Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 #20

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I don't know about YouTube, but I know that some of our links in the Timeline thread are no longer linking to a story = page not found.
Besides the repeat copy and past which can give incorrect links already mentioned by marlywings, I've noticed in the past, when looking for older news articles from a couple of months ago, some seem to be taken down and some not. Not sure why or how a news site determines what to take down and what to leave up for longer.

Maybe after a while, the news site shift some of their articles around to different locations on their site which then changes the link?

I lurk around in some of the other threads here and often enough encounter 'Page Not Found' (or similar wording) when clicking on news links which are no longer current.
 
There has been some discussion re: police needing to sight Allison,but some of us have wondered whether police called out may have been 'buddies' with GBC and therefore trusted him when he said 'all was fine' or words to that effect and not followed up as well as they should have. IMO

The link by Flinders states what is supposed to happen in these circumstances however, you could have a point, after all the person in question is a salesman and an upstanding member of the community. Gift of the gab comes to mind. :)

Zookyliz heard from a mate that two police cars attended that night (I posted the link in an earlier post) and I had wondered if that was the usual practice?

I don't know though, if I had to put money on it and two cars attended, I would think the police would want to sight Allison. IMO

I believe you have raised something worth considering.

Can any of the locals or people who have met GBC tell us about his salesmanship skills or social/ skills of persuasion?
 
Afternoon all..

Another longtime lurker first time poster!!!
Have been following since thread 1.

Don't have anything new to add.

I was just wondering if the SUMMER INMAN case has been discussed before?

I apologise, I would have posted a link or something but am totally new at this and my I pad.

I find it VERY interesting what lengths some parents will go to in order to help/protect their children!!! What do other posters think. Like I said sorry if this has been previously discussed maybe someone could point me in the direction of the posts... Interesting the mother told the police where to find the body in the end.

Would like to say thanks to the dedicated long time members who have remained determined to find out what happened to Allison.

I must say I can't help but wonder how, whoever did this can sleep at night!!!

I feel sick at the thought of Allisons daughters and what they must be going through now and into the future. I remain hopeful there will be justice for Allison. :moo:

oh wow..just read her story, its impossible to believe that this could happen...puts a bigger spin on one of our biggest/most favoured theories doesnt it?
 
Hi Minni.

Yes, I am not sure why, I had not heard of this case before today and the involvement of the parents makes you wonder what people are capable of when it comes to their children.

Thanks for the welcome
 
The link by Flinders states what is supposed to happen in these circumstances however, you could have a point, after all the person in question is a salesman and an upstanding member of the community. Gift of the gab comes to mind. :)

Zookyliz heard from a mate that two police cars attended that night (I posted the link in an earlier post) and I had wondered if that was the usual practice?

I don't know though, if I had to put money on it and two cars attended, I would think the police would want to sight Allison. IMO

I believe you have raised something worth considering.

Can any of the locals or people who have met GBC tell us about his salesmanship skills or social/ skills of persuasion?

He was also a 'potential political candidate'.
 
As mentioned by Firesnake, a brief summary of what happened to Summer Inman, its awful to imagine and it sounds very much like the GBC and Nigelaine theories circulating..also has marriage problems and something additional but within the realm of possibility regarding arguments: custody issues


http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-20048918-504083.html

Not off topic as it closely shadows a theory involving the POI's
 
Thanks for posting all that Minni.. I'm sure I will get the hang of this one day..lol

I was hoping this wouldnt be seen as off topic. It just shows that although it may not be possible to believe something like this could happen, it does happen. The family involvement etc..
 
Good point Timmy - def gift of the gab required
 
At the very beginning of this investigation the Police Superintendent said "We are treating this as an Unlawful Homicide". I found those words curious as I thought all homicides were 'unlawful'.I did some searching and found this article useful. I'm not sure if it Australian formation but can't see that that would effect the definition. I Moo loudly here .

Murder vs. Manslaughter

Killing another person is commonly referred to as murder. However, the precise term for the killing of one person by another is homicide. Murder is a form of criminal homicide that has a precise legal meaning. Murder is usually defined as the "unlawful killing of another with malice aforethought (or "an abandoned and malignant heart"). Malice aforethought refers to the perpetrator's intention of doing harm.

