Bosma Murder Trial - Weekend Discussion #1

[Snowglobe]

How strange is this?

http://www.tristarag.ca/?page_id=130

http://m.thestar.com/#/article/news...ck_leaves_lingering_questions_for_police.html

This is the company that sold the Eliminator to DM. A piece of equipment that expensive likely would have been ordered in after payment, not kept in stock on spec.

But look at what else they sell: water purification equipment. Just an odd coincidence that Tim Bosma's phone was found outside a water purification company.

 

[HackD]

I had never thought of it, but you could be onto something here. What if MS did video the kill from the backseat with his phone ? These guys might have actually wanted their own snuff film to admire later, or SM may have wanted proof that he was not the shooter. ( DM identified by tatoo on wrist of hand holding the gun ? ) If they blacked out some facial details, they might have been able to sell it. There could have been big money in that, but I think the main target of the crime was the truck, and that it could have been that the gun was only used to threaten Tim out of the car, but it all went wrong. I am a bit surprised that they proceeded after being seen by SB, and the tenant at the Bosma home.

If filmed, left wrist of person holding the gun from a drivers seat will be facing the dashboard/steering wheel. Any idea of video production I think might be a bit too much forward thinking to attribute to MS and DM.

I agree it's the truck at the heart of this. I also lean on the theory that this is quite possibly a car-jack gone wrong.

I wonder if MS and DM were 'lit up' with a little Peruvian marching powder, immediately before seeing TB.

 

[Tamarind]

Think about this: Donut goes into a Tim Hortons, where he is spotted by cops taking a coffee break. A day later, cops recall sketchy character from coffee shop, when Tim Bosma is widely known to be missing. Seems like a risky and dumb choice. But no one said criminals are smart.

I would imagine anyone going into Timmies would be buying a beverage and possibly something to eat. I don't imagine they would sit there with a hoody over their head and avoiding eye contact. Thats just my opinion. However if a someone was in another vehicle, after dropping off at test drive and wanted to meet up later, I can see them going through a Timmies drive thru and going to wherever itwas arranged to meet up.

 

[Tamarind]

Words her testimony? IIRC, she's given LE an actual statement, so wordsmithing her testimony 2 years later could get pretty dicey for her- no? Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe that anything CN says while testifying in the TB case can be used against her with her own charges, so IMO, there's going to be an outstanding butt saving performance. The Crown obviously has enough evidence on her to charge her with an Accessory after the Fact- the last thing she needs is a perjury charge to top it off. MOO

Witnesses to date have changed their testimony in some areas. It is the on the stand testimony that I am interested in. Statements can be vague.

 

[Tamarind]

Is DM left- or right-handed? Left-handed people are usually somewhat ambidextrous out of necessity from living in a right-handed world.

Is there video of the murder? Seems lots of video is planned to appear, given the Crown's opening statement. If only we knew whether Tim was shot in the right eye.

Being shot in the right eye would suggest the shot came from outside of the truck. IMO

 

[Snowglobe]

Is the Huang Wei burner phone the cheap flip phone model that I think it is? Very basic and low-end, not good for much, IMO, no loss to toss.

 

[Tamarind]

Do I have a link to a hypothetical scenario being put forth where Tim was shot by a person in the back seat and yet the GSR was located on the ceiling of the front driver's side? Nope, I don't.

The person in the back would have had to have lined up the gun to the side of the headrest, That would mean that the residue would have been in the area of the driver IMO.

 

[Snowglobe]

Does the Tim Hortons in Ancaster have video cams?

 

[Alethea Dice]

It's just ridiculous to think someone worked his way through that tight area and put the gun in a position where the residue ended up on the driver's side.

Isn't the clearest, most obvious solution that DM shot TB?

I don't really think it's possible for the residue to be on the driver's side after a shot from behind because the seats limit a backseat's shooter's mobility and range so much.

I don't understand why some people think it's so important to have the tunnel vision that MS was the assailant.

I think MS was only the getaway driver.

You're certainly entitled to your opinion, as is everyone. I think it is just as ridiculous to think that someone would have to work his way through a tight area or lean over the high part of the seat. He doesn't have to put his body though the space and there is plenty of room for his arm to go through by leaning forwards. If that were the case, it wouldn't be a "shot from behind". The back seat offers much more mobility and range than the driver's seat does.

Personally, what I don't understand is why some people have the tunnel vision that MS had no involvement other than driving the Yukon and waiting for a ride home.

 

[Tamarind]

Why bring a gun if you intend to strangle someone?

So far, there's been no hint that MS was involved at all, except to be there to drive the Yukon and wait for a drive home at the hangar.

