Why would the Ramseys need to stage?

[Holdontoyourhat]

[/b]
I was going to just let this ride, but I had to come back to it. Pedophiles do not walk around with a big "P" stitched on their clothing. My grandfather was an "upstanding citizen" who sang in the choir, taught Sunday school, held a government job and was married to the same woman all his adult life. Pretty decent all-round good guy, right? A man with morals who would never assault or abuse a six-year-old, right? WRONG. He molested my mother for years and had her so caught up in the molester/victim mindset that when my sister and I got to an age where my mother figured he would start trying to molest us, she could only vaguely hint at warnings to us...worded in such a way that young girls would have no clue what she was talking about. Had she ever gone to my grandmother about the molestation, grandmother would have thought she was crazy, grandmother thought my grandfather was perfect.

SO my sister and I get to the "ripe" age, and yep, he molested the both of us as well. And we were adults before we could even share that information with each other, because we'd been told all our lives that grandpa was perfect...so anything a "perfect" man did to us was aokay, right?

The mental games, the guilt and the shame took my brilliant mother to the point of insanity and when faced with the knowledge that she was going to have to go back home and live with her mother and father, she chose to kill herself. She left a note detailing the abuse...a note which my grandmother found, deemed "insane" and destroyed. She never told anyone about the note until I was 32 years old, and then she did so only because she let it slip. To the day she died she refused to believe her perfect husband would do such to anyone. But he did.

So tell me again your list of people who would molest a six-year-old girl? Pedophiles come in all shapes and sizes, and there is nothing I've heard or read about JR that would rule him out as a pedophile. But there is much about what I've heard and seen of him that makes my creep factor alarm go off like crazy.

I do sympathize, believe me.

To provide a rebuttal, I would read your very own post. Here you are discussing your pedophile relative openly in public. Shocking testimony to say the least. Now then, where is that kind of testimony in JBR's case from either before or after the murder? As I said, murdering pedophiles don't just come out of nowhere, do their deed, and then 'get better' like RDI wants us to believe. Your creep factor alarm is perhaps going off falsely, because there's no indication from anyone that anybody in the current pool is a pedophile. JMK was as close as it got.

 

[my_tee_mouse]

I do sympathize, believe me.

To provide a rebuttal, I would read your very own post. Here you are discussing your pedophile relative openly in public. Shocking testimony to say the least. Now then, where is that kind of testimony in JBR's case? As I said, murdering pedophiles don't just 'get better'.

Little dead girls tell no tales.

 

[dodie20]

Part of WHAT staging? There was no staging. The garrote was real and was used to strangle JBR to death. Don't take my word for it, its all in the autopsy report.

The ransom note was the intruder explaining JBR's murder was politically motivated and foreign: small foreign faction, but not the country..., not the only fat cat..., Victory!

The ONLY person who is going to sexually assault or abuse a 6 year old is a pedophile or someone without morals who is working for a pedophile. I have not read that anyone currently in the suspect pool is a known pedophile. And I don't think pedophiles sexually assault, brutally murder, and then just 'get better' like RDI implies.

I don't agree with you. & who's to say the pedophile was a he, & if it was a he, who's to say he got better? & I think some pedophiles,( pedophiles who've had the bejesus scared out of them, for instance), learn to control their urges. Most pedophiles are sneaky, by nature, & they're not out uncontrollably raping children. They bide their time, & wait for the perfect opportunity, with the perfect victim...usually a relative, who won't tattle.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

I don't agree with you. & who's to say the pedophile was a he, & if it was a he, who's to say he got better? & I think some pedophiles,( pedophiles who've had the bejesus scared out of them, for instance), learn to control their urges. Most pedophiles are sneaky, by nature, & they're not out uncontrollably raping children. They bide their time, & wait for the perfect opportunity, with the perfect victim...usually a relative, who won't tattle.

OK so I am to believe that the pedophile who murdered JBR has quietly continued, and their victims are OK with it despite the historical murder? Or am I to believe that the pedophile who murdered JBR was cured by fright and no longer victimizes? Do you have a theory on this?

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

I think some pedophiles,( pedophiles who've had the bejesus scared out of them, for instance), learn to control their urges.

I wonder if there's a clinical foundation for this: Scare the pedophile and they learn to control it. Maybe you've discovered an important new cure.

Far as I knew they were using drugs, imprisonment (no kids in jail), and castration.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

http://abcnews.go.com/US/jonbenet-ramsey-death-fresh-round-interviews/story?id=11792001&page=1

"I think there's always a chance with technology and confession," Schiller said of finding the killer. "I think there's a very, very big chance that the killer has passed on and no longer exists."

my bold

I think there's a very, very big chance that the killer has instead received treatment for pedophilia, in these passing years.

