Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 - #13

[ellou]

Nice review re Interview from Doc Watson on Aussie crims, I hope im not TOS violating here but if I am Ill catch ya in a few days!!! cheers

http://aussiecriminals.com.au/2012/...-under-pressure/comment-page-3/#comment-28691


Doc Watson says:
May 25, 2012 at 5:41 am


Watching the Gerbil Clay interview just now did it for me yet again … Every alarm bell in the world goes off … And the poor young crime reporter (Alyshia Gates) seemed to be buying it too … This will go down as one of the most self-incriminating performances in the history of Australian crime. No wonder there has been no repeat interviews.

Every single tell-tale sign of lies & deceit was there for us all to see and hear.

In case you have lost the link to the YouTube video that Robbo created:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c76CI6vtixI

Transcript (my observations/comments in brackets)

Gerbil Clay:
“I’m trying to look after my children at the moment” (gesticulates with hands in a very peculiar way)
“I’ve got three young girls and …” (looks down pausing, stalling, desperately thinking of what to say next)
“We” (smacks his lips, again looks down unable to face the reporter)
“We really trust that the Police are doing everything they CAN (pulling incredible forced facial expressions) to find my wife and …” (big breath, swallow, licks his lips)
“We just hope that she will … (voice cracking) COME home soon” (choke, gulp, feigned distress).

Gerbil Clay:
“I’ve spoken to the Police about everything … and” (shaking his head side to side, obviously subconsciously realizing his own BS, furtively looks up, with right eyebrow raised, at Alyshia to see if she is buying it (she is) tries to think ahead because his biggest line of deceit is coming … Then looks down:
“I’ve, I’ve had no contact from her at all” (another quick look at reporter to see if she is duped)
(This last statement is true, because it is hard to contact someone when you are dead and held underwater with chains)

Alyshia Gates:
“Was she upset before she went away?”

Gerbil Clay:
“Nooo …” (again shaking head from side to side in subconscious disagreement with his incongruous lying words) and immediately rushes on, without even drawing breath with:
“And, and, the Police, I’ve tried to help the Police as much as I can” (still madly shaking his head from side to side, the classic give-away – this is lie spotting 101 right here)
“We all have” (head shaking side to side)
“With everything we’ve got” (still shaking head from side to side … didn’t Realty School teach him)
“So … Thank you (tearingly)… I’m sorry”
(You had already answered this issue … The question was: was she upset before she left home? She was upset, very upset, women usually are when violently accosted and murdered by a lying cheating cowardly mongrel husband such as you)

Gerbil Clay (regarding the car crash):
“Oh was hurt a little bit … voice fading away … but I’m OK” (here he nods his head to the “I’m OK” bit – which is most definitely a true statement … He is very clearly OK.
(This Is the final straw … I would convict him just on that alone. I am almost serious).

Gerbil Clay:
“We’ve got such great family support”
“My sister, and my family here”
“And they’re looking after ….” looks down, chokes sobs unable to continue … (his family support obviously meaning so much more than his missing wife/mother of his kids).

Scouts honour, this interview does not need any any trained expert in body language to interpret subtle micro-gestures … Gerbil’s lying words and blatant deceit now on the public record – set in stone, not to be washed away like a bit of clay sprinkled on concrete !! ;-)

I am covinced you are right. Igoogled it....GBC certainly is showing all the signs of a liar. The no movement, with the head ,thats a subconscious movement as they don't believe what they are saying .Lacking eye contact.Licking of lips is a strong sign, not using hands alot, ,the leaning back thing.little physical movement.It says if someone displays three or four of these they are probaply telling a porker.Yet again every one deals with grief and emotions differently..I'm not sure if Ihave already mentioned this,sorry if I have.....We need too remember,Lindy Chamberlain....Society had her guilty,due to lack of emotion..I'm trying too keep an open mind..All you super slueths,keep up the good work,Iam a beginner.Cheers

 

[True]

Allison was human and was probably quick to anger at times, like the other 95% of the population. The other 5% are budist monks.

