Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #52

[SLouTh]

I can’t open the link because it’s paywalled but this MSM article mentions that the Crabbs heard the sound of a car on a gravel driveway and that Savage had one:

View attachment 234631

Source: We’re for Sydney | Daily Telegraph

Thanks Bo....yes I had remembered it and found it ………. so both journalists work for the same company … but 2 totally different versions of the same incident...……...

However it could possibly be how William was removed from the property...…. if the car actually stopped....

 

[Thebottomline]

Or maybe drive up the lower (gravel) driveway at No 48?

Brown grass, not gravel. Looks identical to my driveway which is not gravel.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

"He thought he heard the car stop and do a U Turn , or maybe turn in a circle before heading off again.
It didn't stop at Paul Savages, it stopped at number 48 he said. I don't know how long, as long as it takes to put a letter in her box . It stopped and then kept going.
Mrs Crabb also remembers hearing this car...…...

Was this possibly the car with a female driver (blonde, hair tied up, white shirt), which had a little later (Idk, when exactly) little boy with spider man costume in the backseat?? Did the driver reach for WT instead of delivering mail? Though it would be a too big coincidence, if WT just then played near to the road side .... unless he should go there to look for the MFC to return from his meeting.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

How does postie look, I'm interested to learn.
Which type of car did the Crabbs hear on the gravel drive way?

 

[Warshawski]

Is it the DP mentioned here:

NoCookies | The Australian

FYI - Subscriber only ..

 

[Warshawski]

I also assumed he was talking out loud to Heather. Interesting line of thought that he may have been talking out loud to someone else though.

It would be interesting to know if Lyn did confirm seeing him as he claimed to have spent about half an hour with her yet didn't know her name, giving the impression this was the first time he had spoken to her?: Details of ‘deeply troubling’ police grilling of Tyrrell person of interest

Thank you Wes - I’ve not read this previously.
I found it interesting & quite plausible response from PS.

I was struck by these comments:
‘
On the day before William vanished, Mr Savage had seen a car he had not seen before or since “roar” up the street towards the fire trail.

He described it in a statement to police soon afterwards as a “dull red-coloured Nissan Patrol wagon, a 90s model with a square type build”.

In the late afternoon of that day, Mr Savage also saw a vehicle he believed to be a Land Rover Freelander visit the home of William’s foster grandmother.’

 

[stormbird]

Yes and also would differ from the theory that William was taken out of the street by car. I’ve often wondered if the scream that was heard was in fact lil William and not the sound of a bird which fm thought may have been the case as when she attempted to look in that area of the bush where the sound came from was unable to see any blue ( being the Spider-Man suit). Potential witnesses possibly as I’m not sure whether the trail goes past the backyards of the other neighbours specifically the Crabbs

Christ74,
A WebSleuther who was at the inquest reported that the reeds where FFC heard the scream/bird were behind the bus stop, which is near the corner of Benaroon Drive and Batar Creek Road: frogwell thread 39, post 1446 and thread 40, post 53.

 

[Whàngarei]

Thank you Wes - I’ve not read this previously.
I found it interesting & quite plausible response from PS.

I was struck by these comments:
‘
On the day before William vanished, Mr Savage had seen a car he had not seen before or since “roar” up the street towards the fire trail.

He described it in a statement to police soon afterwards as a “dull red-coloured Nissan Patrol wagon, a 90s model with a square type build”.

In the late afternoon of that day, Mr Savage also saw a vehicle he believed to be a Land Rover Freelander visit the home of William’s foster grandmother.’

He had his beak into everything . I wonder did he write th rego number down? Freelander I wonder if it was grey? Was he even telling the truth?

 

[stormbird]

Can you guys just remind me please where we heard about the car on the gravel ?? I know it was recent I just cant remember the source???

I have just read Caroline Overton's Book "Finding William Tyrrell"and there is an entirely different version of the hearing the Postie that day by he Crabbs

This is a small except from the conversation with the Crabbs and Senior Constable Rowley
From Pg 53 and Pg 54 of the E Book by C. Overington

"He thought he heard the car stop and do a U Turn , or maybe turn in a circle before heading off again.
It didn't stop at Paul Savages, it stopped at number 48 he said. I don't know how long, as long as it takes to put a letter in her box . It stopped and then kept going.
Mrs Crabb also remembers hearing this car...…...

And I thought this could be the postie as it wasn't going slow, it was going reasonably fast, like the Postie does."

Excerpts from Books on other Cases are posted within different threads across WS and are within TOS I have also written to CO to ensure I can share small excerpts..

Missing William Tyrrell

SLouTh,
Mr C sounds a bit unsure about the car: "He thought he heard the car stop and do a U Turn, or maybe turn in a circle before heading off again." Was he already listening to the car before it stopped or turned, or was that when he started listening?
Does he say that the car turned around before stopping at No.48, or did it stop at No.48 first and then turn around? (Or maybe it stopped before turning around and then stopped at No.48?)
Thanks!

 

[stormbird]

The mailbox at No.48 is to the left of the driveway as you face the house, and in Australia the driver's seat in a vehicle is on the right-hand side. If anybody was pulling into a driveway, gravel or not, it probably wasn't to deliver mail, or not unless a passenger put it into the mailbox or the driver jumped out and ran around. The rural posties that I've seen tend to stay in their vehicle and pull up in front of the mailbox (not beside it, as they would in a driveway); they hand the mail through their open window. This means stopping on the wrong side of the road, which would be fine on a quiet road like Benaroon Drive. But maybe they might have to pull into a driveway if someone was coming the other way? Or if the driver was delivering to the house for some reason and had to park? But this would mean stopping for longer.

