Bosma Murder Trial - Weekend Discussion #1

[Errrr]

Your assumptions are comforting because you are not seeing this from an Anti-Social Personality Disorder (psychopath) lens. I have been following this closely, have been working in psychiatry with some time working in max security forensic psychiatry for over 20 years. Only my opinion but a lifestyle like his offers little opportunity for highs because he has been catered to and or could buy anything he ever needed. A select few psychopaths get no real highs anymore and only something so extreme like murder can provide that kind of rush. The sloppiness should not be mistaken for arrogance since the last two murders were so poorly investigated.

DM got his first taste of death when he was working on an airplane wing in Brantford for his grandfather. He and an old guy were working off a platform when the old guy fell off and died. I think DM was just a teenager.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

I think the last witness had said that Dellen was sleeping at the hangar when not going home. If there are no phone records for MS ( regular phone) it does suggest that the burner was his (MS)IMHO

There were also reports from neighbours that DM spent time at his own home, as he and friends had been tidying or doing some front yard work on the Wednesday evening. ( May 8th )

I don't think its likely that DM had a sleepover at MS mothers house, he was 27 at the time. JMO

Men were working on car/cars on Wednesday, I think. I don't find the link, sorry.

 

[Sillybilly]

I think the last witness had said that Dellen was sleeping at the hangar when not going home. If there are no phone records for MS ( regular phone) it does suggest that the burner was his (MS)IMHO

There were also reports from neighbours that DM spent time at his own home, as he and friends had been tidying or doing some front yard work on the Wednesday evening. ( May 8th )

I don't think its likely that DM had a sleepover at MS mothers house, he was 27 at the time. JMO

The way Adam Carter's tweets re Jenning's testimony were worded/ordered, I got the impression that DM just started staying at the hangar that week:

Adam Carter
Feb 4 2016 12:31 PM
Jennings says by that time Millard was living in the office area of the hangar. There was a shower, etc in there.

Adam Carter
Feb 4 2016 12:32 PM
Millard and Shane (his son in law) were in the office area of the hangar having a "heated discussion," on Friday when he got back from Home Depot, Jennings says.

Adam Carter
Feb 4 2016 12:33 PM
The two kept looking over at Jennings, he says. "I had this feeling that something's not right here," he says.

Also of note, from ABro's site, DM was known to "hang out" at Smich's at times:

http://www.annrbrocklehurst.com/tag/matthew-ward-jackson

And finally, one last piece of information about how Matthew Ward-Jackson is connected to Dellen Millard. Friends of Iish and Mark Smich tell me that Iish often hung at Smich’s place. They were on good enough terms that Iish would even comment on one of Smich’s sister’s Instagram accounts and interacted on Facebook with Smich’s BFF, Cora. Iish also knew Dellen Millard, who hung out Chez Smich from time to time as well. So, that’s the connection.

 

[ABro]

And, yes, MS lived in Oakville. Which is why I wondered,
if it is DM's burner phone, then why was it in Oakville before DM was?

How do you know where DM was that day? We haven't heard evidence on that topic yet.

 

[jash]

I actually believe that is why he bought it and got his dads approval, by taking him along to see it. It's what a lot of people do, they buy land and build a home.

I'm surprised to be saying this but I kinda agree. According to my notes, DM bought that farm for $835K cash in May 2011. That was around the time he had those non-traditional (trying to be polite) engagement photos done, and more than a year before LB went missing.

I'm not aware of anything that suggests the fiancee was involved in any of DM's nefarious activities. In 2011, there was a house in Oakville where they reportedly had lived together for at least some period of time (per my notes, the house was in fiancee's name and post-breakup, DM was involved in its sale in February 2012).

Just to add some perspective to the timeline, at the end of May 2011 (not long after buying the farm and the engagement photo-shoot), DM and his two buddies drove down to Mexico for the Baja 500 race (~3 week trip). By August 1, 2011, DM and CN had already gotten together.

