Allison Baden-Clay - GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD #35

[BreakingNews]

You cannot harm anyone with the truth - yourself or anyone else. I am sure that you will be treated with respect by the QPS, regardless of whether your observation is part of the puzzle or not. Thing is, you and the QPS will never know, unless it is shared. No matter that you cannot recall the day or car details.:star1: You'll do fine.

I rang Crime Stoppers once over something that seemed out of the ordinary to me, but not of great significance. Just something odd. When media quoted police saying something that locals knew was not true, I phoned again. This in turn led police to find a person who had been missing for 3 months. Not a happy ending, but I am glad that I kept at the police with my ullhair:

So please contact Crime Stoppers.

 

[possumheart]

The one thing that would really put the icing on the cake is if GBC was meeting up covertly with TM still while the emergency services were out looking for his wife. I think if I were to hear that I would faint.

 

[Cyansea]

Marly don't you think his cooking BBQ was just his way of being in the throes of everyone and showing off? It wasn't for his family...

Agree! It was all done just to feather "his" own nest. So people could say, let use that agent to sell, buy, rent a home, he's so nice. He was trying to keep a high profile, so that people would think of him first. All for the love of money.

 

[ellou]

was just looking at his FB page. 360 people now....I'm surprised at these people. I can understand his family but why are the other's there. They are like voyeurs. I would be too embarrassed to be seen.

Hey ,normally don't have much too say,yet I find it very interesting some could really has 360 friends on Facebook.....I propbably have just upest some of you,who do ,do the face book thing!I choose not too!!!
It doesen't appeal too me,I have only one friend ,and that person I can always count ,I talk too my friend always...I bet anything ,all GBC friends on FB. are not really his friends,just a whole lot of wanna be"s,******s,....can I say that ,full of themselves...Maybe I am in trouble now...This is just my view,facebook may work for some,but no one has 360 friends.

 

[MaxwellSmart]

At a cost of $240 have just discovered that police vehicles now have "number plate recognition" capabilities - 10 seconds after driving past them at 80kmph they were hot on my tail to let me know my rego was not current (oops). They were extremely professional about the whole thing and I feel that QPS are trained so well that nothing will have escaped their notice on the GBC case. They are the ultimate jigsaw puzzlers.

 

[mrs plod]

The only problem I see with the theory that the Prado being involved is that it was released back to GBC prior to his arrest. IMO if it had any forensic value at all it would still be impounded along with the Captiva. Just MOO.

I agree. I think I read on here a while back that ABC was seen driving the prado quite often so I would think any child seats would be in that car. It would make sense to transport a body in the car that did not have child seats. Do we know as fact which one ABC drove? And when police looked at the cars, which one had the child seats? Were they in car they would normally be in? Also read of there being toys in the captiva. Does that mean the child seat was in there as well or did they use both cars and regularly swap seats over? Did both cars have child seats permanently in place?

 

[ellou]

At a cost of $240 have just discovered that police vehicles now have "number plate recognition" capabilities - 10 seconds after driving past them at 80kmph they were hot on my tail to let me know my rego was not current (oops). They were extremely professional about the whole thing and I feel that QPS are trained so well that nothing will have escaped their notice on the GBC case. They are the ultimate jigsaw puzzlers.

I believe you could be right ,my friend

 

[BreakingNews]

Hey ,normally don't have much too say,yet I find it very interesting some could really has 360 friends on Facebook.....I propbably have just upest some of you,who do ,do the face book thing!I choose not too!!!
It doesen't appeal too me,I have only one friend ,and that person I can always count ,I talk too my friend always...I bet anything ,all GBC friends on FB. are not really his friends,just a whole lot of wanna be"s,******s,....can I say that ,full of themselves...Maybe I am in trouble now...This is just my view,facebook may work for some,but no one has 360 friends.

Ellou, some of his facebook "friends" included Campbell Newman, Julie Bishop. Yeah it's a status thing. You can have up to 5000 'friends' on facebook before you have to get your own page.

