The Trash Bag in Casey's Trunk

[The Eunice Burns]

just wondering if anyone took a looe at the pic to see if they thought it might be a fabric softener sheet

belle, I looked at it and I think it's too large/long for a fabric softener sheet.

 

[Mystic]

belle, I looked at it and I think it's too large/long for a fabric softener sheet.

could it be a piece of fabric material sometimes used in garmants and the inside of a comforter?

 

[nyvictoria]

could it be a piece of fabric material sometimes used in garmants and the inside of a comforter?

It appears to be some sort of degraded fabric. In the next photo, someone is holding a yellow bag labeled "cloth". It's dated 12/19/08, numbered "1234" and "Lane 4-Amanda"(sp?). I'm assuming the cloth we're looking at is in that bag but I could be wrong.

Were there any lists disclosed that correspond to the numbered findings at the site?


ETA...I just realized these photos are OT for the topic of this particular thread but I'm also wondering why they took so many pics of that tall tree (see last 2 full rows of pics). Going to hunt for the correct thread to bring these questions over...

 

[The Eunice Burns]

Or as BJB pointed out, that scrap of paperish fabric could be/is from a pull-up, or the pull-up.

It is pretty degraded, but it could be part of the stretchy sides, the sides that you rip down to take off a pull-up.

 

[nyvictoria]

Adding link for Crime Scene Photo thread to continue discussion on the fabric...

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=77477"]Crime Scene Photos #3 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[christee]

Bumping this thread to encourage using it to explore the pic of the bag from LE's camera 7/16. I believe the pic was taken before LE retrieved the bag out of the dumpster @ Johnson's Tow Yard ~9:50PM after a few hours earlier Simon surmised that it was the source of the odor emanating from the Pontiac trunk when he & George opened it @ the towyard and Simon tossed it out. This is the bag that is detailed in the forensics report as having the following items (thanks to JWG for the list :thumb

White trash bag w/ blue handles w/ misc. items
1. Empty Coca Cola cherry can 12oz with num #2145.
2. Empty Coca Cola Classic can 12oz with num #22502.
3. Empty Milwaukee's "Best Light" beer can #C7019e.
4. Empty Sprite can 12oz with # 16090RA.
5. Empty circular metal box of "Copenhagen Tobacco" with num # SLN8178.
6. One (1) hair pin; three (3) plastic tie wraps
7. Empty "Dr. Peppe" can 12oz proof of purchase num # 2239E505168X.
8. Empty "Pepsi" can 12oz proof of purchasenum # 1608RF01238.
9. Empty "Sprite" can 12oz proof of purchase num # 16090RA.
10. Empty "Mountain Dew" 12oz proof of purchase num # 2122E504248X.
11. Empty "Oscar Mayer" plastic container 8oz proof of purchase num # 447001090.
12. Empty small "Crystal Light' container num # 249554.
13. Empty "Crystal Light" bottle 16oz with brown liquid proof purchase num # 430093911.
14. Bottle of "Kiwi's Sport Cleaner 5.5oz proof of purchase num # 3160024701.
15. Empty bottle of "Arm & Hammer" 80oz proof of purchase num #33200090430.
16. Empty bottle of "Crystal Light Soft Drink Mix" 80z proof of purchase num #4300095033.
17. Empty black container "Anchor".
18. Empty and broken pizza box "Pizza a Symbol of Quality".
19. Empty carton of "Cherry Coke" 12 packs proof of purchase num# 490003103.
20. Empty carton of "Velveeta" 10.3oz with napkin attach on it with exp day ll/Feb/09.
21. Empty carton of "Velveeta" 12oz proof of purchasenum # 2100065893.
22. Empty carton of "Velveeta" 9Aoz proof of purchase num # 210065643.
23. Empty pack of "Parliament Lights" proof of purchase num # 2820019008.
24. Empty pack of "Marlboro" num # 283022.
25. Empty pack of "Trident Splash" proof of purchase num # 1254667123.
26. Two empty aluminum wraps of "Velveeta" cheese sauce.
27. Piece of fabric that said "L G G made in Honduras of USA fabric".
28. White plastic hanger broken.
29. Piece of paper wrapper "Italian bread" "Roma" with a napkin attach to it.
30. Document "Full Sail" orientation & registration.
31. Three receipts.
32. Document dated on May 9, 2008.
33. Four air freshener sheets.
34. Five napkins.
35. Plastic wrapper of "Stouffer's" garlic chicken proof of purchase num # 1380045214.
36. Three small pieces of plastic wrapper.
37. Three pieces of aluminum foil.​

Seeing thoughts discussed on what caused the reddish stain on one side of the bag in the Photobucket, shovel & backyard threads.

