Wrongful Death Suit filed Nov. 13, 2013 in California, #3

[MyBelle]

In reference to the autopsy report, it states date and time of death as 7/13/11 at 6:48, yet in the same section states last seen alive as 7/13/11 at 21:50, which I assume is an error. However, under date and time of "incident" it states 7/--/11 unk.

The exact time she hanged herself is unknown but the time of death is very clear. The report does appear to have a couple of typos such as the misspelling of her parents' name. It says the ME's return from the call was at 21:20 and I think that is accurate.

The ME's Investigative Report has been filed with the court and the 06:48 time of death appears in several places as does the fact that Coronado PD started CPR so apparently the officers felt the incident took place shortly prior to Adam finding her and that she possibly could be revived.

Which makes the time before midnight totally irrelevant in terms of the wrongful death lawsuit. The report clearly says there was no evidence whatsoever that anyone else was in the bedroom with RZ as she prepared her bizarre ritual of painting and suicide.

JMO

https://roa.sdcourt.ca.gov/roa/face...-196_06-25-15_Request_Other_1435375635093.pdf

 

[MyBelle]

My best guess here is that 21:50 relates to Rebecca's final live phone conversation on 7/12/11 that can be documented by an outside party (sister MZL, maybe?) and 6:48 on 7/13/11 documents the time she was officially declared dead upon examination by first medical responders. As others have mentioned, Rebecca's body showed signs of being dead for at least a few hours upon examination by emergency services personnel at 6:48 on 7/13/11. Therefore, IMO, the relevant block of time related to the "incident," which could have been brief or very prolonged, depending on whether torture preceded death, likely occurred sometime between 7/12/11 at 21:50 and 7/13/11 at 3:48.

All of the above is just my opinion.

I do believe the ME was capable of detecting evidence of torture and there was none.

The Investigative Report does mention the 07/12/11 call with her sister at 21:50 and she was in "normal spirits" and that Adam last saw RZ at approximately 2000 hours.

It also says Coronado PD performed CPR so apparently they didn't believe she had been dead for several hours. It was Coronado Fire Dept. who arrived at 06:53 and detected the rigor in her jaw and advised to stop CPR. I don't believe Adam or the P.D. would have performed CPR if they believed RZ was long dead.

JMO

 

[IQuestion]

BBM above.

The exact time she hanged herself is unknown but the time of death is very clear. The report does appear to have a couple of typos such as the misspelling of her parents' name. It says the ME's return from the call was at 21:20 and I think that is accurate.

The ME's Investigative Report has been filed with the court and the 06:48 time of death appears in several places as does the fact that Coronado PD started CPR so apparently the officers felt the incident took place shortly prior to Adam finding her and that she possibly could be revived.

Which makes the time before midnight totally irrelevant in terms of the wrongful death lawsuit. The report clearly says there was no evidence whatsoever that anyone else was in the bedroom with RZ as she prepared her bizarre ritual of painting and suicide.

JMO

https://roa.sdcourt.ca.gov/roa/face...-196_06-25-15_Request_Other_1435375635093.pdf

