Bosma Murder Trial 04.13.16 - Day 34

[Inspector_North]

These guys are all in it together. They all go on missions and they are all trusted. This in an organized crime ring of sorts, kinda like the mafia. They call it making your bones. Once you've been on a "mission" you can be trusted because you are just as guilty as everybody else in the club.

It's a big jump from theft to premeditated murder, or the cover up of it. Just like assuming that pot smoking means they will easily move on to using heroin MOO

 

[DeepWoodsOff]

The way I see the reliability of witness memory issue is that when a witness's testimony seems to support our own or the popular viewpoint, it is more likely to be believed and the witness seen as being truthful and having a good memory, IMO.

As well, when a witness's testimony contradicts our own opinion or the group think, it is less likely to be perceived as credible, IMO and we then think they are lying or have a conveniently poor memory. Assessing witness credibility is a highly subjective exercise, IMO.

I think as human beings, and not as purely detached, objective people, we all assess witness testimony according to our own perceptions, and the Crown, and both defenses in this case will expose and exploit what they too each perceive to be the strengths and weaknesses in the witnesses testimonies. It's a complex thing trying to arrive at the truth, IMO. I feel for the jury who must decide this case.

All MOO.

Couldn't agree more! It is a very human thing to hear what we want to hear. For me, how they acted at the time they were first interviewed by police has more weight in how I perceive someone's testimony. Someone who cooperated right out of the gate would be more apt to be providing accurate, believable testimony versus someone who provided 4 different statements to police before revealing what they knew. Credibility of character, so to speak. MOO

To me it also speaks to the level that people were involved or how much knowledge they had about the usual "business" workings of DM. The guys that were in tight were more apt to lie to protect DM while the ones that were "small time" gangsters (in their mind) were scared almost straight when they realized murder was involved. MOO

All-in-all...a standard case for a jury...deciding what makes sense and what doesn't make sense and then applying the law. MOO

 

[andreww]

I've been adding Michalski's texts and other events to the timeline. One message that is standing out to me is May 7 @ 8:19am:

Michalski texts Millard, "I told her you guys were fine and it's not the first time this happened and won't be the last."

BBM. IMO this suggests Michalski was more knowledgeable of DM's plans than we've heard about through his testimony. You could also relate the message back to their prior conversation about DM needing to make $100,000 per month. Perhaps they were truly in the process of setting up a theft ring?

Exactly. The text about the sailboat shows that it is not only Millard that is scouting items and initiating missions.

 

[Nosey Parker]

If it was me and I was involved with past crimes with my friend, knew how they stole previous items and they had all the items at their side to steal a truck discreetly. I would assume that they would also steal it like most thieves do it. Scout it out where it is parked and the lighting etc. Bring a trailer of some sort hook the truck up to a winch and load it onto a trailer.

Exactly! Why test drive a vehicle you have already decided to steal? And we know DM had already decided to steal it.

 

[meterclicks]

Sadly most people care more about dogs than they do their fellow man these days.

Well, I'll be the first to admit that I care more about my dog than a good number of people. However, I'm not running "missions", cashing in on 5 finger discounts, having drug fueled parties or murdering people. :fence:

 

[meterclicks]

Court now resuming. The jury isn't back just yet.
by Adam Carter 11:55 AM

 

[DeepWoodsOff]

Exactly! Why test drive a vehicle you have already decided to steal? And we know DM had already decided to steal it.

This is exactly what is still causing me the most confusion.....if you just wanted the truck....steal it. Why even show yourself to anybody who can identify you? You had a guy working for you that has been shown to be able to switch out an ignition or hot wire a car so why even interact with the owners of these trucks? The only reasonable explanation is that the plan was to kill the owner. MOO

 

[redwing7225]

I don't think there have been any references to MB's whereabouts in MSM. But we do now now MB and CN were working to solve DM's problems together on the 11th, before the trailer was discovered by MB's neighbours and LE on the 12th.

