Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #190

[Tealgrove]

If that is the case, that is honestly a failure, IMHO, of the defense team in advising their client and monitoring their client's courtroom behavior. As a defense attorney, I would think one of the last things you would want is for your client's courtroom behaviors to amplify negative emotions in the courtroom.

In this vein, I recall Ariel Castro turning to look at Michelle Knight as she walked into court to give her Victim Impact Statement. His lawyers were so quick to get on him and made him look straight ahead.

There's only one guy in the vid taken by Libby on that bridge. There's only one guy who admitted to being on that bridge. Coincidently, that same guy, the one who admitted being on the bridge, also admitted dozens of times he killed the girls.

I've followed this case for years, since the beginning. All potential scenarios crafted by the human mind have been discussed ad nauseum.

There was no grand meeting in the bottom land that day. Those girls were marched down a steep embankment, through a wooded area next to a stream, across the stream, up a rather steep bank, and in to an area of bottom land not unlike all other wetland/bottomland along streams throughout the world.

This is where they were murdered. There was no tour bus parked above in the cemetery, no group of cars, no vans, no nothing reported to that effect, via witness or cam.

I've personally studied the terrain, followed the rail track, followed deer creek, thought of escape by raft, boat, and canoe, pondered escape via bridge creek, wondered about accomplices, thought maybe they were squirreled away in a car waiting on the driveway under the bridge, heard of the shack, the runes, the rabbits, the puppies, the swords, the guns, the artifacts hanging from the trees, the searches....I could go on, like I said, ad nauseum.

Never has another person been charged. Never. Yeah, I thought maybe KAK and company, but hey, I thought too of numerous others, a guy from Kokomo, a father son team, a relative, somebody at a factory, a serial killer, a trucker, a man just passin' through, a local politician, a judge.....again, ad nauseum.

Yet here we are. One guy on the bridge in the video. One guy admitted he was on that bridge. One guy admitted to killing the girls....with details known only to the killer.

He's busted. Game over. Done deal....if it was typed by me, which it was, then assume it's my opinion

Thank you.

 

[photographer4]

He brutally murdered two young defenceless girls and thought he would get away with it. So now it’s all to be laid bare, he plays remorseful.



While he got away with it, he didn’t have to worry about his wife and mother finding out about his warped sick mind.



Let's not forget whatever he said in some of these confessions. It made the police question his daughters' friends, so it sounded like he was acting inappropriately around other young girls.

MOOO

The police questioned his daughter's friends? I don't think I knew this before and its not shocking since I'm so far behind. Where could I go to learn more about this - is there a link pls and thanks?

 

[photographer4]

That would likely come out during jury deliberations. If a jury member expressed that he was using his own non-evidence based opinion to form a verdict, the jury foreman should alert the judge.

Not a lawyer, this is my understanding though, from having served on a jury for a criminal trial.

jmo

Ah ok, so what would happen then if a foreman alerted a judge to this? I have no experience here and am looking to learn. Ty.

 

[MollyDDD]

Is it because of funding (lack of) that an expert like a Blood Splatter expert wasn't brought in straight away after the girls were located?

I'm wondering why in 2024 instead of 7 years ago.

Ask Carroll County Sheriff Tobe Leazenby.

 

[MollyDDD]

The FBI was involved pretty quick and said use all the resources that you need. I would think there had to be an original expert who did all of this actually at the crime scene. I am wondering if their original report, identity or involvement is not being disclosed or is missing. MOO

Curiouser and curiouser.

 

[steeltowngirl]

There's only one guy in the vid taken by Libby on that bridge. There's only one guy who admitted to being on that bridge. Coincidently, that same guy, the one who admitted being on the bridge, also admitted dozens of times he killed the girls.

I've followed this case for years, since the beginning. All potential scenarios crafted by the human mind have been discussed ad nauseum.

There was no grand meeting in the bottom land that day. Those girls were marched down a steep embankment, through a wooded area next to a stream, across the stream, up a rather steep bank, and in to an area of bottom land not unlike all other wetland/bottomland along streams throughout the world.

