4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, 2022 #78

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PrairieWind said:
As suspected, the testing of DNA was not done by the State of Idaho but was farmed out. This is getting all that info. But we are pretty far along. Is the defense late or was the info to them late? We are just over a month from pretrial.
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Am I reading the wrong document? Not being snippy. Genuine question. I see a lot of questions (fishing) and no assertions or declarative statements in that document.
 
I D Cline said:
Snipped for focus: We also received 166 pages related to December search of Kohberger's apartment, including details on blood testing (2 things presumptive positive) and items collected. Sharing the full file, as I know many are watching the facts of this case closely: https://int.nyt.com/data/documenttools/kohberger-search-records-from-wsu/6e5a6ce24a286a06/full.pdf

Read page 163, this may answer a lot of questions about the WSU Order to seal, IMO
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IMO that's pretty unlikely just based on what it is and the reason it would be given. This document is just letting him know he can't go on campus without arrangements and escort or he can be charged with criminal trespass under


and they have to give him notice of same.


The order to seal the WSU warrant and affidavit is likely something much more sensitive. I base this on the other warrants that were simply redacted with sealed affidavits and also the reasons given for the seal.
 
Sister Golden Hair said:
IMO that's pretty unlikely just based on what it is and the reason it would be given. This document is just letting him know he can't go on campus without arrangements and escort or he can be charged with criminal trespass under


and they have to give him notice of same.


The order to seal the WSU warrant and affidavit is likely something much more sensitive. I base this on the other warrants that were simply redacted with sealed affidavits and also the reasons given for the seal.
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1st paragraph, 3rd sentence reads,
This admonition is effective immediately and will continue
until pending student conduct charges have been resolved and you have been given
permission in writing to return to campus.

This was delivered to BK while he was in jail in Pennsylvania on 12/31/22.
 
I D Cline said:
1st paragraph, 3rd sentence reads,
This admonition is effective immediately and will continue
until pending student conduct charges have been resolved and you have been given
permission in writing to return to campus.
Click to expand...
Yep. You may be right, and ICBW, but 'pending student conduct charges' probably related to the reasons he was fired from his position, and we already know the basic reasons for that. IMO and based on the other warrants/affidavits, I believe the reason for both documents to be sealed is something far more sensitive. I'm just taking a big picture approach since I've gone through all the warrants, and warrants that happened at the same time seem related to me, particularly DropBox.
 
Gardenista said:
Click to expand...
As soon as BK starts questioning the officer, her voice changes and she sounds less sure of herself. You can hear his tone change when he asks if he should have backed up and reversed out of the intersection. Snarky!

BK mentions being from a rural area that doesn't have cross walks. Didn't he also mention assisting law enforcement with rural policing in his application for an internship with Pullman PD?
 
Observe_dont_Absorb said:
Not making excuses for him but if he's not neurotypical, going through every permutation of a situation can be a trait of autism.

Altho he did come of as politely and humbly excusing that he'd made an mistake by refusing to acknowledge the error just going round every permutation of saying 'yeah, but...' rationalisations
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True. But LE is not required to do neuro-testing on people who run red lights.

On the contrary, neuro-atypical people need to either follow traffic laws or give up their licenses or have them restricted. At least, in most states. That is, if they cannot obey traffic laws. This only happens if they're cited, though.

I keep in mind that he was tailgating (twice!) at a high rate speed on his cross-country journey (caught in Indiana, IIRC - and with no prior signals from other LE, per what the Indiana LE said).

Bad driver. != murderer, of course. But adds to the pile. Minor rule breaking is a thing to be aware of in criminal cases. IMO.

There's a reason why so many killers end up being described as "polite" by LE. This was one of the first things LEO's tried to teach me when I began working at the police academy. "It's never the guy with the rainbow mohawk," said one sergeant. "It's never the guy who plays loud music all night long."

We discussed gang markers at length, as a side conversation. But in general, the guy who comes to your door and looks normal should not be trusted any more than the guy who comes to your door with a rainbow mohawk or otherwise odd hair or clothing.

In this case, though, we have some atypical behaviors (late night activity) by Kohberger. But out in broad daylight, he's getting stopped (frequently) for driving related issues. Perhaps it's his VSS.

Not sure if we're allowed to discuss possible diagnoses beyond that one (VSS) which does have some things in common with autism, IMO. At any rate, it's new information (to me, anyway). There will be more.

IMO.
 
