Australia Australia - Marion Barter, 51, missing after trip to UK, Jun 1997 #3

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** above correct - Also CAN'T ignore the fact that her sisters think she could up and leave
 
Zechoan said:
Goran Markovic....I must read up about him as sounds interesting. I think if the F Remakel from the paper was involved, then Remakel would not have been his real name if he was a con man. Or could Marian or her con man have seen Remakel ad in paper and used it to their/her advantage (I.e. Name change and BB bank access to help throw everyone off who would be looking for her?) what do you guys make off someone from the school's rumour of Marion's inappropriate interactions with boys? I was thinking Someone vindicative was trying to discredit her and ruin her teaching reputation, but why....? Could Marion have discovered something illegal going on through TSS and someone has tried to ruin her rep first? If this thing she found out was big, maybe this was why she was forced to leave her old life? Pedophile ring, drugs. Sounds far fetched though. Just, if the Remakel ad was in paper in 94, why wait til 97 for name change and subsequent chain of events that year? This case is by far the most mind boggling one I've ever come across. If it's a case of coercion by a conman and nothing to do with TSS, why the awful allegation about Marion from the school that same year?
Click to expand...


The other F. Remakel who was possibly in the paper in 1997 was the obituary of Frances M Remakel in June, 1994.

REMAKEL, FRANCES M. was born 22 July 1921, received Social Security number 324-12-8507 (indicating Illinois) and, Death Master File says, died 21 June 1994 140,924,661

REMAKEL, EVANGELINE thru REMAKLUS, LORETTE M

May mean nothing to a potential con artist, but you never know...
 
I am new to this thread and I am totally fascinated by all the possibilities!

Did Marion change her name BEFORE she travelled to England and got a new passport with that name?

I am thinking that she was having an affair with a married father of one of her boy students at least before she left Australia. I also think that the real F. Markel has questions to answer. Maybe she contacted him via that ad and he told her that he was in Luxembourg so they wrote to each other. After she saw what she wanted in England maybe he asked her to visit him in Luxembourg just after her last phone call to Sally. Or he was a conman using Frankel's name as he knew all about him and could assume his identity. He held her hostage getting enough information from her so that his female con partner could assume Marion's identity to visit Byron Bay and withdrew all that money.

There are probably flaws in this as I have not heard all the podcasts.
 
Estelle said:
I am new to this thread and I am totally fascinated by all the possibilities!

Did Marion change her name BEFORE she travelled to England and got a new passport with that name?

I am thinking that she was having an affair with a married father of one of her boy students at least before she left Australia. I also think that the real F. Markel has questions to answer. Maybe she contacted him via that ad and he told her that he was in Luxembourg so they wrote to each other. After she saw what she wanted in England maybe he asked her to visit him in Luxembourg just after her last phone call to Sally. Or he was a conman using Frankel's name as he knew all about him and could assume his identity. He held her hostage getting enough information from her so that his female con partner could assume Marion's identity to visit Byron Bay and withdrew all that money.

There are probably flaws in this as I have not heard all the podcasts.
Click to expand...

Welcome !! its a baffling case …

yes changed her name and then applied for her new passport then travelled all within a very short period of time. She wouldn't have been able to book her flights either until her new passport came through.
 
Estelle said:
I am new to this thread and I am totally fascinated by all the possibilities!

Did Marion change her name BEFORE she travelled to England and got a new passport with that name?

I am thinking that she was having an affair with a married father of one of her boy students at least before she left Australia. I also think that the real F. Markel has questions to answer. Maybe she contacted him via that ad and he told her that he was in Luxembourg so they wrote to each other. After she saw what she wanted in England maybe he asked her to visit him in Luxembourg just after her last phone call to Sally. Or he was a conman using Frankel's name as he knew all about him and could assume his identity. He held her hostage getting enough information from her so that his female con partner could assume Marion's identity to visit Byron Bay and withdrew all that money.

There are probably flaws in this as I have not heard all the podcasts.
Click to expand...


Welcome to the boards! Marion did change her name before she left. She changed it by deed poll in May and flew out toward the end of June.

