Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #25

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You questioned Trinket78 why her/his kids had a n


It doesn't prove it either way. Only that you can be prescribed with one if you do or don't have asthma.


But you would only be prescribed one if your child had respiratory problems. So her kids had respiratory issues.

I don't understand why we would assume she lied about them having asthma though.
 
But you would only be prescribed one if your child had respiratory problems. So her kids had respiratory issues.

I don't understand why we would assume she lied about them having asthma though.
I don't know that anyone is assuming she lied, just discussing it.

If indeed his story is accurate, then these are things to consider, imo and allowed.
 
For those who believe CW's story may be true:

Do you think he panicked and didn't want to be arrested for just Shanann's murder or that he thought he would be blamed for all of the murders? If he only killed Shanann, then shouldn't he have known trying to cover everything up would only make it look like he killed Bella and CeCe as well?

Shouldn't he have expected to be the primary (if not the only) suspect in their disappearances? And shouldn't he have known that he would lose all credibility for lying right off the bat? Obviously he knew there would be a thorough investigation of all the evidence in the house and his activities and that his affair(s) were only going to make him look even more guilty. Why did he think anyone would believe his story about her just taking the girls and leaving everything behind?

There has never been a case where a husband killed his wife because she murdered their children and then tried to cover everything up by hiding all the bodies. Why should this be this first time?
Difficult. I have the feeling that something in between is the truth, something that is not clear to us yet on what happened on that day. I am not believing CW story but I am also not fully convinced that he killed them all. I do think he panicked at some point, yes.

Edit: Initially I was thinking premeditated by CW. I am not fully convinced of this anymore.
 
I didn't say the children had no respiratory issues. Why you made that giant leap with my post, I have no idea.


You said " ...I believe the children's medical conditions and her own were embellished for attention..."

I am saying that her kids OBVIOUSLY had respiratory issues, or they wouldn't have been prescribed a nebulizer.

If you want to assume she is lying about them having asthma, then fine. I am going to take her word for it at this time, until I find out otherwise.
 
For those who believe CW's story may be true:

1)Do you think he panicked and didn't want to be arrested for just Shanann's murder or that he thought he would be blamed for all of the murders? 2) If he only killed Shanann, then shouldn't he have known trying to cover everything up would only make it look like he killed Bella and CeCe as well?

3)Shouldn't he have expected to be the primary (if not the only) suspect in their disappearances? 4) And shouldn't he have known that he would lose all credibility for lying right off the bat? Obviously he knew there would be a thorough investigation of all the evidence in the house and his activities and that his affair(s) were only going to make him look even more guilty. 5) Why did he think anyone would believe his story about her just taking the girls and leaving everything behind?

There has never been a case where a husband killed his wife because she murdered their children and then tried to cover everything up by hiding all the bodies. 6) Why should this be this first time?

(Bolded numericals by me)

1) both
2) yes he should have
3) yes he should have
4) one would think
5) This is good question whether he did or didn't kill everyone. He told this story either way and his lying in retrospect looks awful.
6) A great question, and I don't know. The only thing I can say, speaking only for myself, is that if a seemingly (to all available SM accounts and all voiced friend accounts) devoted and loving and helpful and present husband and father is on trial for the murder of his 3 children and wife and is facing potentially the death penalty, I'm going to look at all angles.

One does have to "suspend disbelief" to a certain extent with respect to the circumstantial evidence thus far and what has been the historical precedence for family murder cases, yes. But once you do that, the bottom line answer to your questions above is that CW made some really bad choices in how he handled what he says happened in that house that night. If his version of events is true, he should have called 911, he should have come clean immediately, and he should have been sobbing in grief. But he didn't handle it that way, and I don't claim to know why (if his version is true).
 
Sorry. I’m confused. The way you snipped my post makes it look like I think SW was lying about the medical diagnosis. I said the opposite.

I figured that would get taken out of context. Was just stating that just because someone posts about having a medical issue doesn’t necessarily mean they have it, or their kids have it. I see people posting things like that all the time, & contradicting their “diagnose(s)”. So it’s not too far of a jump to wonder if it’s true. MOO.

No one thought CW was capable of strangling his wife, & yet here we all are debating the case.
 
CW wasn't lying throughout the interview. He admitted they had an emotional conversation and he wanted to separate. Please show me the proof he lied, please.

Did you find Susan's Smith tearful plea for her children's kidnappers believable? I sure did. So did her ex-husband. Cops did, too, at first.