I D Cline said:
Snipped for focus: We also received 166 pages related to December search of Kohberger's apartment, including details on blood testing (2 things presumptive positive) and items collected. Sharing the full file, as I know many are watching the facts of this case closely: https://int.nyt.com/data/documenttools/kohberger-search-records-from-wsu/6e5a6ce24a286a06/full.pdf

Read page 163, this may answer a lot of questions about the WSU Order to seal, IMO
Click to expand...
Agree, IMO this wording stood out to me on page 163 regarding the trespass admonition from WSU dated 12/30/2022, the date of his arrest in PA, 10 or 11 days after he was notified of losing his TA position on 12/19/2022 IIRC (BBM):

"This admonition is effective immediately and will continue until pending student conduct charges have been resolved and you have been given permission in writing to return to campus."

I hadn't heard about unresolved pending student conduct charges, unless they were solely about reports from fellow female students that he made them feel uncomfortable, and they were ultimately resolved as mentioned in this NYT article dated 2/10/2023 (BBM), MOO:

University Investigated Idaho Murder Suspect’s Behavior Around Time of Killings

University Investigated Idaho Murder Suspect’s Behavior Around Time of Killings​

Bryan Kohberger had a verbal altercation with a professor and was investigated over his behavior around female students before he was charged in four murders.

NYT 2/10/2023

The faculty made the decision at the department’s end-of-year meeting in December, during which professors were also told that some female students reported that Mr. Kohberger had made them feel uncomfortable. In one of those instances, Mr. Kohberger was accused of following a female student to her car, according to two people familiar with the situation who spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to discuss the case.

In the case of the female students, the university’s investigation did not find Mr. Kohberger guilty of any wrongdoing, two people said, and it was other matters that prompted the decision to eliminate his funding and remove him from the teaching assistant job. That decision, they said, was based on his unsatisfactory performance as a teaching assistant, including his failure to meet the “norms of professional behavior” in his interactions with the faculty."
 
PrairieWind said:
As suspected, the testing of DNA was not done by the State of Idaho but was farmed out. This is getting all that info. But we are pretty far along. Is the defense late or was the info to them late? We are just over a month from pretrial.
Click to expand...

I don't read it that way. Can you be more specific? Maybe cite a particular page or provide your own link?

TIA.
 
Sister Golden Hair said:
Awesome! Thank you!
Click to expand...

I don't see anything in this that shows that the Idaho State Lab or the FBI on site during the first two-three weeks of the investigation didn't do DNA testing (most likely ISL). If you find it, in that document, please advise. I don't see it. It's a document requesting information about such matters.

IOW, I don't see any evidence that Othram is the only place that processed the DNA. Do you see that?

TIA.
 
Bogbacal2 said:
With this 3rd request from AT, looks like she’s pulling out all the stops to find something to get the DNA evidence thrown out. I suppose this is a step most criminal defense atty’s take or is this alarming?
Click to expand...

Normal.

And I'm guessing that the sheath still has plenty of DNA for retesting with the Defense expert standing right there. I'm also guessing that it was tested in more than one place, for redundancy.

We'll find out in a month. But I doubt Idaho dropped the ball and just ignored the options they had to make the DNA part air tight. As far as it can be.

IMO.
 
BeginnerSleuther said:
Depends on how it's phrased to them, I suppose. I see the prosecution phrasing it as you have. I see the defense saying "a missed year span is an entirely different car, one that the defendant doesn't own."

IMO, we shouldn't be speaking for the jury as none of us have no idea how the chosen 12 will respond to the evidence. A random skim of posts here tells me that multiple people see and interpret evidence very differently and it's entirely possible that at least one juror will be unconvinced.
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Of course. Trials are notoriously unpredictable. The evidence so far justifies an arrest, the defense will of course follow their game plan to minimize or supress evidence and witnesses and present a SODDI theory.
whiterhino said:
As soon as BK starts questioning the officer, her voice changes and she sounds less sure of herself. You can hear his tone change when he asks if he should have backed up and reversed out of the intersection. Snarky!

BK mentions being from a rural area that doesn't have cross walks. Didn't he also mention assisting law enforcement with rural policing in his application for an internship with Pullman PD?
Click to expand...
Flexing.
 
Last edited:
gremlin444 said:
I remember people a long time ago wondering if they had swabbed the BK's apartment bathroom sink and shower.

On page 8 of the search documents listed above they mention taking a hair from the shower drain. On page 14 they mention doing blind swabs of the drains of the double sinks in the bathroom and the shower--all tested negative for blood.

Click to expand...

I found it interesting he didn't have a shower curtain. He must have tossed it.
 
whiterhino said:
As soon as BK starts questioning the officer, her voice changes and she sounds less sure of herself. You can hear his tone change when he asks if he should have backed up and reversed out of the intersection. Snarky!

BK mentions being from a rural area that doesn't have cross walks. Didn't he also mention assisting law enforcement with rural policing in his application for an internship with Pullman PD?
Click to expand...
In my opinion she sounds exhausted and bored. And pretty confident in her knowledge of the law. She likely deals with people like him and questions/excuses like that every other traffic stop.

