GUILTY CA - Erin Corwin, 19, pregnant, Twentynine Palms, 28 June 2014 - #11

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RSC said:
Imo, they can't just ignore witness testimony because they "know" who the killer is.

It's still possible a red car was involved, and perhaps could indicat another party was also involved...
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I mean they know who the red car belongs to and why it was there. Not that they know who the killer is and are ignoring this important detail. Sorry, I could have wrote that better : )
 
maskedwoman said:
The other thread closed up on me, so I couldn't quote, but I'm not convinced NL would know who Scott Peterson is. He was convicted 10 years ago and she's what 24? So, she would have been 14 when he was convicted, and living in Alaska. My daughter is very close to that age and had no idea who he was when I asked her. IM would know, certainly. But NL, not so much I think.
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Well, it is still a well-known case, whether or not NL or people in their 20s are aware of it or not, it's still a possible topic of conversation here (people I know in their 20s have heard about it)

"Disappearance of Laci Peterson[edit]
Main article: Murder of Laci Peterson
On December 24, 2002, Laci Peterson was reported missing from the Modesto, California home she shared with Scott. She was eight months pregnant[2] with a due date of February 10, 2003, and the couple had planned to name the baby boy Conner. The exact date and cause of Laci's death were never determined. Peterson initially reported his wife missing on Christmas Eve, and the story quickly attracted nationwide media interest.[3][4]

Modesto police did not immediately identify Peterson as a suspect, largely because Laci's family and friends maintained their faith in his innocence during the month following Laci's disappearance.[5] Eventually, police grew more suspicious due to inconsistencies in his story."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scott_Peterson

And here is the link to the article about IM supposedly saying she and NL were just talking about instances like the Peterson case when IM said LE had 'twisted her words':

http://www.examiner.com/article/tragic-ending-for-missing-horse-whisperer-erin-corwin-christopher-lee-arrested

An excerpt relevant to this discussion is pasted below:

Jennifer Castro, a spokesperson for the Anchorage Police Department has stated that an extradition warrant has been put out for Christopher Lee to return him to San Bernardino County.

Whether or not Isabel Megli owner of the White Rock Horse Rescue Ranch in the Yucca Valley has been implicated in this case remains to be seen. When the case first broke, she appeared to be as helpful as possible, and was even the one that told police the damaging statements by Nicole about "never finding the body", among many others.

Since then, Isabel has changed her tune, suggesting she may have been trying to cover something up. She stated the statements she made in those regards were innocuous and benign, and that she was simply discussing cases with Nicole that were compared to Scott Peterson and his missing wife, as well as generic comparisons to crime shows on TV. She even claimed that her words were "twisted" by police.

"I can see how they could pick pieces of what I said, but I'm totally amazed at how they twisted it. Unfortunately, they twisted it a little much. When you find out people are missing, it brings up conversation and it was just conversation about no body, no case. Nicole did not refer to her husband or to this case. It was a generalization of a conversation of CSI, or Law and Order, and (Scott) Peterson."
 
I also imagine that there were footprints leading up to the mine that tell a story. For example, one set means he carried her. Two sets with out a struggle pattern mean he led her there, no scuffle marks means he pushed her down...etc...
 
tvscum said:
WOW, what happened to the guy to actually spoke to MB? You honestly think this guy doesn't know the difference between an Accent and a Cherokee.

This is CL's Jeep. It's really dark Maroon, not red.
http://kfmb.images.worldnow.com/images/4254827_G.jpg
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And a "new car," small passenger car, possibly a rental (typically 1-2 years old) vs. an older model Jeep... I'm so confused by the whole "red car" thing. This is purely selfish because realistically it may not matter in terms of what happened to Erin, but boy do I hope they release more details about this car sighting eventually. They don't owe us anything, I know that, but it's driving me nuts.
 
Many pages ago, someone quoted Occam's Razor. I had never heard of it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_razor

"It states that among competing hypotheses, the one with the fewest assumptions should be selected. Other, more complicated solutions may ultimately prove correct, but—in the absence of certainty—the fewer assumptions that are made, the better."

Regarding the red car witness account. How many assumptions do you have to make to believe the red car was involved in the rendezvous and murder? The multiple theories include: renting a red car, swapping vehicles in the desert, CL and NL returning to the rendezvous point and moving the vehicle, NL and JC colluding to move the blue Corolla, NL's Jeep having the same tires as CL, or maybe even MB is colorblind, and on and on and on.

Or you can make just one assumption. MB saw two cars, one blue and one red, and the people he saw were a different couple unrelated to the case. Isn't that the most simple explanation?

