CA/Canada - Elisa Lam - 21 years old - Los Angeles/Vancouver - 31-Jan-2013 - #1

[mollymae]

I have a question...Was the water tank CLOSED when the worker went up there to investigate? I assume it must have been, or else how could LE have missed checking them when they were up there searching with dogs? And the dogs wouldn't have smelled a decaying body in an OPEN water tank? I highly doubt anyone could reach up from inside that tank and securely close that lid. This is an important detail...

 

[tarabull]

After watching the video a few more times, I am still convinced that the first button she pushes lights up and immediately goes unlit when she takes her finger off, then the four underneath stay lit after she pushes them. Based on the yelp picture of the elevator panel posted earlier in the thread, the button I am referring to would be 14th floor (12th is to the left of it and 15th is to the right of it). If what I am seeing is correct, wouldn't that mean she was on the 14th floor? If she wasn't staying on the 14th floor, I wonder why she would be there.

Do we know if she was staying at the Cecil or the Stay on Main? I believe tarabull posted that the Stay on Main occupied floors 4 - 6 (I'll look back in the thread to confirm). So, if she was in fact staying within floors 4-6, why would she be on the 14th floor?
What happened to you Elisa? This is so sad and scary.

<snip>

BUT - do we know which one she was staying at? The Cecil or Stay?

BBM above, i agree 100% - based on the behavior of the lights on the elevator panel - Elisa most likely was entering the elevator on floor 14...

As for which witch...Cecil or Stay...both have been reported as the hotel she was a guest at...

Maybe they will soon be more specific and report EXACTLY which floor for both, the video and her room.

Sidenote: floor 14 is REALLY the 13th....

ETA: Strike what's in blue above --- I have to disagree, it's NOT the 14th Elisa enters the elevator on ---AFTER reviewing, I remember now, this video showing the 14th floor - isn't the same as the floor Elisa is on in the video - unless they renovated...(at 2:24 mark)...

http://youtu.be/_zkukLsXdE0

 

[Sillybilly]

There is no public access to the roof; it's secured with a lock and an alarm.

Don't know if you saw the info i posted earlier wrt the fellow who claims there are 3 ladders that anyone can use to get to the roof:

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8891136&postcount=421"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased CA/Canada - Elisa Lam - 21 years old - Los Angeles/Vancouver - 31-Jan-2013[/ame]


ETA: Sorry, just catching up and see this has already been addressed

 

[The Cheese]

Jason Proctor &#8207;@proctor_jason
LA coroner says autopsy on Elisa Lam is scheduled for tomorrow morning. Lam's family is in LA right now. #cbc

 

[1.21_gigawatts]

Well, this is just horrible.

RIP

 

[Buckeye lady]

Don't know if you saw the info i posted earlier wrt the fellow who claims there are 3 ladders that anyone can use to get to the roof:

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased CA/Canada - Elisa Lam - 21 years old - Los Angeles/Vancouver - 31-Jan-2013


ETA: Sorry, just catching up and see this has already been addressed

The Coroner should be able to tell how long she has been deceased and the cause of death. I wonder if any drugs would still be able to be detected in the system.My deepest condolences to her family. Life sure isn't fair. She was such a beautiful young lady and had her whole life ahead of her. If it was foul play, I sure hope the murderer is caught.

 

[AnonymousD]

In lieu of cctv footage from the roof surely LE is questioning anyone with the perfect view of those water tanks...

From the looks of that picture, it seems there would be multiple people with a good view.

 

[dotr]

Just want to take a moment to wish the Lam family strength at what must surely be the most agonizing time of their lives.
My condolences to the family and friends of this lovely young lady and hope for answers that can help make sense of this tragic event.

 

[JoCoKSEyes]

That elevator video is one of the freakiest things I have ever seen. That is right out of a horror movie.

Has there been any explanation as to why the counter stops and starts several times around the 2:54 mark?

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

Seajay and sillybilly - I noticed this too! But, I figured my eyes were playing tricks on me or it was poor quality video. After reading that the video could have been edited to remove people, it does seem possible that this is the case.

One other thing I noticed with the time counter at the bottom of the screen (other than the stops previously mentioned) is a lapse of time in the counter where it appears the minutes are shown. From what I can make out, to the far right is the millisecond (? is that right?), to the left of that are the seconds, and to the left of that are the minutes. Earlier in the video when I saw a change in the minutes on the counter I then counted the seconds changing and right at 60 seconds the minutes changed (around 2:42/43 in the video). Then I started counting the seconds again and only a few seconds later (around 2:49) the minute changed again, instead of the usual 60 seconds later. So - just before the pauses in time others have mentioned, there also seems to be a lapse in time that has been edited from the video.

