17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #18

[JBean]

So the judge found her complaint valid, but also his. Both were awarded injunctions.

It's a 'he said, she said' sort of thing. So no one really knows the true story.

Thanks for the link,
fran

Sounds like a potential pattern emerging-"guilty with an explanation"
In this case we don't have "he said -she said" we have "he said - he couldn't say anything"

JMHO of course.

 

[katydid23]

It seems to be a pattern with all these complaints of violence involving GZ. No one knows the true story because it appears he never was held accountable. His life appears to be just one big lumpy rug. jmo

Growing up and working with my defense attorney dad taught me that when a defendant is made public, there can be all kinds of 'evidence' that comes out. And it is not always accurate as a way to gauge who the person really is. Maybe he is a violent, cold hearted monster. But so far, I am not convinced of that.

Just because ONE former co-worker tells a story about him being fired, it does not mean it went down that way exactly.
And if he really did THROW a drunk woman cross the room, then imo, he would have been arrested and or sued by someone.

The same with the RO's from the ex girlfriend. It looks to me like it was a two way volatile relationship. I don't automatically assume that he was the violent one and she was the totally innocent victim. I saw a lot of cases like this when my dad defended clients. It is quite often a two way street.

Not always, but if it is a very violent abusive husband then you often end up with women going for medical treatment and the men being arrested. We have no evidence of that here. I think they both drank and were both immature and jealous.

I BELIEVE HE SHOULD HAVE BEEN ARRESTED FOR MANSLAUGHTER ON THE FIRST NIGHT. But I also believe that he is being unfairly painted as a violent, cold blooded, premeditated killer. And so I am responding in defense of him in that way only.

 

[francie]

“George Hall, a retired Presbyterian minister, said he was Zimmerman's neighbor for 20 years in Manassas, Va., until about 2001. Hall said Zimmerman and his brother attended church, and he wrote a recommendation for Zimmerman for a police academy in 2004.”

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_NEIGHBORHOOD_WATCH_ZIMMERMANS_SUPPORT?SITE=MOSPL&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

I wonder if George was accepted/rejected, dropped out/graduated and if he graduated why didn’t he work for police dept? Hmm. jmo.

 

[frenchvixen]

That chills me to the bone. Anybody who can shoot someone for walking in his neighborhood and looking wrong and think that it'll blow over...

Death will never blow over.

Just frightening. Cold to the core.

Umm.. I have been saying this since the beginning. This man's demeanor at the police station 30 min after shooting TM was too calm. It is so frightening. I remember hitting a deer while driving about two years ago. I talked about it for months and wondered if the poor thing lived or died. Everytime I drive in that part of Pennsylvania I think of the poor deer :-(

This man snuffed the life out of someone else and even if it was in so-called self defense I would have been hospitalized. HE THOUGH IT WOULD BLOW OVER. Is that so? TM's parents' world is forever darkened b/c of you. That does not blow over.

 

[lisalei321]

What I found interesting was GZ had injuries to his face and his ex blamed it on the dog. LOL.


http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...ce-20120321_1_petitions-documents-injunctions

How did he get a gun with a prior injunction?

Seems like that would have raised a flag on his carry permit.

Per article quoted above.

Sent from LG Esteem using Tapatalk

 

[LolaMoon08]

I looked through the info from the ex gf and I don't see anything about him 'throwing her across a room.'

The woman said she offered to drop the papers off the following day, but Zimmerman became upset, took her cellphone and shoved her. A fight ensued, she said, and her dog bit Zimmerman's cheek.

The ex-fiancée reported that Zimmerman had "open handed smacked" her in the mouth and berated her during an argument in January 2003.

In November 2002, Zimmerman claimed his ex had assaulted him with a baseball bat after he went to a concert without her.
http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...ce-20120321_1_petitions-documents-injunctions

It sounds like a troubled relationship on both sides, imo. But a shove and an open handed smack don't sound all that violent in comparison to what we are hearing about him.

As for the other 'story' about his being fired for assaulting a woman. I am not sure how accurate that is. Nobody else has come forward, including the woman. And why wouldn't she sue if he threw her across a room while he was on duty as a security guard? Why wasn't he arrested?

BBM I respectfully, and strongly disagree. Any man that would put his hands on a woman, is no man at all!

As for the whole incident with the party... it was an "illegal" party which is usually when strippers come to the house/hotel to do nude performances. Of course the girl wasn't going to press charges and the other people at the party weren't going to call the cops because then they would all be busted.

MOO

 

[katydid23]

“George Hall, a retired Presbyterian minister, said he was Zimmerman's neighbor for 20 years in Manassas, Va., until about 2001. Hall said Zimmerman and his brother attended church, and he wrote a recommendation for Zimmerman for a police academy in 2004.”

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_NEIGHBORHOOD_WATCH_ZIMMERMANS_SUPPORT?SITE=MOSPL&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

I wonder if George was accepted/rejected, dropped out/graduated and if he graduated why didn’t he work for police dept? Hmm. jmo.