My :twocents:, I agree w/ MsInformed that the stain resulted from the bag contacting the reddish sludge (maybe rust, pizza sauce, etc.) that appears to me to be present in the bottom of the dumpster.

Discuss....

I don't know for sure but I believe this is a pic of the bags still inside the dumpster, Before anyone touched them. The clear water bottle appears to be laying on top of the white bag on the left and slightly under and behind the bag on the right. It also looks like both bags and the water bottle are resting near the bottom of a wall of the dumpster. In the lower right corner of the pic looks like another inner side wall of the dumpster.

My theory on the red stain: I think it's rust and nastiness from when the bags were tossd in the dumpster. I think the bag on the right bounced and then rolled backwards, like a finger being rolled in ink to get a print, then landing the way it's pictured and showing the part of the bag with red stain. I also find it kinda interestin' that the red stain is not smeared or smudged at all-there is clear detail and edges where the red stain meets the white plastic.

Surely there was at least a partial print on one of the bags (of course there wouldn't be if gloves were worn).

Ok I'm done now!

ETA-who would've thought there could be so much analysis and discussion of 2 bags of garbage in a dumpster!-lol

 

[Jolynna]

I'm bumping up this thread because of all the misconceptions about the trash.

Most importantly, there was no pizza in the trashbag. Just pieces of a pizza box. The stinky pizza was a rumor given to reporters by Cindy.


Here are the E-mails between the Body Farm & OSCO confirming that no pizza was found in the trashbag:

-----Original Message-----
From: Vincent, Michael (OCSO)
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 5:30 PM
To: Vass, Arpad Alexander
Subject: **Exempt**

Doc,

I check the trash that was in the vehicle there was no meat products in the trash. There were pieces of a pizza box and other food containers. I will be emailing you a picture of the items first thing tomorrow.

ASL/CSI Michael J. Vincent
OCSO/Forensics Unit

-----Original Message-----
From: Vass, Arpad Alexander
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 5:33 PM
To: Vincent, Michael
Subject: RE: **Exempt**

Mike, not sure how I got that there was a pizza in the trunk – sorry about that one, but can you send me an itemized list of stuff that was in the trunk at the time the car was searched? Also, were the maggots on the pizza box?? Arpad

Arpad A. Vass, Ph.D.

-----Original Message-----
From: Vincent, Michael (OCSO)
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 5:40 PM
To: 'Vass, Arpad Alexander'
Subject: RE: **Exempt**

The pizza story came from the mother, who told reporters the smell was from pizza in the trunk. A local news station left a half of pizza in a trunk for seven days, there results were no smell, no maggots, just dried out pizza. I will send you the list along with the pictures.

ASL/CSI Michael J. Vincent
OCSO/Forensics Unit

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4081493&postcount=1"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - 2009.08.07 Emails between Oak Ridge and OCSO[/ame]
[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4081493&postcount=1"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - 2009.08.07 Emails between Oak Ridge and OCSO[/ame]
​

Here is the list of items from the trashbag courtesy of BondJamesBond:

