2011.06.25 Sidebar Thread (Trial Day Twenty-eight)

[logicalgirl]

beyond the scope perhaps?

I don't know - maybe a legal hat can give us the answer to that.

You will notice I am not saying the same kind of questions about CA's testimony as I am about LA?

CA is clearly trying to "offer up" to the defense. But LA is the one who has never appeared on a talk show for money, has never sold any pictures for money, hasn't sold any articles, granted any interviews, come to any hearings or any days of the trial unless his fiance was there or he needed to be.

He's a strange introverted guy, but he doesn't seem to me like he wants to cooperate with either side. I don't believe CA can convince him to do something he doesn't want to do at all to "save" his sister. I think Lee is the wild card and Baez had best step away from LA before he really blows and says a whole lot of stuff Baez does not want him to say.

My bottom line is I'm not about to be a pawn for the Defense and accept every sordid accusation the Defense Team, and primarily Baez and ICA have made just because it is titillating to talk about and to speculate about. When we are talking about abuse, it's going to have to come from somewhere than the lips of a known liar, a liar who lies even when she doesn't have to, before I believe it's gold.

 

[Mare10]

According to GR from his statements on the O'Reilly Factor, JB wanted that jury to know that CA and GA were afraid that LA was the father of Caylee and that's why they didn't want him to be a part of her birth. But didn't JB say that LA did not go that far and that it was GA that did those horrid things to her. Although, in JB's OS he did not say...he said .....(think Clinton). So, they allow GA to be present at her birth but not LA. What is the world?? I keep going back and reviewing testimony and such and it get's more confusing the more I listen and read this stuff. I'm trying to make some sense of yesterday but so far, I'm not getting anywhere :banghead:

 

[Rapunzel]

Sorry if this has already been posted!
PHEW! I am scrambling to catch up!

http://www.clickorlando.com/video/28353909/index.html

Thanks for posting this. I think she used the bat phone...:floorlaugh:

 

[SoCalSleuth]

beyond the scope perhaps?

No. A good attorney never asks a question for which they do not know the answer. No way would JA ask LA a question when LA could answer anything and in doing so, perhaps open the door to evidence hurtful to the prosecution or which the prosecution tried hard to keep out.

 

[*JMO*]

My question is - why didn't JA ask Lee what it was he discussed with him?:waitasec:

He just went off into his snit about LA even having a conversation with Baez, the man who publicly stated while a couple of people watching that he wanted to follow in his father's footsteps and was already abusing his sister.

I just find the suggestion that LA would sit down and agree with this to save his sister's life - when it would completely ruin any life that LA hoped to have now or in the future. You see him explaining to every employer, to his wife and future children, friends, etc., that it was all to save his sister? Think of the implications of that.....

Maybe because it was an intended lead into opening the door to the sexual molestation allegation. He was alluding to a big secret and I believe the whole scenario about going to talk to Baez was a trap to get JA to ask him about something that had not been admitted. If he heard anything from his parents, it was that the whole family needed to unite to save her life. So, if he went to Baez, it was to tell him that he was "in".

I think that all of them are following a script and Baez is in on it. I also think that once it was realized that the state had a good case and the DT was faltering that the A's circled the wagons and jumped in with both feet to do and say whatever it takes. Each one of them is playing a role in this play.

 

[BigFatMommyDog]

No. A good attorney never asks a question for which they do not know the answer. No way would JA ask LA a question when LA could answer anything and in doing so, perhaps open the door to evidence hurtful to the prosecution or which the prosecution tried hard to keep out.

Which (kind of) begs the question - if it was the key underpinning to to his defense theory, why didn't JB ask or try to elicit "it" on direct? (I'll need to go back and listen again to be sure...)

 

[QuietMind]

I don't know - maybe a legal hat can give us the answer to that.

You will notice I am not saying the same kind of questions about CA's testimony as I am about LA?

CA is clearly trying to "offer up" to the defense. But LA is the one who has never appeared on a talk show for money, has never sold any pictures for money, hasn't sold any articles, granted any interviews, come to any hearings or any days of the trial unless his fiance was there or he needed to be.

He's a strange introverted guy, but he doesn't seem to me like he wants to cooperate with either side. I don't believe CA can convince him to do something he doesn't want to do at all to "save" his sister. I think Lee is the wild card and Baez had best step away from LA before he really blows and says a whole lot of stuff Baez does not want him to say.

