CA - Chelsea King (17) Rancho Bernardo (north San Diego County) #2

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1 Rape IDAHO AV Friday 04/03/2009 08:00 AM
2 Rape W GRAND AV Friday 04/17/2009 12:00 PM
3 Rape S CENTRE CITY PY / W FELICITA AV Saturday 04/18/2009 7:00 PM
4 Rape E EL NORTE PY Tuesday 05/05/2009 10:00 PM
5 Rape W GRAND AV Saturday 05/09/2009 10:00 PM
6 Rape W EL NORTE PY Wednesday 05/20/2009 2:00 PM
7 Rape COUNTRY CLUB LN Friday 05/22/2009 12:00 AM
8 Rape TANGLEWOOD LN Wednesday 06/10/2009 11:00 PM
9 Rape W EL NORTE PY Saturday 06/20/2009 1:21 PM
10 Rape W WASHINGTON AV Friday 06/26/2009 01:30 AM

1 Rape HEATHERWOOD CT Sunday 07/19/2009 4:00 PM
2 Rape ROCK SPRINGS RD Tuesday 07/28/2009 9:28 PM

1 Rape W GRAND AV Thursday 10/01/2009 12:00 PM
2 Rape TAFT ST Sunday 10/04/2009 10:00 PM
3 Rape N BROADWAY Friday 10/09/2009 06:10 AM
4 Rape W VALLEY PY Sunday 10/25/2009 7:30 PM
5 Rape W GRAND AV Monday 11/23/2009 8:00 PM
6 Rape W GRAND AV Sunday 11/29/2009 4:00 PM

1 Rape W GRAND AV Monday 11/23/2009 8:00 PM
2 Rape W GRAND AV Sunday 11/29/2009 4:00 PM
3 Rape W EL NORTE PY Monday 01/18/2010 01:30 AM
4 Rape W WASHINGTON AV Monday 01/25/2010 10:30 AM

Website is ARJIS (Automatic Regoinal Justice Information Systems
Alot of different locations in the County. I just use her town. Did not put addresses here. To many sex crimes to enter.

http://mapping.arjis.org/address. I did not enter homicides either.
Bold by me. Weird, much? And while I'm at it, W and E El Norte Py is just up the road and not far from where Amber disappeared. That's four more really close to JAGs old address.

Just checked, W Washington is really close, too. 2 more.

Picture of area attached.
 

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Looking back at the situation now...I can honestly say I was in no mental condition myself at that time to make an educated decision in the matter. When someone threatens to hurt your child, you go into protective mode in ways I'd never experienced before. Now I also wonder what kind of message that plea deal gave my daughter? I will have to talk to her about it tomorrow.

I hope you didn't think I was judging you on your decision. It had to be extremely difficult. It's unfortunate it has to be one way or the other, protect the child and let the predator go free much earlier, testify and maybe damage the child but protect other kids?? It shouldn't be that way.
 
His probation was up in 2008 so he was no longer being monitored. This means he had every right to be as close as he wants to a school.

So my whole self righteous diatribe about his mom knowing he wasn't supposed to be that close to a school goes right out the window. :angel:

Me too -- I thought he was still on probation, but that ended in 2008. Making it easy for him to start hunting again. Do we know what month in 2008? We know Amber went missing a year ago (quite convenient, since he was no longer being watched). Can you imagine what other damage this has done since his probation ended? I dare to think....

Mel
 
it's true you can't feel safe anyplace when alone...i am alone at night as my husband works overnight and i harldy ever sleep until he is home (am disabled so not working). we have had a run of the ever-increasing home invasions here in city where i live, in all neighborhoods and the htought terrifies me (and keeps me on the boards here so late into the night...)we keep a car in the driveway all the time but anyone watching a day or more would know the drill.
when i can get out i tend to take walks around the neighborhood during the day (when my legs are working :) but now i wonder if even that is a good idea, since i sure can't get out of my own way. but i see teens walking around with headphones on all the time as we are near a high school...and they are often alone.
i think for younger people (i am in late 40's) that unless they know someone who has been a victim, they don't think much about danger...while us older folks always have it in the back of our minds as we are more likely to know a crime victim, or have been one...
just rambling tonight as today was so upsetting and as usual, i am alone!

