WFTV Exclusive: Plea deal next Monday on Check Fraud Charges

[coco puff]

Bolded by me: Yeah I hope this isn't off topic because it speaks of AH and KC.
That part about her moving in is so interesting to me. Normally Kc would lie and have a way out. In this case she down right backed her self into a corner. I think there may be something there. Kc talked to TL about 15000.00 and Ca mentioned that Kc was talking on the phone to TL about I think she said 14000.00 . Kc went as far as having AH mail her camera to the Hopespring address. So, it looked like they were going to indeed move in together. I wonder if Kc and Ca were working on a plan to get GA out of the house. Wonder where this 15000.00 figure came about. I think it is possible that Kc thought she was going to get 15000.00 somehow. What do ya think? as always theories and moo

She lied about being pregnant.
She lied about her child being alive.
She lied about having a job.
She lied about the existance of a nanny.

There is no way out of any of these lies. They will eventually be proven to be a lie.

 

[LambChop]

Plus how do you lie about going to work everyday and not have a job while living at home? She was surrounded by enablers who permitted her to get away with whatever she decided to do. If she was called on anything she would throw a fit or cast that person off, no longer useful to her. JG comes to mind. She never has had a way out, she just believed she could always pull it off because everyone permitted her to do so. Ever hear the saying, "She thinks she can get away with murder?" This would be someone who would argue with you when their dog is peeing on your lawn and they tell you it's not their dog.

 

[logicalgirl]

I don't remember any video of AH but there have been multiple pics of her posted. IIRC there is the audio recording and the transcript of her depo/interview. Here is a link w/her pic.

http://www.wesh.com/news/22285878/detail.html

Oh Geez, I've looked and looked, and apologized for speaking in error everyone! I do remember her speaking, not Annie - because Annie didn't impress me at all and I thought she was being dishonest - but Amy? Sorry again I brought it up!

 

[ZsaZsa]

Bolded by me: Yeah I hope this isn't off topic because it speaks of AH and KC.
That part about her moving in is so interesting to me. Normally Kc would lie and have a way out. In this case she down right backed her self into a corner. I think there may be something there. Kc talked to TL about 15000.00 and Ca mentioned that Kc was talking on the phone to TL about I think she said 14000.00 . Kc went as far as having AH mail her camera to the Hopespring address. So, it looked like they were going to indeed move in together. I wonder if Kc and Ca were working on a plan to get GA out of the house. Wonder where this 15000.00 figure came about. I think it is possible that Kc thought she was going to get 15000.00 somehow. What do ya think? as always theories and moo

CA could kick GA out and stay in the house, She didn't have any qualms about doing it the year before, it seems. If KC and CA were working on a plan to get GA out of the house why did KC need to lie when Amy's mail was forwarded to their house? Just another example that everything that comes out of KC's mouth is a lie- simple as that. Of all people her own mother knows the least about her. She is SO gullible.
The only one with $15,000 was probably her maternal Grandmother, Shirley Plesea- KC probably had a few more of her checks stashed for an 'emergency'.... just like before.

 

[skygirl]

Bolded by me: Yeah I hope this isn't off topic because it speaks of AH and KC.
That part about her moving in is so interesting to me. Normally Kc would lie and have a way out. In this case she down right backed her self into a corner. I think there may be something there. Kc talked to TL about 15000.00 and Ca mentioned that Kc was talking on the phone to TL about I think she said 14000.00 . Kc went as far as having AH mail her camera to the Hopespring address. So, it looked like they were going to indeed move in together. I wonder if Kc and Ca were working on a plan to get GA out of the house. Wonder where this 15000.00 figure came about. I think it is possible that Kc thought she was going to get 15000.00 somehow. What do ya think? as always theories and moo

I have nothing to back this up. Just theories and o/t, but want to go there and think more about this.....

I wonder if KC knew how much her g-ma had in her account, because she stole from it twice if I'm not mistaken.

G-ma(shirley p) also told on KC to CA on the 15th (Fathers Day) during the visit, about the stealing.

IOW-if G-ma(shirley p) was on KC's list to clean out financially? Or even do her in as well?

(sorry o/t)

 

[doogiesgirl]

Very interesting......

"“There is some strong indication to me, from my experience, that a plea to these charges, if in fact there's an adjudication, may be an indication that the murder case may not go to trial.""

http://www.wftv.com/news/22275948/detail.html

There are two phases of a criminal trial: (1) the guilt phase -- determining whether or not she is guilty of the crimes charged, and (2) the punishment phase.

