me to believe that the restraining item he chose to bring to bind her is CORD? Of all the things he would have BROUGHT to the house - the note is obviously most important and he did not bring one, and the binding device ending up being "cord" implies an object of opportunity that was lying around. Like the broken paintbrush handle, pen, pad of paper.
That cord could have been bought for John's sailing and used also for the kids' sled or any other thing. Because they did not find more of it - does NOT conclude that some excess of it was taken away. If that were the case the perp would also take away the pen, pad of paper and paint tote or brushes.

Same thing with the duct tape. For all anyone knows it went into a pocket or purse and was right there all along - but just not for eyes to behold. And walked away when the Ramseys left that afternoon.

And there is NO evidence - only speculation by a minority - that a stun gun was ever used on JonBenet. You cannot include this in the same category as the cord, duct tape, etc. that we KNOW exist and police have posession of.
You can't call it "missing" when you've no proof it ever existed.

And for the fibers found on her, let me tell you what forensic specialist Dr. Henry Lee involved in the case itself has to say about it:
"This questioning pertained to the black fibers found
on the duct tape, JonBenet's body, the white blanket, and the floor of the wine cellar." They questioned Patsy about what she wore on the morning she discovered her daughter missing from her room - and Patsy described the red sweater and black slacks she'd worn the night before.

You do not know what dirty laundry - with size 6 panties in them - they took as evidence. I recall they DID indeed retrieve some of JonBenet's underwear as evidence.

Most likely JonBenet and Daphne wrote on themselves during the day at the White's. Very typical of kids this age and JonBenet was known to do it Patsy said.

You could probably look at most of the notepads in my house and find missing pages in the middle of them. It's not uncommon for me to do that. Means nothing in this crime. Proves nothing. It's the note itself and the practice one that DO mean something.

Sorry Bluecrab but I think you are trying to prove a theory that the evidence just does not fit. So far I see not one thing that lends credence to a fifth person being in the house that night and being involved in the crime.
I see LOTS of evidence that her immediate family who we know and they admit WERE there that night - were absolutely involved in the crime.
Just "who" did "what" is the $64,000 question.

 

[BlueCrab]

Angel,

Regardless of what Henry Lee writes, the BLACK fibers at the crime scene were allegedly from the black and red jacket Patsy wore that evening.

The dark BLUE fibers were on the labia and inner thighs of JonBenet. No matches to these dark blue fibers nor the garment they came from were found elsewhere in the house. The source of the dark blue fibers is missing.

JMO

 

[BlueCrab]

And there is NO evidence - only speculation by a minority - that a stun gun was ever used on JonBenet. You cannot include this in the same category as the cord, duct tape, etc. that we KNOW exist and police have posession of.
You can't call it "missing" when you've no proof it ever existed.

Angel,

The stun gun injuries on JonBenet are NOT speculation. They exist. We have all seen the crime scene photos of the injuries. Most forensic pathologists believe those injuries are consistent with the marks that would be produced by a stun gun, including the only pathologist who examined and measured the injuries -- Dr. John Meyer. Therefore, the stun gun did indeed exist and is one of the missing items of evidence. It wasn't found in the house -- and was most likely removed by a fifth person who left the house in the middle of the night following the murder.

JMO

 

[K777angel]

Angel,

Regardless of what Henry Lee writes, the BLACK fibers at the crime scene were allegedly from the black and red jacket Patsy wore that evening.

The dark BLUE fibers were on the labia and inner thighs of JonBenet. No matches to these dark blue fibers nor the garment they came from were found elsewhere in the house. The source of the dark blue fibers is missing.

JMO

Well Bluecrab, someone somewhere may have CALLED those fibers found on JonBenet "dark blue" - but Det. Arndt, who was there at the autopsy, quoted Coroner Dr. Meyers in her application for search warrants as telling her that he found "numerous traces of a dark fiber when he examined JonBenet's vaginal and pubic areas." He also found dark fibers and dark hairs on her shirt. No mention that the dark color was "blue."
In addition, the Boulder Police informed John Ramsey that the dark fibers found in JonBenet's pubic area matched those fibers from the black shirt he wore that night. One made in Israel.

 

[K777angel]

Angel,

The stun gun injuries on JonBenet are NOT speculation. They exist. We have all seen the crime scene photos of the injuries. Most forensic pathologists believe those injuries are consistent with the marks that would be produced by a stun gun, including the only pathologist who examined and measured the injuries -- Dr. John Meyer. Therefore, the stun gun did indeed exist and is one of the missing items of evidence. It wasn't found in the house -- and was most likely removed by a fifth person who left the house in the middle of the night following the murder.

JMO

Bluecrab be honest about what Meyer REALLY said! He said, and this is just a FACT - that you can NOT determine whether a stun gun was used unless you EXAMINE THE TISSUE. Which they could not do as Hunter nor the Ramseys would agree to have the body exhumed. The injuries described in the official autopy report are NOT the way an injury would be described were it the result from a stun gun. No burns. Just "abrasions." Not the same thing.

So you can speculate all you want. This stun gun nonsense is NOT a fact.
Anymore than you can claim to know exactly what object it was that was used to cause the head blow. It would just be pure speculation.