Armchair Psych discussion of Jodi Arias

[Cate49]

IMO--When it is not premediated or when you do not have other options as JA did. She moved far away, and then kept coming back, why? If he was sooo abusive why keep running back for more? She is a murderer to me, it really is that simple.

My comments are not always my opinons. I just put things out there to have discussion.

 

[Cate49]

Clearly people are passionate in the emotion connected to this case. Discussion of anything against Travis sparks temper. However, to jump into a forum and not take the time to understand the nature of some of the posts is frustrating to me.

 

[lil_buddy]

This is about the home she shared with David? In calafornia. She stopped paying bills after meeting Travis. Up to that point she had meet the financial obligation.

This is not my understanding. Terms of their mortgage changed and monthly payment went up beyond their means.

The man was Darryl Brewer.

 

[MeeBee]

LOL. I'm not worried.

"Willmott guided LaViolette toward an e-mail string among Alexander and his California friends Chris and Sky Hughes. The e-mails were not actually shown to the jury. Upon instruction from Judge Sherry Stephens, LaViolette was not allowed to read them, but only to characterize their content, and she did so with great difficulty given Martinez’s repeated rapid-fire objections.

The memo line, LaViolette said, was, “You crossed the Line.” Written Jan. 29, 2007, the e-mails expressed Alexander’s anger that the Hugheses had talked to Arias to discourage her from pursuing Alexander because he was abusive to women. He called her a “*advertiser censored*,” only saw her secretly and tended to treat her coldly in public, according to LaViolette.

What was not mentioned in court Thursday was the history of the e-mails. A defense filing from January 2011 details the efforts of Arias’ attorneys to obtain them. Initially the prosecution told the defense attorneys that there were no available text messages sent or received by Alexander and then was ordered to turn over several hundred.

Furthermore, according to the filing, the case agent, Mesa Police Detective Esteban Flores, told the defense attorneys that there was nothing “out of the ordinary” among Alexander’s e-mails; about 8,000 were turned over to the defense in June 2010, including the Hughes e-mails.

The 2011 filing details the e-mail contents, including “A response from Mr. Hughes ... wherein he asserts that he believes Jodi would be his (Travis&#8217 next victim and that Jodi was just another girl that he (Travis) was playing.” Alexander allegedly replied by saying “I am a bit of a sociopath.”

Other e-mails from Sky Hughes, the filing says, say that Alexander considered Arias to be a “booty call.”

How much of the e-mails makes it into testimony remains to be seen. Chris and Sky Hughes have already testified for the prosecution regarding an earlier allegation of misconduct by Martinez, but the topic of the e-mails was not discussed. They could be called back."

Yes, I have been reading about this email and I don't think I'm worried anymore. First of all, Sky Hughes will probably be called to clarify what she meant by "victims" in her email and treating women badly or whatever she really said and to say that she never saw Travis actually hit other women.

Also, they talk about how he treats women, how they become his "victims," etc. but I see no mention of him abusing women. This seems to be LaVi's interpretation and I feel she inserted the word herself. I think when they were actually dating, Travis was very affectionate to her in public, like in that video where he describes his near death experience. He has his arm lovingly draped over as she lays in his lap.

I think he only started acting cold to her once she moved closer to him after they broke up and started showing up in his life uninvited. He argued with her about moving there, was mean to her and she still couldn't take the hint. There are many stories like this of her. She never takes a hint, and just from Travis, from many many people.

We know Travis was a bit of a player and jumped from woman to woman. We know Travis cheated on Lisa with Jodi. We know Travis wasn't perfect. He had his flaws. We also KNOW he was not a pedophile. There is just too much evidence that Jodi was lying and not one shred of evidence that Travis was one. I really think people just need a reason to hate Travis more and are ignoring the big picture.

But it does make me sad to see people talking as if Jodi was justified in her actions and Travis deserved what he got. She had two choices. She could get on with her life in Yreka, cry a little bit over Travis but move on. Or she could hop in her car with 3 gas cans, a gun and a knife and drive 1000 miles to kill him.

 

[Clutchbag]

There are levels of domestic abuse. How do we determine what is an exeptable response to the experience of the victim. Harsh words are said during times of anger that could be classified as verbal abuse. This is common (IMO) in relationships. When does it become forgivable to kill an abuser?

and when does killing someone in self defense stop and murder begin? You would think he was the terminator or some mythical creature that doesnt die or incapacitated so as to escape after being stabbed endless times......shooting him in theface wasnt enough, stabbing him 27 times wasnt enough, she gutted him like a fish...ive just seenthe autopsy pictures......if this so called woman so called specimen of humanity gets off it will be a black day for america and for justice everywhere...she has IMO no defence at all, she is a depraved person withno remorse whatsoever on top and if she smirks and thinks shes running rings round the prosecuting lawyer we shall see who has the last laugh

 

[Clutchbag]

AND on the other side of the coin, I don't believe there is a human who has never been verbally abusive.

