Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 - #6

[Keyboredom]

I remember at the time that he died, many people who knew Michael Hutchence personally said that he had been a heroin addict since before INXS days? Meaning he was pretty much out there....not part of the normal mainstream society as ABC and GBC were...

Michael Hutchence wouldnt have lasted 5 mins living in Kenmore...lol...

Bernard Fanning did ok But he wasn't on smack.

 

[BrizzychickinUSA]

I'm not on board either, but the swingers set is probably larger than many of us would realise .... No kids at home, hair gets done for the big night ... Big night goes wrong ..... Don't buy it, but as I've said previously, everyone has 3 lives:-
a) Public life;
b) Private life, and;
c) Secret life;
The facts are, none of us know, all we have are theories and possibilities. The police would have a mountain of evidence/data of the behavioral habits of all concerned and I have no doubt they have the culprit/s well within their sights.

WOW....I think thats awesome....

Can you elaborate further on the 3 lives....I would love to know... does a person start to show shades of personality disorders if their C life takes up a greater percentage over their A life or something like that....

?

Or better still...what sort of traits does someone show if this happens...?

does anyone know?

 

[Champagne4lulu]

She had unfortunately had looked drawn and sad for a few weeks before - some days more than others. She didn't seem to want to engage in any long discussions or hang around for too long in the mornings - more like avoiding contact and conversation rather than in a hurry. IMHO.

I'm really sad to read this

 

[BrizzychickinUSA]

And that's not the first time that Brookster has said "mom".

so you reckon brooksters a yank....???? wth?

wldnt suprise me

 

[Lurker on Websleuths]

Yeah Michael Hutchence sure was good, I managed to see INXS at Fishermans Wharf only the once. Shouldn't probably have raised it in here but all the talk of threesomes and that earlier just reminded me of the conjecture at the time of his death about whether or not other people had been present there a short time before his death and one of them was supposed to have been a prominent female lawyer. Just more ranting than anything.

 

[CaseClosed]

Lawyers are often given instructions by clients that they have in fact been involved in a death, but that it was accidental, they panicked and then hid the body. In such a scenario the lawyer is ethically barred from revealing to police or relatives that the missing person is in fact dead. Sometimes the lawyer will even be told by the client where the body is. Keeping that knowledge confidential can take a real toll. If the client does not want to make any admissions then the lawyer must act according to those instructions.

Thank you for clarifying. I always wondered if lawyers had to report anything like that to the police or if the law/client privilege protects them in cases like this. Very difficult situation to be in!

 

[brookster]

And that's not the first time that Brookster has said "mom".

thats my term - easy to replace mom for mum. How is this relevant? Good sleuthing I'm not aussie

 

[spratsmum]

Oh Geez!!! I do rememeber that now and it was in answer to me asking same question...Sorry...Serious Bimbo moment happening on my behalf?

Anyone know if they left at same time or together and where they went from there I assume school finishes at 3pm so I wonder what happened after that and who took the kids?

On another note I really feel sorry for the poor staff of C21 Westside...Jobs must feel like they are up in the air at the moment...I notice that there aren't to many properties listed and I know I wouldn't sell my house with them knowing what I know about their business problems at the moment?

Do the BC's own the building they are in now or is it leased? It is a bit flash for a business that is apparently in financial crisis?

I read when this was discussed earlier. that the cross country event finished at 11am. The source was the school newsletter.

We were on the westside of Brisbane today and had a couple of hours to kill between a wedding and the reception, so I convinced my husband to drive out to Brookfield. A few things surprised me.

1, That roundabout is so busy, shops everywhere and at 3 o.clock on a Saturday afternoon a lot of traffic, it is not that big either, but there a loads of places to hide.

2. Was the distance between the BC home and the roundabout - it is quite a distance.

By the way there was a police sitting in Brookfield Road on the approach to the roundabout when we returned.

3. How isolated and private the Baden Clays's home is - it is set back from the road and has high hedges all around, the gates was open and you could see some of the house, but not much. The church is up the hill a little and is much higher than the BC home. The showground is not directly across the road as I though it is down the road a little and the entrance is around a corner.

Something would have to be out of the ordinary for you to even notice it happening at this house. It is not like suburbia, it is rural and the houses are some distance apart. It really was a totalloy different perspective from what I had pictured for the photographs.

 

[clem1970]

thats my term - easy to replace mom for mum. How is this relevant? Good sleuthing I'm not aussie

Are you a fellow Rhodie?

 

[brookster]

so you reckon brooksters a yank....???? wth?

wldnt suprise me

not a yank, sorry. Im a brookfieldian. Back to the case now peeps...

 

[Blue Bottle]

She had unfortunately had looked drawn and sad for a few weeks before - some days more than others. She didn't seem to want to engage in any long discussions or hang around for too long in the mornings - more like avoiding contact and conversation rather than in a hurry. IMHO.