Between 10:30 - 11:30pm on May 10th is when the neighbour spotted the trailer being driven into MB driveway. (according to spreadsheet)
iirc, someone mentioned seeing the door open or a light on...maybe I'm imagining this but perhaps MB was home at the time? imo

 

[TupeloMz]

This is exactly what is still causing me the most confusion.....if you just wanted the truck....steal it. Why even show yourself to anybody who can identify you? You had a guy working for you that has been shown to be able to switch out an ignition or hot wire a car so why even interact with the owners of these trucks? The only reasonable explanation is that the plan was to kill the owner. MOO

You just answered questions that I have had running around in my head for days. Thank you.

 

[andreww]

Exactly! Why test drive a vehicle you have already decided to steal? And we know DM had already decided to steal it.

I think it was a timing thing. He needed the truck soon and stealing it at night meant breaking a window, ignition, and steering lock. I still maintain the plan was to force TB out of his own truck but he fought back and was killed unexpectedly. But the idea was to get a pristine truck with keys.

 

[Ironworker736]

This is exactly what is still causing me the most confusion.....if you just wanted the truck....steal it. Why even show yourself to anybody who can identify you? You had a guy working for you that has been shown to be able to switch out an ignition or hot wire a car so why even interact with the owners of these trucks? The only reasonable explanation is that the plan was to kill the owner. MOO

You don't think that showing up at the target's house for a test drive would be a perfect way to scout it out for the future theft? They could have been planning to return that evening to actually steal it.

 

[TupeloMz]

You don't think that showing up at the target's house for a test drive would be a perfect way to scout it out for the future theft? They could have been planning to return that evening to actually steal it.

I get that...but why kill TB then?

 

[meterclicks]

Jury now being recalled.
by Adam Carter 12:04 PM

 

[Inspector_North]

Rather than assume the weight of the toolbox is 4-5 pounds, or why DM did something that didn't make sense. Assume Psychopath, and most actions become explainable. MOO

 

[Ironworker736]

I get that...but why kill TB then?

That's the question. Hopefully we find out.

 

[andreww]

It's a big jump from theft to premeditated murder, or the cover up of it. Just like assuming that pot smoking means they will easily move on to using heroin MOO

Im with you there. I don't think it was premeditated, just an armed robbery gone wrong.

 

[Nosey Parker]

You don't think that showing up at the target's house for a test drive would be a perfect way to scout it out for the future theft? They could have been planning to return that evening to actually steal it.

They could have scouted out the vicinity etc., as they had done on previous 'missions'. No need to make contact with the owner and drive it. IMO.

 

[ADAWG]

Test drive it one to see the lay of the land. Where it is parked and see if it is actually what you want. Pretend your interested to get an up close look of the property without having to sneak about. This way you can get a close up look if there is camera's etc. The kind of view from the road and how hidden you would be etc. I think test driving would give a thief a lot of valuable info with regards to stealing the vehicle

 

[brightii]

So AM expects DM to steal the truck - how the heck is he going to know any details? You think DM is going to incriminate himself fully to his buddy by telling him every single detail of the crime? Come on, who is being naive?

DM had no reason to share with AM his intention to steal a truck, and IMO, when DM chose to do so he actively and fully incriminated himself.

Yesterday, AM was asked by the Crown why he asked DM about the Monday test drive with the truck and here is AM's response:

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 14s15 seconds ago
Crown asks why he would ask about the truck. "I was just curious," he says. #Bosma

It seems to me that not only is AM lying about what he knew about the theft, and perhaps more, he in his own words was "curious" enough to follow up later with DM about the truck, IMO. I cannot believe that had DM only told AM that he successfully stole it, the conversation would have stopped there. AM would more than likely have asked him for details, IMO, to satisfy his self-professed curiosity, IMO. Also, his "I was just curious" remark about the theft of a truck was IMO a very cavalier statement to make. IMO, AM was not disturbed by DM's truck theft plan . . . at all.

All MOO.

 

[Massasauga Rattler]

I don't think there have been any references to MB's whereabouts in MSM. But we do now now MB and CN were working to solve DM's problems together on the 11th, before the trailer was discovered by MB's neighbours and LE on the 12th.

Leads me to believe we're going to hear from MB on the stand, since there is obviously some involvement regarding concealment of evidence. Or did she ALSO not make the connection between the trailer pressed up against her garage and her son's arrest?