Found Deceased Australia - Karen Ristevski, 47, Melbourne, Vic, 29 June 2016 - #5

[Unit45]

Karen's pinged in Gisborne though. You mean disposal after the event?


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My opinion only but a diversion.

 

[Itsapuzzle]

Yeah, https://s16.postimg.io/dk2u0sjad/ddfd.png

The upload was pretty dodgy, low format.

This site is freaky/concerning.
http://crimescenecleanups.com.au/unattended-death-clean-up/toolern-vale.html

Good heavens! Is that for real![emoji15]


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[Puggle]

I think we saw what the intention was, to get them to request people not to speculate.

The people around this case act so strangely. I mean even watching the ACA with Chris Ristevski, he comes off poorly IMO, for whatever reason AR felt sending him a request for a gun was a reasonable thing to do and CR thought that was a reasonable thing to show ACA and implicate himself as someone with connections to weapons to arm a convicted criminal. AR does a better job of discrediting himself than this swallowing stilted speaking former friendly cousin who associated with him during high ice usage does.

Yes ..... no choir boy either .....whats the saying about the pot and the kettle....

ETA: Mmmm but then again i think a little truth... maybe some embellishing. ...

But we have a record....conviction history ...... violence or at least anti social behaviour (weapon) used in the past.

we have the possibilty of BR and KR being manipulated through fear (Ill kill myself) in an attempt to get monies from them...for Rehab or simply for more money... makes you wonder...

 

[Wonky1]

If you're serious about attention-seeking, doing a murder's likely to be very successful.

Touche. Good point. Only 1 day till Sat when there may be another drip from LE.

 

[Makara]

IMO one of the strange things in this case (apart from the obvious) is that Karen allegedly took her Coach handbag and purse when she left home to go for a walk. I don't believe for a minute that Karen actually went for a walk but why was that information about her handbag and purse thrown into the mix? Karen and Borce were involved in the rag trade and would know 1,001 brand names so the dropping of the Coach brand isn't really a big deal. Who gave that information to police? Was it BR or SR? Either way we've been given a description of the Coach handbag, purse and what Karen was allegedly wearing on the day she disappeared, yet no shoes were mentioned. That's odd IMO. I feel that the handbag and purse were actually in Karen's car and were either disposed of with her, or then again, they may even turn up in a cupboard or wardrobe.

 

[Unit45]

Touche. Good point. Only 1 day till Sat when there may be another drip from LE.

Wonky1, living near the area for those years.

Your theory on a stranger? i explored this at some lenght.

 

[Puggle]

If you're serious about attention-seeking, doing a murder's likely to be very successful.

Ahh but someone with this disorder would know that murder is wrong....so they would do everything within their power to create a grandoise story that would be so dazzling that they believe everyone would be so confused as to not think them to be involved....

but the sheer anxiety associated with what they know is a wrong....would also make them crave what they need the most to exist .....

ATTENTION...

 

[Makara]

Ahh but someone with this disorder would know that murder is wrong....so they would do everything within their power to create a grandoise story that would be so dazzling that they believe everyone would be so confused as to not think them to be involved....

but the sheer anxiety associated with what they know is a wrong....would also make them crave what they need the most to exist .....

ATTENTION...

Puggles, you're describing Baden-Clay to a T.

 

[Puggle]

IMO one of the strange things in this case (apart from the obvious) is that Karen allegedly took her Coach handbag and purse when she left home to go for a walk. I don't believe for a minute that Karen actually went for a walk but why was that information about her handbag and purse thrown into the mix? Karen and Borce were involved in the rag trade and would know 1,001 brand names so the dropping of the Coach brand isn't really a big deal. Who gave that information to police? Was it BR or SR? Either way we've been given a description of the Coach handbag, purse and what Karen was allegedly wearing on the day she disappeared, yet no shoes were mentioned. That's odd IMO. I feel that the handbag and purse were actually in Karen's car and were either disposed of with her or may even have been dumped in the opposite direction. There is just something about the handbag and purse that IMO will clinch this case.

Yeah in agreeance. ..... I think we have been working through this order... With the facts that we have been given via msm.

There was the discussions around the river, possible drowning, stranger....we go on what we have at the time.

Now we have the ping info.....a whole new layer and new train of thought and ideas to explore.

Yep....I think the purse/bag info must have some significance.....the police did seem very focused on it.

 

[Puggle]

Opposite direction...diversion...

Yep good thought.

 

[Puggle]

Puggles, you're describing Baden-Clay to a T.

