2008.09.18 Tracy M Interview Audio #1

[magic-cat]

That's a strong allegation that you make regarding Cindy covering for crimes committed by Casey. Do you have any substantiation for that?

I wonder about Casey's intelligence...you say she's dumb, and her friend Annie said she would definitely not be the mastermind behind any kind of criminal plan because she's not that bright. On the other hand, one of her friends on here (Exit 13) described the Casey they'd always known as "smart". He and other friends (Annie included) expressed the concern that the behavior they'd seen from her in that first prison phone call and everything that's come out since July 15, was nothing like her at all, like she was a completely different person. They were very concerned wondering what could have happened to her in those few weeks before the arrest to have changed her so radically, not to mention resulted in Caylee being missing.

The bizarre tour she took police on July 15 or 16 seemed very confused to me. Taking the police all the way out to her old office where she'd just have to say, once they got there, that she didn't work there anymore. Taking them over to RM/JPC/AH's apartment but pointing to the building across the street instead (an old folks' home), saying the babysitter lived in a 2nd floor apartment in that building with her mother, and the babysitter's roommate lived in a 3rd floor apartment, etc. None of it made any sense, it was crazy, and it wasn't designed to make herself look good, that's for sure.

On the one hand, she's shown enough intelligence, and friends say she was smart enough, that I think if she were the murderer, she would have called police much earlier on and simply said a stranger had grabbed Caylee away from her in a store or something. Or left town for that matter and just told her parents she and Caylee were moving somewhere to be a family with some fictitious boyfriend. And if she were the murderer, I can't see her leaving the tape on Caylee's face, (she'd remove it to make the death appear more innocent, I also don't think she'd dump Caylee in a kind of disheveled state, I think she'd neaten her up), or dumping Caylee down the street from her own home rather than somewhere closer to Sawgrass or J Blanchard or elsewhere, or leaving lots of items with Caylee that matched ones in her home and not removing the matching ones from the home, etc. (Of course the friends and family say she would never harm Caylee, period.)

But because of that bizarre trip she took police around on that day that seemed so dreamlike and didn't make any sense, and certainly wasn't calculated to help her own case, I can't rule out her being mentally ill or otherwise impaired enough that she could potentially have lost Caylee or even harmed Caylee and not remembered it, (or that she could have been taken advantage of by someone who did harm Caylee.) Like her friends (old friends and family), I'd like to know, what happened to her to change her so much, what is her actual mental and physical state (or was)?

Tracey's account of how she was acting during the week she was there also sounds like she was not acting normal. If she were a normal person who didn't know where her child was, she would have been frantic with worry, that worry might be expressed in many different ways, but she'd be worried and distressed. Unless maybe she was medicated or was impaired in some way. If she were the murderer, with any awareness of what was going on at all, she would have pretended to be worried and concerned. She wouldn't have acted playful and like she didn't care about Caylee.

My guess is she has normal intelligence but that she may have (or may have had) some other impairment going on. Unless she was acting that weird and unconcerned about Caylee because at the time, she thought a friend of hers had Caylee and Caylee wasn't going to be harmed. I'm not sure yet if she's the murderer or not. Anyway, I'd be interested in a brain scan and other medical tests due to the behavioral/personality change, and even just because of the history of the seizure, etc. MOO

Bolded by me, respectfully...
I know this was not directed at me but OLG however, I thought I would also respond. The substantiation that Cindy has covered for Casey?
♣ She, Casey, was 8 months pregnant and Cindy was telling the family she could not have been prego because she would have to have sex for that to have happened...
♣ She, Casey, robs grandma Shirleys purse and steals a check to pay for items for Caylee's birthday and Cindy takes care of it FOR her.
♣ She, Casey, robs grandma and grandpas bank account to buy herself a new couple hundred dollar phone and Cindy takes care of it for her.
♣ She, Casey, steals from Lee and from Lee's friends according to him and she is never brought to consequences for this by Cindy or George or anyone else for that matter.
♣ She, Casey, pays NO bills although she is living with her parents and they are completely supporting her daughter. Cindy is on the record stating she gave money to Casey all the time.
♣ Casey robs Caylee's bank savings account and her piggy bank at home and nothing is done about it.
♣ Casey steals gas repeatedly from her parents building and nothing is done about it.
♣ Casey steals her mom's credit cards and charges up ungodly amounts and nothing is done about it.
♣ Cindy removes evidence from the car and washes it and or destroys it.
♣ Cindy hands over the wrong hairbrush to LE when specifically asked for Caylee's and then JOKES to her "spokesperson" or at least in front of him that she should have given them the DOGS toothbrushes.
♣ Cindy and George KNEW that Casey had no money and no job and yet continued on with her in the farse of she was working 12 hour days in split shifts.
♣ Cindy changes her story about smells like a damned dead body in the car to that was pizza and I am sticking to it, although NO pizza was even recovered IN the car.
♣ Cindy states that lying is not against the law and KNOWS her daughter is a big fat lie baby and yet sees nothing wrong with that.
♣ Cindy refuses to allow Tim Miller to have an article of Caylee's clothing so the dogs can get her scent and possibly find her, indicating she KNEW something and did not WANT those dogs to get on Caylee's trail.