BMM - I think that is a valid point, for both Baez and Ashton -remember, a good lawyer should never ask a question for which he does not know the answer. That being said, there is still time for LA, CA and GA to be back on that stand and if we are to believe GR :floorlaugh: they will be and there may be more :waitasec: moments to come.

 

[*JMO*]

According to GR from his statements on the O'Reilly Factor, JB wanted that jury to know that CA and GA were afraid that LA was the father of Caylee and that's why they didn't want him to be a part of her birth. But didn't JB say that LA did not go that far and that it was GA that did those horrid things to her. Although, in JB's OS he did not say...he said .....(think Clinton). So, they allow GA to be present at her birth but not LA. What is the world?? I keep going back and reviewing testimony and such and it get's more confusing the more I listen and read this stuff. I'm trying to make some sense of yesterday but so far, I'm not getting anywhere :banghead:

Without presenting the details, Baez hopes to enter just enough innuendo regarding deep and painful family secrets that it would not take a huge leap for the jury to believe that indeed...sexual abuse and incest was possible in this family that presented a pretty picture to the outside world.

I won't be surprised if George gets on the stand and cries and denies anything happened but will be just evasive enough and emotionally distraught enough to appear that he could be lying and leave the jury with doubts.

That is all Baez needs.. No one has to actually admit they abused ICA for it to seem plausible in this family of dysfunctional and broken relationships.

 

[Hoping4Justice]

Anyone know what Mark Nejame's new theory was on MSNBC? I misssed it.

 

[jon_burrows]

I don't know - maybe a legal hat can give us the answer to that.

You will notice I am not saying the same kind of questions about CA's testimony as I am about LA?

CA is clearly trying to "offer up" to the defense. But LA is the one who has never appeared on a talk show for money, has never sold any pictures for money, hasn't sold any articles, granted any interviews, come to any hearings or any days of the trial unless his fiance was there or he needed to be.

He's a strange introverted guy, but he doesn't seem to me like he wants to cooperate with either side. I don't believe CA can convince him to do something he doesn't want to do at all to "save" his sister. I think Lee is the wild card and Baez had best step away from LA before he really blows and says a whole lot of stuff Baez does not want him to say.

My bottom line is I'm not about to be a pawn for the Defense and accept every sordid accusation the Defense Team, and primarily Baez and ICA have made just because it is titillating to talk about and to speculate about. When we are talking about abuse, it's going to have to come from somewhere than the lips of a known liar, a liar who lies even when she doesn't have to, before I believe it's gold.

Lee and Mallory are on the board of the CMA Foundation. 80% of the donated funds went to pay salaries. Lee is not above making blood money off of Caylee.

IMO

 

[logicalgirl]

Maybe because it was an intended lead into opening the door to the sexual molestation allegation. He was alluding to a big secret and I believe the whole scenario about going to talk to Baez was a trap to get JA to ask him about something that had not been admitted. If he heard anything from his parents, it was that the whole family needed to unite to save her life. So, if he went to Baez, it was to tell him that he was "in".

I think that all of them are following a script and Baez is in on it. I also think that once it was realized that the state had a good case and the DT was faltering that the A's circled the wagons and jumped in with both feet to do and say whatever it takes. Each one of them is playing a role in this play.

Don't we just love Baez's "big secret" reference? This comes from Baez! What if there is no "big secret"? It just amazes me how we accept insinuations from Baez as "truth" - I don't get it at all...:waitasec:

 

[BigFatMommyDog]

Without presenting the details, Baez hopes to enter just enough innuendo regarding deep and painful family secrets that it would not take a huge leap for the jury to believe that indeed...sexual abuse and incest was possible in this family that presented a pretty picture to the outside world.

I won't be surprised if George gets on the stand and cries and denies anything happened but will be just evasive enough and emotionally distraught enough to appear that he could be lying and leave the jury with doubts.

That is all Baez needs.. No one has to actually admit they abused ICA for it to seem plausible in this family of dysfunctional and broken relationships.

Particularly since there will be no psychological expert testimony to support it...(so I guess this answers my previous question). My hope is that the jury sees through this flimsy ruse.

 

[sleutherontheside]

I just had a thought.......it happens at times.

When JB said "maybe if you say it enough times it will be true" referring to JA.......perhaps that is something that KC said to JB at some point about Zanny.

