General Discussions #4

[Rooster]

Hi Rooster,

Are you saying she was stabbed in the office? We thought it was a bedroom.

Moxie

A bedroom...used as an office.

 

[Thinkoflaura]

I meant to post this before but forgot. Perhaps it's mentioned later in this thread. Someone had also pointed out that Raven had his PDA in his hand at Janet's graduation, (although what in the world would he need it for there?) It seems that Raven traveled with his computer(s) - I don't know this to be fact but it seems that way from what we've learned about him. If so, the computer wouldn't have been at the house to BE stolen that night. Did Janet have jewelry? Was it out in the open? Was it taken? Was it disturbed?​

[/indent]

Jerseygirl, in one of the portraits of the little family on the page of Raven's site where he tells of their visit to his relatives in Utah, Janet is holding Kaiden and it appears that last Christmas, at least, she had a diamond or other clear stone ring on. I enlarged the photo because of the pawn shop ticket.. IF it was genuine ( A big if in Raven's case) then it would have been a $15,000 or so diamond retail. Probably $4,000 pawned... not sure how that works but I know they don't give much for anything.

 

[Timex]

Just my 2 cents...but dogs barking...or lack of barking means very little. How many cases have we heard folks say..."Oh, it had to be family because the dog didnt bark"...only to find out later it was indeed, a complete stranger.

 

[Moxie]

A bedroom...used as an office.

What could the burgalar want that would be in that office? Did they keep money or valuables in there?

 

[golfmom]

Just my 2 cents...but dogs barking...or lack of barking means very little. How many cases have we heard folks say..."Oh, it had to be family because the dog didnt bark"...only to find out later it was indeed, a complete stranger.

I was just curious about them. My puppy-dog would sleep right through AND he's just not a barker, it would be very rare for him to actually bark at a stranger ... now a hat on a stranger might get him going ...

:innocent:

 

[Thinkoflaura]

Both dogs live outside in a kennel.

Are you saying then, that dogs which live outside do not have the ability to hear a car or other means of transportation approaching? That they lack the sense of smell to sense a stranger?
That they do not have eyes to see a stranger approach their " domain"?

That ourdoor dogs lack the ability to BARK when someone drove up to their house? They may have lived outside, which makes the case even stronger for the fact that they would have barked loudly enough for neighbors to hear if a stranger was on their turf.

Edited to add: I respect Timex's position and realize that some dogs don't bark much. My experience with friends' dogs, family pets, and even people whom I mostly talk to on the phone, is that their dogs bark whenever someone new comes into their domain.

 

[Rooster]

Are you saying then, that dogs which live outside do not have the ability to hear a car or other means of transportation approaching? That they lack the sense of smell to sense a stranger?
That they do not have eyes to see a stranger approach their " domain"?

That ourdoor dogs lack the ability to BARK when someone drove up to their house? They may have lived outside, which makes the case even stronger for the fact that they would have barked lioudly enough for neighbors to hear if a stranger was on their turf.

Edited to add: I respect Timex's position and realize that some dogs don't bark much. My experience with friends' dogs, family pets, and even people whom I mostly talk to on the phone, is that their dogs bark whenever someone new comes into their domain.

No what I said was they live outside. In a cage. Not able to help Janet. Maybe they barked. I don't know. Maybe they didn't.

 

[golfmom]

Edited to add: I respect Timex's position and realize that some dogs don't bark much. My experience with friends' dogs, family pets, and even people whom I mostly talk to on the phone, is that their dogs bark whenever someone new comes into their domain.

Mine is a little house dog type. He doesn't like the vacumn cleaner either.

 

[Thinkoflaura]

What could the burgalar want that would be in that office? Did they keep money or valuables in there?

The search warrant list of items removed from that room includes a safe.

 

[golfmom]

Mine is a little house dog type. He doesn't like the vacumn cleaner either.

eta: friends of mine who have outdoor dogs or hunting dogs talk about how those dogs just drive them crazy barking at the leaves falling off the trees tho

 

[Timex]

Edited to add: I respect Timex's position and realize that some dogs don't bark much. My experience with friends' dogs, family pets, and even people whom I mostly talk to on the phone, is that their dogs bark whenever someone new comes into their domain.