Mybelle, I am an amateur researcher, and I can't help but notice the constant refrain of ME's and rulings of suicide. Ironically the death of a beautiful young woman, in her 30's, at her beachfront property, being ruled "a suicide" despite obvious signs of trauma and an ME/Coroner willingness to sign off just to "get it over with" is not new! Let me share an actual case with you.
"On the morning of Dec. 16, 1935, Todd`s maid found her employer`s body in the garage, slumped over the wheel of her Lincoln convertible. The coroner ruled her death a suicide. Cause of death: carbon monoxide poisoning. To this day, that verdict is on the books as the official explanation of Todd`s death. While a grand jury ruled that Todd committed suicide, it was unable to explain her broken nose, the bruises around her throat and two cracked ribs. Apparently, the grand jury thought Todd also beat herself to death.!!!"
So who was responsible for Thelma Todd`s death at her beachfront home?
Would it surprise anyone to know the number one suspect was none other than LUCKY LUCIANO. He was called "Lucky" Luciano, because of his ability not only to survive the attacks on his life, but also because he was NEVER convicted for any of the murders (he ordered) of his enemies.
It has been thought she was killed because she refused Lucky Luciano's plan to open an illegal gambling establishment on the 3rd floor of her ocean front cafe. A resort area, frequented by tourists and Hollywood elite. Go figure!
Ironically, Lucky only spent a relatively few years in prison for "IRS issues" then deported to Italy where he lived out the rest of the days with his new wife, IGEA LUSSONI, affectionately known as LUCY.
After all these years, poor Thelma Todd from Lawrence, Mass....will always have a coroner's ruling of suicide because no one was willing to stand up for the truth. (If no one speaks up for the dead...who will?) I'm just giving a brief summary on the case, but wanted you to know that people "revictimized" Thelma by trashing her after her death. (it just sounds too familiar...but such is history)

 

[Zinn]

I do believe the ME was capable of detecting evidence of torture and there was none.

The Investigative Report does mention the 07/12/11 call with her sister at 21:50 and she was in "normal spirits" and that Adam last saw RZ at approximately 2000 hours.

It also says Coronado PD performed CPR so apparently they didn't believe she had been dead for several hours. It was Coronado Fire Dept. who arrived at 06:53 and detected the rigor in her jaw and advised to stop CPR. I don't believe Adam or the P.D. would have performed CPR if they believed RZ was long dead.

JMO

I've just reviewed the report, as I should have done before posting my opinion. It appears "last seen alive" time of 7/12/11 at 21:50 is indeed based on final phone call with sister MZL. Date of death time of 7/13/11 at 6:48 is based on time AS initiated the 911 call. First responders arrived at 6:53 and confirmed death without further intervention. The 6:48 time reflects the time AS initiated a call to 911 regarding the discovery of Rebecca's body. As far as I know, AS did not report witnessing her actual death at that exact time. Given that the body showed signs of being dead for at least a few hours, my opinion has not changed that the relevant "incident" time frame is 7/12/11 at 21:50 through 7/13/11 at roughly 3:50, a period of approximately 6 hours spanning the dates of 7/12/11 and 7/13/11. ETA: This explains why the report does not list a specific date for the "incident" and instead specifies only the month and year, with the qualifier "unk" in relation to the day.

All of the above is just my opinion.

 

[MyBelle]

Mybelle, "YEP, IT IS A MEDICAL OPINION" (It feels good to have a mutual agreement once in a long while?)
And of course, I read the info on the attached link and realized it is VERY SIMPLE TO CHANGE/AMEND a death certificate....AND BE SURE TO INCLUDE YOUR $23 Fee if more than one year and $21 FEE for extra copies.

Changing the death certificate ONLY REQUIRES SUPPORTING AFFIDAVITS AND 2 SIGNATURES....wow...That would be on Pg 4. (I am unable to cut and paste so I'll just type the exact wording,
"When correcting the date of date, time, place or cause of death: Only the physician, coroner or medical examiner can amend these items."

I am thinking Dr. J Melinek's fees were awfully expensive, knowing in advance, her work could only generate more questions....and NOT change the death certificate
absolutely astounding. You know what, I am really rethinking this.
Do you think, and this is a serious question..... someone desperately wanted the death certificates issued as accidental (MS) and suicide (RZ) and made part of the public record, knowing in advance, they would be difficult/cumbersome to change???
BTW: I know first hand, certificates are OFTEN issued with wrong dates on them....I am looking at one right now!

The link I posted clearly shows the Form CAN NOT BE USED TO CHANGE TIME OF DEATH.

Just as the courts can not be used to engage in the game of defamation of character. The Plaintiff's attorney certainly gives the appearance of being an incompetent and incredibly desperate buffoon wanting any media attention he can get.