I do believe MB saw vehicles. I also take him at his word when he says he can't positively identify the male or the female or the vehicles he saw.
 
stayhomemommy said:
BBM: I really wish he would cop a plea bargain! I wonder, though, what his attorney is telling him? Maybe they have seen the evidence and think it's not so strong? Perhaps the attorney thinks he can pull a Jose Baez. Perhaps he's even advising CL not to accept any plea bargains? MOO.
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(sorry for all my rapid back to back posts.. catching up)

I agree with you here. Realistically the odds of him actually getting the DP and having it carried out in California are so slim, I'd almost rather see him plead out as long as "LWOP" MEANS "LIFE without parole " and not some creative variation if he's a "good boy" in prison. He might get sentenced to the DP but odds are he'd die in prison before it'd ever be carried out. If it's cheaper to just let him sit and rot in jail I'm fine with that, as long as he stays there. All IMO.
 
heartgoesout said:
I mean they know who the red car belongs to and why it was there. Not that they know who the killer is and are ignoring this important detail. Sorry, I could have wrote that better : )
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Ah! Yes, I agree with that!
 
Imo, MB was pretty clear that it was EC's car. Assuming there were not two blue cars in the same place, I think occam's razor would mean NOT discounting witness testimony.

tvscum said:
Many pages ago, someone quoted Occam's Razor. I had never heard of it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_razor

"It states that among competing hypotheses, the one with the fewest assumptions should be selected. Other, more complicated solutions may ultimately prove correct, but—in the absence of certainty—the fewer assumptions that are made, the better."

Regarding the red car witness account. How many assumptions do you have to make to believe the red car was involved in the rendezvous and murder? The multiple theories include: renting a red car, swapping vehicles in the desert, CL and NL returning to the rendezvous point and moving the vehicle, NL and JC colluding to move the blue Corolla, NL's Jeep having the same tires as CL, or maybe even MB is colorblind, and on and on and on.

Or you can make just one assumption. MB saw two cars, one blue and one red, and the people he saw were a different couple unrelated to the case. Isn't that the most simple explanation?

I do believe MB saw vehicles. I also take him at his word when he says he can't positively identify the male or the female or the vehicles he saw.
Click to expand...
 
nikb said:
To me this just makes the whole thing more... ironic, I suppose... if the reports about NL saying "no body no case" were true. Guess what? "No body/no case" isn't even true anyway, but in BOTH cases (Lacey's and Erin's) the body was found!
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Exactly, it is horribly ironic... Just because someone is aware of the premise that others (in the MS media, e.g. , Scott Peterson) have committed a similar crime, and that premise was somehow enough to get all the way to trial, it doesn't necessarily mean they were 'golden' and got away with it, but that end result (for Scott, on Death Row at San Quentin) may have escaped them, because the idea (of offing a pregnant woman who was in the way) was what mattered. JMO
 
tvscum said:
From the arrest warrant:
http://www.sbcountyda.org/Portals/8/PressReleases/2014/FMB1400414 Lee warrant and declaration.pdf



Continuing from the last thread:

To me, this statement in the arrest warrant is unequivocal. It doesn't say he picked her from a location closer to the road and then moved the vehicle and then a different woman walked from the Corolla to the Jeep. It says nothing about a red car, moving a car, etc.

Hey judge, we found Lee's tire tracks, he picked her up from the LOCATION WHERE HER VEHICLE WAS FOUND, and he was the last person to see her alive.

LE does not believe a red car fits into their case. I'm not saying MB did not see a red car at some point. I'm just saying, LE is disregarding it as part of their case against CL. If MB gets called to the witness stand during a trial, it will be by the defense.

That is, if there is a trial. Pleading guilty would allow CL to avoid the death penalty and also let NL off the hook to take care of their daughter. IMO, CL has two huge incentives to cop a plea bargain.
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Re "pleading guilty" that "would allow CL to avoid the death penalty", please see earlier posts (a few pages back) regarding the DA on this case adding the "lying in wait" charge along with the murder charge that is a "special circumstance" under which the DEATH PENALTY applies,
 
tvscum said:
Many pages ago, someone quoted Occam's Razor. I had never heard of it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_razor

"It states that among competing hypotheses, the one with the fewest assumptions should be selected. Other, more complicated solutions may ultimately prove correct, but—in the absence of certainty—the fewer assumptions that are made, the better."

Regarding the red car witness account. How many assumptions do you have to make to believe the red car was involved in the rendezvous and murder? The multiple theories include: renting a red car, swapping vehicles in the desert, CL and NL returning to the rendezvous point and moving the vehicle, NL and JC colluding to move the blue Corolla, NL's Jeep having the same tires as CL, or maybe even MB is colorblind, and on and on and on.

Or you can make just one assumption. MB saw two cars, one blue and one red, and the people he saw were a different couple unrelated to the case. Isn't that the most simple explanation?

I do believe MB saw vehicles. I also take him at his word when he says he can't positively identify the male or the female or the vehicles he saw.
Click to expand...