I could go on and on like that, but I think there is AMPLE evidence that Cindy has upheld Casey in her illegal and immoral behavior for YEARS, possibly all her life.:behindbar

 

[magic-cat]

But if she had murdered someone, would she go ask a neighbor for a shovel? Is she that stupid? Isn't that the last thing any person would do? I mean, we've all read her emails and texts, we've heard what her old friends said about her being reasonably smart. She doesn't appear to be subnormal in intelligence. She seems like a reasonably bright 22 year old. If she really needed a shovel for burying or moving a dead body, and didn't want to get one from her dad's shed or Target, wouldn't she find some way to borrow or steal one somewhere without announcing to her neighbor, I need a shovel? (Of course it's only the neighbor's statement that she borrowed his shovel or that he saw her backing into the garage, etc. I have no reason to doubt him but you never know of course who is telling the truth and who isn't, you can't take statements as facts in themselves.)

It has been speculated that she needed the shovel to pick Caylee up since she was already decomposing and perhaps Casey did not want to touch her...so in that instance, she needs to move Caylee so she can "package" her and the shed is locked and she cannot get to the shovel so in a state of panic, because this child IS decomposing, she thinks to borrow the neighbors and tells herself she will make up some excuse, like cutting bamboo...remember at this point Casey is convinced NOBODY will ever know what she has done and she is never planning on telling anyone...

 

[Jolynna]

That's a strong allegation that you make regarding Cindy covering for crimes committed by Casey. Do you have any substantiation for that?

I wonder about Casey's intelligence...you say she's dumb, and her friend Annie said she would definitely not be the mastermind behind any kind of criminal plan because she's not that bright. On the other hand, one of her friends on here (Exit 13) described the Casey they'd always known as "smart". He and other friends (Annie included) expressed the concern that the behavior they'd seen from her in that first prison phone call and everything that's come out since July 15, was nothing like her at all, like she was a completely different person. They were very concerned wondering what could have happened to her in those few weeks before the arrest to have changed her so radically, not to mention resulted in Caylee being missing.

The bizarre tour she took police on July 15 or 16 seemed very confused to me. Taking the police all the way out to her old office where she'd just have to say, once they got there, that she didn't work there anymore. Taking them over to RM/JPC/AH's apartment but pointing to the building across the street instead (an old folks' home), saying the babysitter lived in a 2nd floor apartment in that building with her mother, and the babysitter's roommate lived in a 3rd floor apartment, etc. None of it made any sense, it was crazy, and it wasn't designed to make herself look good, that's for sure.

On the one hand, she's shown enough intelligence, and friends say she was smart enough, that I think if she were the murderer, she would have called police much earlier on and simply said a stranger had grabbed Caylee away from her in a store or something. Or left town for that matter and just told her parents she and Caylee were moving somewhere to be a family with some fictitious boyfriend. And if she were the murderer, I can't see her leaving the tape on Caylee's face, (she'd remove it to make the death appear more innocent, I also don't think she'd dump Caylee in a kind of disheveled state, I think she'd neaten her up), or dumping Caylee down the street from her own home rather than somewhere closer to Sawgrass or J Blanchard or elsewhere, or leaving lots of items with Caylee that matched ones in her home and not removing the matching ones from the home, etc. (Of course the friends and family say she would never harm Caylee, period.)