 

[slug]

I don't believe there really is a treatment for pedophillia.
For anyone to get cured of that they would have to admit they have something which needs curing.
From speaking with people who have had to work with sex offenders they are usally the politest and come across really well in comparison to other offenders but they are so manipulative that they will say what needs saying to suit the circumstance.
If JBR was abused before that night it is possible that the abuser has continued when they have been able to. And unfortuantly to many are not caught.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

I don't believe there really is a treatment for pedophillia.
For anyone to get cured of that they would have to admit they have something which needs curing.
From speaking with people who have had to work with sex offenders they are usally the politest and come across really well in comparison to other offenders but they are so manipulative that they will say what needs saying to suit the circumstance.
If JBR was abused before that night it is possible that the abuser has continued when they have been able to. And unfortuantly to many are not caught.

There is no 'curative' treatement, correct. But there are treatments

Pedophilia (or paedophilia) encompasses a range of adult sexual interest in prepubertal children. As a medical diagnosis, it is defined as a psychiatric disorder in adults or late adolescents (persons age 16 and older) characterized by a primary or exclusive sexual interest in prepubescent children (generally age 13 years or younger, though onset of puberty may vary). The child must be at least five years younger in the case of adolescent pedophiles.[1][2][3][4] According to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM), pedophilia is a paraphilia in which a person has intense and recurrent sexual urges towards and fantasies about prepubescent children and on which feelings they have either acted or which cause distress or interpersonal difficulty.[4] The International Classification of Diseases (ICD) uses a slightly wider definition, and defines pedophilia as a sexual preference for children of prepubertal or early pubertal age.[2]

I mean, we KNOW that JBR was sexually assaulted, therefore SOMEBODY is a pedophile.

Kinda rules out BR since he was neither an adolescent 16+ nor more than five years older.

Treatment

Although pedophilia has yet no cure, various treatments are available that are aimed at reducing or preventing the expression of pedophilic behavior, reducing the prevalence of child sexual abuse.[20][62] Treatment of pedophilia often requires collaboration between law enforcement and health care professionals.[5][20] A number of proposed treatment techniques for pedophilia have been developed, though the success rate of these therapies has been very low.[63]

I wonder how the success rate is measured, by repeat offenses?

This is what I'm trying to say: RDI believes in the Dr. Jekyll & Mr. Hyde solution, where the manifestation of the pervert is absent both before and after the heinous child murder. I'm saying that behavior for the pedophile doesn't come and go at will, like RDI would like us to believe. Probably JBR's killer has been treated for pedophelia possibly chemical castration.

 

[dodie20]

OK so I am to believe that the pedophile who murdered JBR has quietly continued, and their victims are OK with it despite the historical murder? Or am I to believe that the pedophile who murdered JBR was cured by fright and no longer victimizes? Do you have a theory on this?

A pedophile who had had the bejesus scared of him, could learn to control his urges, or he might be quietly molesting the occasional child. & no, the victims wouldn't be ok with it, & the 'historical' murder would have no impact on a child. How many 5/6 year olds, would even know about the murder, & then have the capacity to relate it to what was happening to her? ZERO. She would react like any molested child, regardless of Jon Benet. & to say that since he hasn't been accused of molestation is proof that he isn't molesting, is lame. Most pedophiles are crafty, & go a lifetime, without ever being accused, & very few are actually caught. It has been reported, & I believe these reports, that Jon Benet had been abused prior to her death...& there is a short list of suspects.

 

[dodie20]

I wonder if there's a clinical foundation for this: Scare the pedophile and they learn to control it. Maybe you've discovered an important new cure.

Far as I knew they were using drugs, imprisonment (no kids in jail), and castration.

The fear of the death penalty could scare a self preservationist kind of man, out of a lot of things. Being a pedophile, wouldn't make him have no self control or will power. Pedophiles aren't just running the streets, & raping little kids, with abandon. They know what they're doing, & a man who values his life & reputation, would know how to suppress it, or how to wisely pick his victims.

 

[SheBoss]

It's possible that JR has not come in an "personal" contact with children since the murder. Parties where children are, maybe, but not in an environment condusive to molestation (ie spending the night with a child, bathing a child, etc).

Does the sole surviving daughter have kids yet?

 

[dodie20]

There is no 'curative' treatement, correct. But there are treatments

Pedophilia (or paedophilia) encompasses a range of adult sexual interest in prepubertal children. As a medical diagnosis, it is defined as a psychiatric disorder in adults or late adolescents (persons age 16 and older) characterized by a primary or exclusive sexual interest in prepubescent children (generally age 13 years or younger, though onset of puberty may vary). The child must be at least five years younger in the case of adolescent pedophiles.[1][2][3][4] According to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM), pedophilia is a paraphilia in which a person has intense and recurrent sexual urges towards and fantasies about prepubescent children and on which feelings they have either acted or which cause distress or interpersonal difficulty.[4] The International Classification of Diseases (ICD) uses a slightly wider definition, and defines pedophilia as a sexual preference for children of prepubertal or early pubertal age.[2]

I mean, we KNOW that JBR was sexually assaulted, therefore SOMEBODY is a pedophile.

Kinda rules out BR since he was neither an adolescent 16+ nor more than five years older.

