2009.05.01 Document Release: "FBI FORENSIC REPORT" ONLY!

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I don't know of anyone that would WANT to wear those boots besides kc....LOL
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I have faith in the system as far as the evidence goes. What it comes down to are the people on the jury who for some strange reason do not get it in their skulls the concept of reasonable doubt. Thank Goodness SP's trial was held in an area that understood the term.

Downtown L.A. did not understand it all all. They went for the old "beyond ANY doubt".....that is the kind of jury JB wants....his best bet for that is Miami, IMO....and I think he is heading there.

Remember....kc has plenty of other charges (which she should have been addressed and convicted on by now) that should put her away anyway. Anyone gonna tell me the evidence is not good on those either?
 
Remember....kc has plenty of other charges (which she should have been addressed and convicted on by now) that should put her away anyway. Anyone gonna tell me the evidence is not good on those either?

That's one thing I don't understand...Why didn't they take the check charges to trial first? Since it's an ongoing investigation ,I don't think that anything pertaining to the check charges can be used during the murder trial. So the jury is going to have be looking at a seeming loving mother (prior to June 15/16th) that has a clean record (with the exception of a couple of traffic violations). If she had already been convicted of the check charges (which there is video proof of this crime) the jury would be presented with a woman that is a criminal that has a long history of theft.
 
As far as murder, eyewittnesses and strangers go, you wouldn't want to be on the receiving end of this one...WORST evidence there is most of the time.

A good cirumstantial case is a much better way to go than a stranger's observation. In a store robbery that I know locally, there were three witnesses. Each one gave an entirely different description of the perp. Each gave a different race, weight and height. Funny,how people always seem to want a witness to prove a crime and often they are wrong on what they saw. Most people are not trained observers, to say the least, and during a crime the emotions overide the reality
 
I think others have alluded to this,however disappointing the doc dump may be,I am wondering if the evidence is not coming out in "a backwards sort of way." For example we know that CA,LA, and GA's prints were not found on the duct tape,however do we know that KC's were not? We know that soil samples were not found on the shoes taken from the house,but we don't know if soil samples were found on the boots in the car,or the carpeting of the car.Perhaps in releasing what ISN"T there,there are still real bombshells yet to come,otherwise I am scratching my head and saying "what are the SA possibly thinking?' There has to be a trump card somewhere.I sure hope for Caylee's sake,that by putting the DP back on the table that they were not trying to bluff their way into a conviction.
I could be wrong but doesn't the report say there were no latent prints detected - doesn't that mean there were no prints on the duct tape to compare either to GA, CA, LA or KC? The way I read it, they got prints from GA, CA, & LA to eliminate them from any prints found on the tape. However, the tape had no prints to use to do so. Therefore, they cannot compare them to KC's either - but this report was only dealing with prints collected from GA, CA, & LA under items taken from residence. It has nothing to do with KC's prints but the tape had no prints to compare.

Can someone correct me if I'm reading that wrong?

Also in regards to shoes... Wasn't there another pair of KC's shoes found at TL's after LA picked up her things - under the bed or something? Did those get turned over to LE and have we seen a report regarding them?
 
The problem with the scarcity of tangible evidence is that the defendent in this case is a lazy, not exceptionally bright girl who apparently never thinks more than 10 minutes in advance. I don't believe for one minute that KC meticulously planned her daughter's murder and disposal in advance. This has all the hallmarks of an impulsive action. So while I do believe that it defies logic that the bags and the duct tape came from somewhere else besides the Anthony home, nothing so far ties KC and only KC to the evidence.

I think that when a DA asks a jury for the death of a young woman, they should be held to the highest standards possible. The evidence should be specific in terms of the defendent's guilt. Personally, I do not believe a death penalty case should be based upon circumstantial evidence only. That said, we do not know if the state has other forensics that are positive...such as her prints or DNA on any of the items found with the baby's body. I still cannot believe that a fingerprint was not found on duct tape, particularly where the tape was adhered to hair. This is mindboggling.
 
Means: They may not be able to determine the actual cause of death that is true. And they may not be able to provide any direct evidence that shows that KC did the killing.

Opportunity: KC is the last one known to be with Caylee. And the one to have the vehicle in her possession. And the fact that there was evidence that KC was driving around in the vehicle, which evidence proves that Caylee's remains was in will go a very long way in convincing the jury (as well as shocking them.) Just stop and think about that. It smelled so bad that even KC mentioned the smell. And it still smelled when CA and GA picked the car up. That alone puts KC with the remains of her dead daughter. And she didn't report it, and when the car was checked and she had the opportunity to provide an explanation for it, she was unable to do so. To me and IMO to the jury that will be the most convincing evidence. Who doesn't report the death of their child? She knew about the odor, she knew or should have known that her daughter was missing. And she didn't bother to check out the trunk of the vehicle in between her dinners, shopping trips and movies? It puts KC with the remains, and her failure to report it and attempts to hide/explain it shows attempts to coverup.

