Bosma Murder Trial 02.29.16 - Day 16

[Bsafe]

I agree I think he was in the process of collecting everything to be destroyed. Its serendipitious that LE got to him when they did. :happydance:

Well we know LE paid DM a visit at the hangar just prior to his arrest. Seems he had collected some damaging evidence from the hangar; the gloves and the incinerator file and who knows what else. I suspect he may have been on his way to destroying this evidence but LE got to him before he had the chance. But yet he had TB's truck key on his key chain. :laugh:

CN's DNA found inside the gloves...again DM got someone else to do his dirty work. What's with these people putting themselves in the centre of DM's criminal business? Money I suspect. Here's hoping everyone who had knowledge and partook in helping DM trying to cover his murderous and illegal trails get exactly what they deserve. Sick, sick, sick. MOO.

 

[ArianeEmory]

I haven't read any theories about why DNA was found on the undercarriage and maybe it's too gruesome for people to imagine but I suspect it may have been to help the body fit into the incinerator better. I apologize if that's too offensive to imagine but it is the most likely conclusion.


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I don't see why, having seen the scientist crouching inside it. And Tim was skinny.

My only other theory is ... (Sorry) ... Blood spills/leaks from the truck, and they drive through the spill afterwards. But where was this site, if so?

 

[Ironworker736]

I sense that I'm annoying people by being persistent about this, but isn't it odd that they didn't follow up on the satchel bloodstain DNA, or do we think they just didn't have time today?

I don't think the crown is finished with this witness. I could be wrong.

 

[sleuther76]

The only thing linking MS to this so far is DNA from a cigarette butt found at the hangar correct? So far he's managed to stay in the background in the whole scenario. I wonder if it's the Security Video that is the real evidence that puts him in it? Waiting patiently for the pieces of the puzzle to come together.

I think it would have to be pretty damning security footage for it to constitute a 1st degree charge. However, you are correct, all the evidence (or lack therefore) against MS (thus far) has left reasonable doubt in my mind and had me wondering what evidence has yet to come ...

 

[girl_next_door]

I apologize if this has already been discussed (it probably has lol) but I can't keep up with hundreds of posts daily... I'm wondering why MM (smich's gf) has not been charged with anything whereas CN was? Given what smich said ("don't tell them anything babe") at the time of his arrest, him texting her that bosma was "gone gone gone" (mentioned in the crown's opening arguments) & that her DNA was found on things it seems she was involved or at the very least knew stuff??

 

[Tealgrove]

I sense that I'm annoying people by being persistent about this, but isn't it odd that they didn't follow up on the satchel bloodstain DNA, or do we think they just didn't have time today?

I don't think you are being annoying at all.

But I have been sitting here thinking about it.

Either the blood testimony on the bag got missed by reporters in all that was going on or we will hear about it tomorrow. Clearly a link has to exist between the blood stain, DM's DNA and the crime or else there's no point in bringing it forward as evidence.

I got nothing else at this point.

 

[Bsafe]

Would make more sense to leave the key in the ignition of the truck that was stored in the trailer. I agree it was more of a trophy being on his key ring.

DM having the key also contributes to the theory of DM as mastermind and the rest just lackeys doing his bidding, for money, drugs, kicks whatever.

IMO MOO

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Actually I think a book at this point would be suitable - eventually the world will need to hear about all of the evil done by DM and his crowd. A book will bring it all together in way that separate trials may not.

IMO MOO

I'm sure, ABro's book will be comprehensive and great (already in the work)!

 

[ArianeEmory]

Tealgrove, "missed by reporters" is something I wondered also. I checked the CBC site and the write up for today is still very slim.

 

[Sillybilly]

Yes, according to Canadian law he is. According to MM his then girlfriend, MS told her they were going to steal a truck. IF that was MS's only intention, truck theft, but during the heist, TB was murdered, MS is still responsible and liable. IF he was an innocent dupe, he should have gone to LE ASAP and told them what happened and he wouldn't be in the position he is in now.

Perhaps TD is trying to get MS's charges reduced to second degree. We'll have to wait and see what charges are on the table at the end of the trial, when the judge reads them to the jurors prior to them deliberating. MOO.

Classification of murder

231 (1) Murder is first degree murder or second degree murder.

Marginal notelanned and deliberate murder

(2) Murder is first degree murder when it is planned and deliberate.

Marginal note:Contracted murder

(3) Without limiting the generality of subsection (2), murder is planned and deliberate when it is committed pursuant to an arrangement under which money or anything of value passes or is intended to pass from one person to another, or is promised by one person to another, as consideration for that other’s causing or assisting in causing the death of anyone or counselling another person to do any act causing or assisting in causing that death.

http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C-46/section-231.html

I disagree swedie. The contracted murder reference to something of value passing from one to another is if someone pays, in dollars or widgets, someone else to carry out a murder. It does not relate to stealing an item from the victim. JMO

 

[Tealgrove]

I apologize if this has already been discussed (it probably has lol) but I can't keep up with hundreds of posts daily... I'm wondering why MM (smich's gf) has not been charged with anything whereas CN was? Given what smich said ("don't tell them anything babe") at the time of his arrest, him texting her that bosma was "gone gone gone" (mentioned in the crown's opening arguments) & that her DNA was found on things it seems she was involved or at the very least knew stuff??