But because of that bizarre trip she took police around on that day that seemed so dreamlike and didn't make any sense, and certainly wasn't calculated to help her own case, I can't rule out her being mentally ill or otherwise impaired enough that she could potentially have lost Caylee or even harmed Caylee and not remembered it, (or that she could have been taken advantage of by someone who did harm Caylee.) Like her friends (old friends and family), I'd like to know, what happened to her to change her so much, what is her actual mental and physical state (or was)?

Tracey's account of how she was acting during the week she was there also sounds like she was not acting normal. If she were a normal person who didn't know where her child was, she would have been frantic with worry, that worry might be expressed in many different ways, but she'd be worried and distressed. Unless maybe she was medicated or was impaired in some way. If she were the murderer, with any awareness of what was going on at all, she would have pretended to be worried and concerned. She wouldn't have acted playful and like she didn't care about Caylee.

My guess is she has normal intelligence but that she may have (or may have had) some other impairment going on. Unless she was acting that weird and unconcerned about Caylee because at the time, she thought a friend of hers had Caylee and Caylee wasn't going to be harmed. I'm not sure yet if she's the murderer or not. Anyway, I'd be interested in a brain scan and other medical tests due to the behavioral/personality change, and even just because of the history of the seizure, etc. MOO

I think KC took LE to Universal because she didn't know what else to do. She had been literally ambushed by her mother at Tony's apartment.

KC didn't have a good story because she hadn't needed one. Telling her friends Caylee was with the nanny and telling her parents that she and Caylee were out of town had worked. KC hid from the only people who would ever notice Caylee not being around. Problem solved. KC was free to concentrate on important things like her relationship with Tony.

Fretters that worry about hurting others and that feel guilty after wrongdoing don't usually kill innocents. People that are selfish to the bone do. Not having a conscience doesn't mean you are delusional or driven by compulsion.

Every con man & cheating husband in the world knows how to compartmentalize and disassociate from his dirty deeds and show a sweet face to the public. Sometimes they become arrogant & lazy about covering up and make foolish mistakes.

In no way do I believe that being a clumsy, heartless evildoer proves you are a mentally impaired evildoer. KC was able to manage shot girls, promote Fusian, cook, clean & shop for a household of 4, juggle friends and men and make up elaborate lies to keep her parents at bay...KC knows/knew what she did.

jmo

 

[Woe.be.gone]

The Howard Stern remark was a bit more disturbing then simply being stomach turning. Remember this was early in the post arrest time frame. Before alot of people started asking questons about inappropriate contact between KC and JB, or the whole day sessions at his office, or the admonission of teh jail guards. If Tracey is to be believed then KC had "JB tapping that" on her mind early on and pretty much voiced such. It is a huge red flag that basically confirms something we have lone suspected.

snipped and BBM

*NEWS ALERT*
Woe's thought only -
for the purpose of comic release and food for thought type stuff -
JB WAS CAYLEE'S BIO (unproven speculation) -
funny or true?

This is not off topic since it is Tracy's words that suggest to us the KC was comfortable eluding to the possibility that JB and KC have engaged in other than professional type encounters. How again did KC find this Lawyer?

 

[magnumsmom]

That's a strong allegation that you make regarding Cindy covering for crimes committed by Casey. Do you have any substantiation for that?

I wonder about Casey's intelligence...you say she's dumb, and her friend Annie said she would definitely not be the mastermind behind any kind of criminal plan because she's not that bright. On the other hand, one of her friends on here (Exit 13) described the Casey they'd always known as "smart". He and other friends (Annie included) expressed the concern that the behavior they'd seen from her in that first prison phone call and everything that's come out since July 15, was nothing like her at all, like she was a completely different person. They were very concerned wondering what could have happened to her in those few weeks before the arrest to have changed her so radically, not to mention resulted in Caylee being missing.

The bizarre tour she took police on July 15 or 16 seemed very confused to me. Taking the police all the way out to her old office where she'd just have to say, once they got there, that she didn't work there anymore. Taking them over to RM/JPC/AH's apartment but pointing to the building across the street instead (an old folks' home), saying the babysitter lived in a 2nd floor apartment in that building with her mother, and the babysitter's roommate lived in a 3rd floor apartment, etc. None of it made any sense, it was crazy, and it wasn't designed to make herself look good, that's for sure.

