Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 - #1

[Thinking]

Have just sent an email to crimestoppers suggesting they check the Scout Camp here at Karana Downs. It is isolated from houses, only takes 10-15 minutes to drive from Brookfield, he would in all liklihood have been there at some time in his life due to his Scouts connection, and one would have to drive through the hot zone to get to it from his home, where mobile could have been thrown into the little creek at the centre of hot zone. His mobile phone info for that day would be interesting - especially the pings Ms G Norris referrred to.

Is this the Scout camp where they believe she may have been left? The description sounds spot on.

It is amazing how a few of the posters here suggested the Scout Camp/Mt Crosby/Kholo Creek, earlier in the search. If the killer was looking at this forum at that time, I wonder how they felt when they saw those posts.......

 

[marlywings]

His story has been consistent from the start regarding the evening which was that he went to bed around 10pm and she was watching tv, it's the media that has reported different versions of this.

"His story" may very well have been consistent but at end of day it's still only "his story". He'd been cheating on his wife I would be very hestitant to believe it.

I'm not sure if it's already been mentioned on here but if Allison was supposedly just watching tv, why would she be wearing running shoes??

 

[cluciano63]

I read somewhere today that the police where given specific information about where to find Allison's mobile phone. I can't remember if it was the Courier Mail but the language used was very careful. Something like "directed to a location where they would find the mobile phone". Does anyone know by whom the police were directed by? Later that day GBC engages a Barister.
I have a feeling, his legal team are negotiating charges with the police. Remember Elisa Baker, LE knew it was her, and were getting close but not close enough for Murder 1, so her legal team negotiated Murder 2 in exchange for vital information about the whereabouts of Zahra's remains.

Has it been declared that she was murdered? I thought I read that there were no signs of foul play...in which case, I can't see anyone admitting to anything. JMO

 

[crissyz]

"I'm not sure if it's already been mentioned on here but if Allison was supposedly just watching tv, why would she be wearing running shoes??

I know people that wear running shoes around the house. especially if she had a busy evening (ruling out any fight with Gerard, just on a normal night) running around after the kids, especially on acreage, if she had of been going in and out of the house etc. I think its quite normal personally.

 

[Myserty64]

Well, some very interesting 'inside' information it seems.

The investigation appears to be progressing quite well under the circumstances. Not knowing where the crime scene is makes things a tad difficult.
As in all investigations the police are holding back information only the perpetrator will know.

 

[BrisbaneGirl]

Is this the Scout camp where they believe she may have been left? The description sounds spot on.

It is amazing how a few of the posters here suggested the Scout Camp/Mt Crosby/Kholo Creek, earlier in the search. If the killer was looking at this forum at that time, I wonder how they felt when they saw those posts.......

It goes back to why police did not set up smaller search parties concurrent with the hot zoe search, keeping in mind the forecasted rain as well as being aware of the scout connections, they could of easily assembled small parties of locals accompanied by 1 or 2 police just to at least search for Allison , they would have known from the beginning they were looking for a body. They should have made a widespread immediate search of all waterways within say a 30 minute drive and with the widespread media coverage it would haev been very easy to assemble an appropriate searchparty. Of course after she was found then the forensics take over and the detailed search for evidence, but the main thing is locating the body as soon as possible before too much exposure to the eliments. I just don't understand this and I can't see why this was not doe especially seeing all the locals are more than willing to offer as much help as possible and they have proved this on this forum as well as others. I was saying to my husband and my family, they need to search the waterways within a drive as he would not of been digging at night, too much mess to conceal, and he would at least try to get some distance from his house, " he covert what he know" they should be checking aroud all local scout and camoing grounds as that is what would of sprung to mind when under duress and not able to think calmly and rationally.
Anyone who can shed light on why they did not expand as well as take in mind the heavy rains and possibility of water relocating a body with the current flow? I just can't understand it!!

 

[laserdisc10]

What's the motive and who had motive?

As far as I'm aware, neither the police nor media has intimated Allison was involved with someone who may have had motive, i.e., jealousy. And as others have already said, there have been no warnings from police or anyone else concerning an opportunistic killer at large

From media reports, it seems Allison's remains were fully clothed, which to most would rule out opportunistic rapist-killer

Yet she was killed. Someone was motivated to kill her and conceal her body in order they could remain at liberty

Finger seems to point at only one person - who in turn may have been assisted by one or more others in concealment of the body

Anyone who could continue eating, showering, driving, phoning etc. as the body of a decent woman & mother was rotting alone, uncherished, unprotected and defiled by the elements on a lonely river bank and while dozens of people were dedicating their time and energy to locating her --- deserves to die screaming, imo

 

[laserdisc10]

Has it been declared that she was murdered? I thought I read that there were no signs of foul play...in which case, I can't see anyone admitting to anything. JMO

