Australia Australia - Claremont SK, 1996-97, Perth, WA - #14

[JoWa]

Petedavo, thanks for that.

I can't remember when we started using ATMs, and Eftpos here in Perth - they just started popping up all over the place. We used to have a little bank book and needed to be at the bank before 3.30pm to get cash. We had to budget our payments and cash requirements by pre-planning.

This is just a bit of trivia for the young-sleuths. A bankcard wasn't so easy to obtain, my husband applied for one (about 1986) and was told he couldn't have one because he didn't need one. He didn't have a lot of payments to make, because we used to save up and pay cash. Gaining credit back then wasn't easy - it's much easier nowadays.

Although you could have gotten a debit card, my brother had one around then and my parents got me one in 1990 from challenge bank.


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[JoWa]

Was trying to find the original kimono article from the west Australian in feb 1988 and came across this website below. It is so biased and filled with hate (along with spelling and grammar errors). It just goes to show how dodgy information on the internet is and how valuable reputable sources can be.

http://nyt.bz/ClaremontSerialKillings.html




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[Foolio79]

"Fresh investigative opportunities" does not indicate anything particular.
So where did WS users get the notion that familial DNA helped catch the alleged CSK BRE???
Was that whole 'familial DNA' conversation here on WS just speculation by sleuthers?
Or was there a MSM link to familial DNA leading WAPOL to the accused???
Can somebody please clear this up for me? Did I miss something important???
TIA
[emoji317][emoji317][emoji317]

Yes familial DNA was mentioned in MSM after the arrest. You just need to a simple google search.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...d/news-story/f34913420ecf0edf1a4b991994f8254d

"Next came the technique sometimes called “familial DNA” where police look for people who are closely related to a suspected offender."

 

[Canning Vale]

Yes familial DNA was mentioned in MSM after the arrest. You just need to a simple google search.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...d/news-story/f34913420ecf0edf1a4b991994f8254d

"Next came the technique sometimes called “familial DNA” where police look for people who are closely related to a suspected offender."

Although we the public have been advised that familial DNA was responsible for locating the accused (BRE) they probably couldn't reveal the source. Whether that be Ancestry.com, or one of BREs relatives. We all want to know now but need to be patient and wait for it to be revealed.

:tantrum:

 

[JoWa]

What about Eftpos transactions, they'd prove someone was at the hotel on the nights in question. The hotel would have needed to retain Eftpos receipts for taxation purposes. Surly the police would have seized them at the time. What about an ATM in the actual hotel?

Now that they have BREs bank account details the bank can produce historical statements which will show what areas he's been at, on specific days.

Also, Telstra possibly supplied some staff with credit cards for fuel purchases or a Star card, which would reveal if he had fueled-up within the vicinity. Even if Telstra hasn't got the statements, the banks should be able to produce them.

There must be something which puts him at the scene. These are only in my opinion.

It would be nice to think there was something but IMO a person who has a perpensity to break the law, whether planned or random, would be careful about leaving a trail. Similar to his online presence and his dislike of photos on social media.

Years ago (probably well over a decade) there was something on the news about police tracking down everyone that was in Claremont that night from CCTV and receipts, not just the hotel but all of Claremont. Think they located over 700 people and traced their steps that night all except MM. It was huge and all over the news because it was the first time anything like this had been attempted. Can anyone else remember this or provide links. It was a long time ago now.


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[Canning Vale]

It would be nice to think there was something but IMO a person who has a perpensity to break the law, whether planned or random, would be careful about leaving a trail. Similar to his online presence and his dislike of photos on social media.

I understand what you've typed about the photos and social media, seemingly he kept a low profile incase someone recognized him. Only in my opinion of course. It seems serial killer's often get caught by chance, for example Ted Bundy was arrested for failing to stop for a police officer. After searching his car they found what they initially thought to be burglary tools (ie ski mask, crowbar, handcuffs, trash bags and an icepick).