There are so many different possibilities it is mind boggling. The thought of her corresponding with him between 1994 and seeing him in England entered my mind too. Given it is a French newspaper though, sleuthers wonder why he would then choose a p o box in lennox head.. unless of course he wanted Marion to think he was in Australia when he wasn't and was using a middle man.

Luxembourg was the intended destination on the returning passenger card and a match to an F remakel of the correct age to the man in the ad. However, that assumes is it f remakel. I have gone back and forth and am not convinced it is. Just my opinion. I think the man with Marion had no good intentions, I think the Remakel name and yet no record of a remakel entering Australia before or since is also telling. I think it was someone who knew or knew of f remakel, his age and used that..because look what it does.. Sends you to path of f remakel home in Luxembourg. Why would it be so easy, if the person intended to hurt Marion or keep her from her family? I wondered did Marion simply have an accident? Was her companion too scared to notify police? Who knows.. But it's like seeing a name in a paper,.. Fernand I believe probably would have had his name in paper at some point even if only in Luxembourg, being an ex footballer.. Someone remembered seeing him in a match.. Or even an old team mate.. I think they need to interview f remakel too, but instead of like 7 news did, harass him about what he knows, the authorities need to ask him WHO he knows, how and anyone with a connection to Australia.
 
Having read Sophie Renee's comments, I now suspect that Marion could have been writing to an F Rankel since the ad was placed in 1994 - either the real one or the fake one. This is because the name, F Rankel, is so unusual. Obviously both would have to have had connections to Luxembourg somehow as Rankel was not an international footballer. The conman Frankel could have admired Rankel as a football star and thus knew all about him enought to take on his identity.

I think he could have had his mail re-directed to another address whether it was Luxembourg or elsewhere or he had a contact who forwarded his mail at least initially. He could have said that by the time Marion replied, he had returned to Luxembourg.

Basically, I think this could have been a MAIL ROMANCE SCAM which used to occur before the internet.

I have a feeling that Marion had not met him in person in Australia and she fell in love with F Rankel through letters. Conmen are very good at saying all the right things in letters. In those days, it would have been too expensive to phone. Marion would not have told anyone as she would be too embarrassed to admit that she had fallen in love with a man she had never met. After three marriages, someone on the podcast I watched said that Marion always needed a man. He probably put over the story that he was wealthy, had antiques, the European lifestyle and the fact that he was/had been a footballer could have appealed to her.

Marion could have confided in this man that she owned a house, always wanted to teach at a Steiner school and had always wanted to see Europe. They probably exchanged photos too. After corresponding for a few years, he probably invited her over to Luxembourg to stay with him and if they got on, he intended to marry her. Some men have been known to propose by letter even if they have never met the person and some women fall for it - especially if he is a conman. They know exactly what to say and how to get information to gauge if the woman is wealthy enough and how vulnerable they are for them to scam. He could have asked her for money over the years and she was going over to either get it back and/or get married. She was probably more vulnerable after she was accused of touching the boys and felt so embarrassed that she wanted to escape due the the humiliation.

Just look at all the men and women who have been scammed by conmen. This woman was scammed for $500,000!


He probably conned Marion into selling her house, changing her name by deed poll and resigning as a teacher by promising her a new future with him.

Did she ever get to Luxembourg? I suspect the conman Frankel would have gone to the UK to meet her in order to get her identification papers - driver's licence, bank details, passport, etc and maybe her return plane ticket was brought forward. It appears that it could not have been Marion on the flight to Sydney as she said she was in Tunbridge Wells to Sally about 6pm the night before. It appears that she could not have got to the airport and arrived in Sydney the next day. I was curious that she told Sally she was having tea with "old ladies."

I suspect that the conman was with her when she made that phone call and he would have suggested doing so - hence he made her use the public phone so there would not be a trace.