JMO

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loc...u-Spreckels-Mansion-2011-Death-303178091.html

 

[kimi_SFC]

Mybelle, I am an amateur researcher, and I can't help but notice the constant refrain of ME's and rulings of suicide. Ironically the death of a beautiful young woman, in her 30's, at her beachfront property, being ruled "a suicide" despite obvious signs of trauma and an ME/Coroner willingness to sign off just to "get it over with" is not new! Let me share an actual case with you.
"On the morning of Dec. 16, 1935, Todd`s maid found her employer`s body in the garage, slumped over the wheel of her Lincoln convertible. The coroner ruled her death a suicide. Cause of death: carbon monoxide poisoning. To this day, that verdict is on the books as the official explanation of Todd`s death. While a grand jury ruled that Todd committed suicide, it was unable to explain her broken nose, the bruises around her throat and two cracked ribs. Apparently, the grand jury thought Todd also beat herself to death.!!!"
So who was responsible for Thelma Todd`s death at her beachfront home?
Would it surprise anyone to know the number one suspect was none other than LUCKY LUCIANO. He was called "Lucky" Luciano, because of his ability not only to survive the attacks on his life, but also because he was NEVER convicted for any of the murders (he ordered) of his enemies.
It has been thought she was killed because she refused Lucky Luciano's plan to open an illegal gambling establishment on the 3rd floor of her ocean front cafe. A resort area, frequented by tourists and Hollywood elite. Go figure!
Ironically, Lucky only spent a relatively few years in prison for "IRS issues" then deported to Italy where he lived out the rest of the days with his new wife, IGEA LUSSONI, affectionately known as LUCY.
After all these years, poor Thelma Todd from Lawrence, Mass....will always have a coroner's ruling of suicide because no one was willing to stand up for the truth. (If no one speaks up for the dead...who will?) I'm just giving a brief summary on the case, but wanted you to know that people "revictimized" Thelma by trashing her after her death. (it just sounds too familiar...but such is history)

Wow, incredible indeed. JMO


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[MyBelle]

I've just reviewed the report, as I should have done before posting my opinion. It appears "last seen alive" time of 7/12/11 at 21:50 is indeed based on final phone call with sister MZL. Date of death time of 7/13/11 at 6:48 is based on time AS initiated the 911 call. First responders arrived at 6:53 and confirmed death without further intervention. The 6:48 time reflects the time AS initiated a call to 911 regarding the discovery of Rebecca's body. As far as I know, AS did not report witnessing her actual death at that exact time. Given that the body showed signs of being dead for at least a few hours, my opinion has not changed that the relevant "incident" time frame is 7/12/11 at 21:50 through 7/13/11 at roughly 3:50, a period of approximately 6 hours spanning the dates of 7/12/11 and 7/13/11.

All of the above is just my opinion.

The ME opinion states that Coronado Police began CPR. I think cops would have been able to visually tell she was dead if her body had been hanging there for hours on end.

The ME's report also makes clear that there is no evidence whatsoever that anyone other than RZ was in the area where the "incident" took place.

JMO



AUTOPSY REPORT
REBECCA ZAHAU
11-1517
QPINlON:
....and called 911 at 0648 hours. Coronado Police Department personnel responded and began cardiopulmonary resuscitation (CPR). Coronado Fire Department personnel responded, felt rigor mortis in her jaw (no other areas
were checked), and advised that CPR be stopped.


https://roa.sdcourt.ca.gov/roa/face...-196_06-25-15_Request_Other_1435375635093.pdf

 

[screecher]

BBM above.