 

[Innerchild]

Now that’s a light piece of bedtime reading!

If you want a companion piece to this Ä Police whistle-blower in a corrupt political system, contact me for a lazy 99 page document which is well written and credible enough to finally convince the Authorities to hold an inquest into the murder of Shirley Finn. There are many names redacted but you get the idea that the Commish (1984-95), Assist Commish, Head of Fraud, CIB and others in the purple circle, are accused of corrupt behaviour, Illegal betting, prostitution, drugs, collusion with bikies, prostitutes, horse race fixing, cover ups the occasional murder and promotion of corrupt officers.
Many good cops in those days requested transfers to the country, were forcibly retired or just had to do what they were told no matter what.

http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/wes...n/news-story/ebbdde09e023218eb06647257ad110d9

Was trying to find the original kimono article from the west Australian in feb 1988 and came across this website below. It is so biased and filled with hate (along with spelling and grammar errors). It just goes to show how dodgy information on the internet is and how valuable reputable sources can be.

http://nyt.bz/ClaremontSerialKillings.html




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[Canning Vale]

As everyone's gone quiet, is it worthwhile me researching and posting some of the ways serial killers were caught?

 

[Innerchild]

Agree to disagree. It’s like one of those images that two people can see totally different perceptions. My sources are the same as yours.

Kimono clue to a brutal killing The West Australian, Perth Wednesday February 17 1988
by Cyril Ayris "This kimono may be the clue that helps solve the brutal killing of Victoria Heather Clark, 30, in Victoria Park last September. It was dropped by a man that walked
into a Huntingdale house early on Monday morning and lay on top of a sleeping 18-year-old girl...

Reading the Feb 17[SUP]th[/SUP] 1988 newspaper report is confusing, except if you were the cops or the killer(s). We know that it wasn’t the kimono that came from the VC murder. It was stolen and left at Huntingdale with BRE’s DNA on it. The clue that they thought would solve VC brutal killing was the same DNA. Confirmation of that only came at the arrest of BRE in Dec 2016 that it was DNA of BRE on the kimono.

[FONT=&amp]The Post reports from years ago that I followed detailing the overseas expert bought to Perth, I cannot find copies of. Also, with some behind the scenes help I have checked every missing online page from The Post from the start of Jan to now, The only paper that they wouldn’t give me was 28[SUP]th[/SUP]Jan and I need to check pg 54, if anyone can help there.[/FONT]

Agree to disagree. People interpret information in different ways. I don't believe BRE's DNA was found at the VC scene. I am happy for it to be proven otherwise in the fullness of time. I suspect it was a police tactic in 1988 to link the two crimes to try and put pressure on the offender.


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[justified]

Bankcard started in 1974
ATM's rolled out in 1977
EFTPOS started in 1983

The next year my employer at the time, Vicrail changed from cash wages to electronic bank deposits for pays, and I had to use an ATM to get cash. Thankfully all retailers in Melbourne took bankcard, so it wasn't a big issue.

https://www.eftposaustralia.com.au/about/

http://www.apca.com.au/about-payments/history-of-payments


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Thanks for that, time moves so quickly. I meant more that it was not common usage like today with paywave etc. I had tge old green bank card in early 80's but going out me & my girlfriends used cash.

 

[Innerchild]

That's the guy to watch

Not sure if he is MM, he looks shorter. Is this the guy that had his face deliberately blocked? Is he a cop?

Cops had clear and sharp images but did not release any images to public for many years. Then when they released the images they were so blurry its hard to see anything. One of the main factors in identifying and catching Adrian Bayley was releasing the security camera images immediately. I have seen a clean image of MM inside and what he is doing suggests to me he is BRE.
I’m sure with their clear images they will know whether MM is BRE, then there will be another pile of questions to ask Caporn, to go with “boot lined guy”’ queries from other police officers.

