4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #87

[x_files]

For as much driving as BK did, he really seemed to learn nothing. Bad at intersections, tailgating, K turns, navigation…

Rules weren't made for him.

 

[Jurisprudence]

As always, I wonder how he can do this without taking the stand. For example, if he wants to claim that he's never seen or touched a Ka-Bar knife sheath (and there really are no Amazon records of the purchase), how does he do that? Will it just be his lawyer's assertion (without evidence, as she can't prove a negative) in opening and closing arguments? No witnesses or experts?

"Someone framed him" is a version of an alibi, I believe. I think that without some suggestion of who that could be, and without Kohberger taking the stand, the defense of "someone somehow got my DNA and stuck it only on the snap of the sheath" is very weak.

IOW, Kohberger literally cannot "say" anything that works at trial - unless he takes the stand in his own behalf. I'd love to know what his phone says about all his other late night travel. If it was merely occasionally that he went to Moscow at 3-4 am, what were those occasions? I agree that his stopping his late night trips to Moscow isn't surprising (even if he were innocent) but to stop them altogether, when this was supposedly a long term thing he did? Doesn't sound very strong.

I have a general question too (if anyone knows). Do we actually know that BK and his dad stayed in a motel on their way back? If so, where was it, if anyone knows. I know he was bent on getting Thai food, IIRC, up the road in Indiana - but it's possible that they were sharing driving and that BK drove the night shift as well as part of the day. I guess I'm interested in his sleep habits.

imo

From yesterday:

I haven't seen anyone else discuss this but the warrant return for the car is also interesting. He and his father likely stayed at a Comfort Inn on the way from WA to PA.

The stay information was seized from the car so LE knows exactly where and when. For us, the where, what state, when, they do not disclose. But I would hope LE immediately obtained and executed a warrant for that room, the grounds, and security tapes. There is absolutely a chance evidence was disposed of at that and potentially other sites/stops along the route home.

jmo

https://www.pacourts.us/Storage/med...chwarrant(b.kohberger),inventory,exhibits.pdf

#854

 

[Jurisprudence]

Rules weren't made for him.

He thinks he's smarter than the rules

 

[Jurisprudence]

Barry Morphews attorney is a prepared aggressive defense attorney, Iris Eytan. I do not like her but underestimating her is a nog modtske.

That line of posts had to do with expert testimony and who and what a juror will choose to believe. Attys don't testify as to cell data. It wasn't related to any individual atty's ability (or inability).

jmo

 

[TL4S]

From yesterday:

I haven't seen anyone else discuss this but the warrant return for the car is also interesting. He and his father likely stayed at a Comfort Inn on the way from WA to PA.

The stay information was seized from the car so LE knows exactly where and when. For us, the where, what state, when, they do not disclose. But I would hope LE immediately obtained and executed a warrant for that room, the grounds, and security tapes. There is absolutely a chance evidence was disposed of at that and potentially other sites/stops along the route home.

jmo

https://www.pacourts.us/Storage/med...chwarrant(b.kohberger),inventory,exhibits.pdf

#854

When I saw that Comfort Inn thing in the car warrant return, my first thought was he and Dad staying there on their way back to PA. My second thought was to look for Comfort Inns in and around the WA/ID area to see if this could have been part of his "alibi" plan...

 

[Boxer]

That line of posts had to do with expert testimony and who and what a juror will choose to believe. Attys don't testify as to cell data. It wasn't related to any individual atty's ability (or inability).

jmo

IE really challenged the FBI cast expert on the stand and by using the terminology of a CAST program the FBI does not use and by created a hard to follow 2 hours that no one took anything useful away from.

 

[schooling]

Think about what kind of evidence the defense has likely seen to cause them to essentially (not entirely) concede to portions of the CCTV footage and cellular evidence.

“Sure that might have been his car. But he had no motive to go into that house. Police were pressured to take shortcuts and rush to judgement” is their entire case. Presented through cross examination and likely a DNA expert.

One thing I’ve been saying for a bit now that I think is even more likely. The defense will probably press DM and BF on how familiar they were with everyone who attended their parties. Stopping just short of openly declaring that BK had been there before.