Just guessing but I think she co-operated right from the start thus no charges. MOO

 

[Gumshew]

I don't think so... Just because there was a cigg butt with MM's DNA on it, doesn't mean she was apart of the mruder or clean up. AJ put MM & MS at the hangar prior to the murder, she could have smoked a cigg then...

IMO, MM did kow about the murder, but I believe she was honest once she was taken into custody, and that is why she has not been charged. I believe she will be the one of the most compelling witnesses for the crown...

I did say MM did not kill anyone(as per LE). Not saying MM will be charged. Just that perhaps other charges may be brought forth(I can only speculate who and what, at this point) after guilty verdicts for DM and MS.

Am very much looking forward to MMs testimony too!

 

[ArianeEmory]

I apologize if this has already been discussed (it probably has lol) but I can't keep up with hundreds of posts daily... I'm wondering why MM (smich's gf) has not been charged with anything whereas CN was? Given what smich said ("don't tell them anything babe") at the time of his arrest, him texting her that bosma was "gone gone gone" (mentioned in the crown's opening arguments) & that her DNA was found on things it seems she was involved or at the very least knew stuff??

One answer we've seen to this type of question a few times is, knowledge of a crime is not a crime. I'm just repeating what I've read though, not a lawyer.

 

[Sillybilly]

One answer we've seen to this type of question a few times is, knowledge of a crime is not a crime. I'm just repeating what I've read though, not a lawyer.

Here's a quick one for ya ... from the esteemed law firm of Borden, Ladner, Gervais article:

http://www.blg.com/en/NewsAndPublications/Documents/Publication_3458_1033.pdf

mere knowledge of a crime committed by others does not result in criminal liability under Canadian law.

 

[Ironworker736]

I disagree swedie. The contracted murder reference to something of value passing from one to another is if someone pays, in dollars or widgets, someone else to carry out a murder. It does not relate to stealing an item from the victim. JMO

In Canada, murder is classified as either first or second degree:[SUP][5][/SUP]

First degree	was planned and deliberate
was contracted
was committed against an identified peace officer
while committing or attempting to commit the hijacking of an aircraft
while committing or attempting to commit sexual assault
while committing or attempting to commit sexual assault with a weapon
while committing or attempting to commit aggravated sexual assault
while committing or attempting to commit kidnapping and forcible confinement
during a hostage taking
while committing criminal harassment
was committed during terrorist activity
while using explosives in association with a criminal organization
while committing intimidation.

[TD="bgcolor: #f2f2f2"] Type of murder
[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: #f2f2f2"] Nature
[/TD]

 

[Deleted member 102539]

The truck, "The Eliminator", the accused!, bones, bloodstains - the "Bosma Army" has already seen (and heard) a lot of terrible sad things. I hope, the group hasn't to follow a gruesome video from the hangar. :heartbeat: Some coffee outside the courtroom would be more bearable.

 

[Sillybilly]

In Canada, murder is classified as either first or second degree:[SUP][5][/SUP]

First degree	was planned and deliberate
was contracted
was committed against an identified peace officer
while committing or attempting to commit the hijacking of an aircraft
while committing or attempting to commit sexual assault
while committing or attempting to commit sexual assault with a weapon
while committing or attempting to commit aggravated sexual assault
while committing or attempting to commit kidnapping and forcible confinement
during a hostage taking
while committing criminal harassment
was committed during terrorist activity
while using explosives in association with a criminal organization
while committing intimidation.

[TD="bgcolor: #f2f2f2"] Type of murder
[/TD]
[TD="bgcolor: #f2f2f2"] Nature
[/TD]

Not sure what you are pointing out, but ...

Premeditated murder is if the murder was planned and deliberate, not a premeditated theft of a truck. Yes, if they can prove either or both were involved in the forcible confinement and the murder happened during the course of that forcible confinement, then either or both are guilty of 1st degree murder.

 

[Ironworker736]

Not sure what you are pointing out, but ...

Premeditated murder is if the murder was planned and deliberate, not a premeditated theft of a truck. Yes, if they can prove either or both were involved in the forcible confinement and the murder happened during the course of that forcible confinement, then either or both are guilty of 1st degree murder.

If they prove premeditation or forcible confinement for one, would it not apply to both automatically, given the attempt to cover up the crime? Just wondering?

 

[Sillybilly]

If they prove premeditation or forcible confinement for one, would it not apply to both automatically, given the attempt to cover up the crime? Just wondering?

No, because if one was not involved in either the planning of a murder or the confinement and only assisted in covering up the crime, they would then only be considered an accessory after the fact to murder (i.e. CN).

 

[Ironworker736]

No, because if one was not involved in either the planning or the confinement and only assisted in covering up the crime, they would then only be considered an accessory after the fact to murder (i.e. CN).

I see what you're saying, but to me it seems hard to imagine one of them being there before, during and after, yet only an being accessory after the fact. I wish we had joint venture liability here.