Australia - Warriena Wright, 26, dies in balcony fall, Surfers Paradise, Aug 2014 #8

[Makara]

Unfortunately from a Crown point of view that's not good news, it shows a complete disregard for Justice Byrne's instructions. Obviously the Court cannot speculate on what the object is/was as it was not relied upon at all during the case and it may give rise to the possibility that the jury is considering scenarios that are inconsistent with the evidence led. Will be watching on with interest tomorrow, at best it's ammunition for a subsequent defence appeal (if it should require one) and at worst it may be grounds for an application to declare a mistrial (unlikely, but possible).

I was surprised when I read that the jury had asked what Tostee was carrying when he left the elevator. I was under the impression that the CCTV showing this was not included in the Crown's evidence. How would the jury know about it?

 

[sosocurious]

True, and if they are asking what he was then carrying, the Judge will tell them they there is no evidence of what it was, other than what is visible on the CCTV. He will also likely tell them that they cannot speculate about what it was and that it is irrelevant to their considerations given the Crown did not seek to explain it. In other words.....'If the Crown does not know, you, Members of the Jury, are none the wiser than is the Crown.'

You are probably correct. Given Holt suggested you would have to have been being chased by someone with a knife, could that allow the question to be asked. I wonder.
imo

 

[Fluffykins]

Unfortunately from a Crown point of view that's not good news, it shows a complete disregard for Justice Byrne's instructions. Obviously the Court cannot speculate on what the object is/was as it was not relied upon at all during the case and it may give rise to the possibility that the jury is considering scenarios that are inconsistent with the evidence led. Will be watching on with interest tomorrow, at best it's ammunition for a subsequent defence appeal (if it should require one) and at worst it may be grounds for an application to declare a mistrial (unlikely, but possible).

But at least it's letting the Crown know the jury thinks it's a potentially important piece of evidence they didn't follow up on. I know it won't affect the outcome and Justice Byrne will just say you have to ignore it, but I would like the prosecution to know people are thinking they did a sloppy job, which is exactly what they did, and because of it Warriena and her family may not get justice. Put it this way, if you were paying the prosecution to lead this case, you'd want your money back, wouldn't you.

 

[Bohemian]

Ruth Wynn-Williams ‏@RuthWW 6m6 minutes ago Brisbane, Queensland

Jury has been dismissed for the day.
Deliberation resumes tomorrow #tostee @ONENewsNZ

I would hate to be a member of the jury in this trial.

 

[Aglaia]

All he knew at that time was that she was no longer visible on his balcony.

That could have been an awkward 2am phone call to his lawyer if it turned out she was hiding in the tanning bed, what strange irrational behaviour , to call your lawyer in the early early hours of the morning not even knowing if there's a problem or not

 

[Elde Fruit]

Why ask his age ?

And the technical legal thing is......if there has been no evidence given in the Trail about it....the Judge's answer will be, "There is no evidence what his age was/is."

 

[sosocurious]

I would hate to be a member of the jury in this trial.

View attachment 103219

So would I.
So many unanswered questions.

 

[Ausgirl]

Unfortunately from a Crown point of view that's not good news, it shows a complete disregard for Justice Byrne's instructions.

maybe they are seeking clarification as to whether the item is pertinent to parts of the tape.. if that makes sense?

 

[Elde Fruit]

I was surprised when I read that the jury had asked what Tostee was carrying when he left the elevator. I was under the impression that the CCTV showing this was not included in the Crown's evidence. How would the jury know about it?

The answer is......they were shown that part of the CCTV.

 

[JCB]

I was surprised when I read that the jury had asked what Tostee was carrying when he left the elevator. I was under the impression that the CCTV showing this was not included in the Crown's evidence. How would the jury know about it?

To be perfectly honest I don't know if the footage was admitted into evidence, but if it wasn't then I'd say the likely source is probably this very forum.

But at least it's letting the Crown know the jury thinks it's a potentially important piece of evidence they didn't follow up on. I know it won't affect the outcome and Justice Byrne will just say you have to ignore it, but I would like the prosecution to know people are thinking they did a sloppy job, which is exactly what they did, and because of it Warriena and her family may not get justice. Put it this way, if you were paying the prosecution to lead this case, you'd want your money back, wouldn't you.

Agree 100%, I'm on record as saying although I don't think the indictment should have proceeded in the first place, it was an average performance at best from the Crown. Their most important witness (Dr Little) may as well have been a witness for the defence. It makes you wonder the reason for the delay in getting Dr Little to the stand in the first place.

