Australia Australia - Claremont SK, 1996-97, Perth, WA - #14

[Innerchild]

Hi JoWa
The original article from from the front page of The West Australian on Feb 17th 1988, which I posted an image of. Kimono Clue to a Brutal Murder which I posted an image of. The clue was DNA found on the kimono belonging to BRE.

[FONT=&quot]Mr Edwards, 48, was alsocharged with a home invasion at a Huntingdale home as far back as 1988, when hewas just 20. Police will allege he broke into the bedroom of a young woman andlay on top of her, before she struggled and he ran away...[/FONT]DNA found on a silk dressing gown dropped near the scene of the 1988 incident allegedly matched DNA recovered from the body of Ms Glennon and the Karrakatta rape victim...

It was also made clear that the kimono was stolen from a washing line, although it doesn't say who's line in the article.
http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/western-australia/claremont-serial-killings-police-piecing-together-the-life-of-bradley-robert-edwards/news-story/557f281e68cdf76d572843291ea9cef7”


The fact that the clue linked the brutal murder of VC to the perpetrator of the Huntingdale assault was identified by profilers bought over from America by The Post Newspaper as being the key to finding CSK. Subsequently around Sept and Oct 2015 (I think) a link was made between these crimes and the KK rape.

I have gone to find the Post articles from Sept and Oct 2015 and again recently and have found possible newspapers and pages from newspaper have been redacted / surpressed / missing from online. Recently on 31st December 2016 when The Post reported on BRE's arrest there are pages 14, 15, 16 and 17 missing and from 28th January 2017, page 54 is missing. I have asked for these papers from The Post, but they will not give me copies, although I have copies of every other newspaper since start of Jan 2017. IMO any information that could be used as part of the brief cops are using for the prosecution cases may be subject to suppression orders, and this could include the above information which I've read about recently and over the years.

I don't expect the DNA from the kimono could be used because of handling errors they've made for prosecution for the earlier crimes, however I'm sure for the KK rape attack and subsequent attacks as long as correct procedure for DNA collection was followed all it has to do is match BRE's DNA profile.

Respectfully to those who do not share my view of the kimono clue, I believe it is as close to a fact as you can get that BRE was not only at the scene of the brutal sexual assault and murder of VC he left his DNA through semen at the crime.

Somebody else (David Troy Masters) did confess to this crime, and I believe he did commit the murder but not the sexual assault, as he was unable to sexually assault his murder victim in 1991. It was not that unusual for crims to confess to crimes they did not commit for various reasons, or in this case to take all the heat off BRE. This worked as cops were told to close the case as they had their man and the kimono with BRE's DNA on it was put away and forgotten about for many years.

Interestingly, the first use of DNA in a criminal prosecution in England in 1986 was to disprove a false confession (DNA profiling Wiki)

 

[JoWa]

Spooks, thanks for that. I've been pondering over a theory. Could it be possible for the BLF to roll down the hill into the ocean? Perhaps the BLF wasn't placed in gear properly, rolled down when an innocent bystander tried to stop it and got knocked into the ocean. If it was a column shift they were a bit tricky to place in gear and perhaps the handbrake didn't work properly.

A few years ago I got hit by a rolling car and didn't realize it was unmanned until the last minute.

Anything is possible since no witnesses have come forward and nobody knows what happened. You would need to look back at newspapers to see if anything more is said about the body found. If there are no more articles it wasn't considered a suspicious death. Another possible murder that close to the BLF would have had the media all over it.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[no name]

Hi JoWa
The original article from from the front page of The West Australian on Feb 17th 1988, which I posted an image of. Kimono Clue to a Brutal Murder which I posted an image of. The clue was DNA found on the kimono belonging to BRE.

[FONT=&quot]Mr Edwards, 48, was alsocharged with a home invasion at a Huntingdale home as far back as 1988, when hewas just 20. Police will allege he broke into the bedroom of a young woman andlay on top of her, before she struggled and he ran away...[/FONT]DNA found on a silk dressing gown dropped near the scene of the 1988 incident allegedly matched DNA recovered from the body of Ms Glennon and the Karrakatta rape victim...