Then there is the evidence that connects Caylee's remains to the A family home. The tape, the garbage bags and everything. The A's never reported any breakins before that. They never told detectives about any indications that someone had been rummaging in their home. So indications are that the items were removed by someone familiar with the home. So you have KC connected to the dead remains of her daughter. And to the home.

Then there is the heart sticker. That will be a shocker to the jury also. When you look at Caylee's pics, there are hearts everywhere. Hearts on Caylee's items. Who would discard the dead remains of a child, literally dump them like trash in a trash bag, and put a heart sticker on the duct tape? I really think that the sticker might have been gesture of remorse, or a memorial type item like you might put a favorite teddy bear in a casket- but the jury will see it as a type of contempt- just like we saw here the day it came out. But that will shake up the jury and will seal the deal.

Motive: KC's complaints to friends about her mother's relationship to Caylee, the jealousy and the resentment. And the argument/fight that she had with her mother just before she left the home. Add to that the fact that without her mother she didn't have a babysitter- and that that would interfere with her partying. And that her current boyfriend didn't want anything to do with Caylee.

We know a lot about what happened. But we still don't know what all the SA has. Not all has been released yet. And we get it piecemeal, without all the connections and the context that will make it understandable. Yes, I think they have enough to put KC with the dead remains, and to draw a reasonable conclusion that KC was the one who caused the death.

The smoking gun: Not every murder has a smoking gun. Not every murder has a witness. And not every murder has fingerprints and DNA. The biggest challenges in this case is not going to be proving that KC did it. The biggest challenge is going to be proving that it was first degree. And the coverup story that KC came up with is probably going to go a long way in convincing the jury that it was first degree. KC has had many many opportunities to say it was an accident. And she didn't. She didn't when it was first reported that Caylee was missing, she didn't when she was arrested for neglect, she didn't when she was arrested for murder, and she didn't when Caylee's remains were found. Instead she came up with the Zeniada story. The nanny that no one knows, no one has ever seen. Zanny that no one can even prove exists or has ever existed. Even KC didn't recognize the Zeniada that we know about. Why make up that elaborate story if it was an accident?

Yes, I think the SA has much more that they still haven't released, and I believe it is probably the most d*mming evidence. But to me, I think it won't be needed for a conviction. They already have shown more evidence than many other murders that they have gotten convictions for.
 
That's one thing I don't understand...Why didn't they take the check charges to trial first? Since it's an ongoing investigation ,I don't think that anything pertaining to the check charges can be used during the murder trial. So the jury is going to have be looking at a seeming loving mother (prior to June 15/16th) that has a clean record (with the exception of a couple of traffic violations). If she had already been convicted of the check charges (which there is video proof of this crime) the jury would be presented with a woman that is a criminal that has a long history of theft.

All I can recall is JB going in at the hearing and telling the judge, it would be more economically wise to delay this till after the "Big Case". Judge agreed. We have some Legal Eagles on board that can answer this question. There has to be more to it. I wish they would have charged her and got her a#$ to prison instead of her sitting as a royal highness in county jail. Imagine JB worried about costs?....LOL
 
Means: They may not be able to determine the actual cause of death that is true. And they may not be able to provide any direct evidence that shows that KC did the killing.

Opportunity: KC is the last one known to be with Caylee. And the one to have the vehicle in her possession. And the fact that there was evidence that KC was driving around in the vehicle, which evidence proves that Caylee's remains was in will go a very long way in convincing the jury (as well as shocking them.) Just stop and think about that. It smelled so bad that even KC mentioned the smell. And it still smelled when CA and GA picked the car up. That alone puts KC with the remains of her dead daughter. And she didn't report it, and when the car was checked and she had the opportunity to provide an explanation for it, she was unable to do so. To me and IMO to the jury that will be the most convincing evidence. Who doesn't report the death of their child? She knew about the odor, she knew or should have known that her daughter was missing. And she didn't bother to check out the trunk of the vehicle in between her dinners, shopping trips and movies? It puts KC with the remains, and her failure to report it and attempts to hide/explain it shows attempts to coverup.

Then there is the evidence that connects Caylee's remains to the A family home. The tape, the garbage bags and everything. The A's never reported any breakins before that. They never told detectives about any indications that someone had been rummaging in their home. So indications are that the items were removed by someone familiar with the home. So you have KC connected to the dead remains of her daughter. And to the home.

Then there is the heart sticker. That will be a shocker to the jury also. When you look at Caylee's pics, there are hearts everywhere. Hearts on Caylee's items. Who would discard the dead remains of a child, literally dump them like trash in a trash bag, and put a heart sticker on the duct tape? I really think that the sticker might have been gesture of remorse, or a memorial type item like you might put a favorite teddy bear in a casket- but the jury will see it as a type of contempt- just like we saw here the day it came out. But that will shake up the jury and will seal the deal.