Awwww, keep typing, C. You're not alone on here.

If it makes you feel better we sleep in shifts at my house. My mom learned long ago how to juggle being married to a police officer on shift work. She used to get her bath, do her hair and make-up at 3:00AM. Poof she'd be ready to take us to school when my dad was on 12-8.

Just trying to keep ya feeling safe, C. You are so right about the young people. Even when they know a victim of a crime often they still feel invincible. Just experienced it again with my DD. Young adult. Just walking about not paying attention at 11:00PM at night in these parts. I'm thinking "Who raised this kid?"
 
Longtime lurker yet posting newbie. I've lurked here since the Danielle van Dam case so I know how smart you Websleuthers are.

So I want to throw out my theory and see what you think. With apologies in advance for going a bit off topic, at least at first.

What do the above three mentioned by SWAG have in common?

They are all named for females, and yes, nothing has really changed.

My theory is that these types of crimes, and the handling/punishment of the perpetrators, are not taken seriously enough because by and large the victims are female. If the epidemic were hitting young boys as frequently, our (mostly male) politicians might be goaded a little more into action.

IzzyBlanche, I disagree. In the early 1990's, a big name feminist claimed that if there was a sex-specific disease that killed as many men as breast cancer killed women, it would be declared a national crisis. It turned out that postrate cancer kills more yet got only a fraction of the research funding as brest cancer. Nobody knew but the assumption was that since most of those "in power" were men, they would somehow "look out" for each other. It doesn't really work that way.

I do not dispute that more women/girls suffer sexual violence at the hands of men but men/boys are far more likely to suffer or die at the hands of other men/boys. The problem is that some men, not that many, are violent predators and other men are just as concerned (and just as afraid)as women.

I think you will agree that when a woman/girl goes missing, there is far more "interest" than when a man/boy goes missing. They call this the "missing White Girl Syndrome". Just compare the length of threads on this board. When high profile serial killers are arrested, the ones who targeted women (Bundy, the Green River killer etc) were generally subject of major manhunts but when those who target men/boys (Gacey, Randy Kraft etc) are arrested, nobody even knew a serial killer was operating. Their victims were thought to be runaways or just victims of random violence. I believe that if it had been a 17 year old boy missing in RB Park, this discussion would not be occuring.

The real mystery in this case was "why was Amber Dubois not given the attention of the Escondido PD that Chelsea got from San Diego PD?" I'm wondering if it had something to do with social class. Chelsea drove a BMW and lived in a very nice neighborhood while Amber came from far more modest circustances.

I lived in Poway for 10 years and I thought North County was about as "safe" an area as you are going to find (and a very nice place to live). I am sorry to see something like this happen there but all it really means is that it is just like everywhere else
.

It's true, everywhere else is like everywhere else. Evil roams the land looking for an opportunity. JAG reminds me of a hunter when he decided it was time to feed on his prey. You can't stop or change something like that. He's suppose to be a Human Being, but really it is pure evil to not feel or care about anybody else.

Yes, I did wonder why one case got much more attention. Not to mention we still have A FAMILY OF FOUR MISSING FROM FALLBROOK.

THE MC STAY FAMILY....REMEMBER THEM....WE FORGOT TO KEEP LOOKING FOR THEM LATELY. HOPE THOSE TWO LITTLE BOYS ARE ALRIGHT.
 
I hope you didn't think I was judging you on your decision. It had to be extremely difficult. It's unfortunate it has to be one way or the other, protect the child and let the predator go free much earlier, testify and maybe damage the child but protect other kids?? It shouldn't be that way.