I would be surprised if the ex-fiancee was called as a witness, but I do wonder if she was interviewed by police at all just for some background on DM. I think she was living in one of his condos at the time of the murder(s), so likely was still on good terms with him.

 

[JuneBug67]

[meant to quote a poster who argued Tim would not have resisted if a gun was pulled on him - sorry!]


I can almost guarantee virtually none of us knows what we would actually do in a situation like this. I was the victim of an attempted robbery at knife point alone on a drak street at night. They were two young men, I was a single mom with a one year old child at home. I had 20 dollars on me. The rational thing to do was hand over my 20 and get home safe. What I did instead was flip out swearing at them, yelling and arguing with them, calling them losers effectively, even as they were walking away! This caused the knife holder to wheel back and lunge at me with the stiletto knife to scare me. That shut me up finally, and I shook like a leaf all the way home because of fear and how shocked I was at my own behaviour. There was nothing rational, planned or calculated about it. It just rose up from some well spring of I don't know what in my personality, or from some reactive primitive brain area. I felt terrible guilt thinking about my son. 20 dollars, you know? That's about $29,980 less than Tim's truck.

 

[flipflop]

[meant to quote a poster who argued Tim would not have resisted if a gun was pulled on him - sorry!]


I can almost guarantee virtually none of us knows what we would actually do in a situation like this. I was the victim of an attempted robbery at knife point alone on a drak street at night. They were two young men, I was a single mom with a one year old child at home. I had 20 dollars on me. The rational thing to do was hand over my 20 and get home safe. What I did instead was flip out swearing at them, yelling and arguing with them, calling them losers effectively, even as they were walking away! This caused the knife holder to wheel back and lunge at me with the stiletto knife to scare me. That shut me up finally, and I shook like a leaf all the way home because of fear and how shocked I was at my own behaviour. There was nothing rational, planned or calculated about it. It just rose up from some well spring of I don't know what in my personality, or from some reactive primitive brain area. I felt terrible guilt thinking about my son. 20 dollars, you know? That's about $29,980 less than Tim's truck.

Good point ! ! I think every one of us would be shocked how we would handle a situation like TB's. No one could say how TB would respond to a gun pulled on him, as we do not know how he thinks in traumatic situations and we were not there. Perhaps he didn't have a chance to respond, perhaps he did. Time will tell.

 

[MsSherlock]

I'm surprised to be saying this but I kinda agree. According to my notes, DM bought that farm for $835K cash in May 2011. That was around the time he had those non-traditional (trying to be polite) engagement photos done, and more than a year before LB went missing.

I'm not aware of anything that suggests the fiancee was involved in any of DM's nefarious activities. In 2011, there was a house in Oakville where they reportedly had lived together for at least some period of time (per my notes, the house was in fiancee's name and post-breakup, DM was involved in its sale in February 2012).

Just to add some perspective to the timeline, at the end of May 2011 (not long after buying the farm and the engagement photo-shoot), DM and his two buddies drove down to Mexico for the Baja 500 race (~3 week trip). By August 1, 2011, DM and CN had already gotten together.

I would be surprised if the ex-fiancee was called as a witness, but I do wonder if she was interviewed by police at all just for some background on DM. I think she was living in one of his condos at the time of the murder(s), so likely was still on good terms with him.

IMO, there's a fine line between "being involved" in a persons nefarious actions and being "aware" or that "fear" that someone could be involved in nefarious actions. I group the ex fiancé in the latter, right along with AJ. IMO, the latter can hang in there, reaping the benefits of their association until their suspicions are confirmed. Maybe DM did have plans to get married and build his dream house there, but then perhaps it was just a good way to get a significant pile of money from his Dad. Really a brilliant way to show his Dad that he was serious about being the CEO of Millardair. While WM was investing millions of dollars into the Hangar I don't think he could ever have imagined that the 50,000 square feet he poured everything into would soon become an elaborate oversized garage for his son.