This is where they were murdered. There was no tour bus parked above in the cemetery, no group of cars, no vans, no nothing reported to that effect, via witness or cam.

I've personally studied the terrain, followed the rail track, followed deer creek, thought of escape by raft, boat, and canoe, pondered escape via bridge creek, wondered about accomplices, thought maybe they were squirreled away in a car waiting on the driveway under the bridge, heard of the shack, the runes, the rabbits, the puppies, the swords, the guns, the artifacts hanging from the trees, the searches....I could go on, like I said, ad nauseum.

Never has another person been charged. Never. Yeah, I thought maybe KAK and company, but hey, I thought too of numerous others, a guy from Kokomo, a father son team, a relative, somebody at a factory, a serial killer, a trucker, a man just passin' through, a local politician, a judge.....again, ad nauseum.

Yet here we are. One guy on the bridge in the video. One guy admitted he was on that bridge. One guy admitted to killing the girls....with details known only to the killer.

He's busted. Game over. Done deal....if it was typed by me, which it was, then assume it's my opinion

This post is golden.

 

[grannygates]

Ah ok, so what would happen then if a foreman alerted a judge to this? I have no experience here and am looking to learn. Ty.

Can I ask to clarify.. is your question if the prosecution is presenting evidence that doesn't convince you as a juror that the accused as actually the culprit, and due to this lack of evidence connecting the accused to the crime, you would would come to the conclusion that the accused would be "not guilty" as you feel like it could be possible that someone else was more likely to have done it ?

 

[ClearAhead]

Because he is worried about his wife and mother rejecting him.

I wonder if the circumstances would be different right now if the wife and mother were picking up the tab for his defense, rather than the state? Imagine how horrible it would be to watch one’s life savings draining to pay legal expenses, no guarantee at all he would be found not guilty leading to poverty, husband/son sent to prison for decades. If it were me and he wanted to confess, I might say “hang on a sec, let me get LE”.

However if there’s even a remote chance he might be found not guilty, there’s no financial risk to continuing through the entire legal process when the government is picking up the tab.

Interesting if anyone has ever done a study of the percentage of guilty vs not guilty pleas depending if someone is declared indigent or not?

 

[Arkay]

We have no idea if the man in the back of the video is the man that is speaking because that is not shown on the video.

Respect for your opinion.

However, this would be my question if the man in the video is not the one who uttered, “Guys, down the hill.”

If the man whom we call BG didn’t say it but we can hear it, then this other man who did say it had to be right in the vicinity. Why hasn’t this BG man come forth?

He has to be right out of the frame, this other man, since we can hear him, so why hasn’t this BG man, who was RIGHT THERE and had to hear someone say those words to two young girls who were later found slaughtered…

WHY hasn’t he told the police immediately after A and L were found the very next day that he had passed by a man, whom you may believe isn’t shown saying “G, DTH,” with the information that he saw and heard a man say that to two girls and give a description of the man he heard telling them that, the exact time that they were near each other, and so on?

Or, if the one we SEE on video did not say those words and the other man nearby did, then I would presume BG was an accomplice if he didn’t race to tell LE the moment he heard about the girls.

I don’t believe that is the case, though. I believe BG said it and is the culprit. In my opinion that is also RA.

JMO

 

[arielilane]

July 30, 2024, Day 1 pre-trial hearing


Up early in Delphi. First of three days of pre-trial hearings today in the case of Richard Allen, charged in the 2017 murders of Delphi teens Abby Williams and Libby German.





Heads up: Only after we’re out of the hearing. No phones, no electronics powered up in courthouse on this case.