They have to plant seeds to spark the jury’s imagination of ways the DNA could have gotten into that house. Then transferred onto that sheath. Without saying it.

IMO it’s all for naught though. There’s just too much. And this alibi is super duper weak.

MOO

 

[Sundog]

Think about what kind of evidence the defense has likely seen to cause them to essentially (not entirely) concede to portions of the CCTV footage and cellular evidence.

“Sure that might have been his car. But he had no motive to go into that house. Police were pressured to take shortcuts and rush to judgement” is their entire case. Presented through cross examination and likely a DNA expert.

One thing I’ve been saying for a bit now that I think is even more likely. The defense will probably press DM and BF on how familiar they were with everyone who attended their parties. Stopping just short of openly declaring that BK had been there before.

They have to plant seeds to spark the jury’s imagination of ways the DNA could have gotten into that house. Then transferred onto that sheath. Without saying it.

IMO it’s all for naught though. There’s just too much. And this alibi is super duper weak.

MOO

It shouldn't be difficult to determine that the King Road residents didn't know everyone who attended their large parties. Early on we heard from a 30-ish neighbor that he crashed their parties on several occasions. He lived nearby, worked in Pullman as a chef, IIRC.

 

[Karin1974]

IMO - I’m interested in finding out, if, in any of the camera/video footage le have from that night/early morning of BK in his car, he can be seen wearing a mask?

 

[mcmaffy]

Regarding the alibi issue I get the impression that the defense wants to see all the evidence and then mold BK's alibi to fit.

This may be a perfectly legitimate strategy because an alibi put up earlier might turn out to be weak or even impossible once the State has rolled out it's entire evidential case. But the defense's approach seems at odds with the rationale of requiring an accused to stump up with any alibi within a strict timeframe. An alibi presented before all (or especially any) evidence is revealed by the prosecution which turns out to be open on the evidence would have far more persuasive value than the same alibi disclosed only after the defendant has seen the State's cards.

 

[TL4S]

I've been thinking about how events unfolded on the third floor, where the sheath was found. Per the June 16 filing, the sheath was found by the bodies of MM and KG, to MM's right side, face down and partially under MM's body, and the comforter.

So I've changed my mind a little on the matter. I think Murphy was in KG's room, either shut in by her, or at least sleeping there. BK could have quietly gone to KG's room first, only seeing Murphy, so he shut the door. Then, on to MM's room, where both girls were sleeping.

I've looked at old class photos and court drawings and it appears BK is signing papers with his right hand, so assumed a right hander (not sure they are approved sources, so won't link). I would imagine he'd pull the sheath off with his left hand then. I also looked at Tik Tok photos of MM's room. The left side of her bed was up against the wall along the left corner of the room.

So, I now think MM was sleeping on the left side along the wall and KG was to her right. IMO, BK climbed on top of KG while unsheathing his knife with his left hand and dropping the sheath between the girls (on MM's right side). He attacked KG first, not MM.

The noises DM thought was playing with Murphy was actually MM trying to get out from under the comforter and away, banging against the wall in the process, because really, she would have been basically pinned between the wall and him on top of the comforter and KG.

Her trying to get out is how the comforter maybe ended up over the sheath, and then MM fell in top of both during the attack.

In this scenario, it most likely would have been XK who said "there's somebody here."

Just my opinion for the moment.

 

[maconrich]

IMO - I’m interested in finding out, if, in any of the camera/video footage le have from that night/early morning of BK in his car, he can be seen wearing a mask?

As far as we know, there is no video of occupant(s) in the vehicle. MOO. It doesn't mean they might not have video / stills, just that the information hasn't been released (either way). IMO

 

[TL4S]

I've been thinking about how events unfolded on the third floor, where the sheath was found. Per the June 16 filing, the sheath was found by the bodies of MM and KG, to MM's right side, face down and partially under MM's body, and the comforter.

So I've changed my mind a little on the matter. I think Murphy was in KG's room, either shut in by her, or at least sleeping there. BK could have quietly gone to KG's room first, only seeing Murphy, so he shut the door. Then, on to MM's room, where both girls were sleeping.