 

[BrissyLass]

At a cost of $240 have just discovered that police vehicles now have "number plate recognition" capabilities - 10 seconds after driving past them at 80kmph they were hot on my tail to let me know my rego was not current (oops). They were extremely professional about the whole thing and I feel that QPS are trained so well that nothing will have escaped their notice on the GBC case. They are the ultimate jigsaw puzzlers.

ouch Maxwell ... but you are correct, not much gets past them that's for sure and that has to be a good thing

 

[Mountain Misst]

hi, yes, i agree and i brought this up awhile ago about the fingernails when someone suggested she may have had fake long nails, they would bleed a little enough to cause the small amount of blood found in the car. and because of the reported scratches, its pretty obvious allison fought for her life.
i also agree with you and believe she was smothered or possibly suffocated with plastic and drowned in the bath. i still cant get past thinking she was found with a plastic bag tied over her head.
it sounds like gbc was very charming on the outside, he must have been holding all the bad stuff in and seems so damaged, wonder if it was nurture or nature making him who he is?

Am building a psychological profile on this nature versus nurture with GBC as my subject, as we speak. Due to the public profile of this "special" family I have a wealth of material to work with. It's going to take quite some time - between all our posts here on WS and until we get a trial I'll get it done every spare moment is 'on the case'.

As with all of us, when all's said and done - it's a combination of nature and nurture which makes us uniquely ourselves.

 

[Gemini Girl]

Am building a psychological profile on this nature versus nurture with GBC as my subject, as we speak. Due to the public profile of this "special" family I have a wealth of material to work with. It's going to take quite some time - between all our posts here on WS and until we get a trial I'll get it done every spare moment is 'on the case'.

As with all of us, when all's said and done - it's a combination of nature and nurture which makes us uniquely ourselves.

Thanks MM, are you doing this as part of a formal study program perhaps?

Sorry if I should already know the answer, lol

:waitasec:

JMO MOO

 

[LauraMars]

It's a good question for this type of personality.
Nature( born that way)
Nurture( parent/ carer influence)

I used to think my ex was born a sociopath. ( nature)
I asked his Father , years before I left him, why he lied about me so much and wanted me to be perceived to the world, especially his family, that i was lazy , a bad wife and incompetant mother, when the exact opposite was true of me. ( I used to video everything , as proof of who I was, cleaning house, meals, attending school events etc)
His own father told me that they knew the truth, about me, that everything he said was a lie, and they ignored his false statements about me.
He then told me that as a baby, they knew he was different and put it down to a birth defect , laying incorrectly in womb, as a nurse stated to his pregnant wife that the babys head seemed pulled back too far ? He said he was a troublesome child and teenager and swore at his own Mother and treated her the same.:what: They had to throw him out of home at 17 , but they still supported him financially big time. And still now they pay him huge sums of money yearly.
Anyway, I loved my Father in Law and all his siblings. I was convinced he was simply born this way , as I was told by him.
BUT, years later I was speaking to a friends husband, who knew my husbands Father. I told him he was the nicest, kindest, beautiful man.And how lucky he was my Father in law.
Guess what? :what:
He said that the man I had described was not the Man he knew , as being the most evil, angry, ruthless man he had ever known. He was adamant that my father in law was hiding his true self , and probably old age had changed him. He was visibly shaken , just talking about him. He had apparently affected him in a profound way and caused him a lot of heartache. His career was badly affected too because of my father in law. :what:

I was left questioning whether it was in fact my husbands father who was the reason for his bazaar behaviour.
In my situation, looking at the nature v nurture theory, and I now believe it is a combination of both.

Your post sent a few chills down my spine Aunty, and I have often questioned the very same thing - is it genetic/nature/nurture?