He was NEVER going to get into the academy, imo. He was arrested for an assault on an undercover cop. He will never get past that. My son applied to the academy, is hoping to be accepted, but they wanted to wait for his speeding tickets from when he was 17 to go away. SPEEDING TICKETS. That is it. He has nothing else, never ever in any trouble. And they said the 2 speeding tickets need to be further in his past. LOL

 

[vlpate]

What I found interesting was GZ had injuries to his face and his ex blamed it on the dog. LOL.


http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...ce-20120321_1_petitions-documents-injunctions

Great Dane? :what:

 

[RANCH]

How did he get a gun with a prior injunction?

Seems like that would have raised a flag on his carry permit.

Per article quoted above.

Sent from LG Esteem using Tapatalk

I'm not sure. Do those domestic violence injunctions have an expiration date?

 

[Omori]

Zimmerman is guilty--period. We don't need to look at past histories or charges of racism--it's all irrelevant. The boy was walking home from the store talking to his girlfriend on his cell phone. That much has been verified. Ergo, he should not be dead. There can be no justification for it. The only way it could haver happened is that Zimmerman confronted the individual. Whether Martin attacked him first is irrelevant. So what if he did? Zimmerman confronted him--there is NO OTHER WAY it could have happened. He is therefore guilty. It's really that simple.

 

[vlpate]

He was NEVER going to get into the academy, imo. He was arrested for an assault on an undercover cop. He will never get past that. My son applied to the academy, is hoping to be accepted, but they wanted to wait for his speeding tickets from when he was 17 to go away. SPEEDING TICKETS. That is it. He has nothing else, never ever in any trouble. And they said the 2 speeding tickets need to be further in his past. LOL

The charges against GZ were dropped, there's no conviction, just the arrest.

People are arrested all the time who are found not guilty, charges are dropped, record expunged....etc., Convictions, not arrests count against a person in almost all situations. "Arrest" doesn't equate to "guilty".

I do agree that there is a reason GZ wasn't in the Police Academy. He has done everything BUT enter. I don't know about the psych evaluation angle - I know a lot of crazzzzy cops with anger issues. There's a reason, just can't figure out what it could be.

 

[Desdemona]

He was NEVER going to get into the academy, imo. He was arrested for an assault on an undercover cop. He will never get past that. My son applied to the academy, is hoping to be accepted, but they wanted to wait for his speeding tickets from when he was 17 to go away. SPEEDING TICKETS. That is it. He has nothing else, never ever in any trouble. And they said the 2 speeding tickets need to be further in his past. LOL

Question: Was it THE police academy, where you train to become a LEO, or was it the Citizens' Police Academy where you learn about how to appreciate and work with LE and go on ride-alongs to gain perspective on how LE work in your community?

Do we know whether GZ applied to the actual Police Academy to become a LEO? --

-- Or did he apply for this or something like it?
http://www.seminolesheriff.org/external/InfoSitePage.aspx?pageID=166

TIA

 

[vlpate]

Zimmerman is guilty--period. We don't need to look at past histories or charges of racism--it's all irrelevant. The boy was walking home from the store talking to his girlfriend on his cell phone. That much has been verified. Ergo, he should not be dead. There can be no justification for it. The only way it could haver happened is that Zimmerman confronted the individual. Whether Martin attacked him first is irrelevant. So what if he did? Zimmerman confronted him--there is NO OTHER WAY it could have happened. He is therefore guilty. It's really that simple.

I have a question for you that LE had to ask themselves when investigating this case, and the answer they came up with factored into their decision not to arrest GZ. I would imagine the new investigation is looking at the same question. Given the fact that TM took off running, and had a two minute head start on GZ - why do you think TM didn't go home in those two minutes? People only run for two reasons - they are scared of someone, or they are up to no good and think they've been busted.

This is not me taking a side, this is me trying to sleuth the case the way the investigators do - by looking at the facts and leaving emotion out of it. I am sincerely interested in your point of view on this. TIA!

 

[RANCH]

Question: Was it THE police academy, where you train to become a LEO, or was it the Citizens' Police Academy where you learn about how to appreciate and work with LE and go on ride-alongs to gain perspective on how LE work in your community?

Do we know whether GZ applied to the actual Police Academy to become a LEO? --

-- Or did he apply for this or something like it?
http://www.seminolesheriff.org/external/InfoSitePage.aspx?pageID=166

TIA

Here's a link to a letter saying GZ was accepted to the "Citizen Law Enforcement Academy".

http://www.scribd.com/heidi_vries/d...ation-for-the-Citizens-Police-Academy-in-2008

 

[deelytful1]

“George Hall, a retired Presbyterian minister, said he was Zimmerman's neighbor for 20 years in Manassas, Va., until about 2001. Hall said Zimmerman and his brother attended church, and he wrote a recommendation for Zimmerman for a police academy in 2004.”