On the one hand, she's shown enough intelligence, and friends say she was smart enough, that I think if she were the murderer, she would have called police much earlier on and simply said a stranger had grabbed Caylee away from her in a store or something. Or left town for that matter and just told her parents she and Caylee were moving somewhere to be a family with some fictitious boyfriend. And if she were the murderer, I can't see her leaving the tape on Caylee's face, (she'd remove it to make the death appear more innocent, I also don't think she'd dump Caylee in a kind of disheveled state, I think she'd neaten her up), or dumping Caylee down the street from her own home rather than somewhere closer to Sawgrass or J Blanchard or elsewhere, or leaving lots of items with Caylee that matched ones in her home and not removing the matching ones from the home, etc. (Of course the friends and family say she would never harm Caylee, period.)

But because of that bizarre trip she took police around on that day that seemed so dreamlike and didn't make any sense, and certainly wasn't calculated to help her own case, I can't rule out her being mentally ill or otherwise impaired enough that she could potentially have lost Caylee or even harmed Caylee and not remembered it, (or that she could have been taken advantage of by someone who did harm Caylee.) Like her friends (old friends and family), I'd like to know, what happened to her to change her so much, what is her actual mental and physical state (or was)?

Tracey's account of how she was acting during the week she was there also sounds like she was not acting normal. If she were a normal person who didn't know where her child was, she would have been frantic with worry, that worry might be expressed in many different ways, but she'd be worried and distressed. Unless maybe she was medicated or was impaired in some way. If she were the murderer, with any awareness of what was going on at all, she would have pretended to be worried and concerned. She wouldn't have acted playful and like she didn't care about Caylee.

My guess is she has normal intelligence but that she may have (or may have had) some other impairment going on. Unless she was acting that weird and unconcerned about Caylee because at the time, she thought a friend of hers had Caylee and Caylee wasn't going to be harmed. I'm not sure yet if she's the murderer or not. Anyway, I'd be interested in a brain scan and other medical tests due to the behavioral/personality change, and even just because of the history of the seizure, etc. MOO

BBM. If anyone in that family were "normal" they would have been frantic with worry. But according to Tracey, none of them were frantic with worry.

 

[weasel]

[/b]

Caylee as in the name? or Caylee as in her bio dad is Italian but if Casey were Romanian/Irish that would make Caylee 1/2 Italian, 1/4 Irish and 1/4 Romanian...

BBM
Well I agree there

So, Casey is Romanian/Irish and Caylee is ITALIAN? Hum, goes a long way towards explaining "La Bella Vita", ITALIAN for "beautiful life"....

 

[Woe.be.gone]

I have to admit, there are a few folks that do seem to act like they personally can do no wrong. And seem to take pride in pointing out supposed faults of others.

I just laugh. Cause I know that someone just like them, are doing the same thing to them.

Some times including me. When I think "Good Lord, someone really thinks that way?.. Oh well."

Example would be the talk about the Dog protesting at the A's. Some were just totally wacked, that someone would bring a dog.. anywhere. While others were totally wacked the other direction.

Yadda, Yadda, yadda..

IT's one thing to do that to regular posters.. But TP was a guest, here to answer questions. Yet some folks just had to tell him how wrong HIS OPINIONS where. And how wrong his OBSERVATIONS were. Like it was some point to argue.

I"m one of those folks that if a person doesn't like someone, I can understand that and respect that. But that doesn't meant that I have to, just because they do. And if they expect me to mimic their hatred,Just because they hate them, then I can't respect that. I actually find such distasteful.

It's a fine line type thing. If you're dealing with personality differences, then I tend to agree with you. When you're dealing with a whole family who seemingly is hiding the truth of what happened that caused a little helpless girl's death, then I consider it aiding and abetting.

Think of all the drama, tax payer dollars, manpower and insults to others' their withholding of the truth has caused and is still causing.

This goes beyond not liking someone just because a friend doesn't.

 

[magic-cat]

I think KC took LE to Universal because she didn't know what else to do. She had been literally ambushed by her mother at Tony's apartment.

KC didn't have a good story because she hadn't needed one. Telling her friends Caylee was with the nanny and telling her parents that she and Caylee were out of town had worked. KC hid from the only people who would ever notice Caylee not being around. Problem solved. KC was free to concentrate on important things like her relationship with Tony.

