Babcock Murder Trial - Weekend Discussion #3

[Typhoo1961]

From the Mob Reporter on YouTube..What the jury saw: [video=youtube;46QwzJZulf4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=27&v=46QwzJZulf4[/video]

@ 4:47 on the video, can anyone tell me what you see in the .jpg's on that page? TIA

Is that Noudga in the picture?

 

[NoodlesMcgee]

Actually he told someone they burned a girl. He didn't say killed. Same with the rap. Doesnt mention the killing part.
That, among the other reasons I listed, leaves me with doubts about MS and the actual murder.

Both of the kid smoking buddies of MS said he told them he killed a girl. The one then said he didn't come out and said he killed a girl but the other one did say he said they killed a girl and then burned her.

 

[Kamille]

About the iPad serial number - totally agree. Seems so odd that it landed in MS’ name.

Also MS’ texts about the red bag and the iPad seem out of character, to me at least, based on his usual gangsta style. I would be interested in the full context of all that...

Also, why would Iisho be hanging out at his house for an undetermined long period of time, as stated in MS/DM texts from AH’s most recent video?

Not sure about the red bag and IPad texts. I think those came in from Dungey didn't they? I guess they didn't make it into the released evidence package from Falconer.

As for MWJ hanging around the Smich home, I understand that he and MS were schoolmates in Mississauga. So likely MS's mother knew him as Mark's friend Matthew. I think I remember from the TB trial that he was known to hang around on the porch of the Smich home. And there was something recently about him and MS hanging out in a garden shed in the yard. From the texts, it appears that MWJ is at the Smich home but MS is not although he is on his way there. And he tells DM that MWJ will be there until around 7pm if he wants to come talk to him. Maybe Mama Smich was making him dinner?

MOO

 

[Kamille]

Is that Noudga in the picture?

Yes it is

 

[Kamille]

From the Mob Reporter on YouTube..What the jury saw: [video=youtube;46QwzJZulf4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=27&v=46QwzJZulf4[/video]

@ 4:47 on the video, can anyone tell me what you see in the .jpg's on that page? TIA

I get what you're saying about those pics Lupy. They struck me right away too. First the incinerator and then pictures of a woman lying on the ground in two different positions and then a picture of a dog lying down. Does seem weird. Almost like checking for measurements IYKWIM.

MOO

 

[swedie]

Hey Swedie- it's good to be back, but it's not really good. Many following from the very early days of TB's disappearance/death probably have the same feeling. Thinking back to all of the people on here and other forums who held DM and his money in such high regard-not being able to understand that DM depended on his happy band of enablers who would do anything for a car, trip, drugs, a few bucks or the chance to share some excitement with the one and only mastermind DM. So many people believed DM was innocent.

We saw people who WM had hired for the MRO get crucified- claims of incompetence against well trained aviation people. It was all disgusting.

Most knew that the disappearance of LB and death of WM where no accidents. All of DM's friends are shallow souled enablers-AM, SS, MM, the Lisa's, his ex-fiance- to play ignorance would mean their IQ's were all low double digit bobble heads. It makes me sick to think "money" can do this. At the end of the day, TB's death and DM's escalating arrogance is bringing closure to LB and WM's deaths. It was only a matter of time before more "meat" was needed.

I'm very curious about the "another dead deer on the farm" comment made at the end of August. I for some reason read "deer" as "dead body"- a missing street worker? Deers don't normally go dropping dead out in the open- if they get hit by a car, I don't think someone would drag them to the field. IMHO DM was using some interesting terminology here. Was he thinking of disposing of his "ex"? One of the airplane execs? His dad? MM? There's no trophy pics or text chatter that we know of. It does make me wonder. MOO

BBM - Some people like to upset the apple cart just because they can kwim. I don't think it was a case of some not understand nor believing, but just cases of "because I can" mentality. I could elaborate more but seriously, it's not worth wasting brain cells over. Think like a dog...just kick the dirt over the carp and walk away. :laugh: Hey, I got a visual and I think that would be a cute emoji lol. This is a lovely crowd now and more deserving of attention.

I had absolutely, no doubt about it DM was the mastermind fairly early on and it's very apparent now as we are seeing. DM held the strings of the puppets and he was in control of them. They all knew too much and it is very disturbing what some people will do for money or a reward. Do I think he had any intentions of giving MS the Caddy or the rap studio? Nope, he just dangled that carrot awhile long and eventually he would have gained enough confidence in carrying out murdering on his own and done away with his wing man plus MM. Perhaps he was already in the planning stage for his next victims, drug overdose, car accident in a Caddy or Dodge Caravan maybe...he did have a great car mechanic you know. :thinking:

All these insiders are despicable and pathetic and I hope they never has a second of peace of mind. May they wake up in the nights haunted by nightmares. They need to be paranoid thinking any day LE just might show up at their door to lead them off to prison. DM's minions might believe they have fooled some of the people but that just goes to show how stupid and naive they really are. No one bought there BS lies.