I never followed that case Makara...

But I do see aspects of NPD in AR ..... 17 years in psych ward gives me some insight....and lol...no I wasn't a patient!!!

 

[Oona]

Last week (around 24 Aug) we were told SR was seeking support/working with the Missing Persons Advocacy Network". I wonder what has come about with that.
Taken from their facebook page: MPAN’s objective is to give hope to those directly affected by the disappearance of a loved one by creating awareness for missing Australians and providing practical support to those left behind.
Did SR approach MPAN for moral support during this stressful time, or help, to create an awareness for Karen.
So far I haven't seen any awareness campaign directed by them that I know of.
So that's almost two months after her mother has gone missing, so Im assuming she needs the moral support b/c her speculations as to what happened and who did it may have become clearer at this time?
I personally don't think she is using this service as a way of increasing awareness for her missing mother.

With regard to this case, didn't MPAN say that they try not to get involved when there is an ongoing criminal investigation?

"However, the non-profit organisation, which seeks to reunite loved ones, has only been able to offer minimal advice as it does not 'associate with criminal cases'. "

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...picious-activity-tip-offs-missing-mother.html

 

[Wonky1]

Wonky1, living near the area for those years.

Your theory on a stranger? i explored this at some lenght.

For a stranger to have kidnapped her they'd have to get her into a car. Ince you're on that path it doesn't intersect with roads very often and when it does it's major ones like milatery road or buckley street.

She could have been pulled into a car at canning street reserve but on a partly sunny day in school holidays it would have had people there (popular park for parents to take kids).

Buckley street would have been very noticeable by passing traffic so unless she was coerced into a car in nearby streets to her house (before path winds away down towards river) I can't see how this could have happened.

She would have stuck out like a sore thumb carrying a handbag. People walk there for exercise so unless she was heading via afton street down to Poyton's nursery/boathouse/anglers for a coffee she wouldn't need a bag. At most a purse.

I recall BR said in a press conference somewhere that purse was silver. Police didn't release a picture of similar bag for 2 weeks. I had a leaflet posted end of our street that had a great description of the black jacket (large button etc) and bag but police
were very slow to officially release this bag info. I ended up contacted local newspaper urging them to try and get an image to no avail.

As for no shoes. It's probably been said before but someone not walking to their car doesn't need shoes. In the panic shoes were not included when KR left house and thus a description of which ones were missing hasn't been able to be provided. And LE know this?! Perhaps she has an ultra organised wardrobe with clear shoe boxes with pictures of her shoes as I have. All my shoes (100% even thongs and slippers) are photographed and displayed so if I left home without shoes all my shoes would be present and accounted for.

 

[they'll get you]

No DNA in his?

I've never seen a picture with the merc at the house. Only ever the VWs. Could the Merc be impounded??

Also the VW is a hatch so the only way 'stuff' is hidden is with that vinyl slide thingy.
UR right Mrs G, the Merc's boot would be a hellova lot bigger and It could've been conveniently in the garage.

 

[Itsapuzzle]

People with NPD:

Lie and believe everyone believes their lies.
They never admit any wrondoing ...
They commonly shift blame onto others when things don't go well, or go wrong.
They take us all fools and have a grandiose beliefs
They will make outlandish claims

Ohhh the list goes on...

They live in their own delusional world where they are really are not aware of how ridiculious and outlandish their behaviour can be at times .... they don't actually realise that others see straight through their behaviour..


ETA: And they are known for their attention seeking.....

Food for thought, Puggle. I would love to read his plea in mitigation when he was sentenced .....


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[ediethedog]

EXCELLENT work, SouthAussie. This point looks to be critical, and thanks for pointing out the Australian's quite particular reference to Borce's certification. This begins to smell a bit like motive.

I have a friend that used to work for ASIC I can ask him exactly what is required...

 

[ediethedog]

Agreed. And we are only seeing a small snippet of the picture probably. It just seems as though there may be a connection somehow, due to timing.

People kill for a lot less .. Or so it seems. It does seem like a small sum for such an act, but we just don't know what else was happening in their lives. Some one mentioned earlier that her business would have drained that pretty quickly, which I thought was a very good point. He could probably see good money being thrown at what he perceived as a total waste of funds.

 

[Makara]

People with NPD:

Lie and believe everyone believes their lies.
They never admit any wrondoing ...
They commonly shift blame onto others when things don't go well, or go wrong.
They take us all fools and have a grandiose beliefs
They will make outlandish claims

Ohhh the list goes on...