Fretters that worry about hurting others and that feel guilty after wrongdoing don't usually kill innocents. People that are selfish to the bone do. Not having a conscience doesn't mean you are delusional or driven by compulsion.

Every con man & cheating husband in the world knows how to compartmentalize and disassociate from his dirty deeds and show a sweet face to the public. Sometimes they become arrogant & lazy about covering up and make foolish mistakes.

In no way do I believe that being a clumsy, heartless evildoer proves you are a mentally impaired evildoer. KC was able to manage shot girls, promote Fusian, cook, clean & shop for a household of 4, juggle friends and men and make up elaborate lies to keep her parents at bay...KC knows/knew what she did.

jmo

...and every cheating wife...lol:blowkiss:

 

[Woe.be.gone]

I cannot see your reasoning here. KC has been in jail for over a year now, yet she has not broken down. If she has not broken down in all this time, why are you convinced that her not being in jail that one week that LP bailed her out would have broke her? If she could stand jail this whole year, I don't see where one more week would have mattered.

I have not read ahead and by no means do not wish to put words in OLG's mouth but I have been taking time to read this thread and think about each post. I thanked OLG for her post because I see merit in her opinion that if KC had not received support in the beginning and had not been bailed out so she could plot and plan with her people, (they bolstered her up and assured her that they would make all this go away I would imagine) then, maybe OLG is right.

KC should have been left to stew in her false story and figure out what to say next all by herself. If she remained silent then, at least we would know it was of her own accord.

Makes sense to me.

 

[cyberborg]

Yes, and herein lies the key. Imo, family dynamics involves unspoken yet agreed upon roles. In this case, KC plays the "little girl" and while Caylee was alive, "played mom." Remember the recently released doc about Cindy sending DC to the remains site? If you scroll down to page 18 of that document where they are quoting one of KC's friends, Annie, she notes among other things:

Casey pulled Annie aside and told her "Oh my God, this is supposed to be Caylee's day. I'm her mom. She's not her mom." Casey was getting mad saying "this is my daughter" and claimed her mother was trying "trying to play mom instead of letting Casey play mom... or be mom."​

Imo, this is why it was easy for KC to murder Caylee. Bc KC was "playing mom" as opposed to actually being a mother. As for Cindy? I think she was "playing mom" too. Esp considering that she allegedly told KC:

Even though Caylee is the best mistake you ever made, she was still a mistake."​

Imnsho, Caylee was nothing more than a weapon these two women used against each other.

So true, Caylee was just a pawn, a possession for manipulation and neither CA or KC "playing mom" truly loved and cared for Caylee, she was used as needed when needed. She was ultimately discarded like trash -- OMG. It is time for KC and the A's to understand accountability and pay the price.

:clap::clap::clap::clap:

 

[Woe.be.gone]

I totally agree with you. And FWIW, something doesn't sit right w/ me either. I don't intend to cause offense, but I wonder it it is b/c......

1) I am cynical to my core. (And that may be a failing on my part.)
2) I'm not impressed by the presence here of certain key people.

JMO

Think of us all as if we are a collective hand You are the middle finger strong and upright, willing to put up a fight for what's right. I'm the ring finger, a little mushy at times, then we have pinkys who are always mushy and the pointers - those are the peeps who know they know and point quickly to the truth (so they say). The thumbs are the clueless - bless them we may.

We are a collective hand here at WS. :crazy:

:blowkiss:

 

[Woe.be.gone]

Okay the truth? I am not impressed to the point of not asking tough questions, either. In fact, if someone really knew something about the facts of the actual murder, I would not expect them to be here writing about it (I would like it, but I wouldn't expect it), because we are going to ask very pointed questions.
As I had written before, I would be most grateful to the case peripheral players if they came here to shed light on where we might be wrong or to expand on things we have seen in discovery.
TM has indicated she thinks we are wrong because we should be working instead of writing here (her assumptions, not mine). So we debated her assertion.
TP writes that we are wrong about the Anthony's, and we have debated that as well. They've gotta be able to take a little heat here, otherwise they should rethink coming into the WS kitchen. For us to just kiss their hienies would be stupid and has nothing to do with sleuthing.

I so appreciate this post - thank you.

