GUILTY Australia - Daniel Morcombe, 13, Woombye, QLD, 7 Dec 2003 - #1

[icu nurse]

I agree!! Sadly, I think a whole lot more happened between where Daniel was picked up & the house. I also think when Cowan was "confessing" to Arnold, he may have been a bit wary & was weighing up how far he could or should go with all he told him. He needed to stay in the good books with Arnold. To tell him there was another involved in the abduction, in his mind, may have led to problems between himself & Arnold & he perhaps didn't want to risk that happening.

In my opinion, self preservation is what it's all about with these creeps.

I think you're absolutely correct here Marley.
Another person, regardless of their level of involvement, still means a witness .... And as Cowan was believing this was a super strong crime "family" the stupidity of having someone else be able to place him with extreme detail there might not have been something he wanted to admit to.


One statement that strikes me "I didn't even get to molest him or nothing"........ Like his biggest regret was missing out. But it's sort of a weird remark to make, out of context with the rest of the confession - it just sort of pops at me. Like "I didn't even get my turn" (but still had to dump the body) - kind of petulant maybe? I'm not sure. But it does seem to fit better under the assumption he wasn't alone.

I'll leave it to the psychologists and linguistic analysts - but that statement to me feels like there is a great deal unsaid.

 

[MsAnais]

I can't imagine that Daniel willingly sat in the front seat of Cowan's 4wd for a 20-30 min drive down the highway. I also don't believe the 'he panicked, I panicked' and it was all over.

There were numerous witnesses to a blue boxy car, and two men. I think Cowan left his white pajero in the church carpark, while Daniel was forced into the blue vehicle, one man driving, one man holding him down. The drug dealers removed their pokies card from the Beerwah RSL at 2:20/2:22pm. Were they called in to help Cowan get back to his vehicle and then head straight home? Jackway arrived back at Ipswich at 4:30pm, he's known to speed.
MOO

BBM Absolutely agree! When he said that, it just leapt out as a poorly thought out lie. No one is going to just calmly sit there for nearly half an hour - especially when the deal was (apparently) to be dropped off at the shopping centre.

He's lying all the way IMO. And he's not intelligent enough to formulate realistic sounding lies that have any rationale to them.

I just hope they can somehow get the others involved.......lease:

 

[marlywings]

I think you're absolutely correct here Marley.
Another person, regardless of their level of involvement, still means a witness .... And as Cowan was believing this was a super strong crime "family" the stupidity of having someone else be able to place him with extreme detail there might not have been something he wanted to admit to.


One statement that strikes me "I didn't even get to molest him or nothing"........ Like his biggest regret was missing out. But it's sort of a weird remark to make, out of context with the rest of the confession - it just sort of pops at me. Like "I didn't even get my turn" (but still had to dump the body) - kind of petulant maybe? I'm not sure. But it does seem to fit better under the assumption he wasn't alone.

I'll leave it to the psychologists and linguistic analysts - but that statement to me feels like there is a great deal unsaid.

I hope for Daniel's sake he wasn't molested. It's shocking even thinking about it however I do think there's a whole lot more to that part of the story especially as Cowan didn't seem to go into too much detail at all compared to other parts of the "interview".

Cowan's line "I didn't even get to molest him or nothing".....says to me, he's told Arnold he's a murderer but he's not going to tell him he's also a child molester. Arnold mentioned quite a few times "I'm not going to judge you". Cowan the coward wasn't going that far just in case Arnold did start judging him at some point. The creeps are professional liars & know exactly how much detail to add in to protect their own backsides.

One line that gives me chills.... after Arnold asked him if he'd left any DNA or blood in the house. Cowan replied...

C: No nothing and even if there was my DNA in the house I’d been there before with another guy.

So it's most likely his DNA was in the house & if it was ever found all he had to say was...he'd been there with another guy.

Who was that "other guy"....Jackaway??...another child??

 

[SapphireSteel]

I think its fair to say, he was lying.

For example, Daniels watch.

Forensic linguistics say any time a denial is qualified, there is deception.

Cowan said he "100% did not have" Daniels's watch.

As we all know, the truth is the truth, there is no "percentage" attached...unless, you're lying.

From what is being revealed I suspect there were 2 perps and Daniel was assaulted by both.

Poor little guy....

 

[ozazure]

The owners of the mulcher testified last week. The drug dealers aren't the same people.

19th Feb 2014

FRANK and Hazel Davis, who knew Mr Cowan from the Suncoast Christian Church, said Mr Cowan collected a mulcher from their property at Perwillowen Rd, Nambour, the day Daniel disappeared.