Many dogs do...but many dont. If we could rely on dogs to alert us to such things, we wouldnt have children taken from their beds in the middle of the night while the family dog snoozes.

 

[golfmom]

The search warrant list of items removed from that room includes a safe.

If you were a thief wouldn't you steal the safe? I remember it was locked from the search warrant.

 

[Moxie]

If you were a thief wouldn't you steal the safe? I remember it was locked from the search warrant.

That is a good point, but how would a stranger/burgalar know enough about the house to go directly to the office and how did they know a safe was in there?

 

[Timex]

eta: friends of mine who have outdoor dogs or hunting dogs talk about how those dogs just drive them crazy barking at the leaves falling off the trees tho

But yet the Groens had a pitbull that was known to attack, yet someone managed to get inside and kill 3, kidnap 2. Dogs just cannot be relied upon in such situations.

 

[Thinkoflaura]

No what I said was they live outside. In a cage. Not able to help Janet. Maybe they barked. I don't know. Maybe they didn't.

Come on, even dogs in a cage outdoors have a run to perform their bodliy functions, LOL. I refuse to believe that Janet would allow 2 pets to lay in their own excrement.
They may have had small quarters, but I am sure they had a run. I am not saying that they would have attacked someone, but that it is normal for dogs, especially when there is more than one dog in the household hierarchy, to bark when they are guarding their turf. Doesn't matter if the house was empty, most dogs would have barked if a stranger approached.

OTOH, our dogs start going nuts when one of us turns the corner to our street. They know we are coming home, and they are joyful and totally different from a " stranger alert" bark. I also do not conider my 2 dogs to be unusually bright.. far from it. LOL.

 

[Thinkoflaura]

That is a good point, but how would a stranger/burgalar know enough about the house to go directly to the office and how did they know a safe was in there?

Well, Moxie, if you follow Rooster's reasoning, the " burglar" knew about the safe in the same way that he broke into the house because there was a rare laptop computer on the premises. LOL.

The risk was too great, the reward totally unknown for the theft idea to fly. Most people have anti-theft software on their notebooks. Also, a good new one can be purchased for less than $800. This house had nothing to cause it to be a target of a burglary.
If anything, there was a possibility of a vehicle theft, as there were multiple vehicles owned by Raven and an Accord ( among the most stolen cars) owned or used by Janet.

 

[ewwwinteresting]

OTOH, our dogs start going nuts when one of us turns the corner to our street. They know we are coming home, and they are joyful and totally different from a " stranger alert" bark. I also do not conider my 2 dogs to be unusually bright.. far from it. LOL.

Also, maybe the dogs did bark because they knew the person or didn't know the person and Janet ignored their barking. I ignore my dogs barking all the time

Is a non-random murder someone that knows Janet or just that Janet was the targeted victim?

 

[ewwwinteresting]

:laugh:

Well, Moxie, if you follow Rooster's reasoning, the " burglar" knew about the safe in the same way that he broke into the house because there was a rare laptop computer on the premises. LOL.

I think we can all rest assured this WAS NOT a burglary!

 

[Rooster]

:laugh:

Come on, even dogs in a cage outdoors have a run to perform their bodliy functions, LOL. I refuse to believe that Janet would allow 2 pets to lay in their own excrement.

I'm sure Raven and Janet took good care of their dogs. I'm sure they went on walks with them...and Let them out of their kennel. But, If Raven was at a soccer game and Janet and the baby were inside, possibly sleeping. Then the dog would probably be in the kennel. They slept in the kennel.(or dog run)

 

[PrayersForMaura]

:laugh:

Come on, even dogs in a cage outdoors have a run to perform their bodliy functions, LOL. I refuse to believe that Janet would allow 2 pets to lay in their own excrement.

I'm sure Raven and Janet took good care of their dogs. I'm sure they went on walks with them...and Let them out of their kennel. But, If Raven was at a soccer game and Janet and the baby were inside, possibly sleeping. Then the dog would probably be in the kennel. They slept in the kennel.

aha, so they did have two dogs! i had thought so but wasn't certain.
Need to add the second one to the timeline thread...