AZ - Gabriel Johnson, 8 months, 26 Dec 2009 - last seen in Texas - #12

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TS is saying that EJ gave them Gabriels SS#, birth certificate, shot records, etc.? How convenient! I bet all of that info was given to an underground group.

The "Beth" who adopted in SA. Didn't she post a pic of her, hubby and newborn on the scrapbooking site? Didn't the AMW "tease" also have something about this "Beth".....maybe not...but I did see it somewhere....just in the last few days....I'll go search
 
December 23

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4685738&postcount=872"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - AZ-Gabriel Johnson, 8 months, missing since 12-26-09 thread # 9[/ame]
 
Amster said:
TS is saying that EJ gave them Gabriels SS#, birth certificate, shot records, etc.? How convenient! I bet all of that info was given to an underground group.

The "Beth" who adopted in SA. Didn't she post a pic of her, hubby and newborn on the scrapbooking site? Didn't the AMW "tease" also have something about this "Beth".....maybe not...but I did see it somewhere....just in the last few days....I'll go search
Click to expand...

On the video where tammi admitted to lying, at the end of it they showed the beth post
 
momtective said:
Thanks for the correction Kamille and for the additions from other posters.

So with the adjustment she packed an awful lot into one day didn't she.

Sat or Sun. Dec. 19th or 20th EJ contacts sitter arranges for her to sit with Gabriel on the Wed. Dec, 23rd @ 11:00am<snip>.
Click to expand...

Maybe I missed it, but I guess it was confirmed that Elizabeth contacted Analisa on the 19th or 20th?

So, we are then to assume that Elizabeth already knew she needed that specific time free or was that left open ended with the babysitter?

And, LE confirmed Elizabeth arrived in San Antonio on Dec 20th?
 
W8nC said:
My impression.....could very well be wrong....it's happened before....

On the 20th, EJ called the babysitter and arranged for her to come sit on the 23rd. On the 23rd, the babysitter came and watched Gabriel in the hotel room. EJ went out and met the prospective adoptive parents at a park, some park. She made an agreement with them to hand over Gabe, and possibly collected some up-front cash from them. When she returned to the hotel, she had money (paid the sitter), was happier than when she left (had an agreement in place regarding Gabe), and was having an argument on the phone with someone. I'd guess the argument may have been with Tammi, and may have been about the agreement she'd just made, which Tammi didn't like.

Then on the 26th or early on the 27th, she hands Gabe over to the new parents in the hotel room. She doesn't give them the car seat or all the other baby stuff because they have their own, don't want/need it.

This answers why she said she "met the couple" in the park, but then later says she "handed over Gabe" at the hotel. And she may have not wanted to take Gabe with her the first time she met them because she didn't trust that they wouldn't just take him and run off without giving her something in return? Or maybe didn't want to hand him over without first talking it over with Tammi, and then when Tammi gave her grief about it, decided to turn him over anyway. OR maybe she thought the park thing was a cop/Logan set-up?

Just my own speculation, opinion......no facts to back up any of this.....jusst thinking online...
Click to expand...

Quoting myself....I know, not good etiquette, lol.

BeanE, this pretty much matches your scenario! gmta :)
 
momtective said:
Thanks for the correction Kamille and for the additions from other posters.

So with the adjustment she packed an awful lot into one day didn't she.

Sat or Sun. Dec. 19th or 20th EJ contacts sitter arranges for her to sit with Gabriel on the Wed. Dec, 23rd @ 11:00am

Mon. Dec. 21st unknown what EJ did, if she was out and about with Gabriel or just staying in the hotel room.

Tue. Dec. 22nd unknown what EJ did, if she was out and about with Gabriel or just staying in the hotel room.

Wed. Dec. 23rd Sitter arrives to watch Gabriel @ 11:45am...45min. late.EJ goes out for two hours, possibly to meet with prospective adoptive parents...returns around 1:45-2:00pm. Sometime during this day EJ takes Gabriel to a park (obviously known by both the potential adoptive parents and EJ, possibly near their hotel or in route from their hotel to EJ's) so the potential adoptive parents can meet Gabriel.

Thur. Dec. 24th unknown what EJ did, if she was out and about with Gabriel or just staying in the hotel room.

Fri Dec. 25th unknown what EJ did, if she was out and about with Gabriel or just staying in the hotel room.

Sat. Dec. 26th or Sunday Dec. 27th...I lean heavily toward Saturday if they were traveling a significant distance since one would probably need to return to work on Monday and if they were flying they would probably want a day to just enjoy their new baby. Since no car seat was needed by the couple, I'm inclined to believe the flew and could have hoped an airport shuttle from the hotel they were staying in.

One would hope that airport video and passengers would have been looked at by LE for both the 26th & 27th and that all video from nearby hotels within a 3 mile radius would have been looked at as well.