I'm curious to see if we're going to get a look into DM's financial health. IMHO, looking at this from a strictly logical perspective, DM's balance sheet had to be in steep decline. A huge cash outlay for the distillery condo, upkeep-utility-taxes on Maple Gate, lease payments, utilities and labour costs for the Hangar, vehicles, insurances etc along with all the money that has to be paid out to the CRA when an estate like WM's has to be settled. Aside for rent coming in from the 6plex that DM owned, I'm not sure what kind of income DM really had. MOO

 

[Sphinx]

DM got his first taste of death when he was working on an airplane wing in Brantford for his grandfather. He and an old guy were working off a platform when the old guy fell off and died. I think DM was just a teenager.

In light of what has transpired since, one has to wonder if the old man really just " fell off " the platform, or was the old fellow getting on DM's nerves, and if there was no one else around to see, was he pushed ???? Just speculation on my part, and my own opinion.

 

[MsSherlock]

I never thought of that, but it makes sense. The more I hear about this, the more unplanned it looks. At least on DM's side, since it's all the things that would have been under his control (his incinerator, his hanger, his tattoos, his employees, etc) that showed no signs of being given any forethought or planning.

IMHO, I'm more than content to wait for the Crowns evidence to unfold but I'll tell you where the "unplanned" theory loses it with me. The fact that TB's truck just happened to have the right trailer hitch to tow the incinerator to the hangar. How fantastically convenient was that!!! Sure, sure, it may have been one of those crazy frantic decisions that you make when you have a dead body in the truck that you just stole. First of all, the truck had a box on it, so there's a good possibility that DM and MS put the body in the box so they weren't driving around with it- would explain blood on the undercarriage. IMO, DM and MS had lots of opportunity to ditch the body- they were travelling thru a remote area- creeks, brush, forests- no need for the eliminator. MOO

 

[Juballee]

IMHO, I'm more than content to wait for the Crowns evidence to unfold but I'll tell you where the "unplanned" theory loses it with me. The fact that TB's truck just happened to have the right trailer hitch to tow the incinerator to the hangar. How fantastically convenient was that!!! Sure, sure, it may have been one of those crazy frantic decisions that you make when you have a dead body in the truck that you just stole. First of all, the truck had a box on it, so there's a good possibility that DM and MS put the body in the box so they weren't driving around with it- would explain blood on the undercarriage. IMO, DM and MS had lots of opportunity to ditch the body- they were travelling thru a remote area- creeks, brush, forests- no need for the eliminator. MOO

I imagine this same argument would work if the truck didn't have a trailer hitch and the incinerator was loaded into the bed of the truck and transported that way.

DM was looking for a truck to pull a trailer to buy. He already had a truck with a trailer hitch. If this was planned, why wouldn't he have used the truck he already had to pull the incinerator to the hanger ahead of time? If he's the one who thought ahead to bring a gun, why wouldn't he have thought ahead to prepare the hanger for a dead body?

This again makes me think that the one who planned to bring a gun didn't have access to the other things like trucks and incinerators and hangers and trailers that were required afterwards to cover up the crime. The one who brought the gun only had access to the gun would be my guess, and something tells me that if he had his own vehicle he wouldn't have needed DM along at all.

 

[Juballee]

In light of what has transpired since, one has to wonder if the old man really just " fell off " the airplane wing, or was the old fellow getting on DM's nerves, and if there was no one else around to see, was he pushed ???? Just speculation on my part, and my own opinion.

I don't have have the article in front of me, but wasn't it only like a 6 or 8 foot fall? I doubt that's tall enough for a teenager to think he could kill a man if he pushed him from it. Most teenaged boys I know think they could easily jump down 8-10 feet because they see it in movie chases all the time.

Also, I believe that the man was still alive after falling, wouldn't he have said to one of the other witnesses, 'The kid pushed me!'?

 

[matou]

I just read this comment on ABro's blog and it's a good question:

Why is Pillay allowed to cross examine witnesses before Dungey? It's happened with every witness so far, I believe. ABro is going to look into it.