 

[possumheart]

Unfortunately from a Crown point of view that's not good news, it shows a complete disregard for Justice Byrne's instructions. Obviously the Court cannot speculate on what the object is/was as it was not relied upon at all during the case and it may give rise to the possibility that the jury is considering scenarios that are inconsistent with the evidence led. Will be watching on with interest tomorrow, at best it's ammunition for a subsequent defence appeal (if it should require one) and at worst it may be grounds for an application to declare a mistrial (unlikely, but possible).

IF I were on the jury it would mean that I was considered to be one of Tostee's peers. I would not look on social media or discuss the trial with anyone except the other jurors. As one of his peers, I would bring my experience of living within the catchment they chose. I would look carefully at the evidence and I would hear the terror in Wrie's voice. I would be trying to resolve what might not be on the audio, painting a mental picture of the evening. That is my job as a juror. To bring humanity to circumstance. I would be trying to picture their moments. Gosh, I hope we would be so on-the-job and tech savvy that we would be pointing stuff out to each other, you know, the different relative sizes of the two; 'look how many spirit bottles in the kitchen'; "ain't that white vinyl couch and bed so 'bad taste, Gold Coast'"; 'I'm terrified of elevators'; 'I've got a telescope like that'; 'I used to have a balcony like that' kind of banter. And then I would see, or be shown the CCTV with something strange in Tostee's hands. I would be focused. I would show my fellow jurors.

 

[emirates1957]

I was surprised when I read that the jury had asked what Tostee was carrying when he left the elevator. I was under the impression that the CCTV showing this was not included in the Crown's evidence. How would the jury know about it?

That's why I was curious as to whether a jury member would refer to WS or social media for further information. For me personally the prosecutions delivery didn't match the severity of the audio tape. Trying to put myself in a jurors position - I would want to know a whole lot more. Personally I would take my instructions seriously...cant vouch for others.

 

[Makara]

The answer is......they were shown that part of the CCTV.

I wasn't aware of that. How do you know this? Justice Byrne has instructed the jury that anything Tostee did after Warriena's death is not relevant, so why show that particular CCTV footage in the first place?

 

[SouthAussie]

Well, I hope the judge gives them some latitude. All they are trying to do is work out if Tostee could have had a weapon, that he then took with him and disposed of.
Seems to me that they have the right to ask that. Because the defence raised it. It will be in the court transcript.

 

[Makara]

To be perfectly honest I don't know if the footage was admitted into evidence, but if it wasn't then I'd say the likely source is probably this very forum.

<RSBM>

BBM: Are you serious? When the judge had already instructed the jury to ignore MSM and SM. So do you think there are jury members reading here? :floorlaugh:

 

[Amee]

Shortly after 4pm, however, court reconvened with four questions from jurors.

http://www.news.com.au/national/que...SF&utm_source=News.com.au&utm_medium=Facebook

 

[SouthAussie]

And it is a good sign. They are not buying the defence fairy dust .. I mean tale.

 

[sosocurious]

I was surprised when I read that the jury had asked what Tostee was carrying when he left the elevator. I was under the impression that the CCTV showing this was not included in the Crown's evidence. How would the jury know about it?

Kate Kyriacou &#8207;@KateKyriacou Oct 11

He is the basement now. An outside camera captures him leaving and heading into Lionel Perry Park, adjacent. It's 2.31am. #tostee
0 replies 1 retweet 2 likes
Kate Kyriacou &#8207;@KateKyriacou Oct 11

He seems to be pacing around downstairs. Heads back to the lift. Looking around, pressing the button again and again. #Tostee's
0 replies 1 retweet 2 likes
Kate Kyriacou &#8207;@KateKyriacou Oct 11

The lift opens and #tostee emerges. He peers around the corner. Wearing a long sleeved shirt now.
0 replies 0 retweets 1 like
Kate Kyriacou &#8207;@KateKyriacou Oct 11

Now we will skip ahead to 2.23am. This is after Warriena has fallen from Tostee's 14th floor balcony.

Seems it was.

 

[Amee]

Shortly after 4pm, however, court reconvened with four questions from jurors.
The jury has sought clarification on Tostee&#8217;s age when Warriena Wright, 26, plunged to her death from his 14th storey Gold Coast apartment balcony, and also an answer as to what the long metal object was that Tostee was carrying when he exited his apartment lift in the wake of Ms Wright&#8217;s death.
Most tellingly, however, the jury also sought clarification as to whether Ms Wright&#8217;s state of mind at the time she fell was important, and if her intoxication was something they had to consider as to whether her decision to climb over the balcony balustrade was unreasonable and irrational.
Their final question was to seek clarification of the terms &#8220;causation&#8221;, &#8220;unlawfulness&#8221; and &#8220;intent&#8221;.

http://www.news.com.au/national/que...SF&utm_source=News.com.au&utm_medium=Facebook

 

[Mrs Bennett]

Has anybody here ever done Jury Duty?

I think it might be a little different to what you imagine.