Lunch break takeaways in Delphi … 1/


Defense team argued that arrangements have been made to move Richard Allen from Wabash Valley prison to Cass County Jail, modifying safekeeping order from Nov 2022. Carroll sheriff says he’s ok w/that, as long as Allen isn’t returned to jail in Delphi. 2/


Judge Gull takes safekeeping motion under advisement. 3/


Next: Defense asks to compel prosecutor to hand over evidence w/better organization of 26TB of case files. Prosecutor says he’s giving Allen’s attys what they need, even ‘spoon feeding’ them, but they want things prosecutors don’t have. Judge takes that under advisement, too 4/


After lunch schedule: A motion from Allen’s team to dismiss. Later this week: motions to suppress statements Allen made, prosecution’s list of words and phrases that should be banned from the trial in the murders of Abby Williams and Libby German. 5/


Of note: This morning’s hearing, scheduled to start at 10 am, was delayed until after 11 am. Judge Gull said she didn’t anticipate the construction between Fort Wayne and Delphi.
Court session resumes at 1:30 pm.

Also of note: No phones/cameras/electronics at all allowed 6/


Cx: session resumes at 1:20 pm


Afternoon session...


Here’s an afternoon wrap from Delphi, in the first of three days of pretrial hearings on murder charges against Richard Allen, charged in 2017 murders of Delphi teens Libby German and Abby Williams 1/


Allens attorneys argued to dismiss the case, building off what they called intentional efforts ignore a trail that led to involvement, they say, by a local man who was involved in ritualistic killings in name of Odin. 2/


Atty Andrew Baldwin called it ‘an extreme remedy, but that Allen was saddled with charges that should have aimed to someone else who police didn’t adequately investigate before clearing. Prosecutor: no evidence to back those claims, warrant dismissal. 2/



Judge Fran Gull took matter under advisement. Hearings continue in murder case Wednesday. Richard Allen, dressed in prison orange, didn’t speak during today’s hearings. He mouthed, ‘I love you,’ to his wife and mother in the gallery on the way out. 3/


More details later at http://basedinlafayette.com 4/



July 31, 2024, Day 2 pretrial hearing


Day 2 of 3 of pretrial hearings in the Delphi murders case.
A lunch break summary. 1/



The day is devoted to a motion to suppress statements and confessions Richard Allen made to inmates, prison staff and his family while in custody, since being charged in Oct 2022 in the 2017 murders of Abby Williams and Libby German. 2/


Defense case revolves around Allen’s conditions at Westville Correctional Facility, a prison where he was sent for safekeeping shortly after his arrest. Attys are lining up an argument that the move kept Allen from due process, right to counsel, 5th amendment rights. 2/


During two hours on the stand, former warden at Westville testified that Allen confessed to him, saying he’d murdered the girls, calling them by name. Prosecution suggests that the situation involves 61 incriminating statements over two months offered by Allen. 3/


Judge Fran Gull takes under advisement a motion from the prosecution to dismiss the effort to suppress Allen’s statements. She expresses concern about defense arguments that ‘state actors’ were involved in generating statements, particularly when made to his wife and family. 4/


Hearing resumes at 1 pm. 5/


At one point, Richard Allen found Jesus and tried to make things right with God by confessing more than 60 times to the Delphi murders of Abby & Libby, an Indiana State Police detective testified today.

Allen's defense team looks to toss it all Details:

Details: https://basedinlafayette.com/p/isp-detective-allen-confessed-60 r=2fe&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web



Long day wraps in Carroll Circuit Court. Among the highlights in motion to suppress statements made by Richard Allen about the murders of Abby Williams and Libby German. A few highlights: 1/



An ISP detective says Allen, in phone calls and video from his prison cell, confessed to family, guards and inmates “60-plus times … and that’s being conservative.”Says two-month string of confessions came in 2023 after Allen says he found Jesus. 2/



Defense attys press questions about how confessions were inconsistent and came during terrible conditions in Westville Correctional Facility unit where Allen was held in ‘a prison inside a prison.’ Said conditions made him crack physically, mentally. 3/


Final arguments come Thursday morning to start Day 3 of pretrial hearings in the case.
More tonight at http://basedinlafayette.com 4/





August 1, 2024, Day 3 pretrial hearing


Back for Day 3 of pretrial hearings in the Delphi murders case.
Here’s a look at the arguments from Day 2: ISP detective: Allen confessed ’60-plus’ times to Delphi murders.
Defense looks to toss it all: https://basedinlafayette.com/p/isp-detective-allen-confessed-60