I had a relationship with a true sociopath (oxymoron I know) a long time ago, and he too has a father who seems to be of the same evil mind. They usually came across as the most charming, bright and sometimes interesting men, but their ruthless disregard of basic morality, the truth, the law, let alone respect for fellow human beings eventually became apparent.

My long lost ex was also very troublesome as a child/teen, even though he seemingly had a stable and very privileged homelife - he had an awesome mother at least. I am still very close to her, and while she knows of and understands what her son is capable of, she still loves him.

I had/have a daughter with this person, and I can honestly say that she has a truly good and hugely loving heart, a beautiful soul. They have only a few things in common, like her amazing artistic ability. She even has exactly the same hand writing as him, although they never lived together...go figure?

So at the end of the day, I don't know whether there is a clear answer? Is it one or the other, or a bit of both?

 

[possumheart]

Am building a psychological profile on this nature versus nurture with GBC as my subject, as we speak. Due to the public profile of this "special" family I have a wealth of material to work with. It's going to take quite some time - between all our posts here on WS and until we get a trial I'll get it done every spare moment is 'on the case'.

As with all of us, when all's said and done - it's a combination of nature and nurture which makes us uniquely ourselves.

The mod did say not to 'personalise' him ... just making you aware of that

:dunno:

 

[AAAA]

Speaking of OW, there's been talk she was around on the day, since early on, hasn't it, and a friend of someone here was adamant they saw her at cross country (thursday).
Every time I think of her an image doesn't leave my mind which is that of a car without its registration plate leaving the Brookfield SS school car park at drop off, turning left (no right turns allowed at drop off), then turning left at Brookfield road (towards show ground). It was a dark coloured 4WD and the route it took would be the one taken to return to BC seniors, which I assume is where OW was staying. The problem is I just can't remember for sure that it happened Friday morning, and that's why I never reported it to police. I know I saw it that week, and thought it odd, and asked myself why would someone do the school drop off in such a car, but I can't be sure I saw it on Friday... Now I wonder if it was one of the BC cars which was used the night before to dispose of the body after removing the plate/s. It was a woman driving, and now I wonder if it was OW (she looked worried), whether she had even noticed the plates weren't on?... Anyway, did anyone else local notice a car without plates driving in and out of the school carpark that week?

As far as I know some sports cars and 4WD's are allowed to drive with only one number plate. There are a few in the Brookfield area that drive cars with only one plate. Pretty sure my husband told me this in the past. Will check.

 

[Mani]

Hey ,normally don't have much too say,yet I find it very interesting some could really has 360 friends on Facebook.....I propbably have just upest some of you,who do ,do the face book thing!I choose not too!!!
It doesen't appeal too me,I have only one friend ,and that person I can always count ,I talk too my friend always...I bet anything ,all GBC friends on FB. are not really his friends,just a whole lot of wanna be"s,******s,....can I say that ,full of themselves...Maybe I am in trouble now...This is just my view,facebook may work for some,but no one has 360 friends.

ellou,

360 is not a large amount when so many would be work related. There are some people who have over a thousand friends.........we all know it's not possible to keep track of that many people but those sorts of people need to show they are popular. Cheers

 

[squizzey1]

At a cost of $240 have just discovered that police vehicles now have "number plate recognition" capabilities - 10 seconds after driving past them at 80kmph they were hot on my tail to let me know my rego was not current (oops). They were extremely professional about the whole thing and I feel that QPS are trained so well that nothing will have escaped their notice on the GBC case. They are the ultimate jigsaw puzzlers.

oops not so smart Maxwell. i believe there are only one or two of those cars
and they are shared from Toowoomba to the sunshine coast , sounds like bad luck but thats QPS for ya

 

[Mani]

