CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #18

[Karinna]

This is why Chase arguing that Joey gave him permission to write out cheques is a complete and utter lie.


Nobody would give somebody that kind of leverage when they owe them so much money and that’s before we even get to the fact Chase had been in jail for theft.

Agree. And the fact that Merritt owed Joey so much knowing that he couldn't really ask JM for more until he at least attempted to pay JM back some of what he owed. And Merritt needed money ASAP, and could not wait because he had a gambling addiction to feed and bills to pay, like a drug addict needing an instant fix.
The only way he could see to do that IMO was to murder JM and his family to gain access to the money. He knew if Joey or Summer were still alive he would go back to prison once his fraud was discovered, as i think Joey did discover that just before the murders, per MM's testimony. And i don't even want to think of why he murdered two beautiful innocent little boys, only an enraged & demented killer would know the answer to that.
All IMO.

 

[missy1974]

Could someone give me some Clif Notes on what bas been testified to about DK's alibi and proof he was in Hawaii? Do we know where he is currently? I assume he didn't testify?

The cliff notes...

We have heard from investigators that his alibi was verified, I believe Dugal and Smith said this. He don't really know what they did to verify it as most questions are objected to.

During testimony last week. They showed IP addresses captured by PayPal. First, they showed that the IP's matched in Joey's account activity and Dan's account activity at least on the 10th of February (unclear if more matched). On direct, they did show that there were debit card transactions that are in Hawaii as well, as a way to explain this from the defense, the question was posed "Could Dan have given his card to someone else?"

Then during the computer guys testimony, they showed how the computer guy looked up those IP's on 3 different sites and where they were. (see attached Dans IP JanFeb). On cross, he was shown some other documents, one being a phone bill, one being a call log from CAD (used by LE) where he said he was in Hawaii. (phone bill is attached), sorry, didn't take a snip of the CAD where it showed Location: Hawaii (but this would have been info given by Dan himself) On cross, the questions were posed about whether or not Dan could have been using a VPN or remote/network accessed as way to explain the IP's, and that looking up the IP's is not always reliable.

That's all I can think of at the moment lol Hope that helps

 

[mrjitty]

The testimony is a bit of a slog

It gets to a very weird place where the Forensic Accountant is discussing the forged backdated cheques as "appearing in the EIP accounts" (well of course they have to because they were created and cashed)

So the argument is Chase was allowed to create these cheques instead of Joey creating them himself.

IMO this rather implicates the accused.

He chose the correct names for the jobs, and specific amounts and backdated - so that the cheques could fly.

But it is the backdating specifically which gives him away.

 

[mrjitty]

@Tortoise

This really is a massive exercise in deflection

We all know Joey & Chase had a long course of dealing in which Joey controlled all the money and maintained a ledger in terms of how much money Chase was owed at any point in time taking into account receivables from customers, payments on Chase's behalf to 3rd parties, and payments to chase himself

What isn't explained and is cast into even great doubt is why Chase suddenly took it upon himself to create delete and backdate cheques

Because that wasn't the course of dealing before 1 Feb 2010

In many respects this deep dive into the finances suggests that the spigot was cut off. The only way he was getting his Saudi/PM money was by writing the cheques to himself - which is why suddenly he was flush with cash.

 

[mrjitty]

tldr

Having murdered Joey, he needed to then go create himself the cheques on the PM and Saudi jobs etc to get the money

This testimony makes it clear how the finances work - but provides no explanation why Chase took it upon himself to create the cheques, delete them and backdate them

 

[mrjitty]

Interesting also - just like DK, Chase started receiving $$ direct from clients including Saudi and PM

So I guess he was also diverting Joeys cash to his own pockets

 

[mrjitty]

Maline tried to slip in

1. Joey gave chqs to CM - "typical of construction companies" - objection sustained
2. Joey allowed CM to write chqs - - objection sustained


This is the trouble - this witness is one of the better defence witnesses - but Maline wants him to testify on behalf of Chase as regards facts only within Chase's knowledge

I have no idea why the Judge is allowing this

 

[mrjitty]

If you want some trial comedy gold, go to 41.40 of Part 4 where the forensic accountant claims DK hacked Joey's Paypal

LOL

(we know it wasn't hacked - DK just reset the pass - someone had access to Joey's email)

ETA - the whole sequence from then on is Maline trying to get the witness to to testify that Dan hacked in and stole Joey's cash

 

[InspectorGadget]

If you want some trial comedy gold, go to 41.40 of Part 4 where the forensic accountant claims DK hacked Joey's Paypal

LOL

(we know it wasn't hacked - DK just reset the pass - someone had access to Joey's email)

ETA - the whole sequence from then on is Maline trying to get the witness to to testify that Dan hacked in and stole Joey's cash

Who was that?

 

[mrjitty]

Damn DA Melissa Rodriguez is a bad arse

Again it looks like the defence prepared all this at the last minute - implication Chase tailoring his version at the last minute

All of this must have been known to the defence back in 2016

 

[LadyL]

It's quite obvious DK was rifling funds from EIP, ruining the reputation JM had worked so hard to build. Once DK ruins the reputation he then illegally sells the business to an unsuspecting buyer. DK is a snake and IMO capable of any and all misdeeds including murder. Yet it's CM being charged and railroaded, the jury will see through this scheme, it's too transparent not to. I really can't see why there are so many on this thread supporting a ******* like DK.

some of us (me ) know DK's a snake but also think that Chase Merritt did the ultimate misdeed

 

[mrjitty]

So by far the most informative witness - i have no real idea why the defence did not focus on this kind of stuff in the first place.