 

[OneLostGrl]

After finallly listening to the interview I am convinced more than ever that kc talked cindy into believing that caylee drowned in the pool and that it was somehow all her fault (cindy's)...I believe cindy always saw kc as an extension of herself and never let her develop into a grown up,I think that shows especially in this interview when they talk about the sevendust song,kc can't own anything,it's cindy crying and saying that's her song,yet again she turns kc into nothing....I also believe cindy made kc so good at the game of denial that kc really did not think of caylee as being dead or what she did to her....kc literally has no sense of reality....she knew what she did but like tracy said she believes her own lies,that was her only way to survive ....I'm not trying to make excuses for her,I'm just trying to make sense of this ...and I don't believe like so many that kc has no soul....I believe kc was never allowed to develop her soul....the music she listens to,her icons and her photography shows that she can think deep...she was just never allowed to show it and her only concern became herself and if she was pretty enough to be loved.It's really sad I think...

 

[Woe.be.gone]

I hate to get preachy - and as far as I know no one here is a Christian. But, for those who are - did it ever occur to you that Tracy is acting in a Christian manner? God hears the cries of the imprisoned throughout the Scriptures. Whether the prisoners in question are mass murderers, sex offenders, baby killers - whoever - Jesus says that when you visit a prisoner, 'you visit me.' " (Matthew 25).

I do believe that KC killed Caylee - and probably in a horrible fashion - and thus should be locked away from society and I also believe that Tracy is doing a goodness to write her and give her money. I commend her for it.

Se herein lies a problem - twisting stuff to suit the situation.

1. I am a Christian and give credit to God Almighty for saving my soul. In the name of Jesus.

2. It is not my job to ultimately judge another human soul - therein lies my comfort.

3. Yes, visiting prisoners is a nice thing to do and God could use you as His vessel to plant a seed or help someone turn toward goodness.

4. Agreeing with and/or bonding with the prisoner is not necessary.

"I planted, Apollos watered, but God was causing the growth. So then neither the one who plants nor the one who waters is anything, but God who causes the growth. Now he who plants and he who waters are one; BUT EACH WILL RECEIVE HIS OWN REWARD ACCORDING TO HIS OWN LABOR."
1 Corinthians 3:6-8.

5. Jesus said, "RENDER TO CAESAR THE THINGS THAT ARE CAESAR'S, AND TO GOD THE THINGS THAT ARE GOD'S." Mark 12:17

 

[OneLostGrl]

That's a strong allegation that you make regarding Cindy covering for crimes committed by Casey. Do you have any substantiation for that?

I wonder about Casey's intelligence...you say she's dumb, and her friend Annie said she would definitely not be the mastermind behind any kind of criminal plan because she's not that bright. On the other hand, one of her friends on here (Exit 13) described the Casey they'd always known as "smart". He and other friends (Annie included) expressed the concern that the behavior they'd seen from her in that first prison phone call and everything that's come out since July 15, was nothing like her at all, like she was a completely different person. They were very concerned wondering what could have happened to her in those few weeks before the arrest to have changed her so radically, not to mention resulted in Caylee being missing.

The bizarre tour she took police on July 15 or 16 seemed very confused to me. Taking the police all the way out to her old office where she'd just have to say, once they got there, that she didn't work there anymore. Taking them over to RM/JPC/AH's apartment but pointing to the building across the street instead (an old folks' home), saying the babysitter lived in a 2nd floor apartment in that building with her mother, and the babysitter's roommate lived in a 3rd floor apartment, etc. None of it made any sense, it was crazy, and it wasn't designed to make herself look good, that's for sure.

On the one hand, she's shown enough intelligence, and friends say she was smart enough, that I think if she were the murderer, she would have called police much earlier on and simply said a stranger had grabbed Caylee away from her in a store or something. Or left town for that matter and just told her parents she and Caylee were moving somewhere to be a family with some fictitious boyfriend. And if she were the murderer, I can't see her leaving the tape on Caylee's face, (she'd remove it to make the death appear more innocent, I also don't think she'd dump Caylee in a kind of disheveled state, I think she'd neaten her up), or dumping Caylee down the street from her own home rather than somewhere closer to Sawgrass or J Blanchard or elsewhere, or leaving lots of items with Caylee that matched ones in her home and not removing the matching ones from the home, etc. (Of course the friends and family say she would never harm Caylee, period.)

