AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #18

[BeeGirl]

The 911 info is, in my opinion, conflicting and confusing:

• They have the cell that called 911*
• No one spoke directly to the dispatcher.
• Investigators also believe Jayme was at home during the shooting based on details from the 911 call and evidence from the home.
  
• The dispatcher "could hear a lot of yelling" during the 911 call.
• The call was "pinged" to the Closs' home.
• When the dispatcher called the number back, a voicemail greeting indicated that the phone belonged to Denise Closs.

Then yesterday, Sherriff Fitzgerald says both that the call is "confusing" and there's "nothing" to help in it.

So, which is it? Is there nothing or is there yelling? If there was yelling, who was it? Was someone yelling about Jayme? To Jayme? Was it Jayme yelling?

If so, to me, that's not "nothing".

*ETA: If they have the phone, they also have the fingerprints to know who dialed it. That's significant in and of itself, but especially in conjunction with the mysterious yelling and unknown origin of the conclusion Jayme was there.

 

[Lizzack1]

They may not want someone linked to that car to know what they know about markings, decals.... scoop etc

I wonder if they will ask for tips on the cars of interest in ANY color at some point? I’d think if either belongs to a suspect, they’d have it painted or otherwise disguised to not match the ones in question by now. Assuming they have a connection to someone who has the resources to do so under the radar and is willing to do it. MOO

 

[CuriousMaine]

The 911 info is, in my opinion, conflicting and confusing:

• They have the cell that called 911
• No one spoke directly to the dispatcher.
• Investigators also believe Jayme was at home during the shooting based on details from the 911 call and evidence from the home.
  
• The dispatcher "could hear a lot of yelling" during the 911 call.
• The call was "pinged" to the Closs' home.
• When the dispatcher called the number back, a voicemail greeting indicated that the phone belonged to Denise Closs.

Then yesterday, Sherriff Fitzgerald says both that the call is "confusing" and there's "nothing" to help in it.

So, which is it? Is there nothing or is there yelling? If there was yelling, who was it? Was someone yelling about Jayme? To Jayme? Was it Jayme yelling?

If so, to me, that's not "nothing".

I'll take the Sheriff at his word for now, and say, it's both: confusing and nothing. Now, what that means exactly, IDK.
What he says is ironically, confusing and nothing.

 

[mks762]

I am new to this website, but have been following this horrible case from the beginning and I feel it all points back to an electronic connection.This is in response to Gardener 1850 comment about the LE electronics angle.

I totally agree. Maybe LE has been reviewing Jayme's social media and are now focusing on that one angle more closely based on the info they have. There is a lot to determine about a person if you look at an individuals social media/phone apps and see who they follow and who follows them. I won't specifically mention any one particular website/application , but there are a few popular apps used by teens today on their phones( other then FB )that allow them to post pictures and comments. By looking into these followers & who they choose to follow can often give you a glimpse of their interests etc.. I agree with Gardener 1850 that maybe a gaming device/interactive game or some type of electronic device allowed Jayme to have contact with an individual or a group of individuals who may have befriended her . Maybe LE has determined that Jayme was a frequent play in interactive digital games and developed some type of relationship. Although I have never played any of these games, I hear through friends that their kids interact with people all over the world when playing. As we have all heard, these games can be very violent and dark and in the past these "gamers" have portrayed the violence they see on these games into real life situations .If I recall correctly, the Sandy Hook killer played very violent digital games. Just another angle I thought of once I heard the direction LE was now taking.

Welcome to WS!! Very nice, well thought out post! My biggest issue with the electronic connection is I'm fairly confident the FBI would've found the perp by now. There is some sort of trail left on everything done via electronics. User names, phone numbers, IP addresses, etc etc etc. Regardless how tech savvy this person may be, I'd like to hope the FBI is more so and would've been able to track them down by now.

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

Do you recall what the numbers were or what that post based it on?TIA

Replying to my own quote.
Here is the link to SORT. I searched within a 3 mile radius. You can click on the map to view where sex offenders live in reference to the Closs home. If I were thinking in this direction (I have no theory at this point) I would be more concerned with those who failed to register, have warrants for not reporting, have never been caught, or were registered I believe in the 90's(?) but a new law stopped requiring registration. I've been trying to remember more about that law and am drawing a blank.
SORT :: home
This is an article from Sept 2018 in reference to states with the highest sex offender numbers.
"Wisconsin has 425 registered sex offenders per 100,000 people...... "
Sex Crimes: Here Are 15 States With the Most Registered Sex Offenders

 

[Charliegizmo49]

You never know. I felt that way with the DG Alaska case. It was like a deeply buried evil had been unearthed exposing one evil crime after another with all the same kids. Rape, drugs, murder. Even a prior death their "friend" ruled accidental shooting was revisited and is now being prosecuted. It was almost to much to comprehend in a small town and the ages of those involved. And to add, DG was a very good kid.

Help me. I just moved out of Alaska. Who was that? I helped with logistics and organization of the Kenai family 4. The kids grandmother was my much loved neighbor and she died a short time before they were found. Sad from before the day they were reported missing. Very violent for a long time.