Is it strange that the full 4:00 minute video would be released when Elisa is only on the video for less than 3 minutes?

Still way behind... And know poor Elisa has been found deceased... RIP...

but regarding the video... Hope this doesn't bore y'all to tears...

could LE have removed anotherperson from the video...

they may know who it could be... And wants thatperson to come forward...

Maybe they are watching the other person to observe his/her behaviors?

If s/he acts like he is avoiding coming forward... Police may be adding this avoidance to other behaviors for their investigation?

Just some ideas that you all have already hashed out...

P.S. The fact that LE kept that part of the video where the doors open and close repeatedly... (Which reminds me of a Hitchcock type movie... BTW ) then that part of the video must be important for some reason, too!

JMO

 

[Deleted member 96356]

The water was tested and no biohazard was present? With a corpse in it?

So: is there someone here who can explain the process/time for decomposition in water, and what sort of contamination process there would be? Don't know how cold the water is in those tanks, so just a ballpark explanation...

ETA: thanks to anyone who could provide that info

 

[tarabull]

Floor plan for the 11th visible here at 5 secs in:

http://youtu.be/mlnOqmzwZuQ

Can anyone make it clearer and bigger...???...

 

[dotr]

http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Elisa+death+police+determine+foul+play+accident/7992016/story.html

"Elisa Lam's death: LA police try to determine if it was foul play or an accident

The hotel had once been the occasional home to infamous serial killers such as Richard Ramirez, known as the Night Stalker, and Jack Unterweger, who was convicted of murdering nine prostitutes in Europe and the U.S"


Read more: http://www.vancouversun.com/news/LA...r+with+video/7971056/story.html#ixzz2LTO4gMFC

 

[Joe Friday]

One of my biggest questions is if there was normally a ladder on the outside of the tanks. Also if there is a ladder on the inside the tanks which would have made access easy or not. It was reported earlier that these were metal tanks. The manufacture of the tank might of installed or welded rungs on the outside and inside of the tank to be used as a way to enter and exit the tank for maintenance purposes or maybe not. All the pictures I have seen don't suggest that there are permanent ladders installed on the outside of the tanks.

If Elisa did manage to climb up the tank and fell in or climbed in, she might not have been able to get back out if no ladder existed inside of the tank. She no doubt would have drown after losing strength to keep herself a float.

If she was placed inside the tank by someone while she was alive I think bruises and abrasions would be noticed during postmortem examination. Looking at the configuration of the four tanks and the height it would be an incredible feat for someone to carry a body up there and place the body into the tank.


I have examined many photos on the web and cannot determine if the ladder seen leaning against the tank where Elisa was found, was placed there by the firefighters or if this ladder might have been placed there by the maintenance man or been there all along. Without this ladder I don't see an easy way for an individual to climb the tanks, much less for someone to carry a body up to the top of the tank. This is no doubt an aluminum ladder which makes me think that this is NOT the fire departments ladder since aluminum ladders have a higher risk of electrocution. I just can't see the LAFD still using aluminum ladders. If this ladder was already present on top of the building the fire department might of opted to use this ladder since to get their own ladder to the top of the building, the ladder would have likely had to have been carried up the stairs or hoisted it up the outside of the building using a rope, since a ladder of this size I don't think would have fit inside the elevator. I would imagine that this ladder was used by the maintenance man who originally discovered Elisa's body in the tank.

If the only way to get on top of these tanks was by use of this ladder and if the ladder was normally stored inside what looks like a small building on the top of the roof and placed there by the maintenance man when he went to examine the tanks in regarded to the water pressure problem, than someone with good knowledge of the hotel must of placed Elisa in the tank since Elisa couldn't have moved the ladder after being inside the tank. Who would have known were the ladder was and who would have put the ladder back where it belonged?

I have read in the comments left by past guests of the hotel that water pressure was an issue and perhaps this ladder was left standing against the tanks on a regular basis. Regardless I think if that ladder was kept there on a permanent basis is a big clue to this mystery.

JMO

 

[Lindsaym]

Psychotic or no, drugged or no, Elisa was shown on the video trying to go down. Whether or not the roof was accessible by "scary" ladders, I really don't think she suddenly changed her mind and decided to go up.