But because of that bizarre trip she took police around on that day that seemed so dreamlike and didn't make any sense, and certainly wasn't calculated to help her own case, I can't rule out her being mentally ill or otherwise impaired enough that she could potentially have lost Caylee or even harmed Caylee and not remembered it, (or that she could have been taken advantage of by someone who did harm Caylee.) Like her friends (old friends and family), I'd like to know, what happened to her to change her so much, what is her actual mental and physical state (or was)?

Tracey's account of how she was acting during the week she was there also sounds like she was not acting normal. If she were a normal person who didn't know where her child was, she would have been frantic with worry, that worry might be expressed in many different ways, but she'd be worried and distressed. Unless maybe she was medicated or was impaired in some way. If she were the murderer, with any awareness of what was going on at all, she would have pretended to be worried and concerned. She wouldn't have acted playful and like she didn't care about Caylee.

My guess is she has normal intelligence but that she may have (or may have had) some other impairment going on. Unless she was acting that weird and unconcerned about Caylee because at the time, she thought a friend of hers had Caylee and Caylee wasn't going to be harmed. I'm not sure yet if she's the murderer or not. Anyway, I'd be interested in a brain scan and other medical tests due to the behavioral/personality change, and even just because of the history of the seizure, etc. MOO

Bold is mine-

You ASSUME she would- your expectations of peoples behavior are just that.. what YOU expect them to do in the event they murder their child and are caught!. Perhaps that's how YOU would act!

Regardless, it's obvious she is not a "normal" person. Normal people don't lie about having a job for 2 years.. plus the second job.. leaving the home every day as if . Normal people don't make up stories about being mugged with a GUN to their heads. Normal people don't steal from their childs piggy banks or from their parents, grandparents, siblings and siblings friends. Normal people don't lie about an OBVIOUS pregnancy.. normal people don't try to tell a man who they know is NOT the babys father, that he is the father! Normal people don't tell their friends their father had a friggin' stroke and is in the hospital when he has not and has not.

As for Cindy covering Casey's crimes- how 'bout gramma's checks, or Casey's habit of stealing from her? When Cindy called 911 the day she picked up Casey she told them she wanted "to press charges" against Casey for "stealing an auto and stealing money". She ALSO says she has "3 statements". Try listening to the audio's and reading the emails that we have been given in this case- there is plenty of substantiation.. from Cindy's own husband, mother, and son!

 

[Bathbuddys]

That's a strong allegation that you make regarding Cindy covering for crimes committed by Casey. Do you have any substantiation for that?

I wonder about Casey's intelligence...you say she's dumb, and her friend Annie said she would definitely not be the mastermind behind any kind of criminal plan because she's not that bright. On the other hand, one of her friends on here (Exit 13) described the Casey they'd always known as "smart". He and other friends (Annie included) expressed the concern that the behavior they'd seen from her in that first prison phone call and everything that's come out since July 15, was nothing like her at all, like she was a completely different person. They were very concerned wondering what could have happened to her in those few weeks before the arrest to have changed her so radically, not to mention resulted in Caylee being missing.

The bizarre tour she took police on July 15 or 16 seemed very confused to me. Taking the police all the way out to her old office where she'd just have to say, once they got there, that she didn't work there anymore. Taking them over to RM/JPC/AH's apartment but pointing to the building across the street instead (an old folks' home), saying the babysitter lived in a 2nd floor apartment in that building with her mother, and the babysitter's roommate lived in a 3rd floor apartment, etc. None of it made any sense, it was crazy, and it wasn't designed to make herself look good, that's for sure.

On the one hand, she's shown enough intelligence, and friends say she was smart enough, that I think if she were the murderer, she would have called police much earlier on and simply said a stranger had grabbed Caylee away from her in a store or something. Or left town for that matter and just told her parents she and Caylee were moving somewhere to be a family with some fictitious boyfriend. And if she were the murderer, I can't see her leaving the tape on Caylee's face, (she'd remove it to make the death appear more innocent, I also don't think she'd dump Caylee in a kind of disheveled state, I think she'd neaten her up), or dumping Caylee down the street from her own home rather than somewhere closer to Sawgrass or J Blanchard or elsewhere, or leaving lots of items with Caylee that matched ones in her home and not removing the matching ones from the home, etc. (Of course the friends and family say she would never harm Caylee, period.)