Speaking of OW, there's been talk she was around on the day, since early on, hasn't it, and a friend of someone here was adamant they saw her at cross country (thursday).
Every time I think of her an image doesn't leave my mind which is that of a car without its registration plate leaving the Brookfield SS school car park at drop off, turning left (no right turns allowed at drop off), then turning left at Brookfield road (towards show ground). It was a dark coloured 4WD and the route it took would be the one taken to return to BC seniors, which I assume is where OW was staying. The problem is I just can't remember for sure that it happened Friday morning, and that's why I never reported it to police. I know I saw it that week, and thought it odd, and asked myself why would someone do the school drop off in such a car, but I can't be sure I saw it on Friday... Now I wonder if it was one of the BC cars which was used the night before to dispose of the body after removing the plate/s. It was a woman driving, and now I wonder if it was OW (she looked worried), whether she had even noticed the plates weren't on?... Anyway, did anyone else local notice a car without plates driving in and out of the school carpark that week?

Enough people on here have suggested you contact Crimestoppers - why would you not? That small piece of information may be something that fits with another person's information and tells the police something they have been querying.

MOO

Also, in addition - if you are a local - why has it taken you all these months to come on here and ask WS about contacting the police - what have the people supporting you/close to you told you to do? Seems odd to me if no one has suggested you ring the police.

 

[squizzey1]

I agree. I think I read on here a while back that ABC was seen driving the prado quite often so I would think any child seats would be in that car. It would make sense to transport a body in the car that did not have child seats. Do we know as fact which one ABC drove? And when police looked at the cars, which one had the child seats? Were they in car they would normally be in? Also read of there being toys in the captiva. Does that mean the child seat was in there as well or did they use both cars and regularly swap seats over? Did both cars have child seats permanently in place?

My grandchildrens { who go to school with the girls{ father told me the Prado was Allisons and she always drove it. suppose she would use captiva when other was being serviced or whatever .cant comment on seats.

 

[alioop]

Is it possible for the seats in the Captiva to be removed? I've been thinking that the back seats were removed entirely and then Allison's body was placed in the back of the car. This may account for the lack of staining etc. on the back seats as seen in the pics below.

View attachment 24787

View attachment 24788

I have done my experiments on my captiva as there have been a few things niggling me for quite a while. Let me explain the layout of my 7 seat captiva which is basically the same as the BC captiva.

There are 3 rows of seats. Two seats in the front row, 2 sections of seats in the middle row (which are split into two thirds and one third which give 3 seating positions) and two seats in the back. The second row and back row fold down flat which is very easy and quick to do. In the photos of the BC captiva taken from the back looking in, both second and back row of seats are folded down. So no seats have been removed, just folded flat giving a large flat area.

In my captiva we use only the first two rows of seats. We are a family of 4 but often carry 5 people with 3 across the middle row. The back row stay flat and there is plenty of room in that hatchback "boot " section on top of the back row folded down seats for luggage, shopping etc. When we have had more than 5 people to transport we have used one or two of the back seats. To get into those back seats you have to fold forward the middle seat sections ( which you can't do easily if you have a kiddy car seat there) or if you are only using 1 back row seat you can climb in the hatch at the back.

I don't know what seating configuration the QPS found the captiva in. However I presume that the usual configuration is that the middle row of seats would have been used by the girls so those seats would usually be up. I have been wondering if poor Allison would have fit in the hatchback "boot" section without the need to fold down the middle row of seats. So I got in the "boot" section of my captiva and had a trusted family member close the hatch. Whilst not comfortable, I certainly fitted in the space and I am taller and bigger than Allison. Interestingly as I could only lie sideways, my head was on one of the wheel arches where the photos show Allison's blood was found. So my point is that she could have fit in the "boot" section without laying down the second row of seats.

The other thing that has been niggling at me is that for Allison's blood to have been found on the wheel arch from some previous injury eg nosebleed, then she would have had to have been sitting in one of the back row seats. I have had my captiva for 4 years and I have only sat in the back row seat once. I hated it, felt claustrophobic way back there. The BCs only had their car for 8 weeks and I think that it is unlikely that Allison sat back there. Most people I think would send kids to sit in those seats.