Now there is a flaw in this scenario in that he would have needed to obtain her identification papers days BEFORE THE FLIGHT. So as she was still alive then, earlier that week he could have (eg held her at gunpoint and) threatened to kill her if she did not hand them over. In this scenario, this conman would have had a female accomplice on standby to use Marion's airline ticket and her identification for the flight and to remove money from her bank account in Byron Bay. This woman either had black hair or dyed it black to look like Marion and possibly 0nly stayed the 8 days.

These romance scams are often organised by a team of criminals. Sadly, I do not think Marion lived much longer after she got off that phone call - hence no word from her since. I think Marion's body would be found in the area of Tunbridge Wells.

Please point out any flaws in this scenario as it is the best I can do today.
 
It appears that it could not have been Marion on the flight to Sydney as she said she was in Tunbridge Wells to Sally about 6pm the night before. It appears that she could not have got to the airport and arrived in Sydney the next day. I was curious that she told Sally she was having tea with "old ladies."


There is a post on here to compare Marion's handwriting with the handwriting on the arrival card for Florabella, 1 expert couldn't comment the other said they felt it was Marion's handwriting, Sally said it was her mothers handwriting, take a look and see what you think. That may or may not sway your opinion on if you think Marion was on the flight back to Brisbane.
 
Itsapuzzle said:
Whoops, was just reading a link I put up the other day and saw I'd picked up the wrong one to upload .... err, it made no sense, sorry, full errors such as "while they trafficked from Apr to Nov 2014" - um, that should be "travelled"!! . .... this is the correct news story, very readable, unlike the other .... apologies.
https://www.smh.com.au/national/serial-scammer-on-the-run-from-nsw-police-20161209-gt7dgj.html
Click to expand...
My name is Kelly Boulter. Unfortunately I am one of many victims of the convicted fraudster Goran MARKOVIC (as a result of my effort, he appeared on 60 Minutes and in the SMH article). I have recently been contacted by one of your members who thinks MARKVOIC may have something to do with a woman who went missing in the UK in 1997. I have limited access to records that confirm he was in Melbourne between the 21st of April to the 4th of October, 1997. At some point whilst still on bail (I don't know if it was in 1997 or afterwards) he fled Australia for the UK. I can find out in which year this was if you need the information. MARKOVIC's MO is stealing money and cars, abusing people in the process. He is a sadistic psychopath whom I believe is capable of murder but I have no evidence of the latter. I have been told he has done online romance scams in order to steal money. His real name is Goran MARKOVIC, confirmed by many sources, but he does use aliases, such as Adrien Albert Basile, Gordon Maverick, Gary McDonald, Scott Billinger, Gordon Michael McCormick (also changes the spelling of these names), and many others I don't know of. If you have any questions, let me know and I will be happy to answer them. I believe he now lives in Sydney, Australia.
 
BKB said:
My name is Kelly Boulter. Unfortunately I am one of many victims of the convicted fraudster Goran MARKOVIC (as a result of my effort, he appeared on 60 Minutes and in the SMH article). I have recently been contacted by one of your members who thinks MARKVOIC may have something to do with a woman who went missing in the UK in 1997. I have limited access to records that confirm he was in Melbourne between the 21st of April to the 4th of October, 1997. At some point whilst still on bail (I don't know if it was in 1997 or afterwards) he fled Australia for the UK. I can find out in which year this was if you need the information. MARKOVIC's MO is stealing money and cars, abusing people in the process. He is a sadistic psychopath whom I believe is capable of murder but I have no evidence of the latter. I have been told he has done online romance scams in order to steal money. His real name is Goran MARKOVIC, confirmed by many sources, but he does use aliases, such as Adrien Albert Basile, Gordon Maverick, Gary McDonald, Scott Billinger, Gordon Michael McCormick (also changes the spelling of these names), and many others I don't know of. If you have any questions, let me know and I will be happy to answer them. I believe he now lives in Sydney, Australia.
Click to expand...

Hi Kelly, firstly so sorry to hear about what you went through.
I think my first question is whether he was fluent in French? The ad in question (from 1994) was in French and I just don’t believe someone would post that ad unless they were fluent in the language.
Thankyou for offering information aabout him.
 