Mr Davis, 80, said Mr Cowan worked for his son Trevor's sandblasting business in 2002-03 and was regular at their family functions.

He said Brett had phoned to borrow the mulcher between 12.45pm and 1pm.

"It would have been half to three quarters of an hour later and I helped him load the mulcher into his vehicle.

"I now know it was a white Pajero stationwagon … five doors if you count the back one.


http://www.sunshinecoastdaily.com.a...be-witness-says-car-parked-silly-ang/2174828/

----------------------------------------------------

February 20, 2014

A drug dealer cannot remember whether Daniel Morcombe's accused killer visited her house to score on the afternoon the teenager disappeared 10 years ago.

Sandra Drummond supplied Brett Peter Cowan, the man charged with Daniel's murder, with marijuana for about two years.

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...disappeared-20140220-3332x.html#ixzz2ubEUwust

Thanks for the recap Marly, I am not sure how I missed that!!

 

[Fuskier]

I think its fair to say, he was lying.

For example, Daniels watch.

Forensic linguistics say any time a denial is qualified, there is deception.

Cowan said he "100% did not have" Daniels's watch.

As we all know, the truth is the truth, there is no "percentage" attached...unless, you're lying.

From what is being revealed I suspect there were 2 perps and Daniel was assaulted by both.

Poor little guy....

Hypothetically, this scenario could be: he was abducted, overpowered, threatened ,subjected to verbal & physical violence, violently sexually assaulted by two grown paedophiles, then murdered and his body subsequently dumped?

Being a decent little boy, from a decent family, who had saved his money and was on his way to buy Christmas presents for his family, he must have been filled with abject fear for his own safety and life, then terror at the realisation that these 'bad' men weren't about to let him go.

Sorrow for Daniel and the Morcombe family. May these two crims suffer the consequences and punishment by legal penalty for these crimes. I wish they would bring back hanging IMO. Some criminals actions are so deviant, that they need to be locked away from the rest of the community for the rest of their lives. They can never be rehabilitated IMO.

:candle:

 

[Crimson clover]

Hypothetically, this scenario could be: he was abducted, overpowered, threatened ,subjected to verbal & physical violence, violently sexually assaulted by two grown paedophiles, then murdered and his body subsequently dumped?

Being a decent little boy, from a decent family, who had saved his money and was on his way to buy Christmas presents for his family, he must have been filled with abject fear for his own safety and life, then terror at the realisation that these 'bad' men weren't about to let him go.Sorrow for Daniel and the Morcombe family. May these two crims suffer the consequences and punishment by legal penalty for these crimes. I wish they would bring back hanging IMO. Some criminals actions are so deviant, that they need to be locked away from the rest of the community for the rest of their lives. They can never be rehabilitated IMO.

:candle:

BBM
I'm of the religious sort...so I believe there is a heavenly aura that surrounds our innocent children, like Daniel...experiencing fear and terror, before death.

Hanging? I've read that capital punishment has been abolished in Australia.
Crimes of nature against children, IMO, are the most evil acts in our society.
I'd support justice by castration...preferably by rubber bands...and only cuz I'm nice.

 

[Crimson clover]

According to Cowan's confession...
http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...owans-confession/story-fnihsrf2-1226840017462
Daniel jumped into the passenger seat of his Pajero, then later put in the back by the mulcher.
Police confiscated the Pajero...searched, dusted for prints...to no forensic avail.

I'm thinking, Daniel may never have touched Cowan's stuff. Which lays even more credence to the blue sedan and a two-perp scenario.

Daniel was only at the bus stop between 1:30 to 2:15 ish (45 minutes), right?
How is it two sexual predators, in two separate vehicles...manage this abduction? Are they laying in wait under the overpass?

 

[SapphireSteel]

I think possibly BC drove past, saw him, phoned his mate, then waited till he got there to stuff Daniel in his car.

I don't believe for one second Daniel agreed to go anywhere with him.

I sincerely hope LE have enough to lock these two away for ever.

No we don't have the DP, as tempting as it is we voted it out decades ago along with the rest of the world except you guys.

It's not the answer. Satisfying for onlookers, but useless, punishment wise.