Also, Elizabeth would have eaten whilst in SA, so is there video of her and Gabriel eating at a restaurant, Burger King, Taco bell, other fast food joint...any video of her at a grocery store, Walmart, or Target purchasing milk, snacks, etc.

If indeed EJ did give her child to a couple to adopt him and LE believed that then I would think they would have searched every source of video available during that time frame, from hotels, to banks, to ATM's, restaurants, and airports. Also suggested by another poster that the couple might have also shopped in the area for baby supplies.
I wonder if LE really believes the adoption story.
Click to expand...

IIRC, she didn't even arrive in SA until the 22nd.???
 
Originally Posted by Amster
TS is saying that EJ gave them Gabriels SS#, birth certificate, shot records, etc.? How convenient! I bet all of that info was given to an underground group.
Click to expand...

Yeah, exactly, this is very suspicious to me that all of this was given to the Smith's.
 
BeanE said:
Yeah but I've got my couple descending from the heavens, like the Greek gods.
Click to expand...

LOL, let's hope not! Those Greek Gods were pretty cra**y parents iirc.

I'd have to think the parents were arranged in advance, either by TPS, or some of her crowd, or by EJ, I have no clue. Wonder what EJ was doing with all her free time those 8 days the Smiths were "babysitting" for her. She didn't have a job, right? And it doesn't take all that much actual time to sell a couple dogs and some jewelry. Maybe she was online digging up some other options for her adoption scheme, other than TPS.....maybe a higher bidder.
 
Did anyone check into Jack Smith to see if he has a record?
I'm wondering why they made a move from Nashville.
He seemed to have a good business going in 2002.
 
Anyone else ever heard that Tammi has another last name that starts with a T?
 
trudysplace said:
I am not an attorney but have been in the legal field for many years. And the answer is yes, Texas would most likely be the state which would have jurisdiction, since baby G was last seen alive in SA.
Click to expand...

A big ty to the ones that responded to my question!

I only asked b/c I am for the DP especially when a child is involved. In Az the average time from conviction to execution is about 12 years, it may be longer for women sentenced to death. I hope I am correct to assume Tx would be much quicker.

I only hope what I am starting to think is wrong and sweet baby Gabe is home soon!
 
time said:
Yeah, exactly, this is very suspicious to me that all of this was given to the Smith's.
Click to expand...

Me too, I guess I can understand the BC and the shot records but SS number?
You would think in a case like this that the SS Administration would be notified that this is a missing child just in case someone tried to obtain a card for them..
Least, that is what I am thinking..
 
W8nC said:
LOL, let's hope not! Those Greek Gods were pretty cra**y parents iirc.

I'd have to think the parents were arranged in advance, either by TPS, or some of her crowd, or by EJ, I have no clue. Wonder what EJ was doing with all her free time those 8 days the Smiths were "babysitting" for her. She didn't have a job, right? And it doesn't take all that much actual time to sell a coule dogs and some jewelry. Maybe she was online digging up some other options for her adoption scheme, other than TPS.....maybe a higher bidder.[/QUOTE]

The 'baby market' is rife with that. I believe that was the reason for the reference in all those adoption ads to "no time wasters".

I had a close friend get royally jerked around by a young woman who used her baby as collateral. It broke her heart. They waited through the whole pregnancy being told they were "THE ONES", then it all fell apart at the end as they found there were a number of "OTHER ONES". :furious:
Click to expand...
 
Amster said:
TS is saying that EJ gave them Gabriels SS#, birth certificate, shot records, etc.? How convenient! I bet all of that info was given to an underground group.

The "Beth" who adopted in SA. Didn't she post a pic of her, hubby and newborn on the scrapbooking site? Didn't the AMW "tease" also have something about this "Beth".....maybe not...but I did see it somewhere....just in the last few days....I'll go search
Click to expand...

I'm wondering if they still have the documents. Also wondering if the birth certificate is one that has Gabriel's footprints on it or if it's just a standard B/C.
 
W8nC said:
LOL, let's hope not! Those Greek Gods were pretty cra**y parents iirc.

I'd have to think the parents were arranged in advance, either by TPS, or some of her crowd, or by EJ, I have no clue. Wonder what EJ was doing with all her free time those 8 days the Smiths were "babysitting" for her. She didn't have a job, right? And it doesn't take all that much actual time to sell a couple dogs and some jewelry. Maybe she was online digging up some other options for her adoption scheme, other than TPS.....maybe a higher bidder.
Click to expand...

and that would be why she would suddenly call TS and want Gabe back, so he coould "visit his daddy"??
 
I think it is good that the Tammi supporters on her page are now turning on her and linking her shady lies, connections etc
 
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