Mybelle, I am an amateur researcher, and I can't help but notice the constant refrain of ME's and rulings of suicide. Ironically the death of a beautiful young woman, in her 30's, at her beachfront property, being ruled "a suicide" despite obvious signs of trauma and an ME/Coroner willingness to sign off just to "get it over with" is not new! Let me share an actual case with you.
"On the morning of Dec. 16, 1935, Todd`s maid found her employer`s body in the garage, slumped over the wheel of her Lincoln convertible. The coroner ruled her death a suicide. Cause of death: carbon monoxide poisoning. To this day, that verdict is on the books as the official explanation of Todd`s death. While a grand jury ruled that Todd committed suicide, it was unable to explain her broken nose, the bruises around her throat and two cracked ribs. Apparently, the grand jury thought Todd also beat herself to death.!!!"
So who was responsible for Thelma Todd`s death at her beachfront home?
Would it surprise anyone to know the number one suspect was none other than LUCKY LUCIANO. He was called "Lucky" Luciano, because of his ability not only to survive the attacks on his life, but also because he was NEVER convicted for any of the murders (he ordered) of his enemies.
It has been thought she was killed because she refused Lucky Luciano's plan to open an illegal gambling establishment on the 3rd floor of her ocean front cafe. A resort area, frequented by tourists and Hollywood elite. Go figure!
Ironically, Lucky only spent a relatively few years in prison for "IRS issues" then deported to Italy where he lived out the rest of the days with his new wife, IGEA LUSSONI, affectionately known as LUCY.
After all these years, poor Thelma Todd from Lawrence, Mass....will always have a coroner's ruling of suicide because no one was willing to stand up for the truth. (If no one speaks up for the dead...who will?) I'm just giving a brief summary on the case, but wanted you to know that people "revictimized" Thelma by trashing her after her death. (it just sounds too familiar...but such is history)

BRBM

"LUCKY" & "LUCY" :jawdrop: time for some :toastred:

Holy Moley. Excellent post!

BTW, pretty sure LUCKY was convicted of over 60 counts of prostitution and guess where he did most of his time??? That's right fellow posters...Clinton Correctional Facility :lol: Oh, and Sweat has been shot and captured.

 

[Zinn]

The ME opinion states that Coronado Police began CPR. I think cops would have been able to visually tell she was dead if her body had been hanging there for hours on end.

The ME's report also makes clear that there is no evidence whatsoever that anyone other than RZ was in the area where the "incident" took place.

JMO



AUTOPSY REPORT
REBECCA ZAHAU
11-1517
QPINlON:
....and called 911 at 0648 hours. Coronado Police Department personnel responded and began cardiopulmonary resuscitation (CPR). Coronado Fire Department personnel responded, felt rigor mortis in her jaw (no other areas
were checked), and advised that CPR be stopped.


https://roa.sdcourt.ca.gov/roa/face...-196_06-25-15_Request_Other_1435375635093.pdf

Do I understand correctly it is your opinion that the actual time of death was 6:48am on 7/13 and that nobody else was on the premises at the time of the incident, even though AS claimed to have discovered Rebecca's body at 6:30am? In other words, it is your opinion that the incident occurred sometime before 6:30am with nobody else present and Rebecca held on until the minute AS made the 911 call at 6:48 and coincidentally died at exactly that time?

I think we will have to agree to disagree on this point.

All of the above is just my opinion.

 

[MyBelle]

And it is likely that Jonah Shacknai, who loves\ed his children more than anything, (according to everything we know about him), would have cut Rebecca out of his life entirely after Max's accident - whether she was found responsible by CPS, or not.

JMO.

Would a child death investigation still involve CPS? iirc, a detective did try to call RZ and I have to wonder if his call was about Max's injuries. I can't think of any other reason a detective would call her, can you? The premise of the wrongful death lawsuit is that it was a "revenge" killing yet all evidence points to a very bizarre and visible suicide because LE was closing in.

JMO

 

[screecher]

Yeah Zinn. Ludicrious. Just as ludicrious as CPR being performed. How did that happen? Crazy.

All anyone needs to do is look at Rebecca's body to know no CPR was performed.

 

[MyBelle]

Do I understand correctly it is your opinion that the actual time of death was 6:48am on 7/13 and that nobody else was on the premises at the time of the incident, even though AS claimed to have discovered Rebecca's body at 6:30am? In other words, it is your opinion that the incident occurred sometime before 6:30am with nobody else present and Rebecca held on until the minute AS made the 911 call at 6:48 and coincidentally died at exactly that time?