Who's gonna tell me they haven't done and said nasty cruel things to their SO and/or children?

Thats right, thedefense is so weak it may as well be a homeopathy recipe,ie a fake

She slaughtered this man in a horrific way, she has to pay for it....this is no casey anthony case, bad as that was......this is a whole new level......

 

[SMK]

This is not my understanding. Terms of their mortgage changed and monthly payment went up beyond their means.

The man was Darryl Brewer.

I still believe there had to be something more at work than simply wanting Travis' house.....There are older men who would have been easier to catch. It had to be the whole package (no double entendre meant ) : His looks, his charm, his popularity, his sexiness, with the house as part of that?
(one other aside, perhaps not appropriate but it burns me up: If anyone can clarify, I would be more than grateful: Why is that any time a woman has normal breasts I find out she had to have surgery to get them? In terms of celebrities and others, in the past 15 years I can think of virtually dozens and dozens and dozens in which this was the case. Has nature gone haywire, forgetting how to make decent-size breasts? Girls in my day looked that way without any surgery: I was one of them and in the locker rooms with them in high school. Plenty of girls were 36C with no help from any surgeon. What gives? Surgery has now replaced ordinary pubetry-phase development? If you put girls on an island, they would all be flat chested? Someone clarify please ..... I saw Jodi and thought, "finally, a girl who actually developed and needed no surgery, just like in the old days" - and now i find out........ :furious

 

[lil_buddy]

This is not my understanding. Terms of their mortgage changed and monthly payment went up beyond their means.

The man was Darryl Brewer.

Hmmm... upon reflection, this is based on JA's testimony; I do not believe it was supported by Brewer.

I think it may be correct that JA decided to stop paying her 1/2 of the bills to pursue TA.

 

[MeeBee]

I still believe there had to be something more at work than simply wanting Travis' house.....There are older men who would have been easier to catch. It had to be the whole package (no double entendre meant ) : His looks, his charm, his popularity, his sexiness, with the house as part of that?
(one other aside, perhaps not appropriate but it burns me up: If anyone can clarify, I would be more than grateful: Why is that any time a woman has normal breasts I find out she had to have surgery to get them? In terms of celebrities and others, in the past 15 years I can think of virtually dozens and dozens and dozens in which this was the case. Has nature gone haywire, forgetting how to make decent-size breasts? Girls in my day looked that way without any surgery: I was one of them and in the locker rooms with them in high school. Plenty of girls were 36C with no help from any surgeon. What gives? Surgery has now replaced ordinary pubetry-phase development? If you put girls on an island, they would all be flat chested? Someone clarify please ..... I saw Jodi and thought, "finally, a girl who actually developed and needed no surgery, just like in the old days" - and now i find out........ :furious

You should see my sister's *advertiser censored*. Maybe that'll restore you faith :floorlaugh: JK!

 

[lil_buddy]

I still believe there had to be something more at work than simply wanting Travis' house.....There are older men who would have been easier to catch. It had to be the whole package (no double entendre meant ) : His looks, his charm, his popularity, his sexiness, with the house as part of that?
(one other aside, perhaps not appropriate but it burns me up: If anyone can clarify, I would be more than grateful: Why is that any time a woman has normal breasts I find out she had to have surgery to get them? In terms of celebrities and others, in the past 15 years I can think of virtually dozens and dozens and dozens in which this was the case. Has nature gone haywire, forgetting how to make decent-size breasts? Girls in my day looked that way without any surgery: I was one of them and in the locker rooms with them in high school. Plenty of girls were 36C with no help from any surgeon. What gives? Surgery has now replaced ordinary pubetry-phase development? If you put girls on an island, they would all be flat chested? Someone clarify please ..... I saw Jodi and thought, "finally, a girl who actually developed and needed no surgery, just like in the old days" - and now i find out........ :furious

To clarify, I did not say I thought JA pursued TA for $. I believe it is more complicated than that.

I do think the beginning of the end was the financial strain of that house. Too much responsibility. She could not handle. The bigger your PD the less able you are to deal with stress.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

It does sound like this trial may have hit an old emotional wound in you. Without even realizing it, you may have identified more with JA than the victim, TA. It has touched some old wounds in me also. I was raped one time. He was a man in my office who I went out with once. But I knew it would be my word against his and I couldn't prove it in a court. So I had to see him at work, afterwords, but couldn't talk about what he did to me for fear of also losing my job.