White trash bag w/ blue handles w/ misc. items

1. Empty Coca Cola cherry can 12oz with num #2145.
2. Empty Coca Cola Classic can 12oz with num #22502.
3. Empty Milwaukee's "Best Light" beer can #C7019e.
4. Empty Sprite can 12oz with # 16090RA.
5. Empty circular metal box of "Copenhagen Tobacco" with num # SLN8178.
6. One (1) hair pin; three (3) plastic tie wraps
7. Empty "Dr. Peppe" can 12oz proof of purchase num # 2239E505168X.
8. Empty "Pepsi" can 12oz proof of purchasenum # 1608RF01238.
9. Empty "Sprite" can 12oz proof of purchase num # 16090RA.
10. Empty "Mountain Dew" 12oz proof of purchase num # 2122E504248X.
11. Empty "Oscar Mayer" plastic container 8oz proof of purchase num # 447001090.
12. Empty small "Crystal Light' container num # 249554.
13. Empty "Crystal Light" bottle 16oz with brown liquid proof purchase num # 430093911.
14. Bottle of "Kiwi's Sport Cleaner 5.5oz proof of purchase num # 3160024701.
15. Empty bottle of "Arm & Hammer" 80oz proof of purchase num #33200090430.
16. Empty bottle of "Crystal Light Soft Drink Mix" 80z proof of purchase num #4300095033.
17. Empty black container "Anchor".
18. Empty and broken pizza box "Pizza a Symbol of Quality".
19. Empty carton of "Cherry Coke" 12 packs proof of purchase num# 490003103.
20. Empty carton of "Velveeta" 10.3oz with napkin attach on it with exp day ll/Feb/09.
21. Empty carton of "Velveeta" 12oz proof of purchasenum # 2100065893.
22. Empty carton of "Velveeta" 9Aoz proof of purchase num # 210065643.
23. Empty pack of "Parliament Lights" proof of purchase num # 2820019008.
24. Empty pack of "Marlboro" num # 283022.
25. Empty pack of "Trident Splash" proof of purchase num # 1254667123.
26. Two empty aluminum wraps of "Velveeta" cheese sauce.
27. Piece of fabric that said "L G G made in Honduras of USA fabric".
28. White plastic hanger broken.
29. Piece of paper wrapper "Italian bread" "Roma" with a napkin attach to it.
30. Document "Full Sail" orientation & registration.
31. Three receipts.
32. Document dated on May 9, 2008.
33. Four air freshener sheets.
34. Five napkins.
35. Plastic wrapper of "Stouffer's" garlic chicken proof of purchase num # 1380045214.
36. Three small pieces of plastic wrapper.
37. Three pieces of aluminum foil.
http://www.wftv.com/pdf/20321119/detail.html

Here are pictures of the trash, http://www.wftv.com/pdf/20321119/detail.html No ham and cheese. No meat products what-so-ever.. Even the velveeta has been wiped from the foil. There's nothing there to attract fllies and maggots or to bubble and brew into whatever spilled out all over KC's car trunk...
​

 

[ThinkTank]

Someone posted on one of the threads (cannot remember which one???) a link to a really up close and clear photo of the two white trash bags that were in Casey's trunk (Exhibit 6 in Cindy's depo), and they said it "was the best photo of these bags that they had come across yet, and asked if we could see possible photos of Caylee in the corner of the bag." Does anyone have that link to that photo??? Or know which thread this was posted on, and what page of the thread?
It was NOT this Fox photo (it was a different photo with no media logo on it)
http://media.myfoxorlando.com/photogalleries/040609casephotosset2/1/lg/Trash_bag_0869208.htm
TIA

 

[Jolynna]

Someone posted on one of the threads (cannot remember which one???) a link to a really up close and clear photo of the two white trash bags that were in Casey's trunk (Exhibit 6 in Cindy's depo), and they said it "was the best photo of these bags that they had come across yet, and asked if we could see possible photos of Caylee in the corner of the bag." Does anyone have that link to that photo??? Or know which thread this was posted on, and what page of the thread?
It was NOT this Fox photo (it was a different photo with no media logo on it)
http://media.myfoxorlando.com/photogalleries/040609casephotosset2/1/lg/Trash_bag_0869208.htm
TIA

I think I saw some trash pictures that were better too. But, those were all I could come up with today. I just wanted it known that NOTHING from that trashbag could possibly have created the "smell" we've been hearing about. Nor was there anything in that trunk that would have turned to adipocere.

 

[Harmony 2]

I'm bumping up this thread because of all the misconceptions about the trash.

Most importantly, there was no pizza in the trashbag. Just pieces of a pizza box. The stinky pizza was a rumor given to reporters by Cindy.


Here are the E-mails between the Body Farm & OSCO confirming that no pizza was found in the trashbag:

-----Original Message-----
From: Vincent, Michael (OCSO)
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 5:30 PM
To: Vass, Arpad Alexander
Subject: **Exempt**

Doc,

I check the trash that was in the vehicle there was no meat products in the trash. There were pieces of a pizza box and other food containers. I will be emailing you a picture of the items first thing tomorrow.

