Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #58

[dalidalii]

Hi all - long time reader of these threads - first time posting.
Like everyone, will be very sad if an accident was not disclosed at the time and managed appropriately. Have always thought William’s sister could hold some answers as she grows up.
Also wanted to say, as a long time lurker, I have always smiled at how polite all members are to each other.

 

[PingTheRouter]

It's got to be the last proof of life at 9.37am pic has been proven to be false,

its got to be right, that's what they used for years as " proof of life"

 

[wfimuscle]

I'm still struggling with this new turn of events, if this all ties back to the timestamp being incorrect, pic wasn't taken at 9.37am but 7.37am, it points to the FPs lying and both are involved in a cover up, there was enough time to hide/dispose the body and make up a story.

If the timestamp and FP's claim are correct at it being 9.37am, I find it hard to believe that between that time and 10.30am, WT had a fatal accident, FM hid body in the house or FGM's car, concocted a story FGM and WT's sister went along with, all before FD arrived on the scene.
FD not aware of the tragedy and cover up, helped in the search along side neighbours before police were called at 10.53am. Some time during this day, FM drove FGM's car and buried the body nearby.

It's got to be the last proof of life at 9.37am pic has been proven to be false, and a witness has been interviewed again and the balcony is now the primary focus. If it's the case, WT or evidence of his death will be found. Jmo
My brain is fried at this point.

easily bring a photo up on your phone, screenshot it & crop it to suit. You now have a new time stamp!
Great discussion, thank you!

 

[Mrs G Norris]

I'm still struggling with this new turn of events, if this all ties back to the timestamp being incorrect, pic wasn't taken at 9.37am but 7.37am, it points to the FPs lying and both are involved in a cover up, there was enough time to hide/dispose the body and make up a story.

If the timestamp and FP's claim are correct at it being 9.37am, I find it hard to believe that between that time and 10.30am, WT had a fatal accident, FM hid body in the house or FGM's car, concocted a story FGM and WT's sister went along with, all before FD arrived on the scene.
FD not aware of the tragedy and cover up, helped in the search along side neighbours before police were called at 10.53am. Some time during this day, FM drove FGM's car and buried the body nearby.

It's got to be the last proof of life at 9.37am pic has been proven to be false, and a witness has been interviewed again and the balcony is now the primary focus. If it's the case, WT or evidence of his death will be found. Jmo
My brain is fried at this point.

I think you are right, it is very difficult to make the story fit unless the timestamp of the photos was actually 7:37am.

Assuming police are on the right track: Is it possible WT took his tiger play too far with the FM and she lost her temper and lashed out? Might not have been an accidental fall at all. I think it would have been very easy to confuse a young child and an elderly woman about times, and lead them to believe whatever the FM wanted them to believe, living with elderly people their short term memory is especially fluid, and they are very suggestible.

If this all turns out to be true I will be so stunned.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

I'm still struggling with this new turn of events, if this all ties back to the timestamp being incorrect, pic wasn't taken at 9.37am but 7.37am, it points to the FPs lying and both are involved in a cover up, there was enough time to hide/dispose the body and make up a story.

If the timestamp and FP's claim are correct at it being 9.37am, I find it hard to believe that between that time and 10.30am, WT had a fatal accident, FM hid body in the house or FGM's car, concocted a story FGM and WT's sister went along with, all before FD arrived on the scene.
FD not aware of the tragedy and cover up, helped in the search along side neighbours before police were called at 10.53am. Some time during this day, FM drove FGM's car and buried the body nearby.

It's got to be the last proof of life at 9.37am pic has been proven to be false, and a witness has been interviewed again and the balcony is now the primary focus. If it's the case, WT or evidence of his death will be found. Jmo
My brain is fried at this point.

My brain is fried too. Even if the photo was misdated, how has it taken 7 years to work that out?! It does all sound a bit of a stretch to have hidden a body and composed a story, but the police seem confident in the current searches. Crazy!

Just spotted this line under the last photo: Mr Jubelin placed a Spider-Man suit, similar to the one William Tyrrell was wearing when he vanished, along a bush walk frequented by Mr Savage to record his reaction on secret police cameras. I don't recall hearing about this before, but there are no more details in the article. Anyone know more?