I think we will have to agree to disagree on this point.

All of the above is just my opinion.

I merely countered your claim that first responders knew she was dead. The report does say Coronado PD did do CPR until told to stop by the FD. I have no reason to believe it is not accurate.

I think the report clearly states it is the ME and investigator's testimony. Are you aware of any LE who will do CPR on a person they know is dead and is beyond resuscitation? I'm not.

The ME notes that investigators found no evidence of anyone other than RZ in either the bedroom or the balcony from which she hanged herself. Adam was in the guesthouse.

JMO

 

[MyBelle]

Yeah Zinn. Ludicrious. Just as ludicrious as CPR being performed. How did that happen? Crazy.

Yeah, first responders actually doing their job and trying to help someone who offed themselves. Ludicrous, indeed

JMO

 

[Zinn]

Yeah Zinn. Ludicrious. Just as ludicrious as CPR being performed. How did that happen? Crazy.

Are you suggesting the fact that AS's stated he performed CPR is proof that Rebecca was alive at the time he reportedly performed CPR, even though signs of rigor mortis were noted by first responders moments later?

Also, can someone remind me of the date on which NR cancelled her scheduled lie detector test due to the death of MS?

All of the above is just my opinion.

 

[screecher]

Are you suggesting the fact that AS's stated he performed CPR is proof that Rebecca was alive at the time he reportedly performed CPR, even though signs of rigor mortis were noted by first responders moments later?

Also, can someone remind me of the date on which NR cancelled her scheduled lie detector test due to the death of MS?

All of the above is just my opinion.

Not at all. Quite the opposite. I call bullchit on all of it. Sorry I didn't make myself clear. I doubt any CPR was attempted. By anyone.

 

[Betty P]

BRBM

"LUCKY" & "LUCY" :jawdrop: time for some :toastred:

Holy Moley. Excellent post!

BTW, pretty sure LUCKY was convicted of over 60 counts of prostitution and guess where he did most of his time??? That's right fellow posters...Clinton Correctional Facility :lol: Oh, and Sweat has been shot and captured.

Wow. Lucky + Lucy. Makes sense.

Wow.

 

[Zinn]

Yeah, first responders actually doing their job and trying to help someone who offed themselves. Ludicrous, indeed

JMO

And it is your opinion that first responders backdated the time of death to the time of AS's call, before they arrived, for what reason? And what is your opinion as to why the date of the incident was described as "unknown"?

All of the above is just my opinion.

 

[Zinn]

Not at all. Quite the opposite. I call bullchit on all of it. Sorry I didn't make myself clear. I doubt any CPR was attempted. By anyone.

Sorry, Screecher. I quoted the wrong post when I replied.

 

[MyBelle]

Are you suggesting the fact that AS's stated he performed CPR is proof that Rebecca was alive at the time he reportedly performed CPR, even though signs of rigor mortis were noted by first responders moments later?

Also, can someone remind me of the date on which NR cancelled her scheduled lie detector test due to the death of MS?

All of the above is just my opinion.

Please refer back to the ME's report filed recently as part of this lawsuit and linked upthread. The ME clearly states that first responders, Coronado Police, performed CPR until Coronado Fire dept personnel told them to stop after rigor was detected in the jaw.

JMO

 

[MyBelle]

And it is your opinion that first responders backdated the time of death to the time of AS's call, before they arrived, for what reason? And what is your opinion as to why the date of the incident was described as "unknown"?

All of the above is just my opinion.

First responders don't determine time of death. That's the ME's job and he also states that Adam cut her down, partially removed the gag in order to perform CPR. Rigor can set in after two hours or maybe faster for all I know. The fact is, it was detected in her jaw by firefighters, not the first responders who were the P.D.

It is unknown when exactly RZ hanged herself and died so it makes sense to list it as unknown.

JMO