It hasn't even been mentioned at trial that he drove the Yukon or whatever else vehicle dropped them off. DM had more than one vehicle to his name so it's not like he needed the Yukon and MS to get home. Besides didnt AJ say that DM stayed at the hangar sometimes! MS was there for some reason and don't think it was to drop off and wait around for no reason IMHO. I do however think others were in a drop off vehicle, at least one other.

 

[MsSherlock]

Does the Tim Hortons in Ancaster have video cams?

That TH's is right beside a Pioneer Gas station that's loaded with cameras. They share a parking lot.

 

[Tamarind]

That TH's is right beside a Pioneer Gas station that's loaded with cameras. They share a parking lot.

Thats assuming the drop off went to the closest Tim's to where they dropped off or to a Tim's closer to where they arranged to meet. IMO

 

[SnooperDuper]

You're certainly entitled to your opinion, as is everyone. I think it is just as ridiculous to think that someone would have to work his way through a tight area or lean over the high part of the seat. He doesn't have to put his body though the space and there is plenty of room for his arm to go through by leaning forwards. If that were the case, it wouldn't be a "shot from behind". The back seat offers much more mobility and range than the driver's seat does.

Personally, what I don't understand is why some people have the tunnel vision that MS had no involvement other than driving the Yukon and waiting for a ride home.

Why make Ms into the murderer when he's not, though? <JMO>

 

[Snowglobe]

Or that "Donut" existed. Anyways, the Wilson Street location does have a drive-thru cam:

http://mobile.yp.ca/bus/Ontario/Ancaster/Tim-Hortons/4363875.html

Yes, going there would be a poor choice, if one wanted to avoid detection. Maybe "Donut" went to TH in Brantford, closer to the end destination.

 

[MsSherlock]

You're certainly entitled to your opinion, as is everyone. I think it is just as ridiculous to think that someone would have to work his way through a tight area or lean over the high part of the seat. He doesn't have to put his body though the space and there is plenty of room for his arm to go through by leaning forwards. If that were the case, it wouldn't be a "shot from behind". The back seat offers much more mobility and range than the driver's seat does.

Personally, what I don't understand is why some people have the tunnel vision that MS had no involvement other than driving the Yukon and waiting for a ride home.

Oh don't get me wrong. IMHO, MS is just as guilty as DM is and they're both justly charged. It was a team event. If you took either one out of the equation, the murder would not have happened. It took both of them to get the truck, murder TB & incinerate TB to conceal the crime. Also, just my observation, DM seldom operated solo. Thus the CN and SS connections. MOO

 

[EspressoBean]

There is no evidence to suggest that Donut existed and no evidence to suggest a Tim Hortons was involved. That only came in the picture b/c the suspects said their friend dropped them off and went to TH. It's pretty clear they had some nefarious plan in mind so it would be doubtful they'd say TH if the plan involved a Tim's. Saying someone just went to Tim Hortons is just a believable thing for anyone in Ontario to say. There has been no evidence pointing to a Tim Hortons.....or a donut, really.

 

[Snowglobe]

If "Donut" had a rendezvous in Brantford, this would show advance planning. Advance planning is not necessary for a first-degree murder conviction, if the murder was committed during others crimes, as pointed out by sillybilly. But if Brantford was preselected as the location for murder, why? Do certain people connected to this murder live there? Convenience?

 

[Snowglobe]

I think a number of us are quite skeptical of anything these characters said.

 

[EspressoBean]

If "Donut" had a rendezvous in Brantford, this would show advance planning. Advance planning is not necessary for a first-degree murder conviction, if the murder was committed during others crimes, as pointed out by sillybilly. But if Brantford was preselected as the location for murder, why? Do certain people connected to this murder live there? Convenience?

LE said that the murder happened in the truck, close to home. Brantford is where the truck drove through and what happened there is still in question.
But as for a Brantford relevance, SS lives there.

 

[SnooperDuper]

Oh don't get me wrong. IMHO, MS is just as guilty as DM is and they're both justly charged. It was a team event. If you took either one out of the equation, the murder would not have happened. It took both of them to get the truck, murder TB & incinerate TB to conceal the crime. Also, just my observation, DM seldom operated solo. Thus the CN and SS connections. MOO

I see DM as the leader and MS as his left hand man...yes, DM felt he needed to have an assistant (and shows a remarkable ability to delegate, too).

DM wouldn't have committed the crime without MS's support, but MS would not have committed the crime at all if he were paired with another person, IMO.

I think the trial will show little involvement by MS, except immoral support.