I didn't think you were judging. You are right, there has to be a better way. In the situation, I felt like I had to choose between two bad choices. I can understand why so many agree to a plea.
 
If I was helpful, glad to be. What I 'saw' was farther back from the water, my view in the flash of vision I got was farther back from the shore, higher up on a hill. Higher above the water. I sensed dryness. What I 'saw' looked a lot like this picture that was posted up thread:

122510


Well, the image embedding doesn't seem to be working, but it's the photo here:

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2010/mar/02/suspect-is-linked-to-assault-at-park/?imw=Y

However there were no branches or debris between my perspective and what I 'saw' in this visionary flash.

There were more leaves on the ground, and whoever was doing the burying was on his knees pulling leaves over a grave. In other flashes of this scene, branch debris was placed over the leaves at the end of this burying. I sense dismemberment or heavy knifing violence at the very least.

Looking at the above picture, as if it WAS the scene of this burying, to the left one could look through trees and see the lake below. perhaps 100 - 200 feet down.

I may have gotten a composite of events in that area, so there may be someone else. Perhaps 'Amber'. I do not know the details about her, but it seems some on this thread are saying she disappeared near Lake Hodges too?

As I 'look' at this now. It appears to be very much natural, and I believe a person could look at it and not notice anything amiss. Perhaps a dog would know there's something buried. I'm not sure what they can detect, or what they have resources and the desire to try to find.

Needless to say, this creates an emotional response in me as well. My heart goes out to King family. If only we could do a 'system restore' and back time up to before this happened.
 
They discussed this on JVM today. The Judge Marilyn Milan said maybe it is time for witnesses to be required to testify, since far too often the result of a plea bargain is a JAG being released back into society.

While I agree, I think the testimony of a child or teen should be done via video. While many say the accused is allowed to face their accuser - in these cases, that should be waived. The ACLU would have a field day, but why would anyone want to damage the victims further?

I'm against plea bargains, and I'm certainly against releasing SO early (for good behaviour or tax cuts). How many more children have to die before we lock these perps up and throw away the key.

We're moving on Thursday to an area that has 1 registered sex offender. Yes, 1. I already know what he looks like, and have his address. Thankfully, we're moving to a town with a population of less than 5,000 (and where everyone knows your business - I love that). While I love San Diego, it's time to move out and get to a town where everyone keeps on eye on one another (here I don't even know my neighbor). The crime rate is also next to nil.

Somtimes, we gotta do what we gotta do. I know we could get hit by a mac truck, but I need to pray and keep an eye out for my child.

Mel
 
it's true you can't feel safe anyplace when alone...i am alone at night as my husband works overnight and i harldy ever sleep until he is home (am disabled so not working). we have had a run of the ever-increasing home invasions here in city where i live, in all neighborhoods and the htought terrifies me (and keeps me on the boards here so late into the night...)we keep a car in the driveway all the time but anyone watching a day or more would know the drill.
when i can get out i tend to take walks around the neighborhood during the day (when my legs are working :) but now i wonder if even that is a good idea, since i sure can't get out of my own way. but i see teens walking around with headphones on all the time as we are near a high school...and they are often alone.
i think for younger people (i am in late 40's) that unless they know someone who has been a victim, they don't think much about danger...while us older folks always have it in the back of our minds as we are more likely to know a crime victim, or have been one...
just rambling tonight as today was so upsetting and as usual, i am alone!

I know how you feel, thats why we got a dog.My daughter works nights, so Im here with my grandson. I have beware of dog signs posted out front even though hes the sweetest thing. But he is a good watch dog thank god. I live across the street from a high school and think of Amber just walking to school, so many people around, just always watch the kids walk by sitting outside when its nice. My girlfriend told me that her mom was walking to her friends house when she got mugged and stole her purse. This creep broke her arms because she fell backwards when he pushed her. OMG my dog is barking, I hate this..BRB
 
If I was helpful, glad to be. What I 'saw' was farther back from the water, my view in the flash of vision I got was farther back from the shore, higher up on a hill. Higher above the water. I sensed dryness. What I 'saw' looked a lot like this picture that was posted up thread:

122510


Well, the image embedding doesn't seem to be working, but it's the photo here:

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2010/mar/02/suspect-is-linked-to-assault-at-park/?imw=Y

However there were no branches or debris between my perspective and what I 'saw' in this visionary flash.