Motive: KC's complaints to friends about her mother's relationship to Caylee, the jealousy and the resentment. And the argument/fight that she had with her mother just before she left the home. Add to that the fact that without her mother she didn't have a babysitter- and that that would interfere with her partying. And that her current boyfriend didn't want anything to do with Caylee.

We know a lot about what happened. But we still don't know what all the SA has. Not all has been released yet. And we get it piecemeal, without all the connections and the context that will make it understandable. Yes, I think they have enough to put KC with the dead remains, and to draw a reasonable conclusion that KC was the one who caused the death.

The smoking gun: Not every murder has a smoking gun. Not every murder has a witness. And not every murder has fingerprints and DNA. The biggest challenges in this case is not going to be proving that KC did it. The biggest challenge is going to be proving that it was first degree. And the coverup story that KC came up with is probably going to go a long way in convincing the jury that it was first degree. KC has had many many opportunities to say it was an accident. And she didn't. She didn't when it was first reported that Caylee was missing, she didn't when she was arrested for neglect, she didn't when she was arrested for murder, and she didn't when Caylee's remains were found. Instead she came up with the Zeniada story. The nanny that no one knows, no one has ever seen. Zanny that no one can even prove exists or has ever existed. Even KC didn't recognize the Zeniada that we know about. Why make up that elaborate story if it was an accident?

Yes, I think the SA has much more that they still haven't released, and I believe it is probably the most d*mming evidence. But to me, I think it won't be needed for a conviction. They already have shown more evidence than many other murders that they have gotten convictions for.


Very good points.
 
Concerning the recent download:

Remember the SA did overload on the amount of items they picked up from house and crime scene. The majority of which is useless to case. They had to hand over all of this and their efforts and results in processing per JB's request. Of course, there is going to be a lot that doesn't connect. Don't give up just because of this...means nothing. They have more than what they need to convict her. This latest reading should not disappoint any of you; you have to expect this. Every little thing in their cartons was not going to prove "murder". So have hope and beleive they know what they are doing. Right now they are giving JB what he ask for...y
 
I guess it's all in how you take the information. I saw nothing adressing the stain itself. The report is talking about the carpet sample yes but are they talking about "the stain" or another part of the trunk liner?

I've been reading over old reports on evidence collection and submission to FBI and Oakridge Labs here:
http://www.wftv.com/news/18530350/detail.html
http://www.wftv.com/news/18530418/detail.html


When CSI Bloise examined the trunk he commented on a stain observed on the spare tire cover which I believe is part of the carpeted floor area of the trunk. He collected part of this stained area (OCSO evidence #Q-16) and it was eventually sent to the FBI Lab (FBI evidence #Q-44). (link #2 above) FBI report states it was examined for hair, none were found. The sample was also examined in the FBI Chemistry Unit and results showed residue of chloroform with no other chemicals detected. I could find no other tests performed on the stained carpet by the FBI.

Now, another piece of the stained tire cover carpet from the trunk was sent to Dr. Vass at Oakridge Lab. (pg. 3 on link #1 above) This is the piece of stained carpet that Oakridge tested including LIBS and VFA. We have seen the results of LIBS which were consistent with human decompostion. We have not seen any VFA results as far as I know.

The FBI and Oakridge analysis and results are part of the same doc dump here:
http://www.wftv.com/download/2008/1024/17794795.pdf

So, we have seen some results on testing of "the stain" just not all of the results. The VFAs should be really informative as the report states it will help in the determination of a decompositional event and is the best means of obtaining a post-mortem interval (PMI) in lieu of entomological evidence.
 
I forgot to mention process of elimation. KC admits she left the home with Caylee. She admits that she was the last person from the household who was in Caylee's presence. So KC herself has ruled out any other members of the A household.
 
The totality of the evidence proves Casey killed Caylee beyond a reasonable doubt. I would go off topic if I listed all the evidence such as the 31 days/decomposing body in the trunk/lying/rare duct tape/laundry hamper and on and on. My point is if a juror needs a video tape of Casey doing the deed or a bloody knife with her fingerprints, it's simply not going to be there. I believe the latest document dump doesn't show anything except LE followed up on testing because of bits and pieces they found during the investigation (Casey getting Xanax from Annie, Chloroform searches, etc).