You made a valid point about the deer. And yes the word deer...dear? I think many of us have had strong speculation there might have been other victims. I sure hope LE have done a thorough investigation and looked into other missing persons' cases, giving them serious consideration of the possibility. What's interesting IMO, is the fact DM would invest a large sum of money buying the incinerator and home made trailer, just to use for two people. I do think he was planning other missions. ALL MOO.

 

[huntergerrard]

I believe that the red tape shown on the vapour barrier that's crumpled up against the wall, is used to hold the plastic sheeting in place on the wall. If that's correct, then the monsters ripped vapour barrier off a wall and brought it to this crime scene. One does not use vapour barrier in a barn. I am very confident that DNA was found at the crime scene.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toront...sday-1.4394149

That's kind of what I said a few days ago. The plastic sheeting with red tape looks like the same plastic sheeting with red tape that was covering a patio door at DM's home (the pic of the pool).

 

[swedie]

I get what you're saying about those pics Lupy. They struck me right away too. First the incinerator and then pictures of a woman lying on the ground in two different positions and then a picture of a dog lying down. Does seem weird. Almost like checking for measurements IYKWIM.

MOO

The person lying on the ground looks to me like a guy in black swimming shorts, lying by the pool. Perhaps a bunched up grey towel beside him. JMO. Date are 6/8/12, times 1:05pm and 1:12pm.

 

[Lupy]

I get what you're saying about those pics Lupy. They struck me right away too. First the incinerator and then pictures of a woman lying on the ground in two different positions and then a picture of a dog lying down. Does seem weird. Almost like checking for measurements IYKWM

MOO

Thanks for your reply Kamille. This is what I am thinking too.

 

[Grey-St]

Grey - St, I agree with you it is the way predators act they groom the person first. Your comparison to pimps is I am sure correct. I think DM did it to Laura too because he gave her drugs like ecstasy at her birthday party that she got rid of . His method was the same with Laura and when she became a liability to him then he wanted to permanently get rid of her...
...what is more disturbing about MS and DM is how many protected them. By protecting these they actually allowed more murders to take place. If the police had been given more info about Laura and her ties to DM it probably would have caused the police to carefully look at DM. Instead many people knew things and protected DM and MS.

You got it! DM groomed, manipulated and then exploited everyone in his life. He kept people around for the very purpose of benefiting himself. None of his relationships (in love, friendship or business) were organic in any way. Didn’t he even write a note about Laura stating “what does she have to offer me?”

His minions were under his control and did their best to protect him (and also protect themselves). I’m not saying this however as an excuse for their behavior. Eventually your moral compass should kick in, and you’re supposed to then do the right thing.

As for the police, I think you’re misunderstanding some of the facts. They were giving a ton of information about Laura’s disappearance from SL and her family. They pretty much chose to not investigate further for their own biased reasons (IMO). This is the main reason DM got away with what he did for so long, and more murders took place.

However, I do remember a text from DM to MS stating he needed to “call the police back”. Does anyone remember when this occurred and can anyone speculate what it may have been about?

 

[deugirtni]

You got it! DM groomed, manipulated and then exploited everyone in his life. He kept people around for the very purpose of benefiting himself. None of his relationships (in love, friendship or business) were organic in any way. Didn’t he even write a note about Laura stating “what does she have to offer me?”

His minions were under his control and did their best to protect him (and also protect themselves). I’m not saying this however as an excuse for their behavior. Eventually your moral compass should kick in, and you’re supposed to then do the right thing.

As for the police, I think you’re misunderstanding some of the facts. They were giving a ton of information about Laura’s disappearance from SL and her family. They pretty much chose to not investigate further for their own biased reasons (IMO). This is the main reason DM got away with what he did for so long, and more murders took place.

However, I do remember a text from DM to MS stating he needed to “call the police back”. Does anyone remember when this occurred and can anyone speculate what it may have been about?

It was just a few days (3 or 4?) before WM committed 'suicide'. Was there a case involving one of DM's tenants around that time, perhaps?

 

[mimimic]

Re-reading the August/September bit in the timeline seems to be skimmed over. It is disturbing.

 

[Oreck]

Can anyone recap what the Crown witness actually said?

Because 5-10 miles seems way off.


Phones pinging off the same tower in the Toronto area would strike me as significant, IMO. I’m a 911 dispatcher in the area. If I were to get a 911 call on a cell phone in the 5 Maple Gate Area, I can see a) an estimated location with a suggested radius and b) the cell phone tower it’s coming from. It’d be extremely unusual to see a tower that far away based on my experience.

I live in a small city of 12,000 and we have one (ugly) tower in the center of town.
The Roger's man that testified said a cell phone has a range of 20 miles.

 

[Yendys]

From the Mob Reporter on YouTube..What the jury saw: [video=youtube;46QwzJZulf4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=27&v=46QwzJZulf4[/video]

@ 4:47 on the video, can anyone tell me what you see in the .jpg's on that page? TIA

@4:12 in this same video, the bottom left corner of file folders is greyed out. I'm sure we say this in the TB trial as well. WM related?