When this happens in Alaska everything about it is so very bad.

FIGURED IT Out. IT HAPPENED WHILE I WAS Out if STATE.

There’s a lot in David’s murder not shared. I know this little “group” HAD BEEN ACTING Out and behaving as far out of line as I had seen. We were identifying juvenile crime/ behavior issues and they were front and center. The killers in my informed opinion had no parental supervision and should have been taken into custody years ago. Historically that area has pockets of high drug use violence and every crime imaginable.

My daughters truck was stolen out of Anchorage and found a couple days later in Butte, just out of Palmer Wasilla.

The truck was found on fire burned to the frame. The kids had poured a huge amount of kerosene and gas in the interior and cans left in the bed. The explosion was heard a couple away and it had been lit from a gasoline trail 50 feet away. 25 kids watched it burn. All because it was a beautiful truck. Jealously.


The football teams in the schools are the toughest and some delinquent juvenile criminals meaner than I can explain. Those kids took David out and simply executed him. After beating him. None had basic human respect for human life or anything. Morally bankrupt brains. A LE friend said that describing them. Their friends knew and no one or parents came forward. A poor example of 99.9% if the people who live up there.

 

[Gardener1850]

I am new to this website, but have been following this horrible case from the beginning and I feel it all points back to an electronic connection.This is in response to Gardener 1850 comment about the LE electronics angle.

I totally agree. Maybe LE has been reviewing Jayme's social media and are now focusing on that one angle more closely based on the info they have. There is a lot to determine about a person if you look at an individuals social media/phone apps and see who they follow and who follows them. I won't specifically mention any one particular website/application , but there are a few popular apps used by teens today on their phones( other then FB )that allow them to post pictures and comments. By looking into these followers & who they choose to follow can often give you a glimpse of their interests etc.. I agree with Gardener 1850 that maybe a gaming device/interactive game or some type of electronic device allowed Jayme to have contact with an individual or a group of individuals who may have befriended her . Maybe LE has determined that Jayme was a frequent play in interactive digital games and developed some type of relationship. Although I have never played any of these games, I hear through friends that their kids interact with people all over the world when playing. As we have all heard, these games can be very violent and dark and in the past these "gamers" have portrayed the violence they see on these games into real life situations .If I recall correctly, the Sandy Hook killer played very violent digital games. Just another angle I thought of once I heard the direction LE was now taking.

Welcome gipsypup!

The only gaming system I mentioned was X-box 360 with the Kinect feature. Just to clarify, I don't think Jayme was secretly communicating through something like that because all those type of communications with other players would be saved and easily found by LE-- I was wondering if perhaps someone may have hacked a camera and could have been secretly watching her through something like that (super creepy idea). I don't know that the Closs family even had one of those types of gaming systems. However, the games are not all violent-- there are many that are for younger kids that use the cameras. Here is another article about how X-box Kinect or other devices in the home could be collecting video, images and info about users:
Is my Xbox spying on me?
Although most MSM articles I'm finding now seem to focus on what info from a device in the home is accessible to the government, and not if the cameras can be hacked by someone looking to "virtually case" a home or to stalk its occupants. So perhaps my speculation is way too out there and only happens in the movies. I don't really know much about technology. All I know, is I try to keep my computer cameras covered with a sticky note and my microphone off, just in case. I saw on the news years ago about an issue with kids bringing home school laptops and leaving them open with the camera showing their entire room and it being possible for someone to hack the camera to see what their room looks like or to watch them even when they were not aware of it. Perhaps camera security has improved to close the way into hacking these devices? I really don't know...

 

[Charliegizmo49]

I know it's been stated in several articles that background noise was heard such as yelling, a disturbance or a commotion, and the only word they could make out was "help," but what exactly did Fitzgerald say at the PC? I can't remember.

He said there was nothing of help in the 911 call.

 

[ACG2x]

I think he was ambushed:

- Knock, knock, knock/similar attention seeking sound at front door
- Dad goes to door, looks out window, sees nothing
- Since he sees nothing but is sure he heard something, opens door to take a look around
- Boom. Never knew what hit him.

moo.

Certainly plausible but that knock would've come around 12:30 AM on a Sunday night/Monday morning. If I heard a knock at my door at that time of night, I would initially be very freaked out and might not go out to take a look around. Unless it was common for the Closs' to have visitors at that time of night which I am doubting. Just saying it's an extremely strange time to have a visitor at your door.

 

[Le Singe]

The 911 info is, in my opinion, conflicting and confusing:

• They have the cell that called 911*
• No one spoke directly to the dispatcher.
• Investigators also believe Jayme was at home during the shooting based on details from the 911 call and evidence from the home.
  
• The dispatcher "could hear a lot of yelling" during the 911 call.
• The call was "pinged" to the Closs' home.
• When the dispatcher called the number back, a voicemail greeting indicated that the phone belonged to Denise Closs.

Then yesterday, Sherriff Fitzgerald says both that the call is "confusing" and there's "nothing" to help in it.

So, which is it? Is there nothing or is there yelling? If there was yelling, who was it? Was someone yelling about Jayme? To Jayme? Was it Jayme yelling?

