Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 #19

[Fuskier]

I have been wondering just who the police have interviewed that was known to Allison. We know they have interviewed people close to GBC, but we have not been privy to any people close to her that have been questioned. I brought it up yesterday because, in all the shows and books etc that I read and watch on true crime, the detectives ALWAYS interview everyone close to the victim, and closely examine her life in the week or weeks prior to her death. No one has mentioned any friends of hers or acquaintances that have been interviewed, but that doesn't mean it hasn't happened

Exactly. IMO most interviewees would have been directed not to talk about Police business. This seems to be usual procedure during a Police Investigation.

 

[jubillee]

I have to say that if all men who had affairs killed their wives there would not be too many women left

 

[loveandlite2012]

If 2-3 days ago I would give 50/50 chance that GBC is the perp, today I would give 95% that he is not the one. My suspicion about him was mainly because I never believed that Allison went for walk at 10pm. My current theory is, that it's possible that Allison told him that she was going for walk, but in actual fact she simply went out to see someone, for a quick chat. Perhaps, to tell them off, once again. It is not uncommon when a woman resorts to a brief affair when her husband is cheating on her. May be that what happened some time ago, and that guy did not take No for an answer. That could explain why Allison was so far from home and that could explain screams. It had to be somebody really angry. With GBC, Allison would be more in control - she could afford to be angry at her own husband as he deserved that. But not with a stranger - it sounds more like fear. To prove this theory, one needs info about Allison's incoming calls and texts. Interesting if the police can request from all telephone companies to provide info about calls to a specific number. As for GBC, he could have suspected that Allison could (if not should) have an affair because he's had one. May be he did not believe that Allison went for a true walk either, and that's why he called the police in the morning.

With the two cars allegedly seen at 4am, it could be unrelated, or it could be deliberate to mislead the police. It depends on who the witness is.

I was also thinking about randomness of the attack, like if Allison indeed went for walk, just near the house, and somebody stopped and asked for directions, and they could simply snatch her. Or, if it was somebody from the neighborhood, somebody known to Allison, who asked her for some favour and lured her into a trap. While this is, in theory, possible, it is less likely. All IMO.

None of that rings true to me. <modsnip>?

 

[LauraMars]

There is an interesting case being heard in NZ at the moment. The victim was killed by a shotgun sometime in 2010 (July I think). The way in which it was reported in the media was that it was a real whodunnit and police didn't not seem to have much to go on. A lot of calls were made for help from the public in terms of providing information about certain things, amongst them the whereabouts of some puppies that had gone missing from the victim's shed on the morning of the killing. Anyway, the point of bringing this up is that an arrest wasn't made until 9 months after the killing, and the person charged was his brother-in-law (married to the victim's sister). The prosecution are alleging his motive had to do with conflict and rivalry over the running of the farm they were both involved in (which belonged to the victim's father) and that the accused felt he was being pushed out of the operation by the victim. The accused denies the murder but admits vandalising some property belonging to the victim in an attempt to drive him and his wife from the area. The interesting thing, I think, in relation to Baden-Clay case, is that there was no whisper of any of this in the mainstream media prior to his arrest. So for nine months there was no speculation or suspicion that the general public were aware of about the accused (but that's not to say that there was no local gossip but whatever there was it wasn't readily accessible in any fora that I am aware of). He was a pallbearer at the victim's funeral and was photographed and filmed a number of times when the family were interviewed. The trial is ongoing so there is no outcome on his guilt or innocence but based on the evidence we have heard so far one would have to imagine that the police and family were suspicious of him from the outset. It may be that there will be a similarly long wait for an arrest in the Baden-Clay case, regardless of whether GBC is involved or not.

I remember reading a few news articles on this case Sheldor, but I was under the impression that the police had the brother in law as prime suspect in the early days, and interviewed him quite early on in the scene. I thought they arrested him sooner than 9 months later too, but I could be wrong there sorry.

I am sure it is the same case I am thinking of though, North Island farmers?

 

[Nads]

I assume it was the parents laptop? I don't think there is any reason to think otherwise? Gbc's would have been left at his house, but this was clearly a raid of the seniors' house. I think at first it was assumed the raid took place because GBC was staying there, but I no longer think that. I believe it was a raid of the BC seniors' house and belongings, and 6 bags of evidence were taken away along with the laptop and hard drive. All belonging to the BC seniors.