Another time, a psychologist who I was being seen by for a problem having to do with sex, tried to have sex with ME in his office! When I stopped his advances, he tried to make me feel like there was something wrong with ME, by saying he had never seen a person before who could turn their feelings on and off like a faucet. Well I did because I knew it was wrong and would destroy our doctor/patient relationship. I never went back to see again after that day. I wanted to report his unethical behavior to whoever licenses him, but again, it was my word against his.

I felt powerless in these two incidents against the men. My anger at them has only grown in the time since. So these are some of my own emotional buttons. Perhaps I identify too strongly with JA and how and why she did what she did to Travis. She took her rage and anger to the criminal level, something I don't think I could do.

One time I met a guy at a dance club who said he was a disc jockey. He was a tall blond and extremely handsome and we danced together all night long. It was during the disco period and a good friend of mine was an expert so I was pretty good at it from receiving instruction from him. Anyway, the night was coming to an end with the disc jockey and he asked me out to breakfast. My girlfriends didn't want to go and between the three of us we let me go off alone with him. Dumb, dumb and dumber. He drove me out to a muddy field - a mile or so in each direction from any road. I was drunkish but getting more alert and asked, 'where are you going?'. He stopped the car and whipped out the biggest thing - I'm not kidding - grabbed my head and tried to force me to perform oral sex on him. I refused and began shouting at him that he could have me any other way (not! but that's all I could think to do/say at that moment). Then I opened the car door and began tromping through the mud wearing high heel sandals.

Now get this - he drove up beside me and told me to get back in the car and that he'd drive me home - and I did! I didn't know what else to do as I couldn't see a road or know what direction to go. He kept his word but when he got close to my apartment (near a police station), I jumped out of the car at a light, ran across the street and down to the police station. It was two or three o'clock in the morning and I was a muddy mess, wearing a dress with my hair and makeup looking all disheveled. My emotional state was near hysterical and the policeman could tell I was in complete distress as I blurted out that the guy (whose name I didn't know but is a disc jockey for what station I didn't know - duh!) was going to take me to breakfast but drove me out into a field (in another town) and whipped out his humongous dick and tried to force me to perform oral sex on him.

The method in which the cop dealt with me made me feel like the biggest *advertiser censored* in the world. Obviously, in that moment I was the dumbest chick on the planet but the biggest *advertiser censored*? It was the cop's tone that implied, "what did you expect?, and you shouldn't be so stupid". On top of that, I had to ask him if somebody could escort me home to make sure I wasn't being followed and if they could keep an eye out at my place for a little while. The cop was going to let me walk back onto the street alone. It was humiliating and, yes, I had taken a very big chance and was very lucky big dick wasn't an even bigger perv or a murderer. Still, the male cops made me feel like a bigger piece of crap than I already had decided all by myself that I was.

Does this story even fit this case? My point is, if anyone had met this guy who acted so nice and gave himself an intriguing title, the last thing you'd think is that he'd force a sex act upon a girl when immediately out the door. You wouldn't think he'd have too.

 

[Clutchbag]

I think she was possibly sadomasochistic in her sexuality,she was no victim IMO in any wayshape or form,only one victim here,all else is lies

 

[lil_buddy]

I still believe there had to be something more at work than simply wanting Travis' house.....There are older men who would have been easier to catch. It had to be the whole package (no double entendre meant ) : His looks, his charm, his popularity, his sexiness, with the house as part of that?
(one other aside, perhaps not appropriate but it burns me up: If anyone can clarify, I would be more than grateful: Why is that any time a woman has normal breasts I find out she had to have surgery to get them? In terms of celebrities and others, in the past 15 years I can think of virtually dozens and dozens and dozens in which this was the case. Has nature gone haywire, forgetting how to make decent-size breasts? Girls in my day looked that way without any surgery: I was one of them and in the locker rooms with them in high school. Plenty of girls were 36C with no help from any surgeon. What gives? Surgery has now replaced ordinary pubetry-phase development? If you put girls on an island, they would all be flat chested? Someone clarify please ..... I saw Jodi and thought, "finally, a girl who actually developed and needed no surgery, just like in the old days" - and now i find out........ :furious

Thin, small framed women tend to have smaller breasts. Big *advertiser censored* on a slender woman can be a give-away.

*advertiser censored* that are spherical (Have you see JA's nudie pics?) are fake.

 

[Cate49]

and when does killing someone in self defense stop and murder begin? You would think he was the terminator or some mythical creature that doesnt die or incapacitated so as to escape after being stabbed endless times......shooting him in theface wasnt enough, stabbing him 27 times wasnt enough, she gutted him like a fish...ive just seenthe autopsy pictures......if this so called woman so called specimen of humanity gets off it will be a black day for america and for justice everywhere...she has IMO no defence at all, she is a depraved person withno remorse whatsoever on top and if she smirks and thinks shes running rings round the prosecuting lawyer we shall see who has the last laugh

My post was not about this case in particular but in the domestic abuse excuse used in court ....generally.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

Thank you for sharing your experiences, and I'm sorry that you had to go through such horrible ordeals.