 

[they'll get you]

I'm confused that so many witnesses have seen so many different cars, a white 4x4, a boxy blue car and a white van.
Why would Cowan lie and cover up for Jackway?
It would be a huge coincidence for Cowan & Jackway to be in the same vicinity, so if Cowan has called Jackway, surely the police have the phone records from these germs. For the two to be there in their cars, did Cowan phone Jackway from the church car park or from near the underpass and tell Jackway of his find? From reports I've been reading these pedophiles offend many times and have a well thought plan for the quick grooming of children. These mongrels would have to work quickly to get Daniel into the car in front of so many passersby.
EXAMPLE: If Cowan was waiting to catch the bus and Jackway pulls over, partially on the road saying his little kitten was stuck under the seat of his car and could he have help. Cowan offers help but needs small arms to get the cat and asks Daniel to help. Why would Daniel think there was any plan, Cowan hasn't got a car there and he's waiting for a bus too? I'd nearlyconsider helping! Daniel is already in the car, Cowan jumps in on him and holds him there and Jackway jumps in drives off.
Cowan is guilty and he's gone but how do the police get Jackway? Phone records maybe?

Looking at the photos of Cowan & Jackway they appear to be painted with the same brush as that scum Adrian Bayley, who incidentally changed his name too! (JILL MAHERS MURDER).

 

[MsAnais]

I'm confused that so many witnesses have seen so many different cars, a white 4x4, a boxy blue car and a white van.
Why would Cowan lie and cover up for Jackway?
It would be a huge coincidence for Cowan & Jackway to be in the same vicinity, so if Cowan has called Jackway, surely the police have the phone records from these germs. For the two to be there in their cars, did Cowan phone Jackway from the church car park or from near the underpass and tell Jackway of his find? From reports I've been reading these pedophiles offend many times and have a well thought plan for the quick grooming of children. These mongrels would have to work quickly to get Daniel into the car in front of so many passersby.
EXAMPLE: If Cowan was waiting to catch the bus and Jackway pulls over, partially on the road saying his little kitten was stuck under the seat of his car and could he have help. Cowan offers help but needs small arms to get the cat and asks Daniel to help. Why would Daniel think there was any plan, Cowan hasn't got a car there and he's waiting for a bus too? I'd nearlyconsider helping! Daniel is already in the car, Cowan jumps in on him and holds him there and Jackway jumps in drives off.
Cowan is guilty and he's gone but how do the police get Jackway? Phone records maybe?

Looking at the photos of Cowan & Jackway they appear to be painted with the same brush as that scum Adrian Bayley, who incidentally changed his name too! (JILL MAHERS MURDER).

The only other issue is the reliability of eye-witness testimony. I just watched a documentary on Paul Bernado & Karla Homolka :facepalm: who abducted and killed teenage girls. Anyway, several witnesses told LE - and were adamant! - that the car they saw a girl climb into was a white Camaro. It shaped the whole missing persons investigation. It turned out that it was actually a gold Nissan.........perhaps a white Camaro was in the area and they all got confused - who knows the explanation for that??

But research has shown again and again that unfortunately, eye-witness testimony is very fallible - particularly in relation to colour and detail.

 

[Crimson clover]

I'm confused that so many witnesses have seen so many different cars, a white 4x4, a boxy blue car and a white van.
Why would Cowan lie and cover up for Jackway?
It would be a huge coincidence for Cowan & Jackway to be in the same vicinity, so if Cowan has called Jackway, surely the police have the phone records from these germs. For the two to be there in their cars, did Cowan phone Jackway from the church car park or from near the underpass and tell Jackway of his find? From reports I've been reading these pedophiles offend many times and have a well thought plan for the quick grooming of children. These mongrels would have to work quickly to get Daniel into the car in front of so many passersby.
EXAMPLE: If Cowan was waiting to catch the bus and Jackway pulls over, partially on the road saying his little kitten was stuck under the seat of his car and could he have help. Cowan offers help but needs small arms to get the cat and asks Daniel to help. Why would Daniel think there was any plan, Cowan hasn't got a car there and he's waiting for a bus too? I'd nearlyconsider helping! Daniel is already in the car, Cowan jumps in on him and holds him there and Jackway jumps in drives off.
Cowan is guilty and he's gone but how do the police get Jackway? Phone records maybe?

Looking at the photos of Cowan & Jackway they appear to be painted with the same brush as that scum Adrian Bayley, who incidentally changed his name too! (JILL MAHERS MURDER).

BBM
We are assured prosecution is privy to Cowan's phone records.
http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...-daniel-morcombe/story-fnihsrf2-1226835868869

Cowan was told he made a call to a man called Andrew Stevens at 8.51am on December 7, 2003.

