GUILTY WI - 6 dead, 61 injured after car rams into crowd at holiday parade, Waukesha, 21 Nov 2021 *ARREST*

[Cryptic]

The most viable suit would be against parade organizers and town for lack of barriers.

Though anybody can be sued for anything, the town itself also enjoys sovereign immunity. As a result, they do not have to comply with any judgement.

Towns, however, can agree to pay settlements for a variety of reasons. That might include cases stemming from this attack.

At the same time, offering settlements may set a bad precident as victims of any crime could then expect settlements from the city as the city could always have done more to prevent crime "X".

 

[Cryptic]

Given our litigious society now, would these victims have a case against the City/DA for allowing Brooks out on low bail? This might sway the tide against no bail, and low bail for criminals.

The city, probably not as Courts and bails are a county function.

As @Shamrock mentioned, the individual officers are immune from suits. Sovereign immunity also extends to the County as a whole. That does not mean that they cannot agree to settlements stemming from the attack.

 

[Shamrock1]

Though anybody can be sued for anything, the town itself also enjoys sovereign immunity. As a result, they do not have to comply with any judgement.

Towns, however, can agree to pay settlements for a variety of reasons. That might include cases stemming from this attack.

At the same time, offering settlements may set a bad precident as victims of any crime could then expect settlements from the city as the city could always have done more to prevent crime "X".

I’m not quite sure what you mean that sovereign immunity allows a public entity to not comply with a judgment. That’s not true. A judgment would come after a trial that finds the public entity liable for the injuries.

Public entities are found liable all the time. And they pay the damages ordered.

Here, on the limited info we have, I don’t think a suit against the town would survive summary judgment. JMO.

ETA: Summary judgment - Wikipedia

 

[doyoulovemepfg]

The city, probably not as Courts and bails are a county function.

As @Shamrock mentioned, the individual officers are immune from suits. Sovereign immunity also extends to the County as a whole. That does not mean that they cannot agree to settlements stemming from the attack.

One difficulty in receiving a settlement, however, could be county fears of setting a precident where every victim harmed by a perpertrator following a Court decision regarding bond or punishment then sues and also expects a cash settlement.

I don't think a suit against the city would stand here - it is more likely that a suit against the City of Milwaukee or John Chisholm would be one that would be litigated because they are the ones directly responsible for DB being out on bail. Waukesha and Milwaukee are in two separate counties and the optics of this politically - specifically due to Waukesha County (not the city) being one of the reddest places in the nation and Milwaukee being one of the most segregated cities/counties in the country AND a Black perp - would not be good. This is likely why both US Senators from WI warned against co opting this tragedy for political purposes - we have unfortunately already seen some people running for local office using it to solicit campaign donations: https://www.nbc26.com/news/state/se...ue-joint-statement-on-waukesha-parade-tragedy
Given that Baldwin and Johnson very very rarely agree on things, I think this could be a preemptive strike against any suits that may appear with that specific type of targeted litigation.

 

[Cryptic]

I
Public entities are found liable all the time. And they pay the damages ordered.

No, Public entities are accused of being liable all the time.

They, however, are rarely, if ever, formally found to be liable by a Court. And even if found liable, the finding would be meaningless unless the public entity waived their immunity.

Public entities cannot be forced by a Court to pay damages. There are limited exceptions such as suits regarding the non payment of a contractual debt.

But.... at the end of the day, local governments effectively cannot be sued unless they agree to be sued. Needless to say, such agreements are rare and can be retracted at anytime by the Sovereign for any reason.

In short, public entities dont usually respond to Court orders regarding damages from lawsuits. Rather, they make voluntary decisions to pay settlements- when it is in their interests to do so.
Sovereign immunity in the United States - Wikipedia

 

[LietKynes]

Oh! I wasn't meant to imply anything about external abuse or discuss the merits of the carceral system either way. I more mean- when you're cold and alone, when you can't hold a job because you don't have a home or a place to bathe, drug abuse becomes self medication because it's the easiest option.

<modsnip>

I do agree that he's past the point at which rehabilitation can happen, at least in the sense of being allowed to walk free, and I have no pity or sympathy for him. I couldn't care less about him and more... how do we keep this from happening to others? It is not enough to say "you should be strong enough to get help and stay away from drugs" because, not everyone IS strong enough, and giving in to that should not have to lead to so much pain and suffering for innocent bystanders.

bbm
Ita.