Treatment

Although pedophilia has yet no cure, various treatments are available that are aimed at reducing or preventing the expression of pedophilic behavior, reducing the prevalence of child sexual abuse.[20][62] Treatment of pedophilia often requires collaboration between law enforcement and health care professionals.[5][20] A number of proposed treatment techniques for pedophilia have been developed, though the success rate of these therapies has been very low.[63]

I wonder how the success rate is measured, by repeat offenses?

This is what I'm trying to say: RDI believes in the Dr. Jekyll & Mr. Hyde solution, where the manifestation of the pervert is absent both before and after the heinous child murder. I'm saying that behavior for the pedophile doesn't come and go at will, like RDI would like us to believe. Probably JBR's killer has been treated for pedophelia possibly chemical castration.

just because someone is a pedophile, doesn't mean he's acting on it...even someone who has acted on it, in the past. Pedophiles choose to have sex. It's not a demonic possession, that he has no power over. Unfortunately, some are so ruthless, & they act on their urges.

 

[joeskidbeck]

The most clever pedophiles do not look like perverted freaks. They look like doctors, lawyers, priests, and Sunday school teachers. These are the ones who go for years undetected so that when and if their perversion ever comes to light, few will believe it of them. There are many posters right here on WS who will testify to this. They have lost family and loved ones because of their disbelief. I am not accusing JR or anyone else directly of abusing JB, but someone did and I will not fall into the trap of not believing any man could not have done it because of his wealth, status, or business acumen.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

The most clever pedophiles do not look like perverted freaks. They look like doctors, lawyers, priests, and Sunday school teachers. These are the ones who go for years undetected so that when and if their perversion ever comes to light, few will believe it of them. There are many posters right here on WS who will testify to this. They have lost family and loved ones because of their disbelief. I am not accusing JR or anyone else directly of abusing JB, but someone did and I will not fall into the trap of not believing any man could not have done it because of his wealth, status, or business acumen.

my bold

There is no knowledge that JBR was abused by anyone sexually or otherwise prior to the night she was murdered. Its not treated as a case fact except right here on this forum. Its a mere claim.

 

[Toltec]

There is absolutely no cure for Pedophilia, period.... they just simply choose to molest or not molest.

 

[SheBoss]

Switching tacks a little, I have another point I'd like to address if it hasn't been done to death already.

Does anyone have any idea what Pasty's make-up looked like the morning of the 26th?

I don't care what sort of complexion you have, make-up looks very different after 20 hours of wear than freshly applied. I realize she had probably been crying her eyes out, but today's make-up (especially the expensive kind, like I would assume P would wear) will hold up to most anything when freshly applied. Did anyone think to check her make-up?

 

[UKGuy]

my bold

There is no knowledge that JBR was abused by anyone sexually or otherwise prior to the night she was murdered. Its not treated as a case fact except right here on this forum. Its a mere claim.

Holdontoyourhat,
This is not the case you are either ignorant or are deliberately misconstruing the facts.

JonBenet Inside the Ramsey Murder Investigation Chapt. 24. states:-

In mid-September, a panel pediatric experts from around the country reached one of the major conclusions of the investigation - that JonBenet had suffered vaiginal trauma prior to the day she was killed

And JonBenet Inside the Ramsey Murder Investigation Chapt. 32. states:-

Detective Harmer presented a surprising anatomy lesson on vaginas to a meeting attended primarly for men. She showed a picture of the vagina of a normal healthy six-year-old girl and contrasted it with a photo of the vagina of jonBenet. Even to the uninformed the visual difference was apparent, and Harmer cited the experts who said there was evidence of chronic sexual abuse although the detectives referred to it only as 'prior vaginal trauma.'

.

 

[LinasK]

The ONLY person who is going to sexually assault or abuse a 6 year old is a pedophile or someone without morals who is working for a pedophile. I have not read that anyone currently in the suspect pool is a known pedophile. And I don't think pedophiles sexually assault, brutally murder, and then just 'get better' like RDI implies.

Excuse me, when has any RDI implied that pedophiles "get better"????:waitasec:
And I too have publically talked about my molester, also an immediate family member- an uncle molesting a niece also qualifies as incest I have learned!!! He's been dead now for 7 years, so I'd be willing to disclose his name if someone was curious...

 

[joeskidbeck]

LinasK, just the fact that you are willing to speak to us about your abuse/abuser is enough. I know how hard that must be. In another thread when I spoke of the abuse of my nephew it made me literally sick. People who don't believe will not believe no matter what you or I say. Personally, I can't think of one good reason a person would not be willing to accept the fact that JonBenet was abused unless they were very close to her. How many doctors and LE officials does it take to make one believe?

 

[LinasK]

LinasK, just the fact that you are willing to speak to us about your abuse/abuser is enough. I know how hard that must be. In another thread when I spoke of the abuse of my nephew it made me literally sick. People who don't believe will not believe no matter what you or I say. Personally, I can't think of one good reason a person would not be willing to accept the fact that JonBenet was abused unless they were very close to her. How many doctors and LE officials does it take to make one believe?

I would dearly love to shout out to the world that he (insert real name) was a child molester- the reason I haven't is fear of recrimination from his adopted daughter and her family/cousins. I have had the pleasure not too long ago of stomping on his grave! That felt good!