My point is that I'm not an expert on analyzing what's going through the brains of people who are being interviewed by the news media in stressful situations which is why I always make it clear it is my opinion based on my own personal and professional experience. JMO

Didnt he lie just by giving any interview? He KNEW where they were, because he put them there.
 
C.W. did do housework even though FB posts claim it was SW
I would imagine she might not want him to as she seemed to be so particular about the way she kept her house. The only reason I say that is because I have friends who are like that (one says she has OCD) even though I think she is joking, but she doesn't allow anyone else to do the housework because she says they won't do it right!
 
On SW facebook page under "More" heading then "Check-Ins" and then under subtitle "Places" and also under the subtitle "Recent", there are several medical facilities highlighted by SW. They have corresponding photos of the girls at those medical facilities along with correlating dates providing a chronology of the medical appointments.
 
After 11 years of going to many specialists, I was diagnosed with Fibromyalgia. Even now that I have a diagnosis, I've had multiple doctors because not all doctors specialize in everything. It seems like when I've been lucky enough to find one, they've moved. I live in the same town as Shanann so I can absolutely see why she may have gone to multiple doctors. Unfortunately when the pain isn't visible, not all doctors take you seriously.
I'm sorry you have that. Hugs.
 
I am posting the evidence we know of again as some have asked. If anyone has other evidence to add please copy and add.

Evidence of triple murder:

1. Dad claims he saw a blue child on a baby monitor at night.

2. The coincidence of two people, unrelated by blood, both reacting to something in a short span of time by losing their minds and committing homicide, defies reason.

3. The coincidence of those same people both committing homicide in the exact same manner -strangulation- is unlikely.

4. A father passionate enough with love for his children, to kill at the sight of them being harmed, would be desperate beyond reason to save them. But:
a. Dad failed to call 911 to try to save his children. Even if he thought they were beyond help, a parentslove is so intense they will desperately and irrationally try for help that will never come.
b. There is no account of him throwing off the mother and working desperately to revive them or resuscitate them. Hell, total strangers have performed CPR on a child's corpse in rigor. (Cooper Harris case). But a passionately loving dad didn't even try in this case?

5. The dad failed to call 911 after killing his wife in a supposed fury of emotion.

6. Dad also failed to run screaming onto the lawn for help or in anguish.
In cases of such Greek tragedy magnitude either 5 or 6 usually comes into play.

7. This entire scene - the "emotional argument", the vicious strangulation of two children, the father witnessing the incomprehensible and reacting with murderous fury and anguish - all of it was totally silent. Except for the poor dog howling that night. How do we know? Because the houses are in close proximity and neighbors mentioned hearing nothing but the dog the next day IIRC.

8. CW did not scream or wail in anguish so great that it caused him to murder his wife. Not one report of such sounds.

9. CW supposedly lost his mind in grief and anguish. However he regained it in moments in a manner that does not comport with a true mental break. In cases we have seen where people lose it and commit murder, they are typically either wailing on the lawn and to 911 operators or they are in an apparent psychotic state- not lying about what happened, not covering it up, not able to function normally at all. See thumbnail of Julie Schenecker as an example of what this looks like. Police interview Julie Schenecker after kids found dead

10. CW, after such an insanely, horrific Greek tragedy of a scene, calmly loaded up the bodies of his wife and children in order to conceal their deaths and dispose of them. We know this because a neighbor stated she witnessed him leaving. (No reports of wailing and she said, IIRC, the truck drove normally. So no veering, spinning of tires or other signs of lack of composure). And it's apparently on video.

11. CW, a man passionately in love enough with his kids to erupt in murderous rage when they're harmed, did not attempt to give them a burial that comports psychologically with the love and bond parents have with their kids. Death Rituals Reported by White, Black, and Hispanic Parents Following the ICU Death of an Infant or Child
A Global History of Child Death

12. Instead he dumps them in two separate vats of oil. Not together. No way to commemorate their lives. Concealed. Discarded. In a manner that veers from any known traditional burial rite of any kind.

13. CW went to work and monitored the ring video of his house. After the horrific Greek tragedy he just endured. He went to work. And monitored the video of his front door.

14. CW left a few voice messages and sent some texts to the wife he knew was dead, thus calmly concealing what happened.

15. CW calmly called SW's friend after she came to the door and he saw her on the ring video. He asked what was going on. We know this because he stated as much and this is corroborated by the friend.

16. CW rushed home - blowing stop signs and with beating heart, according to him- when CW came to the house and expressed alarm. The first time we have heard of a hint of emotion on his part since the horrific murders of his kids supposedly by his wife and his heat of passion killing of her, occurs when he the authorities are about to get involved.