Apologies if it sounded like I misunderstood your comment in my previous reply.

I was only thinking that DB does not fear the consequences of his actions and neither, it would seem lately-- do other career criminals.
People should fear the repercussions of hurting and killing innocents.
But they don't worry about what sometimes amounts to a short prison stint, and to add insult to injury DB was let out time after time to terrorize.
It's infuriating.

I agree with your post that there needs to be better help for those who are willing.
My coworker's family has had some terrible sadness two years ago partly due to her adult child not admitting she needed professional help.
They tried to stage an intervention and it backfired spectacularly.
But I give the parents kudos for doing everything in their power to help their child.
No one could have done more; and I understood to some degree their struggle.
They fought to help her right up to the end.
I think people have to want to get help -- even if at the same time they can't resist numbing their pain; if that makes sense ?
Jmo.

 

[Shamrock1]

Public entities are found liable all the time.

Public entities, however, cannot be forced by a Court to pay damages. There are limited exceptions such as suits regarding the non payment of a contractual debt.

But.... at the end of the day, local governments effectively cannot be sued unless they agree to be sued. Needless to say, such agreements are rare and can be retracted at anytime by the Sovereign for any reason.

In short, public entities dont respond to Court orders regarding damages from lawsuits. Rather, they make voluntary decisions to pay settlements- when it is in their interests to do so.
Sovereign immunity in the United States - Wikipedia

Again, an injured plaintiff can successfully maintain suit against a public entity and, if a jury awards damages, the public entity must pay. I’m not quite clear on this idea that a public entity is free to ignore a court order. There are a number of hurdles for a plaintiff suing a public entity, but a public entity is not necessarily immune from suits and certainly not free to disregard court orders.

In this situation, I do think the town will enjoy immunity.

https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/cite/3.736

 

[Cryptic]

Again, an injured plaintiff can successfully maintain suit against a public entity and, if a jury awards damages, the public entity must pay.
https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/cite/3.736

No, that is not correct. The State has sovereign immunity and does not need to respond to jury awards etc.

Here is the core quote from the MN laws that you cite:

"The state will pay compensation for injury to or loss of property or personal injury or death caused by an act or omission of an employee of the state while acting within the scope of office or employment...."

The State does not place themselves under the authority of a Court. Rather, the State will decide when compensation is due and the State will decide how much is paid.

The Sovereign does not respond to Court orders regarding lawsuit payments and does not care what a jury awards. In the end, the Sovereign alone decides what he (or she) pays and to whom via offering a settlement when he/ she chooses to.

 

[Shamrock1]

No, that is not correct. The State has sovereign immunity and does not need to respond to jury awards etc.

Here is the core quote from the MN laws that you cite:

"The state will pay compensation for injury to or loss of property or personal injury or death caused by an act or omission of an employee of the state while acting within the scope of office or employment...."

The State does not place themselves under the authority of a Court. Rather, the State will decide when compensation is due and the State will decide how much is paid.

The Sovereign does not respond to Court orders regarding lawsuit payments and does not care what a jury awards. In the end, the Sovereign alone decides what he (or she) pays and to whom.

We’ll have to agree to disagree on this one (I’ve landed multiple jury verdicts against a variety of public entities in several states).

 

[doyoulovemepfg]

Sixth charge is official for DB after the death of Jackson Sparks:
https://www.tmj4.com/news/waukesha-...charged-with-sixth-intentional-homicide-count

WAUKESHA, Wis. — The Waukesha Christmas parade suspect, Darrell Brooks, has been charged with the expected sixth intentional homicide count on Monday.

The sixth charge was filed following the death of 8-year-old Jackson Sparks.

Wisconsin prosecutors initially charged Brooks with intentional homicide in the deaths of five people who were killed when an SUV was driven into the Christmas parade.

Brooks made his initial court appearance Tuesday, Nov. 23.

 

[Cryptic]

We’ll have to agree to disagree on this one (I’ve landed multiple jury verdicts against a variety of public entities in several states).

Now, that I can agree with (agreeing to disagree).

Clearly, jury awards can be obtained against public entities. We just disagree on what such awards truly mean.