I've looked at old class photos and court drawings and it appears BK is signing papers with his right hand, so assumed a right hander (not sure they are approved sources, so won't link). I would imagine he'd pull the sheath off with his left hand then. I also looked at Tik Tok photos of MM's room. The left side of her bed was up against the wall along the left corner of the room.

So, I now think MM was sleeping on the left side along the wall and KG was to her right. IMO, BK climbed on top of KG while unsheathing his knife with his left hand and dropping the sheath between the girls (on MM's right side). He attacked KG first, not MM.

The noises DM thought was playing with Murphy was actually MM trying to get out from under the comforter and away, banging against the wall in the process, because really, she would have been basically pinned between the wall and him on top of the comforter and KG.

Her trying to get out is how the comforter maybe ended up over the sheath, and then MM fell in top of both during the attack.

In this scenario, it most likely would have been XK who said "there's somebody here."

Just my opinion for the moment.

To clarify (too late to edit), the PCA states the sheath was on MM's right side (as viewed from the door). From what I can tell, looking from her door would be more or less like looking from the foot of the bed, so the sheath was to the right of her, not on her anatomical right. Jmo.

 

[girlhasnoname]

I've been thinking about how events unfolded on the third floor, where the sheath was found. Per the June 16 filing, the sheath was found by the bodies of MM and KG, to MM's right side, face down and partially under MM's body, and the comforter.

So I've changed my mind a little on the matter. I think Murphy was in KG's room, either shut in by her, or at least sleeping there. BK could have quietly gone to KG's room first, only seeing Murphy, so he shut the door. Then, on to MM's room, where both girls were sleeping.

I've looked at old class photos and court drawings and it appears BK is signing papers with his right hand, so assumed a right hander (not sure they are approved sources, so won't link). I would imagine he'd pull the sheath off with his left hand then. I also looked at Tik Tok photos of MM's room. The left side of her bed was up against the wall along the left corner of the room.

So, I now think MM was sleeping on the left side along the wall and KG was to her right. IMO, BK climbed on top of KG while unsheathing his knife with his left hand and dropping the sheath between the girls (on MM's right side). He attacked KG first, not MM.

The noises DM thought was playing with Murphy was actually MM trying to get out from under the comforter and away, banging against the wall in the process, because really, she would have been basically pinned between the wall and him on top of the comforter and KG.

Her trying to get out is how the comforter maybe ended up over the sheath, and then MM fell in top of both during the attack.

In this scenario, it most likely would have been XK who said "there's somebody here."

Just my opinion for the moment.

I agree that Kaylee had put Murphy up in either her empty room or the bathroom between the rooms. The girls were sharing a bed so it would have hard for Murphy to sleep with Kaylee if he did that normally.

 

[GA_Peach]

In the last thread @Boxer said, "Any reasonable person who is in the vicinity of a murder immmediately reviews where they were, did they see the murderer etc.
His interest in crime ... vanished when a major crime happened 10 miles away?"

This begs the question. Did BK contact police to share what he saw during his three trips by the house on his long drive? As a criminology major, he should know the importance of witness accounts, even if it appeared that he saw nothing of evidentiary value.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Think about what kind of evidence the defense has likely seen to cause them to essentially (not entirely) concede to portions of the CCTV footage and cellular evidence.

“Sure that might have been his car. But he had no motive to go into that house. Police were pressured to take shortcuts and rush to judgement” is their entire case. Presented through cross examination and likely a DNA expert.

One thing I’ve been saying for a bit now that I think is even more likely. The defense will probably press DM and BF on how familiar they were with everyone who attended their parties. Stopping just short of openly declaring that BK had been there before.

They have to plant seeds to spark the jury’s imagination of ways the DNA could have gotten into that house. Then transferred onto that sheath. Without saying it.

IMO it’s all for naught though. There’s just too much. And this alibi is super duper weak.

MOO

BBM - I'm wondering this too

What if BK claims he is a creature of the night, goes out nearly every night in the small hours for his drives arounds, night jogging, interacts with shady people such as drug dealers and maybe pimps. That he uses the services of male or female streetwalkers or that he sometimes hangs out smoking drugs with randoms.