"Withhold of Adjudication" in a nutshell is skipping over the first phase of a trial where they determine whether or not she is guilty of a crime and with the consent of the defendant, they go straight to the second phase of punishment.

There are many collateral effects of being convicted of a felony. It does mean that she can truthfully say she was not convicted of those crimes that were the subject of the "withhold of adjudication."

Here's an article from the Florida Bar Journal.
http://goliath.ecnext.com/coms2/gi_0199-7651199/Withhold-of-adjudication-what-everyone.html

So if she won't be doing any additional time (only be getting time served) and this won't count as a conviction (if I'm understanding the whole adjunction thing), what is the state or AH really getting out of this?

For a good idea on how this will actually play out in court next Monday, read Hornsby's blog post from Dec 10:
http://blog.richardhornsby.com/2009/12/casey-anthony-insufficient-funds-part-deux/


The parts about Plea to the Bench and Strateregy seem especially
relevant.

_____________________

Well I've read all 9 pages of this thread. Many varying opinions. But I cannot fathom that the prosecution would make a deal with KC that had any kind of stipulation such as : "delay of adjudication/withholding adjudication". It seems to me the prosecutions whole purpose for pushing this check fraud trial through right now was to secure a conviction that guarantees that they can say to the jury (murder jury) that this defendant(KC) has prior past convictions that speak to her character/that she is a felon. I was under the assumption that was the WHOLE point for the state.

Now, I know they do care that AH has justice and closure.....but I would think that if they thought bringing her(AH's) case forward, before the murder case would in any way harm the murder case, they would speak to Amy about the greater importance of doing all they can to see that CAYLEE has justice first and foremost. And I see AH as a person who would agree to that. So for that reason, I cannot believe that the state would make any deals with KC that would allow her to postpone/withhold conviction in the check fraud case.

The only concern I have is the law. I read some of RH's blog and found it most informative....but I didn't have time to read all of it. Since I know next to nothing about these matters, what I am wondering about is if there is some kind of law in FLA that would make it impossible for the state to bring up her felony fraud conviction in the murder trial because of the sequence of KC's crimes. Since the state believes she murdered Caylee sometime on or near June 16th and the check fraud took place many days after that, would that give the defense a way of seeing to it that it is not brought into the murder trial? If this is so then I understand why they went ahead with the fraud case/took a plea, it would be to see justice done for AH. I cannot see the state conceding anything to KC for any motive just to get this case through the court.

If the state made concessions to the defense and if both sides agreed to plea out the murder charge......I can only remotely see the state trading off the DP to wipe out the murder trial, settling for LWOP for KC. I don't know for sure how I would feel about that at this moment....I'd have to think about it longer. BUT...at least some justice has begun to smack KC in the face. We can only wait for the shove she has coming.

MOO

 

[The World According]

_____________________

Well I've read all 9 pages of this thread. Many varying opinions. But I cannot fathom that the prosecution would make a deal with KC that had any kind of stipulation such as : "delay of adjudication/withholding adjudication". It seems to me the prosecutions whole purpose for pushing this check fraud trial through right now was to secure a conviction that guarantees that they can say to the jury (murder jury) that this defendant(KC) has prior past convictions that speak to her character/that she is a felon. I was under the assumption that was the WHOLE point for the state.

Now, I know they do care that AH has justice and closure.....but I would think that if they thought bringing her(AH's) case forward, before the murder case would in any way harm the murder case, they would speak to Amy about the greater importance of doing all they can to see that CAYLEE has justice first and foremost. And I see AH as a person who would agree to that. So for that reason, I cannot believe that the state would make any deals with KC that would allow her to postpone/withhold conviction in the check fraud case.

The only concern I have is the law. I read some of RH's blog and found it most informative....but I didn't have time to read all of it. Since I know next to nothing about these matters, what I am wondering about is if there is some kind of law in FLA that would make it impossible for the state to bring up her felony fraud conviction in the murder trial because of the sequence of KC's crimes. Since the state believes she murdered Caylee sometime on or near June 16th and the check fraud took place many days after that, would that give the defense a way of seeing to it that it is not brought into the murder trial? If this is so then I understand why they went ahead with the fraud case/took a plea, it would be to see justice done for AH. I cannot see the state conceding anything to KC for any motive just to get this case through the court.

