Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 - #7

[kailee]

Thinking back to the granny pash (I've watched it once, don't need to see it again thanks) - my interpretation at the time was he went in for the kiss [is everything alright dear?] and she layed it back on him twofold [sure is!] in a display of support towards him. If he's involved, she knew it, and was showing she's standing by him.

I'm guessing gramps is paying the legal fees.

If an 'elderly gent' was stationed at the bus stop for any length of time, I'm guessing he'd be making a few phone calls pacing about angry as $h!+. Just out of curiousity, is there a pay phone nearby? If children were sleeping over, all those dealings would be best done out of earshot.

Does BWANA have a towball? If not, do they own a second car with a towball? If not, why own a trailer and have it in pride of place in the front yard for years...? (I LOL'd @ mufasa reference) I fully understand the random snap of the trailer the other night taking a life of its own, but that shiney towball on the Prado got me thinking and I honestly can't rule a trailer out. Though you'd think they would have seized it in the raid...

I recall industrial bins being searched the same day of the car accident - was that Saturday? Anyone know what day those bin are normally collected? In a case at Alexandra Headland (Justine Jones) she went missing the night bins were awaiting collection so they sent them all to a special area to be searched for evidence. They ended up finding her remains through this method, otherwise she may never have been found in landfill. Was there anything like this done in Brookfield? Or Kenmore? I realise it's a much bigger collection than the section of Alexandra Headland.

 

[Berry]

As to how people can afford expensive legal representation. The solicitor would require that the client place an initial sum of money into his trust account, and monthly invoices will be drawn against this. The barrister will also require this. The barrister is paid by the solicitor, not directly by the client. In many cases the client will not have the cash needed and so will mortgage a property that they own to cover it. The solicitor may then be the mortgage holder or it may be done through a bank. If the client is subsequently acquited then the fees paid for their defence are not recoverable from the State. People (and their relatives/friends) quite often lose their homes after successfully defending criminal charges. Legal aid is very difficult to obtain due to the relevant means tests. If you are going to mortgage your home, or ask your relatives to, in order to defend yourself then you might as well use the money to get the best you can afford, since the money will not be recouped.

As to lawyers dealing with clients who make admissions or confessions but who want to plead not guilty. The lawyer must inform the client that the lawyer is unable to say anything in court which is inconsistent with what the client has said. They cannot, for instance, assert that the client was not present at the time of the offence, suggest to eye-witnesses that they are mistaken or suggest to the jury some other version of events other than what the client has told them. They can only put the Crown to proof and suggest to the jury that the Crown has not met this evidentiary burden. That is sometimes effective where the Crown case is largely circumstantial. If the client insists on giving oral evidence in court then the lawyer cannot allow the client to say anything under oath which is inconsistent with the confession made. If the client does this, regardless, then the lawyer must withdraw from the matter, without telling the court why. The judge will of course realise what is going on.

Barristers do not generally have the option of refusing, or withdrawing from, a case because they dislike or disapprove of a client. The cab rank rule requires them to accept a brief where the matter is within their expertise and they have the time. Criticising barristers for complying with their ethical responsibilities is pointless. Outside many court buildings you will see a statue of a lady with a blindfold holding scales. Themis represents justice being blind. Meaning that cases are decided on the evidence, not on personal feelings, hunches, biases or community outrage. If a prosecution fails it is either because the accused was indeed innocent, or the evidence was insufficient to establish guilt beyond reasonable doubt, or the prosecution was incompetent. The idea of some clever barrister getting a person off is a myth. There are no secret arguments or rules to find. Witnesses may not be tricked. But defective evidence and insufficient procedural work can and should be identified by a competent lawyer.

Thanks Hawky, in my case of nearly dying because an ex rhodesian 'love tapped' me, a very devoted girlfriend was very rich and left her husband and sons to marry him before my court case (as I was in hospital and Brain Injury Rehab Unit for a long time before I could make my own statement).

She paid over $180 000 to defend him with an SC/QC.

I will tell you what he the SC (who is now a JUDGE) told my prosecutor though..'cannot stand the b itch wife of his...........so ignorant, he is as guilty as sin and I will never do an appeal for him after he is convicted'.

I found out this after he WAS convicted and cried and sobbed with relief to hear good does prevail even with with defense SC.

On a side note 5 jurors came to ex rhodesians' sentencing, so family told me, those jurors cried with relief he got what he got too.