The other thing I have been thinking about is whether there was a kiddy car seat in the BC car. I think there would have been 1 or 2 as our rules in Queensland are strict and kids have to be in car seats/booster seats until they are 7 depending on their height and weight. If the middle row of seats were folded down when the QPS first saw the captiva, then those kids seats would have to have been removed. I don't think the QPS would have allowed the seats to have been removed for someone, say OW to take the kids to school that day in another car. I don't know if they were driven to school but it would have only taken them 5 mins to walk to school. We have 2 cars and have kiddy car seats in both cars as our kids travel regularly in both cars. So even if the captiva was mainly used by GBC, I think there would have been kiddy seat/s in it. Does anyone know what car the girls were regularly dropped off and collected from school in?

So that is my ponderings and experiments. I took some photos of my captiva with seats down and will try and work out how to attach them as they show different angles to the ones we have seen of the BC captiva that may show a better perspective.

 

[Mani]

I have done my experiments on my captiva as there have been a few things niggling me for quite a while. Let me explain the layout of my 7 seat captiva which is basically the same as the BC captiva.

There are 3 rows of seats. Two seats in the front row, 2 sections of seats in the middle row (which are split into two thirds and one third which give 3 seating positions) and two seats in the back. The second row and back row fold down flat which is very easy and quick to do. In the photos of the BC captiva taken from the back looking in, both second and back row of seats are folded down. So no seats have been removed, just folded flat giving a large flat area.

In my captiva we use only the first two rows of seats. We are a family of 4 but often carry 5 people with 3 across the middle row. The back row stay flat and there is plenty of room in that hatchback "boot " section on top of the back row folded down seats for luggage, shopping etc. When we have had more than 5 people to transport we have used one or two of the back seats. To get into those back seats you have to fold forward the middle seat sections ( which you can't do easily if you have a kiddy car seat there) or if you are only using 1 back row seat you can climb in the hatch at the back.

I don't know what seating configuration the QPS found the captiva in. However I presume that the usual configuration is that the middle row of seats would have been used by the girls so those seats would usually be up. I have been wondering if poor Allison would have fit in the hatchback "boot" section without the need to fold down the middle row of seats. So I got in the "boot" section of my captiva and had a trusted family member close the hatch. Whilst not comfortable, I certainly fitted in the space and I am taller and bigger than Allison. Interestingly as I could only lie sideways, my head was on one of the wheel arches where the photos show Allison's blood was found. So my point is that she could have fit in the "boot" section without laying down the second row of seats.

The other thing that has been niggling at me is that for Allison's blood to have been found on the wheel arch from some previous injury eg nosebleed, then she would have had to have been sitting in one of the back row seats. I have had my captiva for 4 years and I have only sat in the back row seat once. I hated it, felt claustrophobic way back there. The BCs only had their car for 8 weeks and I think that it is unlikely that Allison sat back there. Most people I think would send kids to sit in those seats.

The other thing I have been thinking about is whether there was a kiddy car seat in the BC car. I think there would have been 1 or 2 as our rules in Queensland are strict and kids have to be in car seats/booster seats until they are 7 depending on their height and weight. If the middle row of seats were folded down when the QPS first saw the captiva, then those kids seats would have to have been removed. I don't think the QPS would have allowed the seats to have been removed for someone, say OW to take the kids to school that day in another car. I don't know if they were driven to school but it would have only taken them 5 mins to walk to school. We have 2 cars and have kiddy car seats in both cars as our kids travel regularly in both cars. So even if the captiva was mainly used by GBC, I think there would have been kiddy seat/s in it. Does anyone know what car the girls were regularly dropped off and collected from school in?

So that is my ponderings and experiments. I took some photos of my captiva with seats down and will try and work out how to attach them as they show different angles to the ones we have seen of the BC captiva that may show a better perspective.

The school is a two minute walk - look up Boscombe Road on google maps and see how close they were to the school - it is just over a rise from their house. MOO