Re: Gordon Markovic

This smh article on him states “But sources in France, who alleged they were scammed by him, say the French police deported Markovic after discovering that he was in the country illegally.”

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp...r-to-face-charges-in-nsw-20170306-gurp0v.html

So from that you would think he is fluent in French.

Wow there are certainly many red flags pointing at this guy as a possible scamming suspect for Marion. If he was living in the Northern NSW area back in 1994-1997 then I think he is red hot flag material!
 
KiwiNZ said:
It appears that it could not have been Marion on the flight to Sydney as she said she was in Tunbridge Wells to Sally about 6pm the night before. It appears that she could not have got to the airport and arrived in Sydney the next day. I was curious that she told Sally she was having tea with "old ladies."

There is a post on here to compare Marion's handwriting with the handwriting on the arrival card for Florabella, 1 expert couldn't comment the other said they felt it was Marion's handwriting, Sally said it was her mothers handwriting, take a look and see what you think. That may or may not sway your opinion on if you think Marion was on the flight back to Brisbane.
Click to expand...

The arrival card would not be able to be completed in advance so maybe conwoman forged Marion's writing. It would be a miracle if he had another arrival card in his possession collected from an earlier flight with same airline to force her to fill it out under duress. I thought she had bought a return flight from Luxembourg and I assumed that she would be away much longer. However, I guess her departure could have been changed on the airline ticket to departure being from Heathrow. What time did that flight arrive in Sydney? How long did flights take in those days?

As far as we know she spent all her time in southern England from where the postcards were sent from. If she was heading for the airport that night, it is very unusual that she did not tell Sally unless conman was present and told her what to say or she phoned from Singapore or Bangkok airport.

Simplest assumption is that her arrival card was forged and conman forced Marion to print the letters in capitals on a piece of paper so they could be copied by conwoman.

Was it an open dated return? I thought her intention to to be away about one year. She had not even been to Luxembourg yet she is returning to Australia?
 
Estelle said:
The arrival card would not be able to be completed in advance so maybe conwoman forged Marion's writing. It would be a miracle if he had another arrival card in his possession collected from an earlier flight with same airline to force her to fill it out under duress. I thought she had bought a return flight from Luxembourg and I assumed that she would be away much longer. However, I guess her departure could have been changed on the airline ticket to departure being from Heathrow. What time did that flight arrive in Sydney? How long did flights take in those days?

As far as we know she spent all her time in southern England from where the postcards were sent from. If she was heading for the airport that night, it is very unusual that she did not tell Sally unless conman was present and told her what to say or she phoned from Singapore or Bangkok airport.

Simplest assumption is that her arrival card was forged and conman forced Marion to print the letters in capitals on a piece of paper so they could be copied by conwoman.

Was it an open dated return? I thought her intention to to be away about one year. She had not even been to Luxembourg yet she is returning to Australia?
Click to expand...

I am not sure what you mean - arrival cards are issued by the Australian government not the Airline, its a generic form

The flight landed in Brisbane at 10am, she could not have made the call from the UK, flight was approx. 24hrs depending on layer over, but if you look on the Lady Vanish facebook page they have that in detail, someone tracked the flight.

She came via Hong Kong its on the arrival card.
 
KiwiNZ said:
I am not sure what you mean - arrival cards are issued by the Australian government not the Airline, its a generic form

The flight landed in Brisbane at 10am, she could not have made the call from the UK, flight was approx. 24hrs depending on layer over, but if you look on the Lady Vanish facebook page they have that in detail, someone tracked the flight.

She came via Hong Kong its on the arrival card.
Click to expand...

about her flight and the call. It is more than likely that Sally has the wrong day that Marion called. How can sally be so sure about the time she received the call? Remembering that event of the phone call would have been weeks after she received the call , when she started worrying about not hearing from her.
 
Seriallyaddicted said:
about her flight and the call. It is more than likely that Sally has the wrong day that Marion called. How can sally be so sure about the time she received the call? Remembering that event of the phone call would have been weeks after she received the call , when she started worrying about not hearing from her.
Click to expand...