17. CW cooly lied to the friend about where SW was supposed to be that day and why she wasn't at home. After he lost his mind the night before. He is calm and able to work to conceal those events.

18. There is not one hint of brief reactive psychosis or drug induced psychosis in CW's demeanor and behavior since 5:15 am the morning of the deaths, nor the next day as he gives calm and detailed interviews to the media. His pupils are normal. He is not slurring speech. He does not have a vacant stare. He exhibits no delusions or paranoia. He is not showing emotional lability. (I'm no expert in psychology but have seen a few psychotic people due to psychotic breaks or drugs and it's easy to research).

19. CW shows no anguish, depression, grief, concern, sadness or despair during his stoic media interviews, despite having supposedly been so deranged by his passionate love for his kids that he killed their attacker. His eyes are dry. Not red. No signs of puffiness from weeping. His face is smooth and calm. He looks well rested. No bags under his eyes. He smiles. He grins. He smirks. All with the knowledge that his insane wife savagely murdered his precious babies causing him to lose his mind with anguish. And with the knowledge that the people he loved so fiercely it caused him to kill, are rotting in separate vats of oil.

20. CW calmly and continuously lies to the media about the whereabouts of his dead wife and dead children.

21. CW systematically works with LE to track down his wife and kids. Brainstorming. Supplying numbers and addresses. Calling people. All the while knowing they are dead and decomposing.

22. CW is questioned and lies about having an affair. A motive in many murders of wives.

23. SW was pregnant. (A circumstance present in vast numbers of murders of spouses or parents by men).

24. Some people and report that CW seemed distant with his wife and kids in the weeks leading up to this monstrous event.

25. CW was not hospitalized for any reason after this tragedy.

A couple of things from the CO model jury instructions:

D:01 DIRECT AND CIRCUMSTANTIAL EVIDENCE—NO DISTINCTION

A fact may be proven by either direct or circumstantial evidence. Under the law, both are acceptable ways to prove something. Neither is necessarily more reliable than the other.


E:03 PRESUMPTION OF INNOCENCE, BURDEN OF PROOF, AND REASONABLE DOUBT

Reasonable doubt means a doubt based upon reason and common sense which arises from a fair and rational consideration of all of the evidence, or the lack of evidence, in the case. It is a doubt which is not a vague, speculative or imaginary doubt, but such a doubt as would cause reasonable people to hesitate to act in matters of importance to themselves.

https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/Supreme_Court/Committees/Criminal_Jury_Instructions/2017/COLJI-Crim 2017 - Final.pdf

This is an awesome post that gitana1 put together. Thoughtful, thorough, accurate and a great summary of information and EVIDENCE known so far.

With all due respect, for those who believe CW's version of events, that a seemingly loving and devoted mother strangled her babies to death, put something like this together from that point of view? Even those who are leaning towards believing that rather than try to save his babies, CW strangled SW and then for some reason loaded all of their bodies in the back of his truck, "dumped" those precious babies in oil, and covered their mother with dirt? And then went about his day and preened in his shirt for the camera? Knowing where those precious bodies were the whole time?

I am not being sarcastic. I respectfully would really like to see a logical layout of what would lead me to lean toward or outright believe his version of these horrific events. It may help some to at least understand the position better, because I can't wrap my head around it.

All MOO MOO MOO
 
I would imagine she might not want him to as she seemed to be so particular about the way she kept her house. The only reason I say that is because I have friends who are like that (one says she has OCD) even though I think she is joking, but she doesn't allow anyone else to do the housework because she says they won't do it right!
Ah but she posts that she "conditioned" him to put things in her closet properly. So I'm guessing she trained him to do it her way.
 
Hmm.. that post is dated 10/2015 when C.C.W. Would’ve been 15 months old, not 22 months old as stated in the post. Just something I noticed.
Edited to add: No, C.C.W. Would’ve been only 3 months old at that point, so that must be B.W. In that photo. That makes more sense.
 
I figured that would get taken out of context. Was just stating that just because someone posts about having a medical issue doesn’t necessarily mean they have it, or their kids have it. I see people posting things like that all the time, & contradicting their “diagnose(s)”. So it’s not too far of a jump to wonder if it’s true. MOO.

No one thought CW was capable of strangling his wife, & yet here we all are debating the case.

Understood. Yes. People lie on internet. Lol. We’ll have to agree to disagree about that applying to SW. As it does appear her kids had scripts for meds that require a corresponding diagnosis, I’m not going to believe she was lying without additional evidence.
 
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