I've been pulled over 3 times (knock on wood) in my entire life and not one has resulted in a ticket. I also played the the 'gosh, golly, gee whiz' role.

If you're not a jerk and nothing comes back on your identity than it's a 50/50 flip depending on the officer's day.
 
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10ofRods said:
True. But LE is not required to do neuro-testing on people who run red lights.

On the contrary, neuro-atypical people need to either follow traffic laws or give up their licenses or have them restricted. At least, in most states. That is, if they cannot obey traffic laws. This only happens if they're cited, though.

I keep in mind that he was tailgating (twice!) at a high rate speed on his cross-country journey (caught in Indiana, IIRC - and with no prior signals from other LE, per what the Indiana LE said).

Bad driver. != murderer, of course. But adds to the pile. Minor rule breaking is a thing to be aware of in criminal cases. IMO.

There's a reason why so many killers end up being described as "polite" by LE. This was one of the first things LEO's tried to teach me when I began working at the police academy. "It's never the guy with the rainbow mohawk," said one sergeant. "It's never the guy who plays loud music all night long."

We discussed gang markers at length, as a side conversation. But in general, the guy who comes to your door and looks normal should not be trusted any more than the guy who comes to your door with a rainbow mohawk or otherwise odd hair or clothing.

In this case, though, we have some atypical behaviors (late night activity) by Kohberger. But out in broad daylight, he's getting stopped (frequently) for driving related issues. Perhaps it's his VSS.

Not sure if we're allowed to discuss possible diagnoses beyond that one (VSS) which does have some things in common with autism, IMO. At any rate, it's new information (to me, anyway). There will be more.

IMO.
Click to expand...
BBM

I've been thinking about the whole VSS thing. BK managed to navigate in a strange house with a confusing layout in the dark meanwhile he has some kind of visual impairment?

BK seems very buttoned down. Suspiciously normal. JMO I'd suspect him just as much as someone with a face tattoo, if not moreso.
 
Sister Golden Hair said:
Yep. You may be right, and ICBW, but 'pending student conduct charges' probably related to the reasons he was fired from his position, and we already know the basic reasons for that. IMO and based on the other warrants/affidavits, I believe the reason for both documents to be sealed is something far more sensitive. I'm just taking a big picture approach since I've gone through all the warrants, and warrants that happened at the same time seem related to me, particularly DropBox.
Click to expand...
FWIW. When you start on page 151 of the document, the trespass letter makes more sense. As in it appears to be directly tied to WCU PD and their investigation / assistance with investigation. It seems like it's all there in black and white, so like you've pointed out, if's highly unlikely that the sealed warrant has anything to do with the trespass letter. Just MOO after reading posts and the document.

Edited to add the link to the document:
 
10ofRods said:
I think some of the families also want to start foundations or charities. In my own lifetime, this has been a common thing for bereaved families to do (and not just due to murder). I feel so badly for these families, not being able to do that, because apparently any mention of the case could put them in legal jeopardy.

That doesn't seem right. I hope there's a ruling soon. The families should have the right to grieve (including human speech, which is central to human existence) as they see fit.

IMO.
Click to expand...

Do you have a source that says families can't start a foundation? IMO, that has nothing to do with the gag order.

Also,
www.king5.com

Ethan Chapin's parents remember him with new foundation and tulips

Tulips called "Ethan's Smile" are being sold at Tulip Valley Farms in Mount Vernon. Proceeds from the tulips will help fund scholarships for Skagit County students.
www.king5.com www.king5.com
 
Gemmie said:
Sure are a lot of reddish stains in his apartment. Like his light switch for instance. He cleaned his car like a fiend but failed to wipe up his apt? Kinda odd.

View attachment 419690

And they continue for pages (red/brown stains). I can't imagine he'd be that sloppy with potential evidence throughout his apartment when he was so thorough with cleaning his car.

Click to expand...

If you read it, all but 2 came back negative for blood.
 
gremlin444 said:
I remember people a long time ago wondering if they had swabbed BK's apartment bathroom sink and shower.

On page 8 of the search documents listed above they mention taking a hair from the shower drain. On page 14 they mention doing blind swabs of the drains of the double sinks in the bathroom and the shower--all tested negative for blood.

Click to expand...
They also found stains on a pillow/pillowcase and mattress cover IIRC. Both were positive for blood but could very well be BKs own.

Initially I was horrified when I read the list of swabs until I saw they were all negative. Then just a bit grossed out. I don't recall anything about a shower curtain. Maybe the shower had a door? JMO I don't think BK would have intentionally mixed up his own shower curtain with evidence of the crime but then again he did a number of other careless things.
 
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