If I were her family, I would be livid right now at the notion that her death might be ruled misadventure. Everyone who knows her and has spoken of her online paints the picture of a larger-than-life but SOBER personality.

Flip-flops (the footwear she is shown wearing in the elevator) are not great climbing OR swimming footwear.

If you decided to climb, you'd take them off and change shoes, or you'd abandon them by the beginning of the ladder. Maybe they'd fall during your climb (all the way down to the street, or onto a ledge of the building).

However, if someone is carrying you up, the flip-flops are also likely to fall off: and the person carrying you is going to want to cover his tracks and make sure the flip-flops aren't lying around where they fell.

Assuming you got to the top of the roof with your flip-flops intact, you wouldn't jump into the tank IN your flip-flops, would you? No way. Have you ever stepped into a pool while wearing flip-flops? They become serious impediments. If you got to the tank on your own steam, and for some reason wanted to go in (some lunatic idea of making it into your own private pool), you'd kick the flip-flops off, leave them at the side of the tank. Of course, if you got stuck in the tank, the police would find the flip-flops later -- and I assume, since they searched the roof already, they didn't.

Again, though, this is assuming you were alone on the roof -- nobody there to remove the flip-flops as they departed, and left you behind.

In other words, I'm curious: did she have other shoes? And where are the flip-flops we see her wearing in the video?

 

[mollymae]

http://www.gotricounty.com/reuters_images/2013-02-19T232756Z_1_CBRE91I1T6O00_RTROPTP_3_USREPORT-US-USA-MISSINGTOURIST.JPG[/IMG]

Judging by the amount of graffiti visible in this picture (on the tank, box below the tank, inside the door) there's no doubt the roof is accessible by individuals other than the employees of the hotel.

What a comforting thought...anyone can have access to put whatever they please into a hotel's water source *shudder*

 

[Deleted member 96356]

I don't know if I'm allowed to link to stories on Officer.com, but in today's article about this case they mention that residents thought "something was amiss" for days (wrt flooding and water pressure). I thought it was interesting that they mention residents, not guests. So maybe this didn't happen in the hostel portion of the property? Also, days. It's unclear to me whether they mean the water pressure issue was ongoing for days, or they mean days between the flooding and the water pressure problem.

Also, they give Jan 31 as the date for the elevator footage, while CTV puts it at Feb. 1. Given that the date/time stamp on the video is blurred, I wonder where each of these news outlets is coming up with a date.

 

[Eileen730]

That elevator video is one of the freakiest things I have ever seen. That is right out of a horror movie.

Has there been any explanation as to why the counter stops and starts several times around the 2:54 mark?

I have to agree with you right out of a horror movie.
To me it looks like she is talking to someone thats outside the elevator!

 

[sashasnout]

I just watched the elevator video. Believe it or not, I do not find her behavior strange, nor do I think she was on any type of drug.

What I think was happening: (IMO, and I don't even know if this is possible for someone to do with elevators or the video - but this is the thoughts I had when watching it).

My guess is an employee had been befriending her, or joking around with her earlier during her stay at the hotel. I think this employee is messing with her with the elevator.

IF the video in the elevator can be monitored from somewhere else in the building for security purposes, I think this employee sees her enter the elevator and disables the movement of the elevator as a joke (or other scary not-going-there reasons).

She pushes the floor she wants. Her first push seemed pretty deliberate.

It doesn't move.

She waits.

Looks around outside of it. Tries to "catch" whoever is messing with her by bouncing in and out and hiding.

Does some stretches to relieve stress.

Gets back in. Pushes as many different buttons as she can to get it to move.

Still won't move. Walks back out and away.

The employee viewing her enables the elevator to move. Totally to just mess with her head.

My guess is this same employee that "befriended" her also caused the outcome, but in what way I have no idea.

Again, these are my first thoughts on viewing the video, they are only my guesses and opinion, and I have no knowledge whether elevators can be controlled remotely or if the video can be viewed real time in another part of the building.

My thoughts and prayers to Elisa's family, this is a cruel horror no one should have to experience.

ETA: Forgot to mention I think the hand waving had to do with her seeing if the elevator door had an electronic sensor that was maybe causing the doors to not close.

 

[Dushi]

If clothing and flipflops are not in her room, on her body, in the tank or beside the tank... where are they?