I too have noticed some old trauma wounds resurfacing with this case: Yes, it makes one imagine being JA and begins to color perceptions:

But when I watch youtbube footage of her she does not come across as I believe I would (I think I would be more sad and subdued) and I too do not think murder would have been my reaction to abandonment by TA (probably deep depression).

Ditto.
Also I am one who has always used to turn my mistakes inward. It took me a long time to realize I turned the mistakes or intentional bad behaviors of others inward too. Everything must be or is my fault!

Would anybody have believed me if I could have killed the disc jockey?
I don't know but it never dawned on me to even try. Even if I had had a gun, I would have tried to flee first. If my mind was wired differently, maybe I could have shot him when he pulled up again along side of me - in the nuts.

 

[Hammy]

I wish I hadn't missed the first couple weeks of testimony. I came on board when JA was already on the stand. This trial is long with big time lapses. Just when new info is coming out, that I'd like to hear both sides regarding asap, we have to wait four days to get back to testimony.

I also came to the trial late and I strongly suggest you take a look at the first two weeks' testimony. If you're struggling to form an opinion it would be only fair if you saw the prosecution's case presented, medical examiners, detectives, Travis's ex-girlfriend's testifying. You can find it on YouTube - Jodi Arias Trial Day # Part 1/2/3.

Also, I agree with you that Travis was not very nice to Jodi. I certainly would not have dated him. However, you have to look at *many* factors in Travis's life that help explain things. He had a terrible upbringing early on. He was conflicted between his religion (which was especially important to him because it was important to people who saved him from his upbringing - his grandparents) and his natural desires. To me, he simply seemed a bit immature, more like a high school teenager than a 30 year old man, but perhaps it was due to the fact that he had to focus on other things (escaping the poverty) and did not have the time to achieve the emotional maturity. (I hope this doesn't cross the line into being victim-unfriendly, if yes, I apologize).

Finally, even if he was verbally abusive to JA, the bottom line is the evidence clearly shows 1) premeditation, 2) cruelty, 3) coverup from the beginning to end, 4) absolute lack of remorse. If Jodi had been a prone-to-anger person who had snapped and killed him after a fight, and called 911 in tears admitting what she had done, I would not judge her as harshly. (She'd be guilty of murder 2, but not of murder 1).

In my view there's absolutely no conflict here, it simply does not matter if Travis had some flaws. The entire defense is built on character assassination - the pedophile letters (you mentioned you just became aware of them) were forged by Jodi to support her claims. It's very clear from the texts that nothing happened on the day she supposedly discovered the pedophile photo. She claimed that this is what triggered the physical violence (the broken finger) and clearly that is a lie as well. Everything is built on that day and everything falls apart like a house of cards if you examine the lack of logic behind her story. She and the defense team are absolutely vile IMHO to accuse Travis of the worst things they could come up :furious: and to me by the way it would serve as an aggravating factor when sentencing - someone who is capable of this on the stand is probably capable of a lot more behind the scenes. Because of these vile accusations it's very natural that many people are skeptical and very defensive about even the slightest accusation against him and I can absolutely understand that.

 

[Clutchbag]

:facepalm:

My post was not about this case in particular but in the domestic abuse excuse used in court ....generally.

Sure but im not interested in domestic abuse cases here as this is clearly not one
andthis creaturehas no domestic abuse case or paedophilia, its her smokeand mirrors and a disgrace to true victims...she didnt just punch and run from her alledged abuser ,she shot his face stabbed him 29 timesandgutted his throat.........she deserves thesame imo, sorryBout that......anyonehaveany police reports from her? About physical abuse? Ta

 

[To Kill a Mockingbird]

Not happy with the legal defense of PTSD....

 

[SMK]

Thin, small framed women tend to have smaller breasts. Big *advertiser censored* on a slender woman can be a give-away.

*advertiser censored* that are spherical (Have you see JA's nudie pics?) are fake.

OK - still think something has gone haywire, but OK. :facepalm:

 

[SMK]

Ditto.
Also I am one who has always used to turn my mistakes inward. It took me a long time to realize I turned the mistakes or intentional bad behaviors of others inward too. Everything must be or is my fault!

Would anybody have believed me if I could have killed the disc jockey?
I don't know but it never dawned on me to even try. Even if I had had a gun, I would have tried to flee first. If my mind was wired differently, maybe I could have shot him when he pulled up again along side of me - in the nuts.

That was not a good experience (an understatement) and things would have been handled very, very differently in this era. Sorry to hear about it....Yes, I was always a self-blamer as well: Look at it this way: We did not wind up like Jodi.