In her initial X DA Rodriguez landed some very heavy blows.

Incidentally this is a good tip for expert witnesses who want to resonate with Court

Maintain your integrity 100% because the moment you get shown up as a cheerleader, your credibility is blown

Its clear Chase got out hustled by DK as well.

As I've noted several times, all the value in Joey's business was in the sales pipe which was all SEO

DK controlled the shopping cart, and thus controlled the revenue.

 

[Karinna]

So by far the most informative witness - i have no real idea why the defence did not focus on this kind of stuff in the first place.

In her initial X DA Rodriguez landed some very heavy blows.

Incidentally this is a good tip for expert witnesses who want to resonate with Court

Maintain your integrity 100% because the moment you get shown up as a cheerleader, your credibility is blown

Its clear Chase got out hustled by DK as well.

As I've noted several times, all the value in Joey's business was in the sales pipe which was all SEO

DK controlled the shopping cart, and thus controlled the revenue.

BBM, Do you think that could be the reason that Merritt told LE that if he would of murdered anyone it would of been DK? And that was when there wasn't even any mention by LE about murder.
Maybe some underlying seething anger by CM towards DK?

 

[LadyL]

BBM, Do you think that could be the reason that Merritt told LE that if he would of murdered anyone it would of been DK? And that was when there wasn't even any mention by LE about murder.
Maybe some underlying seething anger by CM towards DK?

Maybe DK was next.

 

[Karinna]

Maybe DK was next.

That's kind of what i was thinking. Anyone that got in Merritt's way and got between him and his potential money source kind of situation, and if he had just previously killed successfully which he did for a few years. Because i think if the murder victims hadn't been found at all, he might just have got away with it.

 

[geevee]

Maybe DK was next.

Yeah, as soon as he returned from Hawaii.

 

[la2cabo]

If you want some trial comedy gold, go to 41.40 of Part 4 where the forensic accountant claims DK hacked Joey's Paypal

LOL

(we know it wasn't hacked - DK just reset the pass - someone had access to Joey's email)

ETA - the whole sequence from then on is Maline trying to get the witness to to testify that Dan hacked in and stole Joey's cash

THAT was a slimy move!

 

[citygirl]

Damn DA Melissa Rodriguez is a bad arse

Again it looks like the defence prepared all this at the last minute - implication Chase tailoring his version at the last minute

All of this must have been known to the defence back in 2016

Do you think the jurors will get that?
MR really grilled him. He seems like a solid, unbiased witness, to me. At times he appeared frustrated by Maline's questions.
And, I did notice CM corrected Maline about a money amount. I think Maline said 4700 and CM said it was 6,000.

 

[asyousay]

some of us (me ) know DK's a snake but also think that Chase Merritt did the ultimate misdeed

Well Said!!

unfortunately Joey had a lot of snakes around him that all saw £££ when he vanished. That doesn’t mean they murdered him. Only one person was forging cheques on the night Joey died and deleting what they were doing.

It wasn’t DK!!

 

[Texas Red]

BIB

I presume this is at least partly aimed at me and as I don't like to be misrepresented, i thought i'd reinforce a couple of points.

Firstly, I agreed from the outset that DK (and Chase) wasted no time getting their hands in Joey's money after he went missing.

But as you might recall, I pointed out some legal reasons why hot take conclusions about theft and illegal sale of the business might not be correct.

Theft under US law needs the requisite criminal intent. In particular there must be the intent to permanently deprive the owner of their property. So the defence is always going to be that the actions, though perhaps a misuse of company funds, were not criminal if the intent was to "save the business". And of course burden of proof is on the state in any criminal action. So a lot would depend on facts we simply don't have. e.g what was done with the money?

Second, acts involving a fraudulent component (i.e forging Joey's signature) are more obviously criminal than acts involving misrepresentation (e.g. conning Joey's mum), or misuse. This is a single shiny reason why CM is much more in the frame for stealing from Joey.

So my own opinion is a criminal prosecution against DK would likely be quite difficult - especially given the unclear legal situation between Joey and DK. The more obvious recourse is the civil one, to account for sale proceeds.

I don't really see how that is "supporting DK"

The analyses you make of criminal intent as it pertains to both CM’s and DK’s actions is interesting, IMO, criminal intent could be proved in both circumstances but unfortunately, since the statute of limitations has been exceeded, a criminal prosecution is now a moot point. Considering the fact that prosecution is no longer an option the point of including it now just muddles the true objective of finding the truth.


Their actions in this incident are pertinent to motive and this is where I see bias against CM, DK is given a pass on almost every one of his suspicious actions. The comment that I’m now replying to is a good example, I don’t believe I’ve seen you make any arguments in defense of any of CM’s actions? This is understandable considering you obviously believe him guilty. But, the point is why defend DK? Even if you believe CM guilty, doesn’t exclude DK from some type of potential involvement.