William Tyrrell, Gary Jubelin: Paul Savage, wrongly suspected of disappearance, breaks silence | Daily Mail Online

 

[bearbear]

so with the luminol testing, when they shine the black light on the sprayed area does the blue glow indicate blood/body fluids? they showed the police with their torches under the balcony last night and there was a huge solid area of blue, surely thats not all blood?
sorry i dont have a link it was shown on ch nine news early this morning

 

[bearbear]

fm describing how william wouldnt climb a tree...
M: No it’s not William, it’s not William, he doesn’t do that. On that morning, before he went missing, I’d put him in a tree because Mum’s got some good climbing trees, and he was in it, and he said, “No Mummy it’s too high, get me down,” and I said to him “Why, why don’t you try?”, and he said “No Mummy too high, get me down,” so he wouldn’t be in a tree, it’s not in him.
IN THEIR WORDS: William Tyrrell's parents talk of the day their boy went missing and the 'living nightmare' they endure

 

[FromGermany1]

NSW Police Force
Log into Facebook
The seized car of FGM .....

 

[Aimee2]

A vehicle is undergoing forensic examination after recently being seized by Strike Force Rosann detectives.
As part of ongoing investigations into the 2014 disappearance of three-year-old William Tyrrell, strike force detectives seized a Mazda from a home at Gymea under a Coronial Order last Tuesday (9 November 2021).
The vehicle was taken to a secure facility, where it is undergoing extensive forensic examinations and analysis, which is expected to take several weeks.
This activity relates to inquiries and search operations currently being conducted in the Kendall area.

NSW Police Force

 

[Waverider]

I think she said she drove off then turned around when she got to the riding school and couldn’t find William so came back to the house and rang the police

According to what FFC said in the 000 call at 10.53:

• William went missing 5 minutes beforehand, but she says that he could have actually been missing 10-15 but she’s unsure.
• She also said she had been up and down the road looking for him but couldn’t find him.
• There were no suspicious cars on the road.

There was no mention of getting in car to look for him. She said she only noticed him missing 5 minutes before the call. So if at some later date, she said she had driven looking for him before the call, which I agree that she allegedly must have before the police arrived, then her story is completely inconsistent.

In that case, I’m horrified that police didn’t do their due diligence at all and the lead investigators need to be investigated.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

easily bring a photo up on your phone, screenshot it & crop it to suit. You now have a new time stamp!
Great discussion, thank you!

<snipped as didn’t realise it was a digital camera rather than a smartphone, oops>

Begs the question how much investigation was done of the FP's back then. Welcome, by the way!!

so with the luminol testing, when they shine the black light on the sprayed area does the blue glow indicate blood/body fluids? they showed the police with their torches under the balcony last night and there was a huge solid area of blue, surely thats not all blood?

Based on that doorstep photo I mentioned with similar solid blue, where the perp had masturbated outside the house, I really flippin hope not!!

 

[inkpink]

I think it's very possible the photo has been shown to be fraudulent, which opens up many scenarios.

Something happened in the car after Mc donalds when they pulled over to put an overnight nappy on him.

Something happened at Nanna's that night/overnight Ie. William mistaking Nanna's medication for lollies (Might be why a prescription had to be filled the next day)

Both of these give enough time to concoct a story.

Another option is something happened after 7.30am when the real photo was taken, giving enough time to concoct a basic story, which evolved over time to include cars in the street etcc.

 

[PingTheRouter]

they showed the police with their torches under the balcony last night and there was a huge solid area of blue, surely thats not all blood?

i don't know what photo you are talking about as i haven't seen it and you haven't provided it

the ones iv seen though show them working with a light source to try pick up any blood/body fluids/bleach at night.. like this one below

source : William Tyrrell’s grandmother lashes out at suspect

 

[SouthAussie]

My brain is fried too. Even if the photo was misdated, how has it taken 7 years to work that out?! It does all sound a bit of a stretch to have hidden a body and composed a story, but the police seem confident in the current searches. Crazy!