It was also made clear that the kimono was stolen from a washing line, although it doesn't say who's line in the article.
http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/western-australia/claremont-serial-killings-police-piecing-together-the-life-of-bradley-robert-edwards/news-story/557f281e68cdf76d572843291ea9cef7”

The fact that the clue linked the brutal murder of VC to the perpetrator of the Huntingdale assault was identified by profilers bought over from America by The Post Newspaper as being the key to finding CSK. Subsequently around Sept and Oct 2015 (I think) a link was made between these crimes and the KK rape.

I have gone to find the Post articles from Sept and Oct 2015 and again recently and have found possible newspapers and pages from newspaper have been redacted / surpressed / missing from online. Recently on 31st December 2016 when The Post reported on BRE's arrest there are pages 14, 15, 16 and 17 missing and from 28th January 2017, page 54 is missing. I have asked for these papers from The Post, but they will not give me copies, although I have copies of every other newspaper since start of Jan 2017. IMO any information that could be used as part of the brief cops are using for the prosecution cases may be subject to suppression orders, and this could include the above information which I've read about recently and over the years.

RSBM
Innerchild - the missing pages from 31Dec16 are an advertising feature, namely the weekly specials for Farmer Jacks in Subi.

Do you have the issue of the post dated 07Jan17 - Womems Clothing Riddle article speaks of a floreat resident, ex huntingdale who was interviewed by police in the weeks proceeding BRE arrest regarding the theft of clothes from his line at his house in Huntingdale in 1988. I dont think they found the clothes 29 years on & wanted to return them & I dont ever recall Bret Christian commenting on a Kimono link.

His report on Oct 17, 2015 Fourth Serial killer victim linked for the first time the KK DNA and CG DNA. November 14, 2015 reports on Cottesloe Hotel/Drive in attack. Dec5, 2015 Two New Clues to Seial Killer reports the Commodore and screen printing links. Nothing about a Kimono or VC. His 31Dec16 report about Early Clues Missed - 3 opportunities that could have led them to the killer were kk drivers licence, JR upholstery samples & missed forensic clue untested from CG. Thats it.

 

[Canning Vale]

With regard to the woman abducted from the Sheraton Hotel and left at the bridge... She must have got a good look at the creep because he held her for three hours. Whilst travelling, street lights would have shown his ugly face. There "might" be an identikit in the archived papers. With such a horrific crime you'd have thought more was done. Perhaps something was on the Crime Stoppers TV short clips they used to have - they probably keep archives.

 

[Spinnaker]

With regard to the woman abducted from the Sheraton Hotel and left at the bridge... She must have got a good look at the creep because he held her for three hours. Whilst travelling, street lights would have shown his ugly face. There "might" be an identikit in the archived papers. With such a horrific crime you'd have thought more was done. Perhaps something was on the Crime Stoppers TV short clips they used to have - they probably keep archives.

You would think also that there could be the perps DNA on the tape which was used. The description used was something like 'wrapped up like a Mummy'.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Canning Vale]

There must be loads of finger prints on the wrap. They "may" have got the perp's. finger prints now though! :jail:

You would think also that there could be the perps DNA on the tape which was used. The description used was something like 'wrapped up like a Mummy'.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Canning Vale]

Wrapping someone up in tape may suggest the perp. had intentions of throwing her into the river - now I'm starting to think like a homicidal maniac! Perhaps someone disturbed him and he took off hurriedly not having time to finish the job. :thinking:

Something else has just hit me.... the woman was aged 45 that's the approximate age BREs mother would have been. Perhaps that's why he didn't rape her, he had no intentions of doing so, just wanted to cause physical assault. Perhaps the victim was chosen because she resembled BREs mother. We need photos of both for a comparison.

These are only my thoughts and opinions.

 

[Kambo]

Hi JoWa
The original article from from the front page of The West Australian on Feb 17th 1988, which I posted an image of. Kimono Clue to a Brutal Murder which I posted an image of. The clue was DNA found on the kimono belonging to BRE.