 

[Chrissy74]

Christ74,
A WebSleuther who was at the inquest reported that the reeds where FFC heard the scream/bird were behind the bus stop, which is near the corner of Benaroon Drive and Batar Creek Road: frogwell thread 39, post 1446 and thread 40, post 53.

Ok

 

[JLZ]

Christ74,
A WebSleuther who was at the inquest reported that the reeds where FFC heard the scream/bird were behind the bus stop, which is near the corner of Benaroon Drive and Batar Creek Road: frogwell thread 39, post 1446 and thread 40, post 53.

I was thinking of the track at the back of that area that heads for Albert Street and diverges to the cemetery. The track makes a Y with Batar Creek Road where it turns a bend, at roughly the same distance from Benaroon as the length of Ellendale. But, for William having been taken on foot there via the cemetery, it's coming round in a circle, like the offender is bringing him back.

 

[SLouTh]

SLouTh,
Mr C sounds a bit unsure about the car: "He thought he heard the car stop and do a U Turn, or maybe turn in a circle before heading off again." Was he already listening to the car before it stopped or turned, or was that when he started listening?
Does he say that the car turned around before stopping at No.48, or did it stop at No.48 first and then turn around? (Or maybe it stopped before turning around and then stopped at No.48?)
Thanks!

Hi Stormbird,
Sorry I cant answer the question about the turning (we would need to ask Mr Crabb ….) , as sadly the book doesn't say anything about that.. and I do totally see your point …..

But it does say that they were particularly "listening" for the Posties car as they were checking the mail for the Millers who were away..

Mrs Crabb goes on to say that "the car paused again , before it went off" …..

And they did wonder if this was when William was picked up??

This must have been fairly early in the investigation, as it prompted Fehon to ask for public information by a family representative ….that is when FAC's approved Nicole and John to speak .. (FFamily Friends )

 

[JLZ]

I was thinking of the track at the back of that area that heads for Albert Street and diverges to the cemetery. The track makes a Y with Batar Creek Road where it turns a bend, at roughly the same distance from Benaroon as the length of Ellendale. But, for William having been taken on foot there via the cemetery, it's coming round in a circle, like the offender is bringing him back.

(Sixmaps)
Reedy area lower right adjacent to Benaroon Drive and Batar Creek Road; track mid-right to centre top; Albert Street centre top to top left, with part of cemetery showing upper left.

 

[JLZ]

Hi Stormbird,
Sorry I cant answer the question about the turning (we would need to ask Mr Crabb ….) , as sadly the book doesn't say anything about that.. and I do totally see your point …..

But it does say that they were particularly "listening" for the Posties car as they were checking the mail for the Millers who were away..

Mrs Crabb goes on to say that "the car paused again , before it went off" …..

And they did wonder if this was when William was picked up??

This must have been fairly early in the investigation, as it prompted Fehon to ask for public information by a family representative ….that is when FAC's approved Nicole and John to speak .. (FFamily Friends )

Did Crabbs or Millers have mail and if so what time was it discovered?

 

[SLouTh]

Did Crabbs or Millers have mail and if so what time was it discovered?

We would have to ask @drsleuth if we have Mr Crabb's statement …. ???

There have been a few reports of the times , but I don't know about them actually receiving mail.... I would imagine if they did get mail that day , and if the Millers received mail that day, then they would have heard and possibly seen the car....

They knew that Mr Savage didn't get mail that day and that the car stopped at FGM House to deliver mail...

Sometimes I wish that every body in the street had mail delivered that day! The "Postie" has certainly caused much discussion...…. IMO

Edit to add...… It may not have been the Postie's car that they heard.... but whoever was driving the car, stopped at FGM House but did not stop at PS House or any others up that end of Benaroon Drive...

 

[bearbear]

a small preview of caroline overingtons book missing william tyrrell.....
Missing William Tyrrell

 

[JLZ]

We would have to ask @drsleuth if we have Mr Crabb's statement …. ???

There have been a few reports of the times , but I don't know about them actually receiving mail.... I would imagine if they did get mail that day , and if the Millers received mail that day, then they would have heard and possibly seen the car....

They knew that Mr Savage didn't get mail that day and that the car stopped at FGM House to deliver mail...

Sometimes I wish that every body in the street had mail delivered that day! The "Postie" has certainly caused much discussion...…. IMO

As they were listening for the postie, I imagine they would have checked for mail on their return at 9:30-35, even though postie didn't usually come before 10. If so and either house received mail later, at least we would know that postie didn't come while PS was on his first walk. It would make it more likely that the vehicle they heard at 10-ish was in fact the postie.

 

[Karinna]

Hi Stormbird,
Sorry I cant answer the question about the turning (we would need to ask Mr Crabb ….) , as sadly the book doesn't say anything about that.. and I do totally see your point …..

But it does say that they were particularly "listening" for the Posties car as they were checking the mail for the Millers who were away..

Mrs Crabb goes on to say that "the car paused again , before it went off" …..

And they did wonder if this was when William was picked up??

This must have been fairly early in the investigation, as it prompted Fehon to ask for public information by a family representative ….that is when FAC's approved Nicole and John to speak .. (FFamily Friends )

If the C's were waiting for the post why wouldn't they just go and look out their window or outside to see if the postie had been i wonder? The post normally comes around the same time each day in most places unless it's an extremely busy time like Xmas or something.

 

[SLouTh]

If the C's were waiting for the post why wouldn't they just go and look out their window or outside to see if the postie had been i wonder? The post normally comes around the same time each day in most places unless it's an extremely busy time like Xmas or something.

I have wondered about this too K …. they were out on the back verandah at the time... I have wondered if the car had of come further up the street towards their house, or the Millers, if they then would have gotten up and had a look ???? to confirm who it actually was pulling up outside their house....