<RSBM>

I would feel better about these searches if they didn't seem to be grandstanding.
In watching the Ch7 TV reporting this morning, they actually let the camera person right up onto FGM's (previous) property, to take video of them, from different angles.

The Ch7 journo said (again) I must stress this is only a theory.

This is allowing plenty of latitude for them to later say "Oops, well I guess that theory didn't pan out". imo
.

 

[bearbear]

P: I’d like to have a chat about William himself, because he’s such a vibrant kid, every parent like myself has seen that photo of him in the Spiderman outfit and it just tears at the heartstrings, like you not knowing, what do you see when you look at that photo?
M: I took the photo, I took three photos, I do photo books, of what we do as a family every year. So every time we go somewhere I have my camera and I just take pictures of what they’re doing, and I thought Mum’s getting old, be really good for William and his sister to have memories of being at Mum’s. And my Dad passed away in February that year so that was really the first time we’d been back since Dad passed away, and we were going to go visit Dad’s grave, they were drawing some pictures to put on his grave, they were sending messages to Opa and things like that. I just thought, I want to just take some pictures of that.
So I look at that picture and I remember what we were doing and why we were doing it. I remember William just being absolutely beside himself with happiness at being at Nanna’s house, I remember the discussion with William about putting on his Spiderman clothes because I wanted him to wear a singlet, he didn’t want to wear a singlet, so the compromise was he’d wear a Spiderman t-shirt underneath his Spiderman clothes, so he was Spidermanned out, completely.
All these little things that I just remember, it was just, a normal family, doing normal family things, with their grandmother. D had an appointment which is not unusual, he works remotely. We were going to wait for him to come home and then we were going to go and visit Dad’s grave, then we were going to go out, so we’d planned the day. And I look at that picture and I just think, minutes, minutes, and our world has changed. His sister no longer has a brother, we no longer have a son, we no longer have a child, we no longer have our boy. My Mum is coping with her own grief because it happened at her house, it’s just awful.
P: She can’t blame herself.
M: No she doesn’t, well I hope she doesn’t, no she can’t.

IN THEIR WORDS: William Tyrrell's parents talk of the day their boy went missing and the 'living nightmare' they endure

 

[drsleuth]

yes Doc, Xanthe Malett mentioned it in her comments on this latest development, and I also think it was mentioned in the announcement of this new search & how the Coroner is being kept ‘in the know’.

I’m tying to recall what time MFC left the house that morning to go for his business call. Do you remember what was said at Inquest please ?

Around 9am, just before I think from memory

 

[PingTheRouter]

This is allowing plenty of latitude for them to later say "Oops, well I guess that theory didn't pan out". imo

you'd think they would have to some sort of strong lead to do this though, someone else mentioned they are opening themselves up to a massive lawsuit if they are wrong

wouldn't be the first time either, because they probably would have needed someone higher up to sign off on this to get the go a head and whatever that presentation showed must have been compelling right?

otherwise..

 

[SouthAussie]

Around 9am, just before I think from memory

Yes, his car was seen on tennis club CCTV just before 9am.


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[misty48]

so with the luminol testing, when they shine the black light on the sprayed area does the blue glow indicate blood/body fluids? they showed the police with their torches under the balcony last night and there was a huge solid area of blue, surely thats not all blood?

Pigs' blood can be found in fertilizer (blood meal) so there's a good chance that was what the Luminol reacted to.
In 2004 experiments were started using horses' blood as detection material in soil to determine for how many years Luminol would be effective in reacting.
https://www.acsr.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/Gabel-Shimamoto-Stene-Adair.pdf
Unless there was a bloodbath, I think it's highly unlikely there would be much left to detect after 7 years.

 

[Spiralscientist]

First time poster-
Does anyone know whether the same phone gps tracking technology used in CS case in WA recently could have been used on old data from this case snd perhaps identified that the FFC stayed at one location, eg whether they are now digging approx 1km away, when she did the drive around?
Maybe the balcony fall and related search is a strategy to get FFC talking about a different ‘accidental’ confession, when in fact LE suspect it is related to something else relating to the current AVOs instead. IMO it has to have something more serious involved than an accidental fall.