Plenty of people can give testimony to the fact he's been keeping those hours for many years, so we know he really does do housework at 2am and go night jogging. We know he may have also been going out to buy substances.

What if he says something along the line of he is fascinated by the criminal subculture and he likes to hang for a while with any people he encounters getting to know them and asking questions for his own personal research, that if they handed him their new knife to admire, he certainly would have taken a look at it.

I'm going to be very interesting in the evidence in this case, most especially his online browsing history, emails, texts, interactions, his survey research, and what more we come to know about him.

 

[maskedwoman]

<snipped>
If you watch the body cam videos you'll note that neither officer calls his information in. They only confirm his identity, second officer makes a waving motion toward the WA license plate as he's approaching. To me, it looked like they were looking to verify his identity only so they could report back "Yeah we've got him. He's on State Road or Interstate X by exit X, Town of X" That's jmo based on the fact that they never even checked to see if the guy was driving with a valid license or registration and had no warrants out on him.

I found it funny but not funny that when the officer from the first stop says "Where ya headed" BK (at 10:30 am, mind you) says "We're headed to get Thai food" and his father immediately follows with "To Pennsylvania! The Poconos."

That's a fair point. One article I read suggested that LE lost track of him early on in his cross country trip. I guess there could be something to that. They could have put out a nationwide BOLO on his car and tag number to try and find him. I wonder if he really was following too close. Can you imagine getting pulled over twice in 10 minutes for something you weren't doing? That might explain his alarmed expression and Thai food for breakfast answer LOL. Maybe he was expecting to be arrested. Fun to speculate about anyway.

 

[maskedwoman]

Regarding the alibi issue I get the impression that the defense wants to see all the evidence and then mold BK's alibi to fit.

This may be a perfectly legitimate strategy because an alibi put up earlier might turn out to be weak or even impossible once the State has rolled out it's entire evidential case. But the defense's approach seems at odds with the rationale of requiring an accused to stump up with any alibi within a strict timeframe. An alibi presented before all (or especially any) evidence is revealed by the prosecution which turns out to be open on the evidence would have far more persuasive value than the same alibi disclosed only after the defendant has seen the State's cards.

Probably not the first time it's been tried, but imo that's a risky approach. If he can't prove his alibi, then it just looks and sounds like what it is: a lie crafted to fit into the only timeline crack they can find. MOOooo

 

[Balthazar]

I've been thinking about how events unfolded on the third floor, where the sheath was found. Per the June 16 filing, the sheath was found by the bodies of MM and KG, to MM's right side, face down and partially under MM's body, and the comforter.

So I've changed my mind a little on the matter. I think Murphy was in KG's room, either shut in by her, or at least sleeping there. BK could have quietly gone to KG's room first, only seeing Murphy, so he shut the door. Then, on to MM's room, where both girls were sleeping.

I've looked at old class photos and court drawings and it appears BK is signing papers with his right hand, so assumed a right hander (not sure they are approved sources, so won't link). I would imagine he'd pull the sheath off with his left hand then. I also looked at Tik Tok photos of MM's room. The left side of her bed was up against the wall along the left corner of the room.

So, I now think MM was sleeping on the left side along the wall and KG was to her right. IMO, BK climbed on top of KG while unsheathing his knife with his left hand and dropping the sheath between the girls (on MM's right side). He attacked KG first, not MM.

The noises DM thought was playing with Murphy was actually MM trying to get out from under the comforter and away, banging against the wall in the process, because really, she would have been basically pinned between the wall and him on top of the comforter and KG.

Her trying to get out is how the comforter maybe ended up over the sheath, and then MM fell in top of both during the attack.

In this scenario, it most likely would have been XK who said "there's somebody here."

Just my opinion for the moment.

IMO, if your theory true MM should have extensive defensive wounds as she would have fought to get away from the killer.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

A strange question after all this time but what if the perp went there intending to 'hot prowl' (a new term, I've learned from this site), kill the dog, and not even slaughter any humans at all?