There are different legal variations of murder, known as degrees. Degrees of murder vary by the gravity (seriousness) of the offense (usually measured by the intent of the perpetrator) and the sentence assigned to that offense. For example, murder in the first degree, or first-degree murder, carries the sternest sentences and is usually reserved for murders committed with premeditation or extreme cruelty.

Manslaughter is also a form of criminal homicide. The difference between murder and manslaughter is in the element of intent. In order to commit voluntary manslaughter, a person must have committed a homicide, but have acted in the "heat of passion." This mental state must have been caused by legally sufficient provocation that would cause a reasonable person of ordinary temperament to lose self-control. To convict a person of manslaughter, it must be proved that the person who committed the homicide had adequate provocation (this cannot involve words alone), acted in the heat of passion, and lacked the opportunity to cool that passion. There must also be a connection between the incident of provocation, the heat of passion, and the act that caused the homicide.

Involuntary manslaughter is manslaughter resulting from a failure to perform a legal duty expressly required to safeguard human life, from the commission of an unlawful act not amounting to a felony, or from the commission of an act involving a risk of injury or death that is done in an unlawful, reckless, or grossly negligent manner. Involuntary manslaughter is a relatively new legal concept. Its exact definition varies greatly by jurisdiction, and is sometimes known as second- or third-degree manslaughter.

In order to convict someone of either murder or manslaughter, the distinct elements of each crime must be proved beyond a reasonable doubt, and the actions of the perpetrator cannot be explained or excused by any legal defense, excuse, or justification. Murder and manslaughter also differ in the sentences imposed for each crime. As the perpetrator of manslaughter is assumed to have evidenced less mental culpability, the sentence for manslaughter is usually less than that for murder.
 
At the very beginning of this investigation the Police Superintendent said "We are treating this as an Unlawful Homicide". I found those words curious as I thought all homicides were 'unlawful'.I did some searching and found this article useful. I'm not sure if it Australian formation but can't see that that would effect the definition. I Moo loudly here .

Murder vs. Manslaughter

Killing another person is commonly referred to as murder. However, the precise term for the killing of one person by another is homicide. Murder is a form of criminal homicide that has a precise legal meaning. Murder is usually defined as the "unlawful killing of another with malice aforethought (or "an abandoned and malignant heart"). Malice aforethought refers to the perpetrator's intention of doing harm.

There are different legal variations of murder, known as degrees. Degrees of murder vary by the gravity (seriousness) of the offense (usually measured by the intent of the perpetrator) and the sentence assigned to that offense. For example, murder in the first degree, or first-degree murder, carries the sternest sentences and is usually reserved for murders committed with premeditation or extreme cruelty.

Manslaughter is also a form of criminal homicide. The difference between murder and manslaughter is in the element of intent. In order to commit voluntary manslaughter, a person must have committed a homicide, but have acted in the "heat of passion." This mental state must have been caused by legally sufficient provocation that would cause a reasonable person of ordinary temperament to lose self-control. To convict a person of manslaughter, it must be proved that the person who committed the homicide had adequate provocation (this cannot involve words alone), acted in the heat of passion, and lacked the opportunity to cool that passion. There must also be a connection between the incident of provocation, the heat of passion, and the act that caused the homicide.

Involuntary manslaughter is manslaughter resulting from a failure to perform a legal duty expressly required to safeguard human life, from the commission of an unlawful act not amounting to a felony, or from the commission of an act involving a risk of injury or death that is done in an unlawful, reckless, or grossly negligent manner. Involuntary manslaughter is a relatively new legal concept. Its exact definition varies greatly by jurisdiction, and is sometimes known as second- or third-degree manslaughter.

In order to convict someone of either murder or manslaughter, the distinct elements of each crime must be proved beyond a reasonable doubt, and the actions of the perpetrator cannot be explained or excused by any legal defense, excuse, or justification. Murder and manslaughter also differ in the sentences imposed for each crime. As the perpetrator of manslaughter is assumed to have evidenced less mental culpability, the sentence for manslaughter is usually less than that for murder.