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_NEIGHBORHOOD_WATCH_ZIMMERMANS_SUPPORT?SITE=MOSPL&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

I wonder if George was accepted/rejected, dropped out/graduated and if he graduated why didn’t he work for police dept? Hmm. jmo.

This might answer your question...

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/23/2712299_p2/george-zimmerman-self-appointed.html

A few years back, he came by and asked George Hall, Kay’s husband, to write a letter of recommendation so that he could apply to a police agency. Hall gladly obliged.

Whether Zimmerman ever actually applied to a police agency is unclear. But according to the Florida Department of Law Enforcement, he never applied to take the Basic Abilities Test needed to enter recruit training.

 

[Desdemona]

Zimmerman is guilty--period. We don't need to look at past histories or charges of racism--it's all irrelevant. The boy was walking home from the store talking to his girlfriend on his cell phone. That much has been verified. Ergo, he should not be dead. There can be no justification for it. The only way it could haver happened is that Zimmerman confronted the individual. Whether Martin attacked him first is irrelevant. So what if he did? Zimmerman confronted him--there is NO OTHER WAY it could have happened. He is therefore guilty. It's really that simple.

(BBM)

It appears that who confronted whom first may indeed be relevant according to the law. Exactly what took place in the ensuing physical fight will most likely also be highly relevant -- again, according to the law. The determination of the facts of what happened -- much of which is missing at this time for us, the public -- will definitely drive the outcome of this case... all of which remains to be seen. IMO

Totally agree that TM should not be dead. What a tragedy and what a sordid end for a hopeful young life. I feel terrible for him, his family and friends, and everyone else whose lives have been shattered by the incident, including GZ and his family, the witnesses, the neighbors, etc. It simply should not have happened.

I also strongly believe that the hype, rhetoric, threats, hysteria, opportunism, fomenting of racial divisiveness, shameless media free-for-all, and the public hatefest, does nothing to honor TM's life or memory. That should not have happened, either, IMO.

What a shame it all is. :cry:

 

[LambChop]

I have a question for you that LE had to ask themselves when investigating this case, and the answer they came up with factored into their decision not to arrest GZ. I would imagine the new investigation is looking at the same question. Given the fact that TM took off running, and had a two minute head start on GZ - why do you think TM didn't go home in those two minutes? People only run for two reasons - they are scared of someone, or they are up to no good and think they've been busted.

This is not me taking a side, this is me trying to sleuth the case the way the investigators do - by looking at the facts and leaving emotion out of it. I am sincerely interested in your point of view on this. TIA!

Investigators have to use what they know as fact and not what GZ claims, including the running. It's up to them to be objective when investigating and not try to build a case favorable to GZ. If they are still investigating there is a reason they suspect GZ was not telling the truth. We know the homocide detective wanted to press charges. There is a homocide charge on the reports but SA overroad LE and said there was not enough evidence to convict GZ because he claimed he was innocent by way of the SYG law and they could proceed no further. SA made that decision not LE.

TM's body was further down the sidewalk then we originally thought. He was closer to home and a distance from the cut through sidewalk where GZ claims to have been attacked by TM. If GZ walked down Twin Tree towards the back gate (and where TM was going on his way home) GZ could have cut TM off at the break in the houses forcing TM back towards the cut through and to where his body was found. Only someone who is an expert will be able to explain what possibly happened. jmo

 

[LolaMoon08]

I respect everyone's rights to own/carry a gun... if they are stable and responsible people. I don't understand why gun owners are even backing George Zimmerman? This case has nothing to do with Zimmerman owning/carrying a gun? It has everything to do with him following, confronting, and shooting an unarmed kid. It has nothing to do with Zimmerman's right to own/carry a gun... it is how he irresponsibly used it and an innocent person is dead.

MOO

 

[Adrienne37]

I looked through the info from the ex gf and I don't see anything about him 'throwing her across a room.'

The woman said she offered to drop the papers off the following day, but Zimmerman became upset, took her cellphone and shoved her. A fight ensued, she said, and her dog bit Zimmerman's cheek.

The ex-fiancée reported that Zimmerman had "open handed smacked" her in the mouth and berated her during an argument in January 2003.

In November 2002, Zimmerman claimed his ex had assaulted him with a baseball bat after he went to a concert without her.
http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...ce-20120321_1_petitions-documents-injunctions

It sounds like a troubled relationship on both sides, imo. But a shove and an open handed smack don't sound all that violent in comparison to what we are hearing about him.

As for the other 'story' about his being fired for assaulting a woman. I am not sure how accurate that is. Nobody else has come forward, including the woman. And why wouldn't she sue if he threw her across a room while he was on duty as a security guard? Why wasn't he arrested?

His ex-fiance hasn't come forward either so are we to believe that just because she hasn't come forward that it isn't true?



~jmo~

 

[Elley Mae]

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/23/2712299_p2/george-zimmerman-self-appointed.html

According to the report, agents with Florida’s Alcohol Beverage and Tobacco division were arresting several employees near the University of Central Florida.

I wonder if the agent was in plain (street) clothes.