But then GBC had to go to the cop shop later to get photos of Allison off a computer for the funeral. Doubt it would be the in-law's computer where the photos were. Perhaps Allison's though.

 

[itsthevibe]

I assume it was the parents laptop? I don't think there is any reason to think otherwise? Gbc's would have been left at his house, but this was clearly a raid of the seniors' house. I think at first it was assumed the raid took place because GBC was staying there, but I no longer think that. I believe it was a raid of the BC seniors' house and belongings, and 6 bags of evidence were taken away along with the laptop and hard drive. All belonging to the BC seniors.

Yes, and now to add to it there is my snippet that one of those bags could be a vacuum cleaner dust bag, which NBC refused to give up unless there was a warrant. (unverified rumour at this stage though).

I find the search of the senior BC's house interesting as it seems it was so comprehensive. I feel the police must feel NBC or that family were significantly involved. Did they do a comprehensive search of TM's house? Maybe, maybe not, but it wasn't reported which seems strange if it did happen.

But someone asked the question last night - have the BC seniors lawyered up? Good question that I'd like to know the answer to. There has also been no reporting on extensive or repeated questioning of the BC seniors as there has with TM. Not sure if this is because it didnt happen, or that it just isnt being reported for some reason.

 

[Fuskier]

Hi Everyone
Its ages since I&#8217;ve posted due to study/ work commitments but try and keep following the threads as best I can without skipping. By the time I&#8217;ve caught up then there&#8217;s not enough time to post&#8230;somebody else said this recently. Also got quite frustrated about three days ago after spending a while writing a response it got LOST???
&#8230;something to do with being logged out just at the same time I pressed post I think.

Anyway just a couple of things:

1. As far as I know nobody has discussed this and it might be media mis-reporting but, then again, there has been so much that has been suppressed that could be a reason for it not appearing anywhere. Has anyone remembered this way back from Thread 1? ( the CM do not necessarily have the only reporters following this case).
&#8220;Allison Baden-Clay, 43, was last seen a week ago walking along Brookfield Road in Brisbane&#8217;s west. Her husband, real estate agent Gerard Baden-Clay, reported her missing the next morning.&#8221;

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/queensland/house-searched-for-missing-mum-clues-20120425-1xk24.html

It has apparently been established that there was definitely an argument on the Thursday night. Allison may have stormed off after the Police had left if they were called actually called out.
2. It has been assumed that one of the reasons GBC may be guilty is because he didn&#8217;t help search. Perhaps that is what he and NBC were doing that night &#8230;coming and going of cars etc. Looking fo Allison. Which ones who knows??? Somebody has mentioned that NBC may have been a spotter maybe not for the reasons assumed.
3. This explains the reason for lawyering up because of the GBC being a natural suspect.
4. If Allison walked/ran off into the night perhaps she was picked up after a chance meeting with somebody she knew who lives nearby seeing she was upset OR perhaps she rang somebody who she knew. IMO this doesn&#8217;t need to imply that the BC&#8217;s are the guilty parties because the police may have a suspect in mind but others may be covering for that person.
5. The screams have never been explained. Perhaps the person tried to comfort Allison in the wrong way and she felt taken advantage of&#8230; Perhaps she ran off again then who knows &#8230;this person may have accidentally hit Allison with the small blue 4WD??? Killed her some other way and panicked? Or not???.
6. The missing phone and the hotspot. The phone may have been planted later near the GBC home to deflect the police. http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...urbs-of-brisbane/story-e6freoof-1226338302828
7. EBC probably was at the BC&#8217;s home with the kids that night while all this was going on.
Just My Opinion

with respect, under Australian Law a person is considered innocent until proven guilty. Therefore GBC is considered innocent. It is odd that he has hired himself a legal eagle Criminal Lawyer whilst considered innocent - which leads many of the public to be suspicious of his motives for doing so. Further, the Police searched the B-C seniors home and shed. They removed several items. All reported in MSM. So there is some basis to speculation on this forum. My opinion only, not fact.

 

[Wazzie]

Lol So cute! I have just caught up and would you believe am only just about to have dinner? That's what this place does to me.