There were more leaves on the ground, and whoever was doing the burying was on his knees pulling leaves over a grave. In other flashes of this scene, branch debris was placed over the leaves at the end of this burying. I sense dismemberment or heavy knifing violence at the very least.

Looking at the above picture, as if it WAS the scene of this burying, to the left one could look through trees and see the lake below. perhaps 100 - 200 feet down.

I may have gotten a composite of events in that area, so there may be someone else. Perhaps 'Amber'. I do not know the details about her, but it seems some on this thread are saying she disappeared near Lake Hodges too?

As I 'look' at this now. It appears to be very much natural, and I believe a person could look at it and not notice anything amiss. Perhaps a dog would know there's something buried. I'm not sure what they can detect, or what they have resources and the desire to try to find.

Needless to say, this creates and emotional response in me as well. My heart goes out to King family. If only we could do a 'system restore' and back time up to before this happened.

The caption for this picture is incorrect. This is Highland Valley road, on the opposite side of the freeway from where she was found. If I were LE, I'd be checking closer over there, just in case another body is around.

How far away do you live?
 
The Mom was on her 3rd (if I recall correctly from the scanner chatter) police station trying to get someone to file the report. She had been trying since 2/25 when they had a fight and the girl left home.

Please forgive my ignorance in this matter.

Why would this woman have to go to three police stations to file a missing person report? Does the law differ from State to State?

Fight or not between the mother and teen shouldn't have a da*n thing to do with filing a report. People aren't aware that you don't have to wait the 48 hours we usually hear about to report a person missing. At least not in the State I live in.

Just throwing the question out there. Sorry. I feel for this poor lady. Lord let this child be safe wherever she is.
 
Parents - TEACH your children how to fight - AND FIGHT DIRTY - scratching and poking eyes, kicking in the groin and when they bend over a HUGE JUMPING elbow to the back. I taught mine very early on. How to put your keys between your fingers when you're walking so if you have to punch the key points are sticking out.

We have to fight back - our children have to fight back.

You're so right, SWAG1959.

The sad thing is I believe Chelsea would've put up a good fight, but JAG probably didn't give her a chance. I keep picturing being tackled by this big guy charging fast and hard. Maybe it was a blessing if Chelsea lost consciousness right away. He's an animal. Can we do all those things you mentioned above? We'll each get a turn at him.
 
Over 5,000 people showed up for her vigil tonight. My mom said it was the most moving thing she has ever experienced. Chelsea's dad was there long enough to ask everyone to keep her spirit alive.

I can't imagine what they are going through. She brought this community together in a manner of days, imagine what a force she had been in her family's life.

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2010/mar/02/reports-body-found-lake-hodges/?imw=Y


EDIT: My mom can't count. The news just said 2,000. When I told her, she got snippy and said, "It was A LOT of people."
 
Bold by me. Weird, much? And while I'm at it, W and E El Norte Py is just up the road and not far from where Amber disappeared. That's four more really close to JAGs old address.

Just checked, W Washington is really close, too. 2 more.

Picture of area attached.