You asked where is the evidence she placed Caylee in the plastic bag? I think if you follow the evidence you can reasonabley conclude Casey put Caylee's body in those bags. The hamper was the same make/model of the one in their home. What are the chances? As for the chloroform, Casey didn't need it to kill a two year old. Just because she googled it doesn't mean that was how she killed her.
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Hi to all, I agree with what you are saying.I wish I had a better memory but I am 77 yrs. and I dont. I know I read on the BodyFarm that if chloroform were used only once it wont show up. I think thee defense will say Zanny came in and took her.That would cover the bags etc. being from the house.It's going to be a tough fight at first,reminds me of SP.and how we worried.I also read there (somewhere) the stains in the trunk are decomp stains.I have read sooo much at that site its hard to remember what is where,I do speak the truth though :)
 
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Hi to all, I agree with what you are saying.I wish I had a better memory but I am 77 yrs. and I dont. I know I read on the BodyFarm that if chloroform were used only once it wont show up. I think thee defense will say Zanny came in and took her.That would cover the bags etc. being from the house.It's going to be a tough fight at first,reminds me of SP.and how we worried.I also read there (somewhere) the stains in the trunk are decomp stains.I have read sooo much at that site its hard to remember what is where,I do speak the truth though :)

I know what you mean about the memory. I was trying to think if they ever released the autopsy report. They didn't did they? Didn't they just say something about there was no obvious trauma or something?
 
I could be wrong but doesn't the report say there were no latent prints detected - doesn't that mean there were no prints on the duct tape to compare either to GA, CA, LA or KC? The way I read it, they got prints from GA, CA, & LA to eliminate them from any prints found on the tape. However, the tape had no prints to use to do so. Therefore, they cannot compare them to KC's either - but this report was only dealing with prints collected from GA, CA, & LA under items taken from residence. It has nothing to do with KC's prints but the tape had no prints to compare.

Can someone correct me if I'm reading that wrong?

Also in regards to shoes... Wasn't there another pair of KC's shoes found at TL's after LA picked up her things - under the bed or something? Did those get turned over to LE and have we seen a report regarding them?

You are correct. The FBI report does say NO latent prints were detected. That means there are no prints on the duct tape found on the skull at all.
Sorry, don't know about the shoes.
 
I know what you mean about the memory. I was trying to think if they ever released the autopsy report. They didn't did they? Didn't they just say something about there was no obvious trauma or something?
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mysteriew we make a good pair.I am almost positive the autopsy report was sealed.I seem to remember wondering why,there could be something interesting in there.Dr. G. said there was no sign of trauma to the bones either before death or after. I dont think she was shot.I think it was smothering ~ duct tape.Dr. G. is very thorough in her exams.
 
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Hi to all, I agree with what you are saying.I wish I had a better memory but I am 77 yrs. and I dont. I know I read on the BodyFarm that if chloroform were used only once it wont show up. I think thee defense will say Zanny came in and took her.That would cover the bags etc. being from the house.It's going to be a tough fight at first,reminds me of SP.and how we worried.I also read there (somewhere) the stains in the trunk are decomp stains.I have read sooo much at that site its hard to remember what is where,I do speak the truth though :)
They did say if chloroform were used just once it would not show up.

I believe if it was ever used, it was for the specific purpose of killing Cayle. No parent has ever used chloroform as a babysitter. A safe dosage only puts a person out for 15 minutes at a time. What would be the point of that?

If Casey had been regularly using Xanax or any other of the drugs Caylee's hair was tested for, it would have show up in Caylee's hair. Either Cindy watched Caylee or Casey brought her along. There is no evidence Caylee was put in a trunk while Casey partied. Ever.

I don't think it is a coincidence that Caylee died at the same time Cindy was pressuring Casey to watch her own child more and Casey had acquired a new boyfriend that didn't want Caylee at his place overnight.

JMO
 
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mysteriew we make a good pair.I am almost positive the autopsy report was sealed.I seem to remember wondering why,there could be something interesting in there.Dr. G. said there was no sign of trauma to the bones either before death or after. I dont think she was shot.I think it was smothering ~ duct tape.Dr. G. is very thorough in her exams.

I think she was smothered too.

The medical examiner said there was no trauma to Emma Barker's body either. But, her mother has been accused of smothering her.
 
The gun that was confiscated by the police in early September is the same one that George purchased in August in anticipation of a possible suicide attempt.

http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedFiles/Stories/Local/Anthony%20pgs%202271-2320%20f.pdf
Page 45 of 50
On September 5, when LE picked up the Taurus .38 pistol from the Anthony house, George stated to the media that it was a gun he had from his policeman days. Actually he ordered the gun on August 29 and picked it up with a box of bullets on September 24 of 2008—while Casey was out on bond on home arrest.
 
You are correct. The FBI report does say NO latent prints were detected. That means there are no prints on the duct tape found on the skull at all.
Sorry, don't know about the shoes.[/QIt says that there were no latent prints,I believe from CA,GA, or LA,I could be totally wrong but I do not believe the report addresses PATENT,or PLASTIC prints,or LATENT prints from KC,again I could be totally wrong.:waitasec::confused:
 
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