He was told by the detectives the next call made on his home phone at Alfs Pinch Rd was to Frank Davis at 1.50pm.

Cowan said he had his mobile phone on him that day, as well, but didn’t make any calls.

He was told by police there was a call to his landline at Beerwah from his mobile at 12.58pm.

Were there contact between Cowan and Jackway...it hasn't been revealed, but, surely would prove a bombshell of a smoking gun. If.

 

[marlywings]

I'm confused that so many witnesses have seen so many different cars, a white 4x4, a boxy blue car and a white van.
Why would Cowan lie and cover up for Jackway?
It would be a huge coincidence for Cowan & Jackway to be in the same vicinity, so if Cowan has called Jackway, surely the police have the phone records from these germs. For the two to be there in their cars, did Cowan phone Jackway from the church car park or from near the underpass and tell Jackway of his find? From reports I've been reading these pedophiles offend many times and have a well thought plan for the quick grooming of children. These mongrels would have to work quickly to get Daniel into the car in front of so many passersby.
EXAMPLE: If Cowan was waiting to catch the bus and Jackway pulls over, partially on the road saying his little kitten was stuck under the seat of his car and could he have help. Cowan offers help but needs small arms to get the cat and asks Daniel to help. Why would Daniel think there was any plan, Cowan hasn't got a car there and he's waiting for a bus too? I'd nearlyconsider helping! Daniel is already in the car, Cowan jumps in on him and holds him there and Jackway jumps in drives off.
Cowan is guilty and he's gone but how do the police get Jackway? Phone records maybe?

Looking at the photos of Cowan & Jackway they appear to be painted with the same brush as that scum Adrian Bayley, who incidentally changed his name too! (JILL MAHERS MURDER).

Why would Cowan lie & cover up for Jackaway??. As I said a page or so back, I think Cowan is terrified of Jackaway. He'd be well aware of the consequences in prison if he's caught & implicates Jackaway,..... who is already in prison with not much chance of being released.

As I also said a page or so back, I think Jackaway is the more evil of the two. By the very definition of the word predator, they focus on young children & zoom in on their prey whenever an opportunity arises. I think that opportunity arose for Jackaway & he roped Cowan into being the "front man" in helping him abduct Daniel.

Cowan is at the high end of stupid...stupid enough not to realise passing motorists would be able to give detailed accounts of his looks & appearance. Stupid enough not to twig at all that his "employer, the crime gang" were in fact police. Jackaway, the more cunning of the two, would know if anyone was caught, it would be Cowan.

Even though many of the witnesses stated they noticed two guys, there's only been one or two who gave any sort of detailed account of the second guy they'd seen on the side of the road. So I think Jackaway knew to keep himself hidden for majority of that time. I don't recall any witnesses stating they actually noticed Daniel being put into the blue car. In my opinion I think Cowan waited until there was a break in passing traffic then grabbed Daniel & bundled him into the car.

 

[MsAnais]

Why would Cowan lie & cover up for Jackaway??. As I said a page or so back, I think Cowan is terrified of Jackaway. He'd be well aware of the consequences in prison if he's caught & implicates Jackaway,..... who is already in prison with not much chance of being released.

As I also said a page or so back, I think Jackaway is the more evil of the two. By the very definition of the word predator, they focus on young children & zoom in on their prey whenever an opportunity arises. I think that opportunity arose for Jackaway & he roped Cowan into being the "front man" in helping him abduct Daniel.

Cowan is at the high end of stupid...stupid enough not to realise passing motorists would be able to give detailed accounts of his looks & appearance. Stupid enough not to twig at all that his "employer, the crime gang" were in fact police. Jackaway, the more cunning of the two, would know if anyone was caught, it would be Cowan.

Even though many of the witnesses stated they noticed two guys, there's only been one or two who gave any sort of detailed account of the second guy they'd seen on the side of the road. So I think Jackaway knew to keep himself hidden for majority of that time. I don't recall any witnesses stating they actually noticed Daniel being put into the blue car. In my opinion I think Cowan waited until there was a break in passing traffic then grabbed Daniel & bundled him into the car.

BBM That is - sadly - just so true, Marly. When I worked in child protection it was absolutely chilling to discover how paedophiles operate. And you are right - they are predatory and their focus on young children is obsessional. They are always ready to act IMO, should the opportunity arise.