Haven't the police declared it a criminal homicide ? This alone signifies it's a murder, doesn't it ? Maybe not? Would seem so to me, though

 

[laserdisc10]

It goes back to why police did not set up smaller search parties concurrent with the hot zoe search, keeping in mind the forecasted rain as well as being aware of the scout connections, they could of easily assembled small parties of locals accompanied by 1 or 2 police just to at least search for Allison , they would have known from the beginning they were looking for a body. They should have made a widespread immediate search of all waterways within say a 30 minute drive and with the widespread media coverage it would haev been very easy to assemble an appropriate searchparty. Of course after she was found then the forensics take over and the detailed search for evidence, but the main thing is locating the body as soon as possible before too much exposure to the eliments. I just don't understand this and I can't see why this was not doe especially seeing all the locals are more than willing to offer as much help as possible and they have proved this on this forum as well as others. I was saying to my husband and my family, they need to search the waterways within a drive as he would not of been digging at night, too much mess to conceal, and he would at least try to get some distance from his house, " he covert what he know" they should be checking aroud all local scout and camoing grounds as that is what would of sprung to mind when under duress and not able to think calmly and rationally.
Anyone who can shed light on why they did not expand as well as take in mind the heavy rains and possibility of water relocating a body with the current flow? I just can't understand it!!

A lot of people may comment on your post in the vein of, ' It's fine to be wise after the fact ', etc

but what you're written certainly has me thinking ....

A case of being seen to be doing everything by the book? When of course, every hour that passed would have rendered the physical remains & evidence more degraded? After 11 days ....

 

[BrisbaneGirl]

I know people that wear running shoes around the house. especially if she had a busy evening (ruling out any fight with Gerard, just on a normal night) running around after the kids, especially on acreage, if she had of been going in and out of the house etc. I think its quite normal personally.

As a Mum of same aged children I can assure you that at 10pm at night the kids have bene in bed for 2 hours, the last thing I would be doing would be watching TV in my running shoes. If I was relaxing watching TV on a thrusday night after feeding everyone, cleaning up, preparing for the next day, I would be in my PJ's and possibly nursing a glass of wine looking forward to the last day of the week before the weekend. Does anyone know if the house was left in state that a normal house would be left in at that time of night with young kids.
The reason I ask is, if she regularly went for a walk at 6am, then she sounds like an organised person who would have had everything prepared for the next day for the kids ( uniforms laid out,bags ready, possibly table set for breakfast or schoolluch containers out ready , maybe lunches pre made in the fridge, washing done etc.
If she was watching TV at 10pm then all this would have been done, anyone know if the police checked for all this or photographed the house first thing to go back and look over this, speak to her parents to ask her routines, Mothers ALWAYS know their daughters ormal routines as quite often they are called in to help. If the house looked like nothing has been done then there is another clue at least. Forensics will be able to tell what was in her stomach, did she eat dinner, WHat did the husband say about the meal that night? Had she had a shower prior to going out? Does anyone know if the children have been interviewed? It is crucial with children to do this straight away before they forget or before they have a different version implanted. So many questions!

 

[laserdisc10]

As a Mum of same aged children I can assure you that at 10pm at night the kids have bene in bed for 2 hours, the last thing I would be doing would be watching TV in my running shoes. If I was relaxing watching TV on a thrusday night after feeding everyone, cleaning up, preparing for the next day, I would be in my PJ's and possibly nursing a glass of wine looking forward to the last day of the week before the weekend. Does anyone know if the house was left in state that a normal house would be left in at that time of night with young kids.
The reason I ask is, if she regularly went for a walk at 6am, then she sounds like an organised person who would have had everything prepared for the next day for the kids ( uniforms laid out,bags ready, possibly table set for breakfast or schoolluch containers out ready , maybe lunches pre made in the fridge, washing done etc.
If she was watching TV at 10pm then all this would have been done, anyone know if the police checked for all this or photographed the house first thing to go back and look over this, speak to her parents to ask her routines, Mothers ALWAYS know their daughters ormal routines as quite often they are called in to help. If the house looked like nothing has been done then there is another clue at least. Forensics will be able to tell what was in her stomach, did she eat dinner, WHat did the husband say about the meal that night? Had she had a shower prior to going out? Does anyone know if the children have been interviewed? It is crucial with children to do this straight away before they forget or before they have a different version implanted. So many questions!

Excellent post (supposed to be a thumbs-up smilie here)

 

[BrisbaneGirl]

A lot of people may comment on your post in the vein of, ' It's fine to be wise after the fact ', etc

but what you're written certainly has me thinking ....

A case of being seen to be doing everything by the book? When of course, every hour that passed would have rendered the physical remains & evidence more degraded? After 11 days ....