If the state made concessions to the defense and if both sides agreed to plea out the murder charge......I can only remotely see the state trading off the DP to wipe out the murder trial, settling for LWOP for KC. I don't know for sure how I would feel about that at this moment....I'd have to think about it longer. BUT...at least some justice has begun to smack KC in the face. We can only wait for the shove she has coming.

MOO

This is from R. Hornsby, :Mr. Hornsby explains "So, if any witness (but especially Cindy, George, or Lee Anthony) is called to testify by either party and the defense attempts to elicit exculpatory statements attributable to Casey Anthony, the State can impeach the exculpatory statements attributed to Casey Anthony by introducing her 13 felony convictions and asking Judge Strickland to read Florida Standard Jury Instruction 2.5 to the jury at the same time:

“The evidence of Casey Anthony’s thirteen felony convictions should be considered by you … in weighing the credibility of the statements attributed to Casey Anthony.”
This is all of course IF she is indeed convicted of the fraud. on his blog, click on : Casey Anthony: Insufficient Funds (Part Uno)

http://blog.richardhornsby.com/2009/...nds-part-deux/

 

[SleuthyMama]

While I see every reason why the prosecution would want to be able to introduce a prior conviction as evidence of Casey's character, I know for myself, if I was a juror in the murder trial, the simple fact that she was caught in so many LIES would be enough to damage her reputation in my eyes.

I mean, come on, this is a woman who insisted she had a job at Universal up until the moment they were walking down the hall to her "office!"

 

[logicalgirl]

You are right about the timing Doogiesgirl, but she was charged first with the check fraud charges, before the murder was she not? Maybe that's the reason it is being argued first. Or maybe it has more to do with the severity of the charges, the more severe the crime charged, the more time it takes to prepare and get the trial on the docket. I know SA want those felonies on record when the murder case goes to trial for extra in the penalty phase, and perhaps to trap Cindy and George if they try for perjury when testifying.

On another note, has anyone else noticed how tight Andrea has that leash around Baez's neck when it comes to media comments. When have we ever known him to be quiet with a no comment at all.

Who knew all it took was a tight pull at the leash and a sit command!

 

[Macushla]

I have always felt that the circumstances surrounding the check fraud was very important to the prosecutions's murder case. IF they had not been able to even mention KC's antics with the checks, etc. during the murder trial - it would have punched a huge hole in their time line, made it harder (though not impossible) to show KC's true character, show how uncaring she was that Caylee was missing, etc. The check forging plays, in my opinion, a very important part in the prosecutions case for murder. I can't imagine the prosecution agreeing to delayed sentencing or anything of that nature. I guess we will find out on Monday, won't we? I think JB finally figured out what the Judge was saying during the December hearing and a light bulb went on in his head, hey maybe we would be better off if we let Judge Strickland decide! It's a shame it took him this long to figure out what the Judge was trying to tell him.

 

[skygirl]

I have always felt that the circumstances surrounding the check fraud was very important to the prosecutions's murder case. IF they had not been able to even mention KC's antics with the checks, etc. during the murder trial - it would have punched a huge hole in their time line, made it harder (though not impossible) to show KC's true character, show how uncaring she was that Caylee was missing, etc. The check forging plays, in my opinion, a very important part in the prosecutions case for murder. I can't imagine the prosecution agreeing to delayed sentencing or anything of that nature. I guess we will find out on Monday, won't we? I think JB finally figured out what the Judge was saying during the December hearing and a light bulb went on in his head, hey maybe we would be better off if we let Judge Strickland decide! It's a shame it took him this long to figure out what the Judge was trying to tell him.

BBM:
I totally agree that this is huge, and hope that it will be able to be used in the Murder trial. I think it will have a tremendous impact on the Jury. I remember watching the store tapes for the first time.....It was the only time we can see KC in action while she is missing Caylee. When you see her demenor and see what she is purchasing, it just goes right to your heart. How in the world could she be doing this while her baby is "missing"?

 

[Pattymarie]

If she takes the plea agreement...then she will be a convicted felon right? So wouldn't she have a sentence passed? Wouldn't this mean she would be moved to prison rather than the Orange County Jail?

 

[The World According]

BBM:
I totally agree that this is huge, and hope that it will be able to be used in the Murder trial. I think it will have a tremendous impact on the Jury. I remember watching the store tapes for the first time.....It was the only time we can see KC in action while she is missing Caylee. When you see her demenor and see what she is purchasing, it just goes right to your heart. How in the world could she be doing this while her baby is "missing"?

