Again: Where was Casey going for two years?

[RedSox Mom]

Maybe they wanted KC to get counseling. She was an adult, and as such, couldn't be forced to go. People with family members that are profoundly mentally disturbed that need desperate help, are often turned away form getting it due to the laws in place that won't support them, indeed prohibit them from forcing the issue.

 

[Bittiness39]

Maybe they wanted KC to get counseling. She was an adult, and as such, couldn't be forced to go. People with family members that are profoundly mentally disturbed that need desperate help, are often turned away form getting it due to the laws in place that won't support them, indeed prohibit them from forcing the issue.

ITA, also, I don't think that sociopaths can be helped. I don't think that there is any type of cure. JMO. I just think KC "enjoyed" telling her parents that "I am off on this day" or "I don't have to go to work this week" and that they were willing/regardless of their suspicions to believe it.

Because if you/ or they want or wanted to believe (A) is true (KC lies) then you have/ to believe (B) is true (meaning that KC is capable of doing bad things) then you have to believe that (C) is true (which is, this daughter that we have raised, opened presents with on Christmas morning or Eve or whatever...felt NOTHING for us...not even then...not even at the height of would be a child's happiness...felt zilch in terms of love for them because she can't/couldn't). I think (C) is what kills them. JMO.

 

[countzero]

Just as there are toxic parents, there are toxic children. There are the enabled, KC and the enablers like CA/GA/LA who allowed KC to continue the false life she was leading or pretending to have.

LA could have given her a place to crash during the day early in Caylee's life too. KC could have been giving LA some of her acquired funds. LA may have answers, but is keeping silent because I have not read anything or missed it about the time period between high school and Jan 08 on his relationship with KC. Other than those two told each other everything they could not tell anyone else.

This is one discussion I would love to be a fly on the wall listening to.

 

[Searchfortruth]

I know it's very hard as a parent to think that something is wrong with your child mentally, emotionally. As parents it's just not something we accept easily. I have some experience with this so I can (sort of) say I've been there. It is so much easier to accept when your child has a physical illness as opposed to a mental one. I just don't believe that Cindy tried to get Casey into counseling, I may be totally wrong about that, but that's my take on it. Cindy knew that her daughter was not a fully "functional" adult and she let it slide. She covered for her whenever there was trouble and now wants to cover for a murder, thankfully the state doesn't work that way. I just feel that it's too bad someone didn't recognize and act on the signs earlier, maybe nothing could have been done, IDK, but the possibility does exist that Caylee might be alive still. I don't think all parents are responsible for their adult child's behavior, but in this case I think there is a great deal of culpability.

 

[Bittiness39]

I think a lot of people are weighing in on KC and her behavior because they want some fix. I am not at all trying to insult anyone...please believe me that I too fight with this and I think it is on every board. I can't go there...because that would be way off topic...but where I am at right now...supposedly there is an open chat room where no one but me is there...and someone posted a link on this board. And here I sit.

 

[jai-yen]

Just as there are toxic parents, there are toxic children. There are the enabled, KC and the enablers like CA/GA/LA who allowed KC to continue the false life she was leading or pretending to have.

LA could have given her a place to crash during the day early in Caylee's life too. KC could have been giving LA some of her acquired funds. LA may have answers, but is keeping silent because I have not read anything or missed it about the time period between high school and Jan 08 on his relationship with KC. Other than those two told each other everything they could not tell anyone else.

This is one discussion I would love to be a fly on the wall listening to.

I'm not even convinced that it is a question of toxicity. We all come here with our own life lessons and blaming parents for their children's path seems rather counterintuitive. A parent's job is to *guide*, within a child's own framework. Counseling may or may not have helped.

I went through a similar pattern growing up. In school, like KC, I was the outcast, the one who didn't "fit in" and then once I was on my own, I got crazy with drinking and partying. Drinking and partying is an easy road to acceptance because drunks don't care who you are. If you're a warm body, that's all they require. It's fast and easy community. One thing I know for certain is that it wasn't my parents' responsibility. I made my choices and I dealt with the consequences.

Eventually I grew out of it. If KC hadn't chosen the road she did wrt Caylee, she would have grown out of it, too.

At any rate, it's not her parents' fault. It's hers. She made the choice she made. I'm not convinced that counseling or any action on her parents' part could have altered it.


-Jai Yen

~*

 

[USARDOG]

What research I have done shows sociopaths can be either genetic or formed in response to their environment. Looking at CA's behavior, the way she tried to control everyone and everything, the way she tried to take control of Caylee after "forcing" kc to have the child, I heavily lean toward kc being a product of CA.