God it was horrible and now it's been 10 yrs without any closure for me, I hope it is with this case involving ex rhodesians..........I need it selfishly for me and Allison

 

[Ixnaye]

Hey IXNAYE.......Thanks for that info from today's newspaper....Very helpful.

You are welcome Willough, it's a good article isn't it. I thought it would be handy to post the article for those who are not actually located here in Brisbane.

 

[willough]

LOL - Sadly murderers seem to attract a particular subculture of groupies. The worst ones seem the most popular...
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/09/27/BA8M19PDAN.DTL

Weird isn't it.....A twee insane in the membrane, to get involved. To me, it would be like russian roulette......Waiting for your turn. :what:

 

[Berry]

If this was the case, do you think that she would have been bleeding either from where she was hit or from her nose, mouth etc. I'm sorry to be graphic - but fairly sure that you can handle it Berry. If she was bleeding, then there would have to be blood in the house, car, site of disposal ............ ?

Well no, this is often a "closed head injury", meaning happens inside sweetie and no outside sign of foul play........MINE WAS.

 

[Berry]

I think perhaps the cultural differences i.e. the display on the front of the GB home is an interesting point.

I was just pondering why if it was a "love tap" gone wrong, you wouldn't ring the police, tell them what happened. The punishment couldn't be has bad as it is for murder and disposing of a body. I then thought of the culture of SA regarding police, from what I have read police are seen as being untrustworthy, open to corruption and certainly not the type of relationship that most Australians have for the majority.

I wonder if the love tap theory is right, would BC snr have said, you can't trust the police son, we need to get rid of the body etc.

My other question is - what "evidence" would have needed to be got rid of in industrial bins, or any bins?

Good points:

1. Who would be able to tell if poor Allison was dead??

2. Pulse on wrist/neck?

3. If proven or not proven as a death..........why not ring for Ambo?

4. If non compliance to ring immediately for Ambo, why?

5. Use of bins would therefore be used to be rid of clothes she was wearing after putting 'walking gear' on her to cover this story of his?

All above is JMO if GBC and NBC were involved.

 

[Ixnaye]

Thank you ixnae for the news report. Very interesting. Was interested about the fingernails! Didn't know that

Yes the fingernails was a surprise to me as well, by the sound of it they won't be able to get any clues from under her nails. It also was very interesting how they deduce if a body has been moved from the pooling of the blood inside the body.

 

[Kimster]

Please forgive me if I'm missing the obvious. Although I am here often, time doesn't allow me to read every post.

They've only searched GBC's house and his parents' house? And they are merely awaiting toxicology reports to make an arrest? I would think they would have searched another person's property that Allison knew before releasing the information that they are about to arrest her killer - unless her killer lives in either one of those homes....

 

[itsthevibe]

Please forgive me if I'm missing the obvious. Although I am here often, time doesn't allow me to read every post.

They've only searched GBC's house and his parents' house? And they are merely awaiting toxicology reports to make an arrest? I would think they would have searched another person's property that Allison knew before releasing the information that they are about to arrest her killer - unless her killer lives in either one of those homes....

Correct. No searches of other homes have been reported. So unless they have searched others and not reported it, well I'd say you're right!

 

[Neuromancer]

Thank you Neuro, this is aptly stated, admire you, as a survivor of an ex rhodesian 'LOVE TAP' that caused me to suffer subdural haematomas and being unconscious for 2days after being dumped back in my own home, his sentence was larger due to that lack of remorse and no summoning of Emergency Medical help immediately/ He did press 000 but hung up straight away from his phone records.........he next rang a girlfriend for a ride to drive me to my homeand leave me there, not a river though.

That's good to know that sentencing considers this (I'd only thought about it in the psych profiling sense).

And glad you lived to tell the tale.

what a classic psychopath - calling another girl to give him (and your unconscious body!) a lift home. And that boys and girls, is how psychopaths think...

 

[Neuromancer]

Can anyone confirm if NBC & EBC are still working at C21 as Salespersons? If not when did they leave?

They don't seemed to be currently licenced R/E salespersons...TIA

http://www.fairtrading.qld.gov.au/are-you-licensed.htm

Nice sleuthing!

Well their names were still on the webpage until it was taken down after all this.
Although that doesn't necessarily mean licenses were current.

 

[Neuromancer]

They've only searched GBC's house and his parents' house? And they are merely awaiting toxicology reports to make an arrest? I would think they would have searched another person's property that Allison knew before releasing the information that they are about to arrest her killer - unless her killer lives in either one of those homes....