I don't know what to believe. This all gets quite confusing at times because of conflicting reports.

Someone not long ago posted a link where Allison's closest friend, Kerry-Anne Walker, with whom Allison was in phone contact with on the night she disappeared, spoke out after Allison's funeral and didn't indicate that Allison had been upset for weeks.

Ms Walker said one of the last times she had coffee with her best friend; there was no sign of trouble.

``She said things were good. She was happy,'' Mrs Walker said.

Courier Mail is speaking to ABC best friend
http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...says-best-friend/story-e6freoof-1226353690726

 

[STELLA85]

She had unfortunately had looked drawn and sad for a few weeks before - some days more than others. She didn't seem to want to engage in any long discussions or hang around for too long in the mornings - more like avoiding contact and conversation rather than in a hurry. IMHO.

I'm sorry Brookster I don't believe this to be true

 

[Keentoknow]

Lawyers are often given instructions by clients that they have in fact been involved in a death, but that it was accidental, they panicked and then hid the body. In such a scenario the lawyer is ethically barred from revealing to police or relatives that the missing person is in fact dead. Sometimes the lawyer will even be told by the client where the body is. Keeping that knowledge confidential can take a real toll. If the client does not want to make any admissions then the lawyer must act according to those instructions.

Law and order is upside down. Not to mention persons past record either to jury. Upside is when they appeal sometimes their sentence is increased.

 

[STELLA85]

Bernard Fanning did ok But he wasn't on smack.

Bernard lived in Anstead not Kenmore :rocker:

 

[CJ60]

Agree with assumption 1

Yes - back in Thread 1 Maverickeyboredom.au told us the police knew who the killer was:floorlaugh:

I've been here since Day 1 and I totally agree with their theories/theory back then. I have a close media "link" that was based at the Command Post, and he said after 2 days of Allison missing, that the Police and the Media knew exactly who the killer was and that it was just a matter of gathering evidence. The Police are working so very hard and the Media are totally supporting them in their efforts. Both parties know so much more than us at this time, and although it's killing us, this evidence will hopefully put Allison's murderer away for life.

Couldn't have said it better myself - Bellgirl! Police and Media - doing an amazing job! and I don't want to think the killer will get off - thank you; thanks to all posters that have some inside knowledge and continually reassure us that whoever did this to Allison will be caught and held accountable for this horrific crime.

 

[Hawkins]

Its ok Caseclosed the QPS will have this covered because Premeditation or unintentional in your words is not relevant.

(e) if death is caused by wilfully stopping the breath of any person for either of such purposes;

is guilty of murder.

<snipped>

(4) Under subsection (1)(c) to (e) it is immaterial that the offender did not intend to cause death or did not know that death was likely to result.

Nobody in Qld has ever been charged with murder pursuant to s302(1)(c)(d) or (e). They are redundant provisions. Only paras (a) and (b) are used. In this case if a murder charge arises it will be either an intentional act killing under 302(1)(a) or a dangerous act killing under 302(1)(b).

 

[KG1]

WOW....I think thats awesome....

Can you elaborate further on the 3 lives....I would love to know... does a person start to show shades of personality disorders if their C life takes up a greater percentage over their A life or something like that....

?

Or better still...what sort of traits does someone show if this happens...?

does anyone know?

No one know because it is secret. Lol

 

[indogwetrust]

In Qld to be convicted of murder the Crown must show that the accused intended to inflict GBH or death to some person at the time of the killing.
Unless you have very precise evidence about how death occurred and about who did what to whom and when, it is very difficult to establish the requisite intention. Proving beyond reasonable doubt what a person's intention was at a given time requires very specific evidence. The defense of accident can also be available, as can diminished responsibility. Police need to be mindful of all these factors when investigating and interviewing.

To add to that - the other cirumstance where someone may be found guilty of murder is in the prosecution of an unlawful purpose which is likely to cause death (Criminal Code s302(1)(b) I think). In that case it is not necessary to prove intent. However, on the facts, this scenario is highly unlikely - I think the Whiskey A Go Go deaths were examples of this. Am only adding this as an example of not needing to prove intent, which as Hawkins says, is really diffiuclt to prove.

If the elements for murder are not satisfied bc the accused did not intend to kill or do GBH or the killing was not caused by a dangerous act done for an unlawful purpose, then manslaughter should stick if it is determined that death was caused by:
a) An intentional act OR
b) Failing in a duty to prevent harm to the victim (negligent manslaugther).

 

[brookster]

I'm sorry Brookster I don't believe this to be true

This is personal observation by myself and partner and we had even discussed it before she went missing. You/others might have a different interpretation, which i respect totally.

 

[KG1]

No one knows because it is secret. Lol