If so, to me, that's not "nothing".

*ETA: If they have the phone, they also have the fingerprints to know who dialed it. That's significant in and of itself, but especially in conjunction with the mysterious yelling and unknown origin of the conclusion Jayme was there.

Just my opinion, but i took to be him saying there is nothing on the tape the would make releasing the tape to the public helpful since that was the context of the question his statement was in response to. But i agree it is not at all clear what he means.

 

[ACG2x]

He said there was nothing of help in the 911 call.

Everything I've read indicates there was a lot of unintelligible yelling meaning you couldn't make out what was said or who said it. Even if audio experts could pinpoint whose voices it was, that might not help them much. It's not like the perp announced "My name is XXXX!"

If you heard Jayme and Denise's voices but couldn't make out what they are saying beyond "HELP", that doesn't tell you anything except they were scared out of their minds because an intruder had just shot James to death and was in their home.

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

.

Help me. I just moved out of Alaska. Who was that? I helped with logistics and organization of the Kenai family 4. The kids grandmother was my much loved neighbor and she died a short time before they were found. Sad from before the day they were reported missing. Very violent for a long time.

When this happens in Alaska everything about it is so very bad.

David Grunwald

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

I know it's been stated in several articles that background noise was heard such as yelling, a disturbance or a commotion, and the only word they could make out was "help," but what exactly did Fitzgerald say at the PC? I can't remember.

Watched the PC from 10/17 some of the questions and answers are hard to hear though

 

[Miss Mimi]

Everything I've read indicates there was a lot of unintelligible yelling meaning you couldn't make out what was said or who said it. Even if audio experts could pinpoint whose voices it was, that might not help them much. It's not like the perp announced "My name is XXXX!"

If you heard Jayme and Denise's voices but couldn't make out what they are saying beyond "HELP", that doesn't tell you anything except they were scared out of their minds because an intruder had just shot James to death and was in their home.

Just a quick thought. Could it be possible that the call for help was made while the door was being kicked in? Perhaps that would explain a cry for help and the noises that cannot be discerned?

 

[Miss Mimi]

I think he was ambushed:

- Knock, knock, knock/similar attention seeking sound at front door
- Dad goes to door, looks out window, sees nothing
- Since he sees nothing but is sure he heard something, opens door to take a look around
- Boom. Never knew what hit him.

moo.

That is possible, but that would not explain the door being kicked in, would it?

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

I know it's been stated in several articles that background noise was heard such as yelling, a disturbance or a commotion, and the only word they could make out was "help," but what exactly did Fitzgerald say at the PC? I can't remember.

Trying to find the press release. Gaaaahhhh, but can't. I do remember it was at the end after he said things were scaling down, and someone asked him if he had heard the 911 call, and what was on it. He said he had heard it, and something like it was just a bunch of indesciferable noise.

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

I think her voice can be heard on the call, and that's one thing that makes them so sure she was there. Although he would not confirm the word "help" was heard later at the PC, it was still reported that Fitzgerald did say that in reports on the first or second day, according to a local news source, WAEU13. I'm thinking it was she who yelled help, if it's true that's what was really heard. Jmo

Here it is. "we believe Jayme was home based on the evidence in our case umm some of it from that 911 call..."
So there must be something that was heard.
Kare11>Press conference from Oct 17, 2018 (@about 5:47 spot in video)

 

[MsBetsy]

I'll take the Sheriff at his word for now, and say, it's both: confusing and nothing. Now, what that means exactly, IDK.
What he says is ironically, confusing and nothing.

What I think he means is there is nothing that can be heard that is of any help beyond what they have already concluded, which is that Jayme was present at the time of the murder and there was yelling and a disturbance in the background. If they had something definitive, like the killers voice saying a word or two, I would think they would release at least that part to the public like they did in Libby and Abby's case. Jmo

 

[zencompass]

Certainly plausible but that knock would've come around 12:30 AM on a Sunday night/Monday morning. If I heard a knock at my door at that time of night, I would initially be very freaked out and might not go out to take a look around. Unless it was common for the Closs' to have visitors at that time of night which I am doubting. Just saying it's an extremely strange time to have a visitor at your door.

If I lived in a rural area like that, I believe my first thought would be that someone had car trouble or there was a car accident and they were looking for help.

Having said that, I wouldn't open the door right away. I'd look out windows, turn on lights, etc. , shout through the door and tell them I'd call 911. But that's just me. And I've never lived in a rural area.

Depending on the individual, I suppose some would answer the door right away and some wouldn't.

I certainly agree with you - someone at the door at that time would be very unusual and alarming to most folks!

 

[Cardinal47]

I think he was ambushed:

- Knock, knock, knock/similar attention seeking sound at front door
- Dad goes to door, looks out window, sees nothing
- Since he sees nothing but is sure he heard something, opens door to take a look around
- Boom. Never knew what hit him.

moo.

I never thought of that one but it does make sense. I guess I always was thinking this 'person' came angry and burst right in. I could never see my 'person' hiding.
Something to think about.