I think there is a chance she has it wrong but also the Thredbo disaster happened on the 30th at 11.30pm so the call could not have been before that if she referenced Thredbo, the earliest it could be was the evening of the 31st and she said around dinner time, she may have had the time of day wrong ? Not sure if you move the call to the mid morning, afternoon, if you would then make the flight

She also left a message on the answer phone first Which would likely be the morning of the 31st, and called back later. Wonder how many hours between the first message and the 2nd call.
 
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BKB said:
My name is Kelly Boulter. Unfortunately I am one of many victims of the convicted fraudster Goran MARKOVIC (as a result of my effort, he appeared on 60 Minutes and in the SMH article). I have recently been contacted by one of your members who thinks MARKVOIC may have something to do with a woman who went missing in the UK in 1997. I have limited access to records that confirm he was in Melbourne between the 21st of April to the 4th of October, 1997. At some point whilst still on bail (I don't know if it was in 1997 or afterwards) he fled Australia for the UK. I can find out in which year this was if you need the information. MARKOVIC's MO is stealing money and cars, abusing people in the process. He is a sadistic psychopath whom I believe is capable of murder but I have no evidence of the latter. I have been told he has done online romance scams in order to steal money. His real name is Goran MARKOVIC, confirmed by many sources, but he does use aliases, such as Adrien Albert Basile, Gordon Maverick, Gary McDonald, Scott Billinger, Gordon Michael McCormick (also changes the spelling of these names), and many others I don't know of. If you have any questions, let me know and I will be happy to answer them. I believe he now lives in Sydney, Australia.
Click to expand...
Thanks for sharing here Kelly, fascinating and disturbing tale .... why isn't he living out his days in the slammer, strange his sentences seem to have been so light in comparison to the harm he has caused to others. It's a given he hasn't been convicted for everything he's been up to over the years ... err, my opinion only. Ah well, we're looking for some kind of connection to this advertisement which appeared in a French newspaper called Le Courrier Australien on 10 December 1994. Whether he knew someone in the Ballina area or was known to go Ballina, Lennox Heads, Byron Bay in 94/95, would be interested to hear if there's any link, thanks Kelly. Click on the #47 to see the ad. Thank you for your time, and very sorry that happened to you, hope everything is going better for you now and things are looking brighter for you. Cheers
Itsapuzzle, May 12, 2019
#47
 
Estelle said:
Having read Sophie Renee's comments, I now suspect that Marion could have been writing to an F Rankel since the ad was placed in 1994 - either the real one or the fake one. This is because the name, F Rankel, is so unusual. Obviously both would have to have had connections to Luxembourg somehow as Rankel was not an international footballer. The conman Frankel could have admired Rankel as a football star and thus knew all about him enought to take on his identity.

I think he could have had his mail re-directed to another address whether it was Luxembourg or elsewhere or he had a contact who forwarded his mail at least initially. He could have said that by the time Marion replied, he had returned to Luxembourg.

Basically, I think this could have been a MAIL ROMANCE SCAM which used to occur before the internet.

I have a feeling that Marion had not met him in person in Australia and she fell in love with F Rankel through letters. Conmen are very good at saying all the right things in letters. In those days, it would have been too expensive to phone. Marion would not have told anyone as she would be too embarrassed to admit that she had fallen in love with a man she had never met. After three marriages, someone on the podcast I watched said that Marion always needed a man. He probably put over the story that he was wealthy, had antiques, the European lifestyle and the fact that he was/had been a footballer could have appealed to her.

Marion could have confided in this man that she owned a house, always wanted to teach at a Steiner school and had always wanted to see Europe. They probably exchanged photos too. After corresponding for a few years, he probably invited her over to Luxembourg to stay with him and if they got on, he intended to marry her. Some men have been known to propose by letter even if they have never met the person and some women fall for it - especially if he is a conman. They know exactly what to say and how to get information to gauge if the woman is wealthy enough and how vulnerable they are for them to scam. He could have asked her for money over the years and she was going over to either get it back and/or get married. She was probably more vulnerable after she was accused of touching the boys and felt so embarrassed that she wanted to escape due the the humiliation.