That work absolutely destroyed any innocence I had left! As a parent now, I am really vigilant anywhere I go with the kids. And I notice every single man lurking on the beach, in the playground, the shops....anywhere. If you look, you see them. They watch children. It's truly terrible :facepalm:

 

[marlywings]

Looking at the photos of Cowan & Jackway they appear to be painted with the same brush as that scum Adrian Bayley, who incidentally changed his name too! (JILL MAHERS MURDER).

From all I've read it's quite common for criminals to change their name. One of Sian Kingi's evil killers, Valmae Beck, changed her name to Fay Cramb.

They "think" people will, in time, forget their original names. Cowan's name change was because he so stupidly thought the law would never catch up with him if he changed his name = another example of his level of stupid!!

 

[marlywings]

BBM
I'm of the religious sort...so I believe there is a heavenly aura that surrounds our innocent children, like Daniel...experiencing fear and terror, before death.

Hanging? I've read that capital punishment has been abolished in Australia.
Crimes of nature against children, IMO, are the most evil acts in our society.
I'd support justice by castration...preferably by rubber bands...and only cuz I'm nice.

I have another idea of how they should be treated. It involves very high prison walls, with no roof, in the middle of the Simpson Desert. No beds, no air con or heating, no blankets, no tv, no gym, no computers/internet, most basic of food......virtually nothing. Send them there & tell them to fend for themselves.

And send a very clear message to the predators saying, if you dare to touch our children, the above is the fate that awaits you.

 

[marlywings]

BBM That is - sadly - just so true, Marly. When I worked in child protection it was absolutely chilling to discover how paedophiles operate. And you are right - they are predatory and their focus on young children is obsessional. They are always ready to act IMO, should the opportunity arise.

That work absolutely destroyed any innocence I had left! As a parent now, I am really vigilant anywhere I go with the kids. And I notice every single man lurking on the beach, in the playground, the shops....anywhere. If you look, you see them. They watch children. It's truly terrible :facepalm:

I read some time back, one of the most common places they're found these days is on the perimeters of schools. They sit outside & wait for the kids to come out of school, they have camera at hand & are quite often caught taking photos of them.

It's truly horrific the lengths they go to.

 

[Fuskier]

Monday 3rd March 2014 Day 13 of the Daniel Morcombe trial today.

 

[Fuskier]

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 1m
Day 13: The Daniel Morcombe trial has resumed, with more audio recordings from the undercover operation

Tessa Scott ‏@TessaScott9 5m
Justice Atkinson tells #Morcombe jury trial is now expected to run 5 weeks, not 6 weeks like originally thought @9NewsBrisbane

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 1m
Cowan is talking with crime boss Arnold about arrangements for the next couple of days, when they will "sort things out". #morcombe

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 3m
Fitzy to Cowan: This time next week mate it will all be in ya past and we will never f... talk about it ever again. #morcombe

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 39s
They headed back to Nambour Connection Rd, Cowan pointed out where he saw broken down bus, under the overpass and to the church car park.
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Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 2m
Cowan was put up for the night and Fitzy and another covert officer Ian picked him up for a flight to QLD the following morning. #morcombe

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 1m
After landing in Brisbane, Cowan and the two coverts got into a covert police car set up with GPS tracking. #morcombe

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 2m
Cowan directed them to Beerwah, firstly to where he used to live on Alf's Pinch Rd. #morcombe

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 1m
They drove by Sandra Drummond's house and then to where Cowan said he had picked up the mulcher. #morcombe

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 1m
They headed back to Nambour Connection Rd, Cowan pointed out where he saw broken down bus, under the overpass and to the church car park.

Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 1m
Cowan described to the undercover police how he'd picked up Daniel as they drove under the overpass. #morcombe

 

[Fuskier]

Francene Norton ‏@francenenorton 8s
Fitzy says Cowan directed them to his former home, drug dealer's home and Nambour Connection Road. #morcombe @abcnews

Francene Norton ‏@francenenorton 2m
Fitzy tells court Cowan, he and another undercover officer called "Ian" flew to Brisbane. Then drove to Beerwah. #morcombe @abcnews

Francene Norton ‏@francenenorton 4m
Jury hears more audio recordings. Fitzy tells Cowan "This time next week it will all be in ya past..." #morcombe @abcnews

Tessa Scott ‏@TessaScott9 1m
Covert "Fitzy" detailing flying Perth to Bris with Cowan, telling jury accused showed them where picked up Daniel #Morcombe @9NewsBrisbane

Francene Norton ‏@francenenorton 2m
Fitzy says Cowan "described where he abducted Daniel". #morcombe @abcnews