MG is the info from an American website, as I don't think we have degrees of murder here. :)
 
I believe that if the police were called to a DV situation earlier in the evening on the night Allison disappeared it would have been reported and verified.I say this because I use a popular iphone app,freely availablle on the itunes store..it is called Police Scanner.It allows you to (legally) tune into live police radio alerts.There are 12 channels in QLD alone.SE QLD is probably the busiest and most listened to.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe the QPS Brisbane (but not Ipswich) channels are digital/encrypted and not easily listened to afaik... the iPhone app may be rebroadcasts of the analogue channels.
 
MG is the info from an American website, as I don't think we have degrees of murder here. :)

Hawkins explained the Aussie situation. I think there is some difference here as well.
 
I don't know about YouTube, but I know that some of our links in the Timeline thread are no longer linking to a story = page not found.

And a lot of links in the early threads as well. I have just been looking for some media reports and either the posts are not there or the link does not work.
 
He was also a 'potential political candidate'.

yes thats right..then he would be reasonably adept at turning on the charm and gentle persuasion..he has also done some public speaking, and of course, HE WAS A REAL ESTATE AGENT!!! by all accounts he was skilled in the area of smarmy manipulation...at the very least, he certainly thought so.

Still, I only think it would be possible for GBC to smooth it over without police insisiting they either talk to or sight Allison, if

a) two cars weren't sent out...thats at least four officers..you can't swindle all of em IMO

b) there was some uncertainty where the arguing and disturbance came from

c) he had no prior domestic violence reports
 
Hawkins explained the Aussie situation. I think there is some difference here as well.


2. The Murder/Manslaughter Distinction in Unlawful Homicide

2.1 “Unlawful homicide” is the killing of a human being in circumstances where the law does not excuse killing. In New South Wales, unlawful homicide is generally classified as either murder or manslaughter. The murder/manslaughter distinction is a long-standing feature of our law, emerging first in England in the 16th century as a mechanism used to ensure that capital punishment was imposed for certain killings classified as “murder”.1 Today, the distinction between murder and manslaughter is seen to reflect degrees of seriousness of unlawful killings, based on the everyday understanding that some killings are more blameworthy than others. Liability for murder is reserved for the most serious or reprehensible killings, whereas manslaughter applies to unlawful killings which are recognised by the law as less blameworthy, whether because the offender’s mental state was affected by some mitigating influence, or because the offender did not intend to kill or otherwise lacked the requisite guilty mind for murder.

http://www.lawlink.nsw.gov.au/lrc.nsf/pages/R82CHP2

See this link also....

Criminal Code Act 1899

http://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/legisltn/current/c/crimincode.pdf
 
Some of the links are just broken due to repeated copy & paste...I'll have a peek & ask Kimster if she'll replace them.

That may be the case but some of the news reports from Channel 7, 10 and SBS have been edited to now show the body bag being hauled up to the bridge but no shots of he body itself
 
This is a case where a body was found and immediately foul play known. Similar scenario to this case in what is suspected regarding background, motive, instant foul play. I am uncomfortable with the forensic issues here but interested in what others think.

http://www.azcentral.com/community/...izona-burned-bodies-tempe-murder-suicide.html

The link says suicide but the victim in this case did not commit suicide. The husband is the reference there.

MOO
 
yes thats right..then he would be reasonably adept at turning on the charm and gentle persuasion..he has also done some public speaking, and of course, HE WAS A REAL ESTATE AGENT!!! by all accounts he was skilled in the area of smarmy manipulation...at the very least, he certainly thought so.

Still, I only think it would be possible for GBC to smooth it over without police insisiting they either talk to or sight Allison, if

a) two cars weren't sent out...thats at least four officers..you can't swindle all of em IMO

b) there was some uncertainty where the arguing and disturbance came from

c) he had no prior domestic violence reports

IMO for a couple that had been married for quite a while, I doubt that if there was DV in their relationship, this would have been the first instance police were called to their residence. My thinking is that there was a history of more than one event in police records. Police are not dumb individuals. Am sure they would have spoken to Allison personally, otherwise they would have raised the alarm that night. All of this is obviously based on my opinion that there was a history of DV in this marriage.
 
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