ASL/CSI Michael J. Vincent
OCSO/Forensics Unit

-----Original Message-----
From: Vass, Arpad Alexander
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 5:33 PM
To: Vincent, Michael
Subject: RE: **Exempt**

Mike, not sure how I got that there was a pizza in the trunk – sorry about that one, but can you send me an itemized list of stuff that was in the trunk at the time the car was searched? Also, were the maggots on the pizza box?? Arpad

Arpad A. Vass, Ph.D.

-----Original Message-----
From: Vincent, Michael (OCSO)
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 5:40 PM
To: 'Vass, Arpad Alexander'
Subject: RE: **Exempt**

The pizza story came from the mother, who told reporters the smell was from pizza in the trunk. A local news station left a half of pizza in a trunk for seven days, there results were no smell, no maggots, just dried out pizza. I will send you the list along with the pictures.

ASL/CSI Michael J. Vincent
OCSO/Forensics Unit

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - 2009.08.07 Emails between Oak Ridge and OCSO
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - 2009.08.07 Emails between Oak Ridge and OCSO
​

Here is the list of items from the trashbag courtesy of BondJamesBond:

White trash bag w/ blue handles w/ misc. items

1. Empty Coca Cola cherry can 12oz with num #2145.
2. Empty Coca Cola Classic can 12oz with num #22502.
3. Empty Milwaukee's "Best Light" beer can #C7019e.
4. Empty Sprite can 12oz with # 16090RA.
5. Empty circular metal box of "Copenhagen Tobacco" with num # SLN8178.
6. One (1) hair pin; three (3) plastic tie wraps
7. Empty "Dr. Peppe" can 12oz proof of purchase num # 2239E505168X.
8. Empty "Pepsi" can 12oz proof of purchasenum # 1608RF01238.
9. Empty "Sprite" can 12oz proof of purchase num # 16090RA.
10. Empty "Mountain Dew" 12oz proof of purchase num # 2122E504248X.
11. Empty "Oscar Mayer" plastic container 8oz proof of purchase num # 447001090.
12. Empty small "Crystal Light' container num # 249554.
13. Empty "Crystal Light" bottle 16oz with brown liquid proof purchase num # 430093911.
14. Bottle of "Kiwi's Sport Cleaner 5.5oz proof of purchase num # 3160024701.
15. Empty bottle of "Arm & Hammer" 80oz proof of purchase num #33200090430.
16. Empty bottle of "Crystal Light Soft Drink Mix" 80z proof of purchase num #4300095033.
17. Empty black container "Anchor".
18. Empty and broken pizza box "Pizza a Symbol of Quality".
19. Empty carton of "Cherry Coke" 12 packs proof of purchase num# 490003103.
20. Empty carton of "Velveeta" 10.3oz with napkin attach on it with exp day ll/Feb/09.
21.Empty carton of "Velveeta" 12oz proof of purchasenum # 2100065893.
22. Empty carton of "Velveeta" 9Aoz proof of purchase num # 210065643.
23. Empty pack of "Parliament Lights" proof of purchase num # 2820019008.
24. Empty pack of "Marlboro" num # 283022.
25. Empty pack of "Trident Splash" proof of purchase num # 1254667123.
26.Two empty aluminum wraps of "Velveeta" cheese sauce.
27. Piece of fabric that said "L G G made in Honduras of USA fabric".
28. White plastic hanger broken.
29. Piece of paper wrapper "Italian bread" "Roma" with a napkin attach to it.
30. Document "Full Sail" orientation & registration.
31. Three receipts.
32. Document dated on May 9, 2008.
33. Four air freshener sheets.
34. Five napkins.
35. Plastic wrapper of "Stouffer's" garlic chicken proof of purchase num # 1380045214.
36. Three small pieces of plastic wrapper.
37. Three pieces of aluminum foil.
http://www.wftv.com/pdf/20321119/detail.html

Here are pictures of the trash, http://www.wftv.com/pdf/20321119/detail.html No ham and cheese. No meat products what-so-ever.. Even the velveeta has been wiped from the foil. There's nothing there to attract fllies and maggots or to bubble and brew into whatever spilled out all over KC's car trunk...
​

Thanks Jolynna!! I had wondered about the Velveeta since butyric acid was detected in the trunk.

[ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butyric_acid[/ame]

Butyric acid is found in rancid butter, parmesan cheese, vomit, and body odor and has an unpleasant smell and acrid taste, with a sweetish aftertaste (similar to ether). It can be detected by mammals with good scent detection abilities (such as dogs) at 10 ppb, whereas humans can detect it in concentrations above 10 ppm.

And because butyric acid permeates many surfaces in its surroundings and can endure even through cleanup for a long time.

http://www.prochoice.org/about_abortion/violence/butyric_acid.asp

The goal of introducing butyric acid into a clinic is to disrupt services, close the clinic, and harass patients and staff. Depending on the amount used and how it is introduced into the clinic, butyric acid can cause thousands of dollars of damage, requiring clinics to replace carpeting, furniture, and conduct extensive cleanup of the facility. In addition, even after cleanup, butyric acid's smell leaves a reminder of the incident for months, and often years, to come.

BTW, love your posts... they are always so informative.

 

[BondJamesBond]

bump for continued discussion of the trash from 2009.12.09 doc release

 

[BondJamesBond]

bumping for reference

 

[WolfmarsGirl]

It seems like the defense is pinning a lot on alternate theories about the smell and maggots in the car. Let's try to settle this once and for all.

From what I remember, the trash contained an EMPTY pizza box and, essentially, a bunch of wrappers and EMPTY drink containers, etc. Am I missing something here?

If the defense says the odor and the flies come from the trash, then what the heck was in the trash????

Unfortunately, I am a scatter-brain when it comes to finding information on this forum, but I know I saw some sort of a trash inventory at one point.

Does anyone know how to find out about the contents of the trash?

And, IMO, if the contents do not show something organic, like fruit or rotten meat, then HOW is the DT going to run with their assertions? Surely, the state will give a run-down of the list of items to counter the DT's theory, right?

In which case, none of these hearings related to the smell in the trunk could possibly have any value whatsoever. Right? Why can't the state bring that information up now to end this nonsense?

Or, WAS there something in the trash that might possibly cause an odor? I simply do not know.

Any ideas?

 

[gamom]

The only decomp smelling "trash" in KC's car was sadly Caylee. The other garbage bag had no type of food in it and according to the deputy who put it in her car, never left an odor after removing it from her trunk.

Anyway's what idiot puts trash in their trunk? Every apartment building I have been to have dumpsters to dump trash in. IMO, she put the bag in the trunk to use that as her new excuse as to why her car smells. Since we know the squirrel story would only last for so long.

 

[Horace Finklestein]

Well like you said there was no pizza, there were some wrappers, some empty cans, etc. I don't remember everything that was in there, but there was nothing, and I mean NOTHING that would come close to smelling like decomp. The DT is only fooling themselves if they think anyone will buy the nonsense of trash bags having anything to do with the smell, or the febreze lie having to do with chloroform. It defies common sense and logic and is extremely desperate and offensive imo.

Dr. Lee did go on tv and lie as well - saying maggots could have been attracted to pizza, ham, etc, so I can see where the DT thought they had a winner. Last time I checked maggots feed on blood, not cooked food, bread, etc.

 

[Joanner]

Dr. Lee did go on tv and lie as well - saying maggots could have been attracted to pizza, ham, etc, so I can see where the DT thought they had a winner. Last time I checked maggots feed on blood, not cooked food, bread, etc.

Last week on Nancy Grace, Dr. Lee said there was half eaten pizza in the bag.

"Admissions packet Lake-Sumter Community College, School of Cosmetology" So I wonder if it was Tony or Casey planning a new career?

 

[BlOnDe_GuRrL]

i keep hearing JB say something about cheese..
i made an interesting observation the other day..
velveeta comes wrapped in a foil wrap, inside a box.
only the box was in this trash.. not the foil wrapper.. correct? if so, where's the stinky cheese smell coming from? the cheese itself doesn't come in contact with the box!

 

[ynotdivein]

Bumpity bump

 

[ynotdivein]

Fasten your seatbelts and hold on to your cocktails, folks, we are about to take a magic carpet ride to [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=6316281#post6316281"]this thread[/ame]...

 

[Capri]

photos here
http://www.wftv.com/slideshow/news/20320624/detail.html