[FONT=&quot]Mr Edwards, 48, was alsocharged with a home invasion at a Huntingdale home as far back as 1988, when hewas just 20. Police will allege he broke into the bedroom of a young woman andlay on top of her, before she struggled and he ran away...[/FONT]DNA found on a silk dressing gown dropped near the scene of the 1988 incident allegedly matched DNA recovered from the body of Ms Glennon and the Karrakatta rape victim...

It was also made clear that the kimono was stolen from a washing line, although it doesn't say who's line in the article.
http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/western-australia/claremont-serial-killings-police-piecing-together-the-life-of-bradley-robert-edwards/news-story/557f281e68cdf76d572843291ea9cef7”


The fact that the clue linked the brutal murder of VC to the perpetrator of the Huntingdale assault was identified by profilers bought over from America by The Post Newspaper as being the key to finding CSK. Subsequently around Sept and Oct 2015 (I think) a link was made between these crimes and the KK rape.

I have gone to find the Post articles from Sept and Oct 2015 and again recently and have found possible newspapers and pages from newspaper have been redacted / surpressed / missing from online. Recently on 31st December 2016 when The Post reported on BRE's arrest there are pages 14, 15, 16 and 17 missing and from 28th January 2017, page 54 is missing. I have asked for these papers from The Post, but they will not give me copies, although I have copies of every other newspaper since start of Jan 2017. IMO any information that could be used as part of the brief cops are using for the prosecution cases may be subject to suppression orders, and this could include the above information which I've read about recently and over the years.

RSBM
Innerchild - the missing pages from 31Dec16 are an advertising feature, namely the weekly specials for Farmer Jacks in Subi.

Do you have the issue of the post dated 07Jan17 - Womems Clothing Riddle article speaks of a floreat resident, ex huntingdale who was interviewed by police in the weeks proceeding BRE arrest regarding the theft of clothes from his line at his house in Huntingdale in 1988. I dont think they found the clothes 29 years on & wanted to return them & I dont ever recall Bret Christian commenting on a Kimono link.

His report on Oct 17, 2015 Fourth Serial killer victim linked for the first time the KK DNA and CG DNA. November 14, 2015 reports on Cottesloe Hotel/Drive in attack. Dec5, 2015 Two New Clues to Seial Killer reports the Commodore and screen printing links. Nothing about a Kimono or VC. His 31Dec16 report about Early Clues Missed - 3 opportunities that could have led them to the killer were kk drivers licence, JR upholstery samples & missed forensic clue untested from CG. Thats it.

My understanding is that the Kimono has no link to VC. It was left at the Huntingdale attack and at the time police believed that it may have been linked to the VC assault and murder because it was around the same time. It sat in storage for years and when re tested it was determined to have the DNA profile the same as Karrakatta and the other Claremont girls. I haven't seen anywhere state the kimono was VC's, or stolen from her area nor left at the scene of her death.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Canning Vale]

My understanding is that the Kimono has no link to VC. It was left at the Huntingdale attack and at the time police believed that it may have been linked to the VC assault and murder because it was around the same time. It sat in storage for years and when re tested it was determined to have the DNA profile the same as Karrakatta and the other Claremont girls. I haven't seen anywhere state the kimono was VC's, or stolen from her area nor left at the scene of her death.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Kambo, thanks for the clarification. It appears in 1988 when the kimono was found in Huntingdale the police were hopeful it was the same perp. as the VC murderer. Also, from memory the kimono was linked to the Huntingdale break-in, KK rape and only one of the Claremont ladies - I think JR. Can anyone else clarify this please? If this is the situation what evidence would they have for CG (ie the way she was left at the crime scene).

 

[Spooks-R-Us]

You would think also that there could be the perps DNA on the tape which was used. The description used was something like 'wrapped up like a Mummy'.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I thought the tape was found by the perp at the scene of the crime and then used to tie up the victim in a mummy style wrap. That would indicate the tape wrapping feature of attack wasn't premeditated and the perp just used what ever was laying around or grabbed it out of the bin.

IMO The attack may have been premeditated but the tape wrapping of victim wasn't.