 

[canadiangirl]

I live in a small city of 12,000 and we have one (ugly) tower in the center of town.
The Roger's man that testified said a cell phone has a range of 20 miles.

Yes I think the report said 35kms which seems excessively far!

Sent from my SM-T320 using Tapatalk

 

[ABro]

I live in a small city of 12,000 and we have one (ugly) tower in the center of town.
The Roger's man that testified said a cell phone has a range of 20 miles.

Cellphone towers have different coverage ranges depending on where they are located. The denser the population, the smaller the physical range they cover.

A tower in an urban area is not going to be transmitting for users 5-10 miles away let alone 20. This is why 911 responders use them to get location information. In contrast, at the farm, calls and texts could be pinging a tower more than 30 miles away.

Of course, a tower ping can't put you in a given residence. Millard, Smich and Babcock could all have been at different houses that pinged that same Etobicoke tower on the day she vanished. Or maybe they all just left their phones in a field by the tower and went to a movie downtown.

Or, like you said, maybe Laura just happened to be with a client a few houses away from Millard's residence. Of course, there's no record of her calling that client and there is a record of her calling Millard, which is bit of a problem for that theory.

Then, there's also the fact that Millard's and Babcock's phones pinged a tower near Keele subway station shortly before pinging the tower near his house. And even more of a coincidence that the next day all three phones pinged towers heading to Oakville.

But if it was all just a giant coincidence, I'm sure the defence will call witnesses to explain it and tell us about where the defendants really were. Otherwise the location of the tower pings do corroborate the Crown's theory. Just like how the pings corroborated Laura's friends' stories about where she went before she disappeared.

 

[billandrew]

I get what you're saying about those pics Lupy. They struck me right away too. First the incinerator and then pictures of a woman lying on the ground in two different positions and then a picture of a dog lying down. Does seem weird. Almost like checking for measurements IYKWIM.

MOO

Great observation! I agree that those pics could be references for measurements. They were sent around the same time they were researching incinerators. They realized the homemade one wasn't going to cut it. Smich sent the message about "looking at a mobile one" and "some chopping wood be necessary".

 

[winter2017]

DM hjad a long history of doing troublesome things. He was already on the police radar because they had a record of his tattoo , the tattoo allowed Igor to identify him to the police. He had bothered neighbours I don't have the info but read that he was bothering neighbours , was harassing them, and would retaliate. The signs were there that he was not a nice person. All the same people many testified at first trial knew all this about him.
To become worse and worse and get into more criminal activity is not a surprise.
I am confused about something. they said MS told his gf to leave the garage when he showed some teenagers the rap song about killing someone. Then another video now has appeared where he sang the rap song with MM present, so I don't get it. There are a lot of suspicious things and inconsistencies that don't add up and it means that a lot of lying is going on.
Someone on here said the police messed up and I have said that, but that is before I knew all these people knew things by texts where DM is pretty much saying he is going to harm someone and then the very person he threatens to harm in texts , disappears, ummm, how smart do you have to be to them figure it out that he likely did harm to her. Yet none of them went to the police with info about the texts by him or the rap song, except one teenager, and it looked like that was ignored. MM heard the rap song in the basement of DM s father house, and I am sure since she was around MS all the time something was said about the disappearance of Laura, and that Laura was known very well by DM. Is she really that stupid that she did not think, Ummm, the rap song about killing someone + DM knew Laura = maybe contacting the police? I don't think she was that stupid, it was a deliberate choice not to provide information to the police. That is my opinion.
Then people are saying now what an honest person she was at the last trial, really, well I think she could have figured out with the rap song by MS that something was up and it was all over the news about Laura disappearance.

 

[billandrew]

[video=youtube;46QwzJZulf4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=27&v=46QwzJZulf4[/video]

In this video at 4:52, you can see that Millard sent Smich a screenshot of his June 9 argument with Noudga, the one where he said he wasn't going to call her his girlfriend anymore.

 

[Errrr]

Poor billandrew. AH, The Mob Reporter is making a lot of work for him tonight. LOL But it's fascinating to read this stuff. And yes, it appears we have clarification about the AM "IPod". It seems that LB had an old IPhone of AM's (or a new one that he shut down when it disappeared) that she had restored and used as an IPod for herself. She had a Blackberry so she didn't have this option with her phone. She obviously set up the phone with her own ITunes account and used it to purchase music.

It also appears that DM discovered this phone and believed it to be AM's missing phone. Laura claimed that her father found it in a park, brought it home and she restored it. Looks like DM went to see LB and stole it back. LOL Turned out it was AM's missing phone because DM knew a thing or two about serial numbers. (And he gave MS the IPad why?). DM and CN obviously believed she took it from the house and that she lied.

MOO

It's also possible DM gave it to her and he's lying about all these stories. He's been known to fabricate to cover his involvement with LB. we have never heard LBs take on this phone, just that she asked DM if she could keep it.