She kept saying Caylee was fine and with the nanny. In KC's world maybe that made it true.

JB likes to parrot others in his phrases and comments......perhaps he was parroting a comment by KC.

 

[logicalgirl]

Lee and Mallory are on the board of the CMA Foundation. 80% of the donated funds went to pay salaries. Lee is not above making blood money off of Caylee.

IMO

Uh huh - and wasn't that back when LA hoped, believed Caylee was still alive. Curious to know if we have numbers for who drew what amounts?

 

[QuietMind]

Don't we just love Baez's "big secret" reference? This comes from Baez! What if there is no "big secret"? It just amazes me how we accept insinuations from Baez as "truth" - I don't get it at all...:waitasec:

Personally I don't believe a word of it, but that is what JB threw out there for the jury in his OS and it seems he is still putting that out there through his buddy GR. The problem for JB is to get some testimony/evidence into court that actually backs this up - hasn't happened so far, so all we can do is sit and wait and watch and wonder what the DT will come up with next. JMO

 

[~n/t~]

My question is - why didn't JA ask Lee what it was he discussed with him?:waitasec:

He just went off into his snit about LA even having a conversation with Baez, the man who publicly stated while a couple of people watching that he wanted to follow in his father's footsteps and was already abusing his sister.

I just find the suggestion that LA would sit down and agree with this to save his sister's life - when it would completely ruin any life that LA hoped to have now or in the future. You see him explaining to every employer, to his wife and future children, friends, etc., that it was all to save his sister? Think of the implications of that.....

We don't know what information he gave Baez. I'm not sure JA could've asked him to disclose what was discussed with another attorney. That's a question our legal experts could answer. Maybe Lee realized that Baez was going to call him to the witness stand and went to see him to tell him "No Way, Jose" to the molestation admission.

 

[Mosby]

I just had a thought.......it happens at times.

When JB said "maybe if you say it enough times it will be true" referring to JA.......perhaps that is something that KC said to JB at some point about Zanny.

She kept saying Caylee was fine and with the nanny. In KC's world maybe that made it true.

JB likes to parrot others in his phrases and comments......perhaps he was parroting a comment by KC.

Funny that you bring that up because that's exactly what JB has been doing. "you're not a chemist", "were you at the Anthony home on the day Caylee drowned in the pool" etc. etc. etc. Over and over and over again.

 

[~n/t~]

Don't we just love Baez's "big secret" reference? This comes from Baez! What if there is no "big secret"? It just amazes me how we accept insinuations from Baez as "truth" - I don't get it at all...:waitasec:

I don't think the big secret came from Baez. It was all Casey. Same bull she fed JG, TL .

 

[logicalgirl]

I just had a thought.......it happens at times.

When JB said "maybe if you say it enough times it will be true" referring to JA.......perhaps that is something that KC said to JB at some point about Zanny.

She kept saying Caylee was fine and with the nanny. In KC's world maybe that made it true.

JB likes to parrot others in his phrases and comments......perhaps he was parroting a comment by KC.

Thanks SOTS - you've said what I have been thinking the last little while. It appears we have accepted what the DT and ICA have been insinuating is true is in fact true. I'm feeling punked.

Not about CA however. While I still have compassion for her and the mess she has made of her life, it is obvious she has now set a course to say whatever she can to save ICA's life. And after her come to Jesus conversation with her lawyer knowing what Defense direction Baez was going to take, it's obvious to me she knows for sure that ICA is guilty. And is still prepared to offer what she can.

But I'm not seeing the same thing from LA. And I have no problem being controversial enough to suggest that perhaps we are playing right into the Defense's plan.

 

[Boytwnmom]

I forget the specifics now..47 and he said 7 murders and I forget how many DP's. If all that's true why has no one ever reported it? Why do all reports focus on his inexperience if he's actually very experienced? Who do we believe? I really hope some news outlet follows up on his statements. I think he maybe might have slightly embellished...I know he interned or worked right after law school at the Public Defenders office and wonder if he's "including" all cases he did anything for..like research, running errands for the lawyers. I know after he didn't get admitted to the bar they took him off all lawyer tasks and then he left for the bikini business.

Did he also say at the same time that he had appeared in 47 trials? Maybe "appeared" is not the right word, but my mind's a blank right now.