It is easy to say, kc is an adult, and age wise that may be true, but developmentaly kc is a child and need real parenting, not the vague world of neglect and over control that CA lives in.

 

[SoSueMe]

I've been wondering the same thing about the money, was she stashing it away in some account. hmmm maybe a ZFG account she made up for her supposed escape to Cali? I just don't see many big purchases she made other then the cell phone bills.

You are so right! I forgot about the cell phone bills. It would be easy for her to get behind on those at $300-400 a month. Does anyone know for sure that she really had a Blackberry?

 

[jai-yen]

You are so right! I forgot about the cell phone bills. It would be easy for her to get behind in those at $300-400 a month. Does anyone know for sure that she really had a Blackberry?

I don't recall seeing a Blackberry mentioned in any of the documents. It seemed she had a standard Nokia and/or Samsung cell phone.



-Jai-Yen

~*

 

[SoSueMe]

This brings to mind GA's deposition where he repeatedly tries to defend KC's monetary contributions to the family and just can't seen to be convincing that she helped out at all. Also, I think what KC had on both GA and CA was the fact that she made them feel they "owed" her because CA convinced her to have Caylee and they probably promised a lot of financial and emotional support. Their expectations of just what this meant varied between the three A's. KC appears to have believed it should go on forever. George wanted her to take more responsibility for herself and KC. CA seemed conflicted -- wanted KC to be around to care for Caylee, but for whatever reason did not want to force the financial issues, and also wanted to maintain complete control over KC's personal life and whatever decisions she tried to make about care of Caylee (granted, it appeared that KC often made some bad decisions). Truth is, good or bad decision, if KC wanted to have Caylee at a boyfriends apartment when she stayed there, that was KC's decision -- she was Caylee's parent, not CA. But CA was very strong-willed about this and other subjects when it came to care of Caylee, and KC was forced to lie/defend her decisions. JMO, not defending KC in any way, just making observations.

I agree with what you say here, but no one can take anything the A's said at the ZFG depositions as being the truth. For whatever reason, they decided to be combative and refused to answer honestly. I saw it as them answering the exact question, knowing full well the whole scope of the questions. For instance, GA said no to the question about KC stealing. He very well may not have known about it at the time, but he sure found out about it later and I'm sure with all the sordid details.

IMO, what KC had over the A's was Caylee. They were not about to risk losing that precious child. Caylee was KC's ace in the hole. She also knew that was the only thing she could take away that would really hurt them.

It is also probably why CA would say horrible things about KC to her friends or boyfriends. God forbid someone might take KC and Caylee away from them!

I think they both knew she wasn't working and they probably knew she would go back to the house a lot of the time. If not, why did KC need to come up with a fake email from her boss?

 

[SoSueMe]

Good grief ..
Casey was NOT an escort / hooker / "entertainer" / prostitute ..

IF she were, we'd have heard about it long ago ..

I agree KC was not an escort or whatever. She may have entertained the idea, but I don't think she went quite that far. Besides, she likes an audience.

I do think she probably filled in at Fusian a few times. In some of her text messages she talks about "closing time" and "one table left" or something to that affect. She would be paid in cash and probably earn some good tips. It would provide some quick money other than what she could steal.

 

[MAMABEAR]

What research I have done shows sociopaths can be either genetic or formed in response to their environment. Looking at CA's behavior, the way she tried to control everyone and everything, the way she tried to take control of Caylee after "forcing" kc to have the child, I heavily lean toward kc being a product of CA.

It is easy to say, kc is an adult, and age wise that may be true, but developmentaly kc is a child and need real parenting, not the vague world of neglect and over control that CA lives in.

I think I git it---What CA did was to "? ahhhh---hmmm" stunt KC's grouth as a way to keep her under control? And maybe by the time she decided to leave the nest (since she had no pushing out of the nest) she went crazy trying to make up for lost time---Caylee got to much of a drag? Did I get it?

 

[USARDOG]

Think you are on a good line MOMABEAR. What CA did was hand everything to kc, so then kc becomes dependant on her for everything and doesn't know how to work. When Ca threatened to throw her out, kc wasn't ready, didn't know how to have and hold a job, so she was scared. To get back at CA, and free herself to play with her friends she killed Caylee. IMO, Ca would have done the same to Caylee, given the chance. Caylee already had over 100 stuffed animals... now please, what kid needs 100 (+) stuffed animals...

 

[MAMABEAR]

Sad----was a wreck---waitin to crash. Poor lil Caylee.