Today’s hearings concentrate on prosecution motion to ban some words and phrases, mainly tied to the defense team’s third party theory of a Norse pagan ritualistic sacrifice. Testimony this morning includes an expert who called the scene “textbook.” 2/


Prosecutor claps back, saying the expert on ritualistic murders was working only with info spoon fed to her by Richard Allen’s attys. Expected this afternoon: what detectives know, and testimony of ex-wife of one man the defense says might have played a role in Odinist plot. 3/



Long day, 11 1/2 hours, in court just ended in Carroll County.A few highlights for now … 4/

Judge Gull ended session siding w/defense, agreeing to vacate a safekeeping order that had Richard Allen in a state prison since November 2022. Back in custody of Carroll County. Sheriff says tonight he’s not ready to say where Allen is going. Cass Co Jail past few days. 5/


Much of the day was given to prosecution’s effort to limit certain phrases from the trial, mainly revolving around defense’s third party, Odinist suspects theory. In play: more data from Libby German’s cellphone, alibis and brutal blood pattern descriptions from the scene. 6/




More later tonight (it’ll be late, friends) at http://basedinlafayette.com





@davebangert

 

[Inthedetails]

Realistically - if a juror starts to think on their own that some other guy may have done the crime, regardless of the evidence, what stops them from voting that RA is not guilty? I know it is not supposed to work this way, but what would stop someone arguing to the rest of the jury that it *could* have been someone else? I understand they're told instructions by the judge, but again, what stops them?

What stops a jury member from not following the rules? Honesty, integrity, commitment to the rule of law we have in our nation, plus influence of other jury members who are honest, have integrity, and commitment to the rule of law.

jmo

 

[acehard]

It's very strange that he confessed 61 times and still pleading not-guilty. If his wife and mother say they forgive him, will he change his plea to guilty? Somethings not adding up here.

 

[grannygates]

Respect for your opinion.

However, this would be my question if the man in the video is not the one who uttered, “Guys, down the hill.”

If the man whom we call BG didn’t say it but we can hear it, then this other man who did say it had to be right in the vicinity. Why hasn’t this BG man come forth?

He has to be right out of the frame, this other man, since we can hear him, so why hasn’t this BG man, who was RIGHT THERE and had to hear someone say those words to two young girls who were later found slaughtered…

WHY hasn’t he told the police immediately after A and L were found the very next day that he had passed by a man, whom you may believe isn’t shown saying “G, DTH,” with the information that he saw and heard a man say that to two girls and give a description of the man he heard telling them that, the exact time that they were near each other, and so on?

Or, if the one we SEE on video did not say those words and the other man nearby did, then I would presume BG was an accomplice if he didn’t race to tell LE the moment he heard about the girls.

I don’t believe that is the case, though. I believe BG said it and is the culprit. In my opinion that is also RA.

JMO

Based on the emails between the FBI and DC, they refer to having at least 6 suspects within days of the murders. There’s a lot of options.

And with all due respect, I think that this case will have everyone second-guessing whether they would be willing to come forward as a witness.

Even if this man was completely innocent and not involved whatsoever, if he came forward, no one would believe him. He would be in jail right now or convicted. People are convicting him based upon appearing an image and are completely unwilling to believe that this could ever possibly be someone that was simply caught in the background of a video.. There’s no way he would come forward even if he was completely innocent. MOO

 

[Inthedetails]

Because he is worried about his wife and mother rejecting him.

My hunch, which is speculation only, not a fact, is there is something more personal that his wife and mom don't want him to talk about. The info that detectives have talked to his daughter's friends is a hint (not a fact) that RA has some sort of history that perhaps the family has kept hidden and wants to keep hidden.

It's possible that RA is ready to come clean with all of it and release that burden of shame, but his mom and wife don't want him to.