 

[minni]

Hi everyone
I have been following these threads with interests since day one but have only registered today, and I hope that the following is both 'logical and rational'

In the first few threads there was a big emphasis on the search, what happened in house, finding the body and also GBCs behaviour and of course the movement of the cars. In the last few threads there have been some new angles, maybe dinner after the hairdressers, the chain theory, and new thoughts to where the body may have been dumped. I have been turning it over in my head for the last few days but what if you try to put them together in some kind of sequence;
GBCS goes to chemist in morning, may or may not attend Kenmore CC meeting, both parents attend the school running, Allison goes to hairdresser, kids have been arranged for sleepover and A and G agreed to meet for dinner to have discussion. A wants out, G is in bad mood because card got refused at Coles. They have argument over dinner, A walks out (to pick her car up at shopping centre) G is furious follows he. Kills her and dumps body in industrial bin, not many people around he did it quickly whilst she is in car. He goes home punches walls in frustration and panick, realisesher phone is still there etc. Rings Nigelaine 'help, help I finally killed her'. They get one of his friends to go out with him, one of them picks up A s car, two of them drive to Wirrabara road and dump body in Ugly Creek, weight down with chains taken from Coles car park'

Just my thoughts, would welcome any views etc

this is a very good theory, and it is IMO as possible as many others said, and more so than quite a few. I am still wondering about the weight of the coles chains.....does anyone know just how big they are? does anyone know how heavy they would need to be to weigh an average sized body down and submerge it?

I have another question in relation to the garden shed. What could have been identified as odd at GBC house that morning that might encourage police to search the garden shed at NBC house? any ideas

 

[UnfoldingTruth]

But does it really matter if she was an angel or not, Im sure she was to her parents and her kids and she had friends and family that loved her and now miss her and would do anything to have her back.

she didn't deserve to be murdered because she wasn't an angel or wasn't a goody two shoes....

when you say.

1. Allison was not the goodie two shoes she is being made to be.

it seems like you are trying to find things to justify why something happened to her and shift the blame???

am I misinterpreting your intentions???

I don't really think thats what true was saying. And I agree, to her family she was all those things you say. Nobody deserves to be murdered, no matter what. (And might I add, I think it can be a touchy subject when talking of the dead particulalry somone brutally murdered.) However, it may be relevant to add new light to the theories or to the case if there was factually something Allison was mixed up in that led to her death. Not saying there is, but it may also put doubt on whether the husband was or wasn't involved.

 

[Greg]

yes you are totally misinterpreting what I said, nothing justifies what has happened. I am merely stating what I was told.

Have you ever heard the "Chasers" song - "Everyone is a top bloke after death" it is very true.

I think Allison was a normal person, we all have a good and bad persona. What you consider wrong may not be what I consider wrong. The newspapers have painted a portrait, and some people who knew the lady are saying it is not correct.

but whats it matter if its not correct?? does it affect the investigation into her murder??? why not let the people who have happy thoughts about her keep those thoughts with them after she has gone....

I think its selfish, unless its relevant to the case it shouldn't be on the tip of your tongue as to the first thing you want to blurt out......

 

[UnfoldingTruth]

this is a very good theory, and it is IMO as possible as many others said, and more so than quite a few. I am still wondering about the weight of the coles chains.....does anyone know just how big they are? does anyone know how heavy they would need to be to weigh an average sized body down and submerge it?

I have another question in relation to the garden shed. What could have been identified as odd at GBC house that morning that might encourage police to search the garden shed at NBC house? any ideas

I've never actually seen/heard the garden shed being searched, other than on here someone mentioned. So I am not sure its fact. I have been back and looked at articles and I saw one that said the detectves went to GBC seniors house and seized clothes a laptop and something else I think, but no mention of the shed. Gee would have to go search for the link though.

 

[willough]

But does it really matter if she was an angel or not, Im sure she was to her parents and her kids and she had friends and family that loved her and now miss her and would do anything to have her back.

she didn't deserve to be murdered because she wasn't an angel or wasn't a goody two shoes....

when you say.

1. Allison was not the goodie two shoes she is being made to be.

it seems like you are trying to find things to justify why something happened to her and shift the blame???

am I misinterpreting your intentions???

I cant believe you even said that. Informing a forum that someone isnt an angel, isnt advocating murder.

 

[Greg]

I cant believe you even said that. Informing a forum that someone isnt an angel, isnt advocating murder.

no it isnt willough but its tainting someones character with no relevance to whats happened or evidence just heresay that someones not a goody two shoes.....

a bit distasteful IMO...

Ill drop it anyway the rest of sprats news pretty much mirrored whats been said on here already.