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGxKL8xM1YI[/ame]

 

[logicalgirl]

BBM:
I totally agree that this is huge, and hope that it will be able to be used in the Murder trial. I think it will have a tremendous impact on the Jury. I remember watching the store tapes for the first time.....It was the only time we can see KC in action while she is missing Caylee. When you see her demenor and see what she is purchasing, it just goes right to your heart. How in the world could she be doing this while her baby is "missing"?

Well, we do have the Fusion pictures. Even if she is a convicted felon when she goes into her murder trial, I'm not sure if the store tapes can be brought in - or if SA can just bring in the actual conviction charges. I'll think I'll hop over to the lawyer question thread and leave a question for those of us who want to know.

 

[Pattymarie]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGxKL8xM1YI

Oh...my...goodness....haven't watched this in a long time...in light of all we now know....this tape alone would convince me of her guilt! (Btw, the Beatles tunes in the background are hilarious and dead on!)

 

[autumnlover]

Bolded by me: Yeah I hope this isn't off topic because it speaks of AH and KC.
That part about her moving in is so interesting to me. Normally Kc would lie and have a way out. In this case she down right backed her self into a corner. I think there may be something there. Kc talked to TL about 15000.00 and Ca mentioned that Kc was talking on the phone to TL about I think she said 14000.00 . Kc went as far as having AH mail her camera to the Hopespring address. So, it looked like they were going to indeed move in together. I wonder if Kc and Ca were working on a plan to get GA out of the house. Wonder where this 15000.00 figure came about. I think it is possible that Kc thought she was going to get 15000.00 somehow. What do ya think? as always theories and moo

BBM. In fact, KC did lie to AH about the house. I read AH's interview with OCSO last night and she stated that every time she asked KC about moving in, KC had another excuse, like, "My dad is fixing something..." etc. (I'm paraphrasing). Finally, KC told AH that CA changed her mind about turning the house over to KC because she had 30 days to exercise that option. Here is the link, scroll down to page 5:

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/4823534/Casey-Anthony-Amy-Huizenga-document

 

[Gnatcatcher]

Was there never a security video from Winn Dixie? I also would like to know if Casey did a "balance inquiry" on Amy's account before she began her binge spending, or if she just went along assuming it was the loaves and the fishes and the money would never run out.

 

[MissJames]

You are right about the timing Doogiesgirl, but she was charged first with the check fraud charges, before the murder was she not? Maybe that's the reason it is being argued first. Or maybe it has more to do with the severity of the charges, the more severe the crime charged, the more time it takes to prepare and get the trial on the docket. I know SA want those felonies on record when the murder case goes to trial for extra in the penalty phase, and perhaps to trap Cindy and George if they try for perjury when testifying.

On another note, has anyone else noticed how tight Andrea has that leash around Baez's neck when it comes to media comments. When have we ever known him to be quiet with a no comment at all.

Who knew all it took was a tight pull at the leash and a sit command!

I wonder if AL would prefer to plea out the murder case. If they plea. And get LWP AL could chalk it up as another "win" since KC would avoid the DP.

 

[RR0004]

If she is given a plea deal and pleads guilty will the Pros be able to bring up these charges in the murder trial? I want the jury to know what kind of a person she is and how she steals from friends and family. The jury needs to know that she has a felony on her record. Will it be a felony if they let her plea out? I wonder why the Pros is going along with this or do they have a choice if she decides to plead guilty. If the deal is that she has to plead guilty before she is given a deal can't the Pros say no?

Makes me want Monday to come real quick.

 

[RR0004]

Bolded by me: Yeah I hope this isn't off topic because it speaks of AH and KC.
That part about her moving in is so interesting to me. Normally Kc would lie and have a way out. In this case she down right backed her self into a corner. I think there may be something there. Kc talked to TL about 15000.00 and Ca mentioned that Kc was talking on the phone to TL about I think she said 14000.00 . Kc went as far as having AH mail her camera to the Hopespring address. So, it looked like they were going to indeed move in together. I wonder if Kc and Ca were working on a plan to get GA out of the house. Wonder where this 15000.00 figure came about. I think it is possible that Kc thought she was going to get 15000.00 somehow. What do ya think? as always theories and moo

Do you think Casey was really so cruel that she'd kick her own father out of the house after he'd just suffered a stroke?

(LOL couldn't resist!)