As for my snippets, well I'd have to say these are rumours, as follows:

This one we've heard before, but I'm posting it because it may carry more weight that it's turned up again (although not necessarily)

I've been told by a friend of mine who knows the wife of one of the policeman on the case that there definitely was an argument at the BC house on the Thursday night, which was reported, and the police did attend. At that stage apparently Allison was OK, and eventually the police left. I was told that this was one of the main reasons police attended the next day and went into action so dramatically and quickly. I believe the original info someone posted was also supposed to have come from the wife of a policeman on the case, not sure if it's the same person or not, make of it what you will. I am inclined to believing it, as in my case I know my friend would not exaggerate or lie, and so unless her friend is lying then ... But you never know.

Also from the same source was that when police were doing their searches, they wanted to seize the contents of a vacuum cleaner dust bag, and NBC refused to give it to them if they didn't have a search warrant. (I'm assuming this was at the NBC house but I dont know for sure)

I think there might have been one other snippet of info, but for the life of me I can't remember it, or maybe there wasn't ... will let you know if I remember anything - sorry this place is wearing me out!

Now for wine and pasta!

PS This could be added to the rumour list - the first one might already be there but I'll go and check tomorrow when i've got some time and update if needed.

Perhaps, if the police did attend earlier in the night, GBC didn't have the scratch on his face, but when they attended the next morning he did?

Perhaps, as brought up by another poster (but I don't know how to quote from two posts in the one reply), if ABC did have information GBC did not want to get out - she hinted at this information to the police on their first visit hence the need to shut her up quickly???

 

[SydneySleuth]

If 2-3 days ago I would give 50/50 chance that GBC is the perp, today I would give 95% that he is not the one. My suspicion about him was mainly because I never believed that Allison went for walk at 10pm. My current theory is, that it's possible that Allison told him that she was going for walk, but in actual fact she simply went out to see someone, for a quick chat. Perhaps, to tell them off, once again. It is not uncommon when a woman resorts to a brief affair when her husband is cheating on her. May be that what happened some time ago, and that guy did not take No for an answer. That could explain why Allison was so far from home and that could explain screams. It had to be somebody really angry. With GBC, Allison would be more in control - she could afford to be angry at her own husband as he deserved that. But not with a stranger - it sounds more like fear. To prove this theory, one needs info about Allison's incoming calls and texts. Interesting if the police can request from all telephone companies to provide info about calls to a specific number. As for GBC, he could have suspected that Allison could (if not should) have an affair because he's had one. May be he did not believe that Allison went for a true walk either, and that's why he called the police in the morning.

With the two cars allegedly seen at 4am, it could be unrelated, or it could be deliberate to mislead the police. It depends on who the witness is.

I was also thinking about randomness of the attack, like if Allison indeed went for walk, just near the house, and somebody stopped and asked for directions, and they could simply snatch her. Or, if it was somebody from the neighborhood, somebody known to Allison, who asked her for some favour and lured her into a trap. While this is, in theory, possible, it is less likely. All IMO.

I believe that IF Allison did go for a walk that night then someone would have seen her walking. 10pm is very late for a woman to be out walking and I really think it would be noticed MOO. As for the randomness of an attack, didn't the police confirm that Allisons killer was known to her?

 

[pirathames]

New article on news.com.au this morning:

http://www.news.com.au/national/ger...lay-was-murdered/story-e6frfkwr-1226389597882

 

[Karo]

Allisons sister Vanessa is one of the trustees

Before making a donation, I emailed the address given with the account number published in the CM. and asked about the fund trustees. The reply was:


The trust fund has been established by the Dickie family, with Allison's brother and sister having complete control over the distribution of the funds.

As reported, the funds will be used exclusively for the welfare, care and in particular the education of Allison's three daughters.

I have removed the identifying details but can forward this to admin if required.

 

[Lyndylogic]

If this is true, then it's just horrible. I haven't seen it in the media. It's a vital piece of information. Interesting, who called the police, what was registered, etc. Having obtained such a record GBC was supposed to sit still and not move that night. It would be unthinkable if after the police'd gone he went out and committed a murder. Not impossible, but it is just hard to comprehend, IMO.

I agree. That is why I think it might have been someone else that Alison knew - either she contacted, went to see, went outside chance meeting someone she knows seeing her upset

 

[Radster]

If this is true, then it's just horrible. I haven't seen it in the media. It's a vital piece of information. Interesting, who called the police, what was registered, etc. Having obtained such a record GBC was supposed to sit still and not move that night. It would be unthinkable if after the police'd gone he went out and committed a murder. Not impossible, but it is just hard to comprehend, IMO.