Even taking this path of thought---I can't blame just the parents. They all had a hand in killing Caylee. Not the actual killing but they were like on the side--watching and not taking the chance to jump in and do something.

But then on the other hand---I was in the same situation and I realized that my bio daughter was planning on killin me--put my grand daughter on the street---putting my grand son in a boys home. I cut all strings and got my babies outta there. We moved clean across the USA. There are options. One doesn't have to stand on the tracts as the train gets closer. Poot--I'm just a dumb old woman and I saw what was coming---CA/GA are supposed to be pros. I ain't buyin nuttin from them. They saw it coming and stood on the tracts.

 

[countzero]

Think you are on a good line MOMABEAR. What CA did was hand everything to kc, so then kc becomes dependant on her for everything and doesn't know how to work. When Ca threatened to throw her out, kc wasn't ready, didn't know how to have and hold a job, so she was scared. To get back at CA, and free herself to play with her friends she killed Caylee. IMO, Ca would have done the same to Caylee, given the chance. Caylee already had over 100 stuffed animals... now please, what kid needs 100 (+) stuffed animals...

After years of being the one telling her parents what she wants to do, I think KC was more pissed than scared being "forced" into the real world, aka reality, out to bond with Caylee.

 

[MAMABEAR]

If your dog gets rabies----you don't run around chasing him so you can get em back in the house-------------------------you either call the dog pound or you get the gun and blow it's head off. Do they still call it "the dog pound"?

 

[akashana]

I'm not even convinced that it is a question of toxicity. We all come here with our own life lessons and blaming parents for their children's path seems rather counterintuitive. A parent's job is to *guide*, within a child's own framework. Counseling may or may not have helped.

I went through a similar pattern growing up. In school, like KC, I was the outcast, the one who didn't "fit in" and then once I was on my own, I got crazy with drinking and partying. Drinking and partying is an easy road to acceptance because drunks don't care who you are. If you're a warm body, that's all they require. It's fast and easy community. One thing I know for certain is that it wasn't my parents' responsibility. I made my choices and I dealt with the consequences.

Eventually I grew out of it. If KC hadn't chosen the road she did wrt Caylee, she would have grown out of it, too.

At any rate, it's not her parents' fault. It's hers. She made the choice she made. I'm not convinced that counseling or any action on her parents' part could have altered it.


-Jai Yen

~*

***BOLD BY ME***

From what I read in the docs, KC wasn't an outcast. She was not in the top tier clique, but she had friends and was considered to be just an average girl. I think she had all of the opportunities of any other teen, and more than many. I would have a much easier time understanding her behaviors if she had come up rough from some inner-city project, with a background full of abuse and neglect. I know we all have taken George and Cindy to task for their parenting skills (or lack thereof), but it was a middle-class upbringing by all accounts. KC never had to go to bed hungry or not have clean clothing to wear. There is no record of her being mocked in the halls or the classrooms, dreading each school day for the new humiliation it might bring. So for somebodyh like her to go so far afield is really frightening to me, because it brings the horror home.

She could be anybody.

 

[akashana]

I think a lot of people are weighing in on KC and her behavior because they want some fix. I am not at all trying to insult anyone...please believe me that I too fight with this and I think it is on every board. I can't go there...because that would be way off topic...but where I am at right now...supposedly there is an open chat room where no one but me is there...and someone posted a link on this board. And here I sit.

Huh? I don't understand . . .

 

[RR0004]

I'm not even convinced that it is a question of toxicity. We all come here with our own life lessons and blaming parents for their children's path seems rather counterintuitive. A parent's job is to *guide*, within a child's own framework. Counseling may or may not have helped.

I went through a similar pattern growing up. In school, like KC, I was the outcast, the one who didn't "fit in" and then once I was on my own, I got crazy with drinking and partying. Drinking and partying is an easy road to acceptance because drunks don't care who you are. If you're a warm body, that's all they require. It's fast and easy community. One thing I know for certain is that it wasn't my parents' responsibility. I made my choices and I dealt with the consequences.

Eventually I grew out of it. If KC hadn't chosen the road she did wrt Caylee, she would have grown out of it, too.

At any rate, it's not her parents' fault. It's hers. She made the choice she made. I'm not convinced that counseling or any action on her parents' part could have altered it.


-Jai Yen

~*

Just one note...respectfully...you do not grow out of sociopathy.

Also, I never got the impression that Casey was an outcast...curious as to why you may think so.

 

[RR0004]

If your dog gets rabies----you don't run around chasing him so you can get em back in the house-------------------------you either call the dog pound or you get the gun and blow it's head off. Do they still call it "the dog pound"?

maybe just "the pound". LOL