 

[Logic27]

I've never actually seen/heard the garden shed being searched, other than on here someone mentioned. So I am not sure its fact. I have been back and looked at articles and I saw one that said the detectves went to GBC seniors house and seized clothes a laptop and something else I think, but no mention of the shed. Gee would have to go search for the link though.

I think in one of the courier mail articles there was mention that some garage items and some from the shed were seized. Would you need heavy duty bolt cutters to get those chains or do they just unhook?

 

[spratsmum]

this is a very good theory, and it is IMO as possible as many others said, and more so than quite a few. I am still wondering about the weight of the coles chains.....does anyone know just how big they are? does anyone know how heavy they would need to be to weigh an average sized body down and submerge it?

I have another question in relation to the garden shed. What could have been identified as odd at GBC house that morning that might encourage police to search the garden shed at NBC house? any ideas

do you realise how heavy a dead body is? I don't think you would be lumping it in and out of industrial bins to easily.

I think the first part of your theory is great thoug.

 

[CaseClosed]

Hi everyone
I have been following these threads with interests since day one but have only registered today, and I hope that the following is both 'logical and rational'

In the first few threads there was a big emphasis on the search, what happened in house, finding the body and also GBCs behaviour and of course the movement of the cars. In the last few threads there have been some new angles, maybe dinner after the hairdressers, the chain theory, and new thoughts to where the body may have been dumped. I have been turning it over in my head for the last few days but what if you try to put them together in some kind of sequence;
GBCS goes to chemist in morning, may or may not attend Kenmore CC meeting, both parents attend the school running, Allison goes to hairdresser, kids have been arranged for sleepover and A and G agreed to meet for dinner to have discussion. A wants out, G is in bad mood because card got refused at Coles. They have argument over dinner, A walks out (to pick her car up at shopping centre) G is furious follows he. Kills her and dumps body in industrial bin, not many people around he did it quickly whilst she is in car. He goes home punches walls in frustration and panick, realizes her phone is still there etc. Rings Nigelaine 'help, help I finally killed her'. They get one of his friends to go out with him, one of them picks up A s car, two of them drive to Wirrabara road and dump body in Ugly Creek, weight down with chains taken from Coles car park'

Just my thoughts, would welcome any views etc

Industrial bins are very deep. IMO it would have been quite difficult for one person to pick up dead weight of about 55 kgs and throw it in the bin, and then also get it out of the bin later. It would be easier to just leave her concealed inside the car. I believe she was murdered at home.

 

[spratsmum]

no it isnt willough but its tainting someones character with no relevance to whats happened or evidence just heresay that someones not a goody two shoes.....

a bit distasteful IMO...

Ill drop it anyway the rest of sprats news pretty much mirrored whats been said on here already.

I don't think we should take the high moral ground about tainting peoples character - I think we have been guilty of that on this website on more than a few occasions!!

 

[UnfoldingTruth]

I think in one of the courier mail articles there was mention that some garage items and some from the shed were seized. Would you need heavy duty bolt cutters to get those chains or do they just unhook?

you read my mind about bolt cutters. but as I said I haven't seen it reported. the article I was referring to was CM also. maybe I missed it.

 

[True]

But does it really matter if she was an angel or not, Im sure she was to her parents and her kids and she had friends and family that loved her and now miss her and would do anything to have her back.

she didn't deserve to be murdered because she wasn't an angel or wasn't a goody two shoes....

when you say.

1. Allison was not the goodie two shoes she is being made to be.

it seems like you are trying to find things to justify why something happened to her and shift the blame???

am I misinterpreting your intentions???

Yes Greg, youre misinterpreting. I NEVER said she deserved to be murdered. I am just trying to understand how it came about. Did she stand up to him, have her own issues and it blew up close to the house, or even in the house (as I think it did). Or did she walk away and go for a walk to cool off and he followed her? In other words, was it a viscous face to face fight near the children, in which there would be defense wounds, and the children could have heard the commotion. Or did he follow her and attack her viciously, but being surprised never thinking he was capable of it, didn't fight as hard as she could? Leaving less defense wounds and the children hearing nothing. So much depends on what type of person she was.

I think a lot of posters here prefer to picture her as a graceful ballerina, privately schooled princess, and perfect mother, that butter wouldnt melt in her mouth. She's not mother Teresa, she's a human being. Its like an airbrushed image and you guys can't get it out of your heads.