They live in their own delusional world where they are really are not aware of how ridiculious and outlandish their behaviour can be at times .... they don't actually realise that others see straight through their behaviour..


ETA: And they are known for their attention seeking.....

I'm not a psychologist but for years I dealt with a person with a full blown NPD and I saw straight through his behaviour. One of the most noted traits displayed by a narcissist is they must be in full control at all times. IMO AR does not display as having an NPD. A drug user such as AR loses control whenever he hits up (or whatever it is he does). A Narcissist would never allow himself to be in that situation. They perceive themselves to be above everyone else and must stay in control at all times. In my opinion AR is more of a sociopath with his marked inability to get along with others or abide by societal rules. A sociopath is characterized by a disregard for the feelings of others, a lack of remorse or shame, manipulative behavior, unchecked egocentricity, and the ability to lie in order to achieve his goals.

---

Sociopaths tend to be nervous and easily agitated. They are volatile and prone to emotional outbursts, including fits of rage. They are likely to be uneducated and live on the fringes of society, unable to hold down a steady job or stay in one place for very long. It is difficult but not impossible for sociopaths to form attachments with others. Many sociopaths are able to form an attachment to a particular individual or group, although they have no regard for society in general or its rules. In the eyes of others, sociopaths will appear to be very disturbed. Any crimes committed by a sociopath, including murder, will tend to be haphazard, disorganized and spontaneous rather than planned.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/wicked-deeds/201401/how-tell-sociopath-psychopath

BBM. IMO if AR did murder Karen he would have been found guilty by now.

AR has inserted himself into this case for the sole purpose of attention. Our conversations of late have been more about him than Karen and what has happened to her. I'm tired of discussing him or what he posts on social media. He obviously needs help and he is the only one who can source that help. IMO he had nothing to do with Karen's disappearance, he's just basking in the limelight of Karen's disappearance.

 

[Puggle]

I'm not a psychologist but for years I dealt with a person with a full blown NPD and I saw straight through his behaviour. One of the most noted traits displayed by a narcissist is they must be in full control at all times. IMO AR does not display as having an NPD. A drug user such as AR loses control whenever he hits up (or whatever it is he does). A Narcissist would never allow himself to be in that situation. They perceive themselves to be above everyone else and must stay in control at all times. In my opinion AR is more of a sociopath with his marked inability to get along with others or abide by societal rules. A sociopath is characterized by a disregard for the feelings of others, a lack of remorse or shame, manipulative behavior, unchecked egocentricity, and the ability to lie in order to achieve his goals.

---

Sociopaths tend to be nervous and easily agitated. They are volatile and prone to emotional outbursts, including fits of rage. They are likely to be uneducated and live on the fringes of society, unable to hold down a steady job or stay in one place for very long. It is difficult but not impossible for sociopaths to form attachments with others. Many sociopaths are able to form an attachment to a particular individual or group, although they have no regard for society in general or its rules. In the eyes of others, sociopaths will appear to be very disturbed. Any crimes committed by a sociopath, including murder, will tend to be haphazard, disorganized and spontaneous rather than planned.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/wicked-deeds/201401/how-tell-sociopath-psychopath

BBM. IMO if AR did murder Karen he would have been found guilty by now.

AR has inserted himself into this case for the sole purpose of attention. Our conversations of late have been more about him than Karen and what has happened to her. I'm tired of discussing him or what he posts on social media. He obviously needs help and he is the only one who can source that help. IMO he had nothing to do with Karen's disappearance, he's just basking in the limelight of Karen's disappearance.

My sympathies to you ...... Having worked with people as patients with NPD, they are extremely exhausting snd mentally challenging.....frustrating....

People With NPD whilst sharing similar traits that assist with this diagnosis, they do not all present excactly the same.

Anyone using any substance that alters one perceptions ie; drugs, alcohol or other mind altering medications will obviously loose "control".

To say no person with NPD would drink, do drugs etc simply based on the perception that "they can" control themselves would be incorrect.

Luckily others here are discussing and also throwing around different ideas... I think Im pretty much alone in exploring the aspect or possibility that he maybe involved ....

Yes he can be tiring...

so if ya see purple .... scrolling by maybe an easy solution.

 

[Puggle]

Lerderderg State Park really does look like a 'logical' place (if such a thing can be said) according to the pings.

With a secondary road that goes from Digger's Rest to Gismore, the long way around, past the forest - and via Toolem Vale.

I wonder if they will get the dogs out into that forest.

Yeah Im waiting to see if they search it too ...high on my list also...given the ping info.