[emoji317][emoji317][emoji317]

 

[Canning Vale]

I thought the tape was found by the perp at the scene of the crime and then used to tie up the victim in a mummy style wrap. That would indicate the tape wrapping feature of attack wasn't premeditated and the perp just used what ever was laying around or grabbed it out of the bin.

IMO The attack may have been premeditated but the tape wrapping of victim wasn't.

[emoji317][emoji317][emoji317]

Spooks, thanks for the reply.

Perhaps the wrapping was something from a building site's bin, like large sheets of bubble-wrap.

 

[petedavo.au]

Mr Cook said the review was needed to re-build the West Australian public's trust in the state's forensic services.

Review into 15 years of Pathwest results after DNA bungle http://www.watoday.com.au/wa-news/r...results-after-dna-bungle-20170510-gw1xry.html via @watoday

Sent from my HTC 2PQ910 using Tapatalk

 

[Innerchild]

Hi Kambo, The kimono was not VC's or taken from VC.

The kimono was stolen from a washing line, probably in Huntingdale. This was clearly stated in the conference of top cop after BREs arrest.

The kimono was stolen and taken to the assault of the Huntingdale victim and left at this scene with DNA on it which has been proved to be BRE's.

The clue on the front page of The West on Feb 17th 1988 was the DNA on kimono, not the kimono. You could not see anything on the kimono so most likely DNA was from semen found at VC matched with semen found on kimono from Huntingdale.

The same DNA linked both scenes but cops had no one to match with.

Respectfully I am not saying it was the kimono that linked VC and Huntingdale, it was the same DNA at Huntingdale assault and brutal sexual assault of VC and subsequently identified to belong to BRE.

Post on 17th Oct 2015 is talking about the DNA link between the KK rape and one of he CSK murders, so they also started to match this DNA with CSK.

Tiswas the link to thebrutal killing of VC, because copsfund DA at VC's sxual assautadmuder.

My understanding is that the Kimono has no link to VC. It was left at the Huntingdale attack and at the time police believed that it may have been linked to the VC assault and murder because it was around the same time. It sat in storage for years and when re tested it was determined to have the DNA profile the same as Karrakatta and the other Claremont girls. I haven't seen anywhere state the kimono was VC's, or stolen from her area nor left at the scene of her death.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Mcfishntackle]

Wonder why be hasn't yet made a plea, it because he knows he is done for and is trying to stretch out remand.,... Or go guilty, and won't tell us anything until his sentences will be reduced.,....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Kambo]

Hi Kambo, The kimono was not VC's or taken from VC.

The kimono was stolen from a washing line, probably in Huntingdale. This was clearly stated in the conference of top cop after BREs arrest.

The kimono was stolen and taken to the assault of the Huntingdale victim and left at this scene with DNA on it which has been proved to be BRE's.

The clue on the front page of The West on Feb 17th 1988 was the DNA on kimono, not the kimono. You could not see anything on the kimono so most likely DNA was from semen found at VC matched with semen found on kimono from Huntingdale.

The same DNA linked both scenes but cops had no one to match with.

Respectfully I am not saying it was the kimono that linked VC and Huntingdale, it was the same DNA at Huntingdale assault and brutal sexual assault of VC and subsequently identified to belong to BRE.

Post on 17th Oct 2015 is talking about the DNA link between the KK rape and one of he CSK murders, so they also started to match this DNA with CSK.

Tiswas the link to thebrutal killing of VC, because copsfund DA at

Agree to disagree. People interpret information in different ways. I don't believe BRE's DNA was found at the VC scene. I am happy for it to be proven otherwise in the fullness of time. I suspect it was a police tactic in 1988 to link the two crimes to try and put pressure on the offender.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Innerchild]

Thanks for the below photo Innerchild.

I am interested in who the woman is directly back to the right from MM. I actually think she is in all 4 frames and in the last 2 frames she appears to be putting a jacket on.

She also appears to be waiting for MM.

I originally thought these 4 frames were continuous ad MM was walking past JR, with the same person in background putting on a jumper.

However, when I caught he vision frame by frame there is 20 seconds between the top two frames and the bottom two fames I believe.