Wow I wish I knew what I was looking at, dont know the area at all. Thanx for your input.
 
it's true you can't feel safe anyplace when alone...i am alone at night as my husband works overnight and i harldy ever sleep until he is home (am disabled so not working). we have had a run of the ever-increasing home invasions here in city where i live, in all neighborhoods and the htought terrifies me (and keeps me on the boards here so late into the night...)we keep a car in the driveway all the time but anyone watching a day or more would know the drill.
when i can get out i tend to take walks around the neighborhood during the day (when my legs are working :) but now i wonder if even that is a good idea, since i sure can't get out of my own way. but i see teens walking around with headphones on all the time as we are near a high school...and they are often alone.
i think for younger people (i am in late 40's) that unless they know someone who has been a victim, they don't think much about danger...while us older folks always have it in the back of our minds as we are more likely to know a crime victim, or have been one...
just rambling tonight as today was so upsetting and as usual, i am alone!

I know what you mean. Hubby will start travelling 3 days a week, and I'm freaking out. Do you put bells on the door, deadbolt your bedroom? I will have curtains up everywhere and they will be closed, but I worry about getting into a routine. I don't want that. Even though I'll be in a safe area, are we ever really safe?

I also see kids - pre-school age walking ALONE to the bus stop or to school. I just want to pull over and say "where's your momma"? I still drive my son to and from school. I'm sorry to say I'm an absolutely protective, paranoid, over the top mother. He's not always happy about it, but has said he appreciates it (sometimes)!

Sorry to get OT, becaus this IS all about Chelsea. But if there's a lesson to be learned for our children, that could be a blessing for all of us.

Luv n' hugs,

Mel
 
Please forgive my ignorance in this matter.

Why would this woman have to go to three police stations to file a missing person report? Does the law differ from State to State?

No, but if she disappeared in Escondido, they won't take a report for days. They prefer to label the girls "runaways" like they did Amber. They're not known for being on top of things like the neighboring police department. And they're going to take a lot of heat for not organizing the same size search for Amber. Her parents had to organize their own searches because Escondido maintained she was a runaway despite all the evidence to the contrary. :banghead: I'm sure they dismissed this mother the same way. Oh, you had a fight? She ran away. She'll be back in a few days... :furious:
 
Please forgive my ignorance in this matter.

Why would this woman have to go to three police stations to file a missing person report? Does the law differ from State to State?

Fight or not between the mother and teen shouldn't have a da*n thing to do with filing a report. People aren't aware that you don't have to wait the 48 hours we usually hear about to report a person missing. At least not in the State I live in.

Just throwing the question out there. Sorry. I feel for this poor lady. Lord let this child be safe wherever she is.

I couldn't believe it when I heard it over the scanner..WTH. I feel for her to. I don;t get it...
 
I couldn't believe it when I heard it over the scanner..WTH. I feel for her to. I don;t get it...

Do we have a name? Maybe we can start a new thread to focus on the missing girl. She deserves no less than the response rec'd by Chelsea. My heart goes out to the mother.

Best,

Mel
 
Wow I wish I knew what I was looking at, dont know the area at all. Thanx for your input.
Rock Springs is the last address for JAG. The bolded rape is on Rock Springs (A on the map). B on the map is near where Amber disappeared, C is her address. I circled the other streets listed on the rape report for Escondido from April of last year to January of this year. This north east of where Chelsea disappeared.

Just if you wanted to know. :crazy:
 
I have always been a lurker over here for countless missing person cases. I've been following missing person cases for many years. I hate to admit this on a public outlet like this, but I went to high school with John Gardner. When this story first broke, I thought to myself, I recognize him. But then I brushed it off until I heard from a friend that we went to school with him. Then I racked my brain about him and all of a sudden it came to me tonight. I was an assistant in his class. He was in special ed. Wow....to think back, I had interactions with him all the time not realizing that one day he would wreck havoc on many lives. I am deeply saddened that now our lovely HS will be associated with him.

I really hope we are able to get real honest answers about Amber. Everyone deserves this. God bless Amber's family for assisting Chelsea's family. And everyone really needs to kiss their kiddos extra hard tonight!

:Welcome-12-june:


Welcome adpilove! This is a plea to you to please tell more about JAG as far as your impressions of him as a person. :popcorn:

Pretty Please, Pretty, Pretty Please? :bateyes:
 
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