Speculation only. jmopinion at the moment

 

[Ravenmoon]

So, I am curious about the video.
It is supposed to be 43 seconds long ( I think)
We have only been allowed to see about 2 seconds, at most.
The defense doesn't want the video to be presented to the jury.
Is there something on the video, perhaps BG's hand, a view of the gun, etc. And whatever tha could be, is directly associated with Richard Allen.
Maybe his hand has a scar or a finger once broken that shows predominantly... maybe the gun has something unique?

If that is possible, would it change anyone's mind about him being on the bridge with the girls?

If it's not anything like that, does anyone have a theory about why we haven't seen it, or why the defense doesn't want the jury to see it?

 

[Inthedetails]

So, I am curious about the video.
It is supposed to be 43 seconds long ( I think)
We have only been allowed to see about 2 seconds, at most.
The defense doesn't want the video to be presented to the jury.
Is there something on the video, perhaps BG's hand, a view of the gun, etc. And whatever tha could be, is directly associated with Richard Allen.
Maybe his hand has a scar or a finger once broken that shows predominantly... maybe the gun has something unique?

If that is possible, would it change anyone's mind about him being on the bridge with the girls?

If it's not anything like that, does anyone have a theory about why we haven't seen it, or why the defense doesn't want the jury to see it?

My understanding is LE didn't release more of the video to the public because it contains info only the perp would know (such as a gun). They released only enough for the public to come forward with tips about the voice.

I think they will play all of it at trial.

jmo

edited to add: and tips about his looks, not just the voice. The public didn't need the whole video to see what he looked and sounded like.

 

[ClearAhead]

Realistically - if a juror starts to think on their own that some other guy may have done the crime, regardless of the evidence, what stops them from voting that RA is not guilty? I know it is not supposed to work this way, but what would stop someone arguing to the rest of the jury that it *could* have been someone else? I understand they're told instructions by the judge, but again, what stops them?

I think you’re looking at it a little bit backwards. The jury is instructed to solely focus on if the evidence presented by the P proves the defendant to be guilty BARD. If it does “guilty”!

But if during deliberations jurors vote “not guilty” that indicates they don’t think the state has proved the defendant is guilty BARD…..indicating someone else must be responsible for committing that crime and the wrong guy got arrested and charged.

MOO

 

[MollyDDD]

That would likely come out during jury deliberations. If a jury member expressed that he was using his own non-evidence based opinion to form a verdict, the jury foreman should alert the judge.

Not a lawyer, this is my understanding though, from having served on a jury for a criminal trial.

jmo

It only takes is one person’s doubt. Whether or not they have to explain their reasoning to the other jurors or to the judge, while I doubt that, I am not positive.

 

[Ravenmoon]

I assume he could just do this himself without need of his lawyers? Like, what would stop him standing up in court and just blurting out what he wants to?

I thought about that, too.
Just a thought/ opinion:
His family in the courtroom could be the reason.
They have not wanted to hear his confessions and have told him that he has been brainwashed into believing he is the killer.
It sounds like his biggest fear is that his family won't love him anymore and that they will abandon him.
It's my opinion that is keeping him from blurting out his guilt in the courtroom.

All just my opinion

 

[grannygates]

So, I am curious about the video.
It is supposed to be 43 seconds long ( I think)
We have only been allowed to see about 2 seconds, at most.
The defense doesn't want the video to be presented to the jury.
Is there something on the video, perhaps BG's hand, a view of the gun, etc. And whatever tha could be, is directly associated with Richard Allen.
Maybe his hand has a scar or a finger once broken that shows predominantly... maybe the gun has something unique?

If that is possible, would it change anyone's mind about him being on the bridge with the girls?

If it's not anything like that, does anyone have a theory about why we haven't seen it, or why the defense doesn't want the jury to see it?

I would hope that if there was actually identifying information on that video, that the law-enforcement would’ve released it to the public to help people narrow down the search for the suspect. I think that they just straight up don’t want people to convict a person based on maybe possible looking similar to an man in the background of a video. I’m sorry I’m being very repetitive but IMO it’s not evidence of being involved in the crime. MOO