There was a woman behind MM in top 2 frames and he has stopped and taking to JR. Then another 20 seconds later in real time, the bottom two frames and the remainder of that sequence is shown. This is not jumping from cameras.

The girl in the top 2 frames has a partial obscuring mark on her and I think she was randomly in frame and walked off, because the next two frames were 20s later.

The figure in bottom 2 frames IMO is now definitely male and puts arms directly out to R and then directly out to L putting arms into jumper, before walking off with MM.

I think MM was talking to JR at east 20 and up to 45 sec, waiting for young shorter guy.

If MM was arranging to drop off his young mate and meet up with JR outside Conti later, JR may not have shared this with her friends if they thought he was creepy and she knew they wouldn't approve, just m theory only.

 

[Canning Vale]

Wonder why be hasn't yet made a plea, it because he knows he is done for and is trying to stretch out remand.,... Or go guilty, and won't tell us anything until his sentences will be reduced.,....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I don't know, but at least we know where he is.....

 

[DRT]

Another mention of the yellow Toyota in the May 1988 Sheraton attack.

Also victim was dumped corner of Leach Highway and Centenary Drive.

I thought the tape was found by the perp at the scene of the crime and then used to tie up the victim in a mummy style wrap. That would indicate the tape wrapping feature of attack wasn't premeditated and the perp just used what ever was laying around or grabbed it out of the bin.
IMO The attack may have been premeditated but the tape wrapping of victim wasn't.

[emoji317][emoji317][emoji317]

The wrap was plastic sheeting. I am no sure if this is more or less likely to have DNA on it.

 

[DRT]

Wrapping someone up in tape may suggest the perp. had intentions of throwing her into the river - now I'm starting to think like a homicidal maniac! Perhaps someone disturbed him and he took off hurriedly not having time to finish the job. :thinking:

Something else has just hit me.... the woman was aged 45 that's the approximate age BREs mother would have been. Perhaps that's why he didn't rape her, he had no intentions of doing so, just wanted to cause physical assault. Perhaps the victim was chosen because she resembled BREs mother. We need photos of both for a comparison.

These are only my thoughts and opinions.

I have reposted the article which clarifies there was a sexual assault. In all honesty, I think while 45 year olds can look young for their age there are very few or probably none that look in their 20s. While JC and the lady at the Sheraton may be related even with a 23 year difference in their age group it does not appear to be in BRE's profile to attack an older woman.

 

[meticulously]

Hi Kambo, The kimono was not VC's or taken from VC.

The kimono was stolen from a washing line, probably in Huntingdale. This was clearly stated in the conference of top cop after BREs arrest.

The kimono was stolen and taken to the assault of the Huntingdale victim and left at this scene with DNA on it which has been proved to be BRE's.

The clue on the front page of The West on Feb 17th 1988 was the DNA on kimono, not the kimono. You could not see anything on the kimono so most likely DNA was from semen found at VC matched with semen found on kimono from Huntingdale.

The same DNA linked both scenes but cops had no one to match with.

Respectfully I am not saying it was the kimono that linked VC and Huntingdale, it was the same DNA at Huntingdale assault and brutal sexual assault of VC and subsequently identified to belong to BRE.

Post on 17th Oct 2015 is talking about the DNA link between the KK rape and one of he CSK murders, so they also started to match this DNA with CSK.

Tiswas the link to thebrutal killing of VC, because copsfund DA at VC's sxual assautadmuder.

---------------------------------
---------------------------------

http://www.news.com.au/national/cla...t/news-story/cdad7c5a6b825958b6d46cb11eb44c75

"the robe was put into storage at WA Police’s evidence receival centre, where it sat unnoticed alongside hundreds of thousands of exhibits until just a few months ago.

As part of a continuing operation to retest old evidence with new technology, officers from the State Crime Operations team did DNA tests on the kimono.

It told police that the serial killer they were hunting may have been the same person who dropped the kimono. While the DNA link did not give them a name for that person, it did provide detectives with fresh investigative opportunities contained within the pages of the 1988 case file.

As a result of re-examining that case, it’s understood the major breakthrough — the details of which are not yet clear — came within weeks." Quote.

Surely this explains it , or does it not ?

.