I certainly hope I have not come across as being an after the fact told you so, apologies if I have, most certainly not my intention, just still shaking my head at how the whole police force could not have conducted multiple searches as the same time.
Im not experienced in police work abviously and I mean no disrespect, but even my husband and my mother were saying the same thing so it appears a heck of a lot of people on here as well were offering search suggestions,just wondering why

 

[barrosa]

A very interesting forum. Could we see him point the finger? If there was an accomplice I hope they have hired a lawyer he is very clever.

 

[marlywings]

I think the areas they were searching in, the hot zone/blue/red zones were because of the signals received from her mobile. Once they'd thoroughly searched those areas it was going to be expanded.

 

[laserdisc10]

I certainly hope I have not come across as being an after the fact told you so, apologies if I have, most certainly not my intention, just still shaking my head at how the whole police force could not have conducted multiple searches as the same time.
Im not experienced in police work abviously and I mean no disrespect, but even my husband and my mother were saying the same thing so it appears a heck of a lot of people on here as well were offering search suggestions,just wondering why

No, no. Not what I meant at all. Imo, your post is the product of a practical and analytical mind. It raises points which now seem obvious, in retrospect

I shouldn't have spoken. All I meant was, it's often the case in fora that when someone points out the obvious, some respond by saying 'it's all very well to say this or that in retrospect ' etc.

You haven't offended me in the least. What you wrote got me thinking, as I said. May well be that it has the same effect on others

Forget I spoke, lol

 

[cluciano63]

Haven't the police declared it a criminal homicide ? This alone signifies it's a murder, doesn't it ? Maybe not? Would seem so to me, though

If so, then never mind...I did not see that.

 

[Liadan]

The Brisbane Times is mentioning that Sim card and possibly 'drag' marks near the site of the dumping.

Unfortunately I don't think the information from here on in will be very forthcoming. A barrister to scare the be-jesus out of the media making any sort of statements to the public and the police shutting down ranks to prevent leaks - things will move slowly from here on in.

This was an interesting article tho - apologies if someone has previously posted!
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...hland-for-badenclay-clues-20120502-1xxvn.html

 

[Hillsdon]

Considering the circumstances (imminent business collapse, exit as head of Chamber of Commerce, rumours of affair, etc.) had ABC decided to take the children and leave ? After all, she was very accomplished, popular, well-regarded & respected and only 43 years old. She could have embarked on a new career now the children were in school and could have supported herself and her children - forged a new and happier life for them

Was she in the process of packing her own and children's belongings when a violent argument erupted? Were her symbols of independence -- her phone and car keys -- taken from her, preventing her from calling help or escaping?

I agree laserdisc10, sounds like you are on the right track.

Plus there is a supposed history of aggression in the marriage.

Then she is killed, by mistake or not, with screams, as heard by neighbours. He then calls the girlfriend, she comes over and cleans up the house (although not well enough as there is something about the house that makes the police act so quickly with the widescale search).

He takes ABC in the boot of the white car out to Scout camp/Kholo Creek, quickly dumps the body and speeds back home to get the story straight. On the way home, remembers the mobile in his pocket and chucks it out the car window (locals say that the car was seen driving erractically down Brookfield rd at 11pm) Madly texts on the way home, where has she gone, left home in walking gear etc. Calms down and plans his response to the many questions that are going to be asked tomorrow.

Friday morning; Waits till the kids ask why she isnt back from her normal morning walk, then calls the police.

Just a theory ... lets hope that her family get justice sooner rather than later.

 

[BrisbaneGirl]

No, no. Not what I meant at all. Imo, your post is the product of a practical and analytical mind. It raises points which now seem obvious, in retrospect

I shouldn't have spoken. All I meant was, it's often the case in fora that when someone points out the obvious, some respond by saying 'it's all very well to say this or that in retrospect ' etc.

You haven't offended me in the least. What you wrote got me thinking, as I said. May well be that it has the same effect on others

Forget I spoke, lol

I have not explained properly, I understand your response was being mindful that other may say this, and my undestanding was that you were on my line of thinking, I posted that reply in light if others who may read my post and confuse it so I thought I best just clear it up as I am mindful there are a lot of people deeply affected and I wan tot make sure that I don't offend anyone, don't be sorry you spoke, it was a supportive reply, sorry if my rushed typing came across as otherwise, all good here, and thakyou for your supportive post

 

[BrisbaneGirl]

Laserdisc10 , Sorry, I have not explained properly, I understand your response was being mindful that other may say this, and my undestanding was that you were on my line of thinking, I posted that reply in light if others who may read my post and confuse it so I thought I best just clear it up as I am mindful there are a lot of people deeply affected and I wan tot make sure that I don't offend anyone, don't be sorry you spoke, it was a supportive reply, sorry if my rushed typing came across as otherwise, all good here, and thakyou for your supportive post