Disco

 

[Ixnaye]

Nigelaine has a business address in Wavell Heights. Don't know if BWANAS own the property. It is an insurance business.

That address in Wavell Heights is 10 doors away from me, it's a house the same people have owned it and lived in it for 23 years, no idea what connection they would have with the Baden-Clays but I have lived here myself for 13 years and as far as I am aware they do not run any type of business from out of that house. Although if they were insurance agents then a home office would be all they would need.

 

[Keyboredom]

Um, then you're having micro naps between posts. There was previous discussion on this subject. That's the pivotal moment that I realised whatever is claimed here, particularly by the supposed 'locals', I take zero notice of. There's been nothing of substance since about the second thread.

Is there high unemployment in QLD or something? Some people have far too much time on their hands.:floorlaugh:

I think a few locals have had some pivotal moments reading your posts too. Considering you're posting on the 7th thread while stating there's nothing of substance on it, is what we call in micro-napping dole-budging Queensland, 'ironic'.

 

[Keyboredom]

Oh, c'mon. Let's play the 'I'm the tough new forum member with a quirky sense of fun' (hoping for stacks of 'thanks'). Seriously, there are an unfortunate handful of you that have really dumbed down this thread. I've noticed a lot of regular Aus posters steering clear.

Heck, you've all been mentioned on another couple of forums (and I'm not talking flattery).

So, let's see, according to a select few .... we have 1) a love triangle, 2) a trailer 3) money, power, jealousy and 4) necrophilia:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh: ROFL, pen the book now purlease.

Give it away. Now. I can't stop laughing.

I think the point you're missing is no ne cares if you're laughing or not, and aren't seeking your thanks. Judging by your online demeanour the guess would be you haven't laughed or thanked someone in real life for quite a long time. Over-using emoticons doesn't justify your opinion over others. Despite the vibe you give out, most on here would support your right to an opinion. But the sheer rudeness and nastiness: 'Give it away. Now'.

 

[Neuromancer]

Good points:

1. Who would be able to tell if poor Allison was dead??

2. Pulse on wrist/neck?

It's pretty easy to tell, Berry, if that's any reassurance.

The immediate physical signs are obvious - breathing stops, eyes go fixed and dilated, pallor (paler than a living person ever goes).
Then cooling starts and rigor mortis after a bit.

 

[Neuromancer]

Just like yesterday, the CM headlines in order on the front page are interesting:

1.THE man whose expert evidence freed Lindy Chamberlain says Allison Baden-Clay's body would be telling the story of her murder to investigators.
2.Baden-Clay: Allison 'knew killer', police set for arrest
3.Search: Police visit husband as hunt continues

 

[Neuromancer]

___________

Charges could be laid over the murder of Brookfield mum-of-three Allison Baden-Clay as early as this week with key test results due very soon.

Police said they were unlikely to make an arrest until they had the results of Mrs Baden-Clay’s autopsy and toxilogy tests.

The results are due some time this week with the usual turnaround for the tests two weeks.

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...lers-arrest-20120513-1ykec.html#ixzz1ulo9BU2U
___________

So sounds like, as Kimster said, they've pretty much had it worked out, but just had to make sure nothing in the tests conflicts with their other conclusions.

 

[Keyboredom]

Just like yesterday, the CM headlines in order on the front page are interesting:

1.THE man whose expert evidence freed Lindy Chamberlain says Allison Baden-Clay's body would be telling the story of her murder to investigators.
2.Baden-Clay: Allison 'knew killer', police set for arrest
3.Search: Police visit husband as hunt continues

Seems while each article doesn't provide the public much new info, each one contains something to make the killer squirm. If the killer felt above everyone else in the past, bet they're not self-congratulating at the moment. Can't imagine too much "I think we've got away with this" talk.

 

[BrizzychickinUSA]

If she was a competent caregiver, the kids were happy there then probably, if it was contested by Dickies, then an argument of "the best interests of the children" would develop, it would be a question of capacity as well i spose, But remember, even convicted Fathers are Fathers and have some say in what happens to their children

The Dickies are on the Goldie....an hour and a bit from the kids school....where as the BC grans are walking distance from the girls school; that may have something to do with the careing...

I hope they can grab the girls and put them into Staidens at Sthport....lovely anglican girls school that has day boarding Mon to Fri