 

[DRT]

Was trying to find the original kimono article from the west Australian in feb 1988 and came across this website below. It is so biased and filled with hate (along with spelling and grammar errors). It just goes to show how dodgy information on the internet is and how valuable reputable sources can be.

http://nyt.bz/ClaremontSerialKillings.html




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The article has been posted on this site before in full I looked before across a couple of threads and could not find it.

 

[DRT]

Thanks for that, time moves so quickly. I meant more that it was not common usage like today with paywave etc. I had tge old green bank card in early 80's but going out me & my girlfriends used cash.

Last year or the year before I went to a shop on its opening day and they said that the EFTPOS machines didn't work. The lady said they had to do stuff manually. I was quite amused by them bringing out the old metal credit card machines that imprinted the credit card details onto some carbon paper and ringing up to verify my details. I could have gone to the ATM to get the money out but it was all too amusing.

 

[Canning Vale]

Evidently, familial DNA can be obtained from a pap smear. That’s how long-term serial killer Dennis Lynn Rader was proven guilty.

From the 1970s to the 1990s, Dennis Rader the "BTK Killer"— which stands for "bind, torture, and kill"— terrorized the Wichita, Kansas area. In 2005, he was finally caught and revealed to be a seemingly average married father of two.
Despite the extensive circumstantial evidence, police needed more concrete proof. In a controversial move, the police obtained DNA from Rader’s daughter’s pap smear. The DNA matched evidence found under the fingernails of a BTK victim. With the combined DNA evidence and Rader’s twisted letters, police were able to make an arrest.
http://www.biography.com/people/dennis-rader-241487

WAs Department of Health manages a pap smear registry, I don't suppose the police can access this database.

http://ww2.health.wa.gov.au/About-us

 

[JoWa]

The article has been posted on this site before in full I looked before across a couple of threads and could not find it.

Thanks for trying, I have looked too. Keep getting nauseous from the rolling screen. Eventually I may find it.


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[Spooks-R-Us]

Not sure if he is MM, he looks shorter. Is this the guy that had his face deliberately blocked? Is he a cop?

.

I think he could be a cop - there is something unusual on his belt that could be a cop accessory.

Pic below taken from myleftfoot's post

 

[meticulously]

Thanks for trying, I have looked too. Keep getting nauseous from the rolling screen. Eventually I may find it.


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Jowa , i wonder if this one of the articles you want to read ?

http://awn.bz/site/mobile?url=http://awn.bz/CSK_websleuths_2.html#2714
-----------------------------------

Hi Canning Vale, as you have mentioned looking at some historic cases i recall this one was very interesting as it does cover some of the claremont case and procedure relating to the macro taskforce operations regarding dna / claremont murders . Things about the dna knowledge at the time and the horrific sex assault in Scarborough perth (dixie).

These are the face identikits of mark dixie seen in the documentary

https://youtu.be/Idh0IAXhPVs

.

 

[meticulously]

rsbm..
Kimono clue to a brutal killing The West Australian, Perth Wednesday February 17 1988
by Cyril Ayris "This kimono may be the clue that helps solve the brutal killing of Victoria Heather Clark, 30, in Victoria Park last September. It was dropped by a man that walked
into a Huntingdale house early on Monday morning and lay on top of a sleeping 18-year-old girl...
Rsbm..
Reading the Feb 17[SUP]th[/SUP] 1988 newspaper report is confusing, except if you were the cops or the killer(s). We know that it wasn’t the kimono that came from the VC murder. It was stolen and left at Huntingdale with BRE’s DNA on it. The clue that they thought would solve VC brutal killing was the same DNA. Confirmation of that only came at the arrest of BRE in Dec

Hi Innerchild , this is about masters and mentions BROOME and Katherine .
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=325088
.

 

[no name]

I think My Left Foot was saying that RDM was someone worthy of more attention whom is not MM. Please confirm MLF?

 

[MyLeftFoot]

I think My Left Foot was saying that RDM was someone worthy of more attention whom is not MM. Please confirm MLF?

That's for you to speculate on no name!