 

[CaseClosed]

this is a very good theory, and it is IMO as possible as many others said, and more so than quite a few. I am still wondering about the weight of the coles chains.....does anyone know just how big they are? does anyone know how heavy they would need to be to weigh an average sized body down and submerge it?

I have another question in relation to the garden shed. What could have been identified as odd at GBC house that morning that might encourage police to search the garden shed at NBC house? any ideas

I don't know the area, but standard access driveways (2 way) for any carpark must be at least 6 metres wide, if not more. Add a bit on each side and I would estimate the chain being at least 7 meters long. Chains are heavy because they are solid links (not hollow) and I guess it would weigh at least 10-15 kgs (guessing, as it depends on the gauge of the chain). The chain may have been used to attach something else to her body, not just the chain itself.

 

[minni]

But does it really matter if she was an angel or not, Im sure she was to her parents and her kids and she had friends and family that loved her and now miss her and would do anything to have her back.

she didn't deserve to be murdered because she wasn't an angel or wasn't a goody two shoes....

when you say.

1. Allison was not the goodie two shoes she is being made to be.

it seems like you are trying to find things to justify why something happened to her and shift the blame???

am I misinterpreting your intentions???

I took Spratsmum to only be repeating some alleged information to the best of her ability but not making her own assumptions just relaying what she was told. And I agree with you wholeheartedly, it doesnt matter what type of person she was, or what faults she may have had.

the blame here lies 100% with the rotten *advertiser censored*/s who took her life.

Its been a sore point with many users here whenever someone had hinted at any theory other than one involving GBC being a violent, womanising, cheating, . I think IMO that it is highly likely Allison was angry at her husband...I ask you, who wouldnt be? I would be going off my NUT in frustration and hurt and anger if even HALF of the things claimed here are true.
So rather than focusing on the 'Angel Allison' image or the new, latest, 'Naughty Allison' image it might be wise to try and focus less on what which one she was, and accept that she was just a typical loving mum, friend, neighbour, wife and woman. And maybe to accept that thinks go haywire for good people as well as bad.

 

[UnfoldingTruth]

no it isnt willough but its tainting someones character with no relevance to whats happened or evidence just heresay that someones not a goody two shoes.....

a bit distasteful IMO...

Ill drop it anyway the rest of sprats news pretty much mirrored whats been said on here already.

Can I just say, And not wanting to get into an arguement at all. I think theres been a bit of the character tainting has been done by posters throught this topic on other members of the family involved in the case. Not factual, but often based on hearsay or interpretations.

For the purposes of sleuthing it could be relevant to know ther may be other things going on that open up new theories. I agree we have to be careful on that too though. I don't think Spratsmum meant any harm.

 

[CaseClosed]

I've never actually seen/heard the garden shed being searched, other than on here someone mentioned. So I am not sure its fact. I have been back and looked at articles and I saw one that said the detectves went to GBC seniors house and seized clothes a laptop and something else I think, but no mention of the shed. Gee would have to go search for the link though.

I have heard about the shed being search in the evening news on TV the day the house was searched.

 

[Logic27]

Industrial bins are very deep. IMO it would have been quite difficult for one person to pick up dead weight of about 55 kgs and throw it in the bin, and then also get it out of the bin later. It would be easier to just leave her concealed inside the car. I believe she was murdered at home.

I agree but maybe with two or three people that would not be so hard. For some reason I cannot get out of my mind that news clip that showed the two blue industrial bins in the car park near the chains.

I accept that she may have been killed either in her car or at home. IMO not at home would fit the Gerbyls rational for ringing and saying she had been either asleep or was walking better, as he knew that police would eventually search the home. If you put that together with some views previously espoused ie that he had intended to 'do away' with Allison at some stage (later) but that the opportunity presented itself he would have thought through the fact that home is not a good place because of evidence. With crimes of passion yes, crimes of revenge or for personal benefit I personally think he would have thought to do it somewhere else.

 

[ellou]

No! If every man or woman who had an illicit affair became a murderer..there might only be adulterers and murderers left!

However, a relationship triangle (not gonna call it love) and jealousy is top of the list for motivation to murder. Definitely not the only motive though.

The Maria Korp case is a good example. Maria's husband ultimately committed suicide (good riddance) and his mistress is in jail for a long time for causing Maria's drawn out death. Took her a while but she eventually realized she'd been duped. Too late for Maria unfortunately.

My point is however that if GBC faces a trial - his affair will be used in his defence and you've just proved how that will work to create reasonable doubt.

Good point