 

[LietKynes]

Sixth charge is official for DB after the death of Jackson Sparks:
https://www.tmj4.com/news/waukesha-...charged-with-sixth-intentional-homicide-count

WAUKESHA, Wis. — The Waukesha Christmas parade suspect, Darrell Brooks, has been charged with the expected sixth intentional homicide count on Monday.

The sixth charge was filed following the death of 8-year-old Jackson Sparks.

Wisconsin prosecutors initially charged Brooks with intentional homicide in the deaths of five people who were killed when an SUV was driven into the Christmas parade.

Brooks made his initial court appearance Tuesday, Nov. 23.

bbm
Grateful they're using the word "Intentional".
Not exactly "premeditated"; but clearly not "accidental".
Imo.

 

[mickey2942]

I think that the victims have a legitimate claim against the last jurisdiction that the perpetrator was charged, and released in...

This may be something to watch. And may have further ramifications for other jurisdictions, setting low or no bail for repeat offenders.

 

[steeltowngirl]

I’m currently watching the First 48 show on A&E. This episode, called Gangland, discusses a federal investigation called Operation Triple Beam, where murder and firearms suspects were identified via a rap video they made. Point being: there can be a connection to a person’s music choices and their behavior. DB’s rap songs may not have been as harmless and artsy as I might have first thought. JMO

NEW DETAILS: Music videos help metro Atlanta cops link alleged Bloods gang members

 

[Luna20]

No joke…

Waukesha suspect Darrell Brooks' lawyer in other felony cases moves to withdraw, citing conflicts of interest

 

[doyoulovemepfg]

No joke…

Waukesha suspect Darrell Brooks' lawyer in other felony cases moves to withdraw, citing conflicts of interest

This is unsurprising given the Milwaukee area is one of those "everyone knows everyone" type of places.

 

[doyoulovemepfg]

Full video of court proceeding for DB on the previous car ramming charge: Darrell Brooks appears in court

 

[Luna20]

Does anybody know why this thread can’t be found when looking in the “Crimes in the News” forums? Is it perhaps down for clean up, or maybe being moved? There are 35 pages and several comments each day. I certainly think it is recent and notable and an extremely significant “crime in the news”. Just curious why it seems it can only be found by using the key word search feature. Tia

That’s a good question. I have had that occur on more than a few threads.

 

[doyoulovemepfg]

Darrell Brooks freed on bail before parade, no record of hearing

WAUKESHA, Wis. - Darrell Brooks was freed from jail on $1,000 bail in Milwaukee County just days before the Waukesha Christmas parade on Nov. 21, where prosecutors say he careened his SUV through the route, killing six and injuring more than 60. FOX6 News has learned key details of that early November court hearing have been lost forever.

Milwaukee District Attorney John Chisholm called the bail his office recommended for Brooks just days before the parade "inappropriately low," so why did Court Commissioner Cedric Cornwall go along with it?

FOX6 wanted to know, so we asked for a transcript of the hearing and learned it doesn't exist.

"We saw this coming," said Jackie Rupnow, Wisconsin Court Reporters Association.

Sixteen days before the Waukesha Christmas parade, Brooks was in court in Milwaukee County, accused of running over the mother of his child in his Ford Escape. Despite a pretrial risk assessment that said he was very high risk for committing a new crime, Cornwall set his bail at $1,000.

Why? We may never know.

 

[shotgun09]

How and why do transcripts just disappear?

Darrell Brooks freed on bail before parade, no record of hearing

WAUKESHA, Wis. - Darrell Brooks was freed from jail on $1,000 bail in Milwaukee County just days before the Waukesha Christmas parade on Nov. 21, where prosecutors say he careened his SUV through the route, killing six and injuring more than 60. FOX6 News has learned key details of that early November court hearing have been lost forever.

Milwaukee District Attorney John Chisholm called the bail his office recommended for Brooks just days before the parade "inappropriately low," so why did Court Commissioner Cedric Cornwall go along with it?

FOX6 wanted to know, so we asked for a transcript of the hearing and learned it doesn't exist.

"We saw this coming," said Jackie Rupnow, Wisconsin Court Reporters Association.

Sixteen days before the Waukesha Christmas parade, Brooks was in court in Milwaukee County, accused of running over the mother of his child in his Ford Escape. Despite a pretrial risk assessment that said he was very high risk for committing a new crime, Cornwall set his bail at $1,000.

Why? We may never know.