MB may have seen people unrelated to Erin's disappearance/murder on the side of the road near his home on the day after she went missing (was now found to be murdered) that he reported to LE, but I still find it a little hard to swallow that he saw them in the same remote location, approaching/near by the blue car that later was determined to be Erin's abandoned blue car, and it had nothing to do with her disappearance/murder. JMO
 
Regarding the information published in this MSM article, it speaks to what LE found with Erin's remains in the mine shaft (that I wasn't aware of before):

"After Erin's car was found outside the Twentynine Palms base, detectives found nearby tire tracks that matched the tires on Lee's jeep. Authorities also found ammunition in Lee's Jeep, then matched that ammo to spent bullets found at the bottom of the mine, with Erin's remains."

http://www.desertsun.com/story/news/2014/08/26/jonathan-corwin-closure-now-erin-corwin-vigil/14606557/
 
Twistinginthewind said:
Re "pleading guilty" that "would allow CL to avoid the death penalty", please see earlier posts (a few pages back) regarding the DA on this case adding the "lying in wait" charge along with the murder charge that is a "special circumstance" under which the DEATH PENALTY applies,
Click to expand...

I wonder how much difference the death penalty makes in California? It's just me wondering, because I live here and I tend to think of it as practically a joke. If LWOP means LWOP then to me that's more serious. This is just some kind of generic info but here's some: http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/state_by_state

Number of executions since 1976: 13
1st execution after re-enactment (on 1/1/1974): 1992 [Yes, nearly 20 years later]

Per this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment_in_California As of last year there were 741 offenders on death row. So let's say they happen to start executing 1 per month, we're still talking what 60+ years to get to all of the ones already sentenced to the DP?

I'll be the first to admit that IMO the DP in California is ridiculous and almost pointless, but if they can come up with a LWOP that sticks, I'm all for it. I'm also maybe thinking the DP threat makes some guilty parties to come up with a plea deal so they can get LWOP.

I don't much care what happens to CL at this point as long as he can't hurt anyone else and Erin's family gets justice, but I so hope Erin didn't suffer.
 
tvscum said:
Many pages ago, someone quoted Occam's Razor. I had never heard of it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_razor

"It states that among competing hypotheses, the one with the fewest assumptions should be selected. Other, more complicated solutions may ultimately prove correct, but—in the absence of certainty—the fewer assumptions that are made, the better."

Regarding the red car witness account. How many assumptions do you have to make to believe the red car was involved in the rendezvous and murder? The multiple theories include: renting a red car, swapping vehicles in the desert, CL and NL returning to the rendezvous point and moving the vehicle, NL and JC colluding to move the blue Corolla, NL's Jeep having the same tires as CL, or maybe even MB is colorblind, and on and on and on.

Or you can make just one assumption. MB saw two cars, one blue and one red, and the people he saw were a different couple unrelated to the case. Isn't that the most simple explanation?

I do believe MB saw vehicles. I also take him at his word when he says he can't positively identify the male or the female or the vehicles he saw.
Click to expand...


I agree with the Occam's Razor theory. However, the simplest explanation, making only simple assumptions, is that the red car that was spotted in a remote area of the dessert, next to a murder victims car, by a seemingly reliable witness will turn out to be an oh wow moment.
 
Twistinginthewind said:
Regarding the information published in this MSM article, it speaks to what LE found with Erin's remains in the mine shaft (that I wasn't aware of before):

"After Erin's car was found outside the Twentynine Palms base, detectives found nearby tire tracks that matched the tires on Lee's jeep. Authorities also found ammunition in Lee's Jeep, then matched that ammo to spent bullets found at the bottom of the mine, with Erin's remains."

http://www.desertsun.com/story/news...orwin-closure-now-erin-corwin-vigil/14606557/
Click to expand...

It may just be sloppy reporting. But you are correct, there is nothing in the arrest warrant that says LE found spent bullet casings at the bottom of the mine, with Erin's remains. The arrest warrant says the casing were found "at the scene."
http://www.sbcountyda.org/Portals/8/PressReleases/2014/FMB1400414 Lee warrant and declaration.pdf

DA Ramos said nothing of casings at the bottom of the mine either in his LA radio interview:
http://www.kfiam640.com/media/podca...nandKen/military-wife-arrest-4pm819-25185300/

Ramos mentions burning tires in this interview, but again no mention of casings at the bottom of the mine.
http://www.ktuu.com/news/news/prosecutor-former-marine-murdered-comrades-wife/27620982
 
On Monday, Jonathan said he had once called Lee a friend.
The Lees had been neighbors of the Corwins since last fall, when Jonathan and Erin moved into an apartment building on the Twentynine Palms base. Jonathan and Lee shared a passion for off-roading and recreational shooting, and their wives both volunteered at the same horse ranch, so the neighbors became fast friends. They hung out "almost every day," Jonathan said.
In March, Jonathan discovered Chris and Erin had a brief affair. However, Jonathan believed the fling was over, and so he had made amends with his wife and tried to forgive his neighbor. Jonathan didn't discover the affair had continued until after Erin had disappeared.

http://www.desertsun.com/story/news...orwin-closure-now-erin-corwin-vigil/14606557/

Man that's got to hurt even more. Your friend has an affair with your wife, then murders her. Total betrayal of the highest. My prayers are with him.
 
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