I think I mentioned this way back but it again seems relevant ... a police officer friend of mine who was involved in the initial search (but not the ongoing investigation) told me that yelling and screaming (ie a fight) on the Thursday night had caused the neighbours on either side to call each other out of concern. I'm fairly sure he meant the noise was coming from the BC house and not the screams that were reportedly heard down the road. I have no way of checking anymore, sorry.

 

[Lyndylogic]

with respect, under Australian Law a person is considered innocent until proven guilty. Therefore GBC is considered innocent. It is odd that he has hired himself a top legal eagle Criminal Lawyer whilst considered innocent - which leads many of the public to be suspicious of his motives for doing so. So there is some basis to speculation on this forum. My opinion only, not fact.

I realize what you are trying to say and I certainly believe innocent until proven guilty. However a lot of comments do assume guilt already. The point i was trying to make is that if I had had an argument with my husband esp. one where the police(may) have been called and he disappeared totally out of character I would probably lawyer up too - a sensible move ESPECIALLY if I knew I was innocent and given the underlying circumstances other woman etc.

 

[coffeechick]

Perhaps, if the police did attend earlier in the night, GBC didn't have the scratch on his face, but when they attended the next morning he did?

Perhaps, as brought up by another poster (but I don't know how to quote from two posts in the one reply), if ABC did have information GBC did not want to get out - she hinted at this information to the police on their first visit hence the need to shut her up quickly???

Perhaps GBC has scratches on his face when the police arrived for the domestic so they already knew in the morning that they were done prior to her disappearance - maybe they are not important as we seem to think they are -perhaps GBC and ABC had cooled down when the police had arrived thus they left knowing that things were in hand. Perhaps ABC decided to go out for a walk or whatever - after this time while GBC went off to bed.

 

[Fuskier]

WAZZIE: It would be interesting if GBC did not have a scratch on is face the first Police visit, then did have a scratch on his face the next day.

 

[LauraMars]

I think I mentioned this way back but it again seems relevant ... a police officer friend of mine who was involved in the initial search (but not the ongoing investigation) told me that yelling and screaming (ie a fight) on the Thursday night had caused the neighbours on either side to call each other out of concern. I'm fairly sure he meant the noise was coming from the BC house and not the screams that were reportedly heard down the road. I have no way of checking anymore, sorry.

That's really interesting Radster, and understandable too. How many people might call their neighbour first if they hear something odd, before even considering calling police? Seems the people who heard the screams further down near Rafting Ground Rd might have thought the same.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing yeah?

 

[Fuskier]

Perhaps GBC has scratches on his face when the police arrived for the domestic so they already knew in the morning that they were done prior to her disappearance - maybe they are not important as we seem to think they are -perhaps GBC and ABC had cooled down when the police had arrived thus they left knowing that things were in hand. Perhaps ABC decided to go out for a walk or whatever - after this time while GBC went off to bed.

In my eyes scratches demonstrate a violent event with heightened emotions had occurred. Together with alleged screeming and yelling, the neighbours calling each other out of concern, then allegedly calling the Police out of concern about the domestic situation. It must have been one hell of a domestic, violent incident! My opinion, not fact.

 

[Nads]

IF there was a DV incident that night, or even a fight, it makes sense to me that Allison would drive off in her car, not walk or run off into a dark Brookfield night.

I'm not good at putting scenarios together, but perhaps that could explain the need for NBC to be at the bus stop. To bring Allison's car home after she died. I know that's already been said. But previously the first part was saying A had followed GBC and TM to the scout camp etc.

 

[Lyndylogic]

I think I mentioned this way back but it again seems relevant ... a police officer friend of mine who was involved in the initial search (but not the ongoing investigation) told me that yelling and screaming (ie a fight) on the Thursday night had caused the neighbours on either side to call each other out of concern. I'm fairly sure he meant the noise was coming from the BC house and not the screams that were reportedly heard down the road. I have no way of checking anymore, sorry.

Just remember very loud arguments can, and often, happen but people don't get murdered that often. From memory the other screams were reported down Rafting road near Rees Way and the (Creekside?) Park there - approx. 1.5km by walking down Boscombe and 2.2 by car down Rafting road IMO too far away to be the same incident. Don't know the links for this but Google maps show that as being the distance from Allison's house