 

[Errrr]

In light of what has transpired since, one has to wonder if the old man really just " fell off " the platform, or was the old fellow getting on DM's nerves, and if there was no one else around to see, was he pushed ???? Just speculation on my part, and my own opinion.

I'm not suggesting he was responsible in any way. There is no evidence to support that and he doesn't seem the type to lash out in anger. He may have experienced a sense of excitement he had never before encountered. It's significant if one doesn't normally feel much.

 

[etrain]

dm should have been caught long before this. When he brought the incinerator across the border, they did an investigation on him and why he would need the incinerator. There is no way that a guy that is not in the farming business should have been able to bring it over. He bypassed the guy who sells these in canada by buying it in the usa.

 

[matou]

dm should have been caught long before this. When he brought the incinerator across the border, they did an investigation on him and why he would need the incinerator. There is no way that a guy that is not in the farming business should have been able to bring it over. He bypassed the guy who sells these in canada by buying it in the usa.

I thought he did buy it in Canada. Do you have a source for this info? TIA

 

[Sphinx]

I don't have have the article in front of me, but wasn't it only like a 6 or 8 foot fall? I doubt that's tall enough for a teenager to think he could kill a man if he pushed him from it. Most teenaged boys I know think they could easily jump down 8-10 feet because they see it in movie chases all the time.

Also, I believe that the man was still alive after falling, wouldn't he have said to one of the other witnesses, 'The kid pushed me!'?

You make some good points. It may have been an accident, or possibly DM, because of his resentment, and bad temper, managed to " bump " into the old man, or " accidentally " trip him, likely smiling like a genuine guy, while he did it. With plausible deniability, his Grandfather, and Father would have protected him, and since he was a minor, not much would have happened to him in the justice system. I just find it suspicious that he has been charged with first degree murder in 3 separate cases, and this incident is in his background. If he is a serial killer, he may have started early. Most of them do. This is all speculation on my part, and my own opinion.

 

[MsSherlock]

I imagine this same argument would work if the truck didn't have a trailer hitch and the incinerator was loaded into the bed of the truck and transported that way.

DM was looking for a truck to pull a trailer to buy. He already had a truck with a trailer hitch. If this was planned, why wouldn't he have used the truck he already had to pull the incinerator to the hanger ahead of time? If he's the one who thought ahead to bring a gun, why wouldn't he have thought ahead to prepare the hanger for a dead body?

This again makes me think that the one who planned to bring a gun didn't have access to the other things like trucks and incinerators and hangers and trailers that were required afterwards to cover up the crime. The one who brought the gun only had access to the gun would be my guess, and something tells me that if he had his own vehicle he wouldn't have needed DM along at all.

(modsnip)- back to the "couldn't be DM theory"- had to be someone else, etc etc. IMHO, the Crown certainly isn't thinking this. LE who investigated the crime certainly aren't thinking this. The AG certainly isn't thinking this. IMHO, it's time to cut with the deferral of blame to someone else. They're both charged with the crime. It's the end of the road for DM and his sick murderous antics. No more finger pointing, no more denial, no more getting away with murder! Time to face the facts and the punishment IMHO

 

[SnooperDuper]

(modsnip)- back to the "couldn't be DM theory"- had to be someone else, etc etc. IMHO, the Crown certainly isn't thinking this. LE who investigated the crime certainly aren't thinking this. The AG certainly isn't thinking this. IMHO, it's time to cut with the deferral of blame to someone else. They're both charged with the crime. It's the end of the road for DM and his sick murderous antics. No more finger pointing, no more denial, no more getting away with murder! Time to face the facts and the punishment IMHO

The jury isn't sitting there thinking is there a way that DM could be innocent and MS, guilty?

They are taking in all the evidence and so far it all points to DM.

 

[matou]

I wonder if DM checked his own video surveillance and saw that AJ took the photos?

Also: DM's statement when LE wanted to search his hangar "I thought you would want to." is sooooo cocky. Really??? You're gonna actually say this to police? SMH