Just look at all the men and women who have been scammed by conmen. This woman was scammed for $500,000!


He probably conned Marion into selling her house, changing her name by deed poll and resigning as a teacher by promising her a new future with him.

Did she ever get to Luxembourg? I suspect the conman Frankel would have gone to the UK to meet her in order to get her identification papers - driver's licence, bank details, passport, etc and maybe her return plane ticket was brought forward. It appears that it could not have been Marion on the flight to Sydney as she said she was in Tunbridge Wells to Sally about 6pm the night before. It appears that she could not have got to the airport and arrived in Sydney the next day. I was curious that she told Sally she was having tea with "old ladies."

I suspect that the conman was with her when she made that phone call and he would have suggested doing so - hence he made her use the public phone so there would not be a trace.

Now there is a flaw in this scenario in that he would have needed to obtain her identification papers days BEFORE THE FLIGHT. So as she was still alive then, earlier that week he could have (eg held her at gunpoint and) threatened to kill her if she did not hand them over. In this scenario, this conman would have had a female accomplice on standby to use Marion's airline ticket and her identification for the flight and to remove money from her bank account in Byron Bay. This woman either had black hair or dyed it black to look like Marion and possibly 0nly stayed the 8 days.

These romance scams are often organised by a team of criminals. Sadly, I do not think Marion lived much longer after she got off that phone call - hence no word from her since. I think Marion's body would be found in the area of Tunbridge Wells.

Please point out any flaws in this scenario as it is the best I can do today.
Click to expand...

I definitely don't agree with Marion not having met the mystery man. I believe the man Sally saw her with in the car at the drive through restaurant prior to Marion leaving is the one responsible for her disappearance. I also believe it was Marion who came back into Australia (after her last call to Sally, setting herself up to bide her some time by saying she wouldn't be in touch again for a while). Whether this call was made from the UK though or another country on her way back to Australia, who knows? Sounds as though, and looks like it was her writing on passenger card and a bank teller at the bank in Byron Bay that Sally spoke with 'seemed to recognise' Marion in a photo that Sally shows to him/her. This is just my belief at this point in time.
 
Zechoan said:
I definitely don't agree with Marion not having met the mystery man. I believe the man Sally saw her with in the car at the drive through restaurant prior to Marion leaving is the one responsible for her disappearance. I also believe it was Marion who came back into Australia (after her last call to Sally, setting herself up to bide her some time by saying she wouldn't be in touch again for a while). Whether this call was made from the UK though or another country on her way back to Australia, who knows? Sounds as though, and looks like it was her writing on passenger card and a bank teller at the bank in Byron Bay that Sally spoke with 'seemed to recognise' Marion in a photo that Sally shows to him/her. This is just my belief at this point in time.
Click to expand...

I agree. Whether I think the man was wholly responsible or not, I definitely think he was involved. I think he was from Australia, as in a permanent resident or else spent a lot of his life there. European descent perhaps.. Do we know how well a view Sally got of the man, i. e be able to tell their country of descent? She told Sally he was someone he met at her art class didn't she? If someone spoke French or was from a French speaking country would be interesting to look into whether or not certain parts of Australia attracted certain ethnicities. Perhaps look at where certain cultures thrive... For example if there was anywhere representing the culture of those in Luxembourg or France such as restaurants, cinema, schools etc... where are they concentrated? What schools or universities perhaps have ties with schools or universities in Luxembourg. Just another path to follow....
 
Just as a possible moot point of interest...had a little look and there is no evidence of a Luxembourg embassy or consulate anywhere in Oceania. Nor is there any Australian embassy or consulate in Luxembourg. Could this have made administration of a move to Luxembourg difficult ? Can administration be done through a consulate in a neighbouring EU country?
Both Luxembourg and Australia have diplomatic missions in London..how does it work if the country your in has no embassy or such representation for your home country and you need it ? Could the trip to the UK have had something to do with organising an ultimate emigration to Luxembourg which never transpired?
 
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