But because of that bizarre trip she took police around on that day that seemed so dreamlike and didn't make any sense, and certainly wasn't calculated to help her own case, I can't rule out her being mentally ill or otherwise impaired enough that she could potentially have lost Caylee or even harmed Caylee and not remembered it, (or that she could have been taken advantage of by someone who did harm Caylee.) Like her friends (old friends and family), I'd like to know, what happened to her to change her so much, what is her actual mental and physical state (or was)?

Tracey's account of how she was acting during the week she was there also sounds like she was not acting normal. If she were a normal person who didn't know where her child was, she would have been frantic with worry, that worry might be expressed in many different ways, but she'd be worried and distressed. Unless maybe she was medicated or was impaired in some way. If she were the murderer, with any awareness of what was going on at all, she would have pretended to be worried and concerned. She wouldn't have acted playful and like she didn't care about Caylee.

My guess is she has normal intelligence but that she may have (or may have had) some other impairment going on. Unless she was acting that weird and unconcerned about Caylee because at the time, she thought a friend of hers had Caylee and Caylee wasn't going to be harmed. I'm not sure yet if she's the murderer or not. Anyway, I'd be interested in a brain scan and other medical tests due to the behavioral/personality change, and even just because of the history of the seizure, etc. MOO

wow! this is REALLY some food for thought.
I have gone in this direction myself once or twice.
BUT who else in this circle would have done this to Caylee? and maybe she snapped as she watched or walked in on something happening to Caylee?

Nothing and I MEAN nothing surprises me in these cases anymore.

I started this kind of thinking with the Cantu case. That is absolutley Bizzare!

 

[Woe.be.gone]

I am a Christian and believe the Bible is the Word of God. I believe that criminals should be ministered to. This is why I find very interesting that the A's recently got baptized. If it was for real, it would change their whole way of thinking...maybe they would reach out to KC with the love of God, knowing that He forgives. It would change the way they related to the Grunds (who are also Christian). However, I haven't seen any evidence of this change. Maybe it has happened...but....

Staging? Who am I to judge? God will have the final word. I couldn't even read the thread as I believe the Holy Spirit will communicate if it is true.

 

[Curious Me]

I do agree we should keep our spiritual love for mankind, and be kind, and be forgiving, and pray for them.

However, if you are dealing with a narcissist, you might want to just stay way the heck away from them to avoid your spirituality being tainted by their jaded manipulation of you.

The narcissist I knew used religion and the church, and suggestions that I should forgive 49 x 49 times or until eternity. They can use a person's softness and loving concern for their own selfish gains. A narcissist can leave you bankrupt spiritually. Look at all the people who had loving intentions towards Casey be thrown under the bus.

Tracy did her job there at the house. I'm not surprised at all that she found Casey likeable either despite the dead baby. What I'm trying to say is - it's fine to have your spiritual love of people, but people like Casey will use it against you. I'm surprised Tracy has come out of this so undamaged. She kept her wits about her, and didn't get taken in completely by Casey's enchantment. Thank You Tracy.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

I think it is good and bad. People talk about the 'blogs' and are most often thinking about those that are badly run, if at all and are dis-organized chaos and BS. Most of them are hard to remember and so, when they try to recall the name of a blog they come up with WS.

It is the price WS pays for its fame but it gets dragged into all those blogs that deserve a bad name when WS is actually the best of the best. Totally different, structured, moderated, organized, well run.

The only hope is, it spreads the word on WS but then folks come here and find how good it really is......

This cracked me up! Yes sometimes bad advertising turns into good advertising. :crazy:

I have a friend who sends me tunes from the 70's. I cannot believe the comments people make to each other below the videos. They're like you're a bleep and you're a bleep, bleep, why? Because someone named the wrong guitar or said this type is better than that type. What is with people these days? Jeez.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

KC is NOT a nice girl, she murdered her baby. Her parents are NOT nice people, they don't even want her held accountable for murdering her baby, they want to kiss her a$$ and cook her all her favorite foods. There is no other way to look at it. Everything else anyone says, is as NG is fond of saying "putting lipstick on a pig"!

Are you certain of your feelings? (No Gemini rising here)
Get down, get down, get down, ugh. :rage